Campus can't handle anymore expansion.

[archangel689]

Hi, everyone, our campus cannot handle any more expansion and our IFC wishess to dissallow any more fraternities on campus at this time, however, we have a several fraternities who are demanding entry on campus when we have groups that are already low on numbers and less and less men go greek every year. The social infrastructure CANNOT handle any more fraternities at this campus.

However, we are being told by the IFC president that because of the NIC resolution on expansion all national fraternities on campus have to vote yes and allow unlimited expansion at this campus, eventhough EVERY since chapter wishes to vote 'no' on futher colonies at this campus.

http://www.nicindy.org/resolutions/Expansions.htm

Is the document i'm talking about.

I was also told that NIC resolutions are merely recomendation... however our IFC president is acting as if this is the word of god....

Anywhere can I get information saying that NIC resolutions are purely recomendation before fraternities start dying on this campus?

-Tony

[Peaches-n-Cream]

I think that your fraternity should contact your national headquarters.

[33girl]

Maybe I'm seeing this from a Panhel POV, but the way I read that statement is more that the school or IFC can't say "we will only allow you to affiliate with a huge group like Sigma Chi" when the students hoping to found the new fraternity would rather go w/ Crows or another smaller group.

They're saying that the bigger nationals should not be able to bulldoze over a smaller one (with things like big presentations and pressure from alum groups) if the guys applying want the smaller one. "Unrestricted" is NOT the same thing as "unlimited."

I know this isn't news to you Tony, but your IFC prez is a dumbass.

[33girl]

Here is the text of the statement if anyone else wants to chew on it (the link didn't work):

STATEMENT OF POLICY ON EXPANSION

The North-American Interfraternity Conference encourages appropriate college officials and/or Interfraternity Councils to consider the following for expansion to a campus:

be open to all fraternities not currently represented on the campus;
exclude costly multi-media presentations, financial and housing commitments and political influence;
recognize that the size of a fraternity or the number of local alumni is not an indication of that fraternity's ability to administer an expansion project;
respect the right of any organized college group to seek affiliation with the fraternity of its choice; and,
recognize the constitutional rights of students to associate with a fraternity as guaranteed by the Freedom of Association provision of the United States Constitution.
The North-American Interfraternity Conference, therefore, states its support for open, unrestricted expansion for all college and university fraternity systems, and charges Interfraternity Councils and member fraternities to move toward such a program.

President Pease directed the Executive Vice President of the Conference to call roll at 9:25am. Mr. Williamson identified 51 member fraternities who answered present. A majority vote was established at 26 and a two-thirds vote of those present was established at 34.

[PiEp299]

I'd have to agree with 33girl. "open, unrestricted expansion" means that any group can expand there if a group on that campus wants them there, not that they have to let every group in the NIC onto the campus. It's a matter of common sense and your IFC president doesn't have it.
I also think this ties to a resolution about 3 years ago that stated the NIC members should be open to expansion at any campus, in other words not exclude a campus because of its size or number of fraternities. Also included with this is the Resolution on Alfred University and the Resolution to Freedom of Association and Speech.

You can always email the NIC if you have questions on it nic@indy.org

[madmax]

Originally posted by PiEp299
I'd have to agree with 33girl. "open, unrestricted expansion" means that any group can expand there if a group on that campus wants them there, not that they have to let every group in the NIC onto the campus. It's a matter of common sense and your IFC president doesn't have it.
I also think this ties to a resolution about 3 years ago that stated the NIC members should be open to expansion at any campus, in other words not exclude a campus because of its size or number of fraternities. Also included with this is the Resolution on Alfred University and the Resolution to Freedom of Association and Speech.

You can always email the NIC if you have questions on it nic@indy.org

What did they say about Alfred?
Anyone know what ever happened with Alfred?

[PiEp299]

Originally posted by madmax
What did they say about Alfred?
Anyone know what ever happened with Alfred?

this:

Upon proper motion and second the House of Delegates referred to the NIC Board of Directors, by a vote of 42 in favor and 4 opposed, a motion that would condemn any attempt to sanction, threaten or intimidate undergraduates who choose to remain members of an unrecognized
fraternity and to also request a legal opinion as to Freedom of Association rights of undergraduate members, to be funded by the NIC's Legal Fund.

Referred Motion

Whereas, Alfred University has voted to ban the 100 year-old "Greek System" from its campus, and

Whereas, Alfred University has threatened with expulsion undergraduate members of the six NIC member fraternities for their continued membership in an unrecognized chapter, and

Be It Resolved, that the NIC strongly condemns any attempt to sanction, threaten, or intimidate undergraduates who choose to remain members of an unrecognized fraternity, and

Be It Further Resolved, that the NIC Legal Defense Fund obtain a legal opinion as to the Freedom of Association rights of these undergraduate members.

