Immaturity at It's Best!!!!

[ThetaxiUW]

Need a little help here from the guys (maybe girls). Our chapter is having a problem with people acting immature. They consistantly do things that give our house a bad rep, or make us seem that everyone is like them. A guy in our house posted a sign on the DG annex next door to us saying something bad about them when after called and asked us to repair their window with a "bitchy" tone. A senior did this! We also have things blowing up late at night all the time. We have people who consistantly do stuff to sororities just because they are sororities and you know they are all "bitchy" and "beerwhores". I mean seriously. They actually light fireworks in the second floor hallway at eachother. "Why?" you ask.

"To be funny"

What the hell can we do here? Our rules give us the option of two things. Bring a fine on them ($5, doesn't work due to to many people being immature) or charge them with a major crime against the fraternity ($100 fine and suspension). That has only been done twice. There is no middle ground. Anyone got any ideas. We have weekly speakers at the house during the year and I'm thinking of bringing in a speaker to speak directly about that. Seriously, there are people in our house that are pissed off and are considering moving out just because of that reason. Most of the problems are caused by older members though, and thats where the main problem lies.

How do you get a senior member to realize that he is being immature and that he needs to change his attitudes, without being a dick?

[XiLovin]

Have you had a sit down talk with the guys? Do they still continue? If so, fine their @$$. Seriously, they seem to think that they are above the rules. They aren't and let them know it.

[SigEp42]

I don't know how your standards board is structured, but if they have any ability to vary the punishment, maybe they could think about suspending them from only social activites. For each stunt they pull they can't attend one party, mixer, formal, ect. My chapter did this when people were late with