[Tom Earp]

Yes, and for what it is worth, Alfred did Ban All Greeks!

Greeks were All Banned for what a Local did in a Hazing incident!

Short sightedness is common on smaller schools where they feel That They have no corol over the Students.!

Now, on the Flip Side of the coin, Shorter College, Rome, Ga. decided with just Locals who were getting out of Control to Petition National Organizations.

The National Orgs have come onto Campus and should be growing because of the Restrictions placed on GPA, Hazing and Numbers! We do try to do it right

A sad state of Affairs, ASU, LXA had its Charter pulled for something that happened 2 years ago. (Trying to find out more).

What is surprising, is that they just won a lot of awards from National and now gone!

Damn short sited Academians! Who has the Highest Campus involvement, GPA, Charity Events and Money Donated to the School but members of Greek Organizations?

[Firehouse]

It is against the law for any public university to prevent any legitimate student organization from forming and operating on campus. For fraternities, survival of the fittest is the best solution to expansion problems. A good fraternity will attract members, period. Weak fraternities are weak because they do not offer an attractive product.
33Girl? You there?

[FuzzieAlum]

Just a little logic ... if NIC actually required "yes" votes, than what would be the point of voting?

[33girl]

Firehouse, I have to agree w/ FuzzieAlum on this one....if any fraternity could just come on to any campus at any time, what would be the point of having NIC rules at all?

And the main prob with this situation, as I see it, is the IFC president's willful or stupid (your call) misinterpretation of what the statement of policy on expansion really means.

If you'll read archangel's other posts you'll see that a lot of crap is going on with their Greek system that needs to be fixed...any fraternity that would overlook that and just come storming in is only going for the quick buck and not thinking about what is beneficial to ALL the students. If I remember correctly, there's some verbiage in both the NPC and NIC mission statements about working for the betterment of the campus.

[Firehouse]

As you say, we should always take the good of the institution and its students into account. But sometimes, a new fraternity properly constituted and marketed will be much better for the system than the ones already there and not doing particularly well. You're right: I haven't studied the threads closely enough to know the problems on this particular campus.
It is frustrating though, to see muddleheaded thinking. There is another thread about FSU sororities and rush. I'm staying away from that thread because I just don't feel right about getting in the middle of that discussion. However, since it's just you and me: every sorority here has between 140 and 200+ members except one. That one has been in various stages of struggle for years. They're nice women and they have caring alumni, but it's unlikely that they are going to be able to boost their size up to match the others. But, the campus HAS REJECTED expansion, apparently ONLY because that one sorority can't raise it's numbers. There are more than enough women who would love to join a new sorority or sororities...but they're not going to join that one. It doesn't make sense to me.
You should know this about NIC. It's not at all like national Panhellenic. Few of the national fraternities pay any attention to anything they say, and there are no chapters that feel any obligation to any NIC 'rules'. We do use the NIC's stated positions on expansion to our advantage, but no fraternity chapter, officer or system that I know of feels 'directed' by NIC to do anything. Some nationals have pulled out; others pulled out and then returned (mine is one of those). There is a strong feeling that NIC is not an effective or aggressive representative of the general Fraternity's interests.
33Girl, good to talk to yuo again.

[madmax]

Originally posted by PiEp299
this:

Upon proper motion and second the House of Delegates referred to the NIC Board of Directors, by a vote of 42 in favor and 4 opposed, a motion that would condemn any attempt to sanction, threaten or intimidate undergraduates who choose to remain members of an unrecognized
fraternity and to also request a legal opinion as to Freedom of Association rights of undergraduate members, to be funded by the NIC's Legal Fund.

Referred Motion

Whereas, Alfred University has voted to ban the 100 year-old "Greek System" from its campus, and

Whereas, Alfred University has threatened with expulsion undergraduate members of the six NIC member fraternities for their continued membership in an unrecognized chapter, and

Be It Resolved, that the NIC strongly condemns any attempt to sanction, threaten, or intimidate undergraduates who choose to remain members of an unrecognized fraternity, and

Be It Further Resolved, that the NIC Legal Defense Fund obtain a legal opinion as to the Freedom of Association rights of these undergraduate members.

Colleges don't answer to NIC. The way I read the law greeks can operate a public school with or without the school's consent but at private schools, the school makes the rules period.

http://www.dke.org/quarterly4.html

[madmax]

Originally posted by Tom Earp
Yes, and for what it is worth, Alfred did Ban All Greeks!

Greeks were All Banned for what a Local did in a Hazing incident!

That wasn't a local.

[33girl]

The hazing incident that cast the spotlight on Alfred to begin with was by a local. The latest incident was by a national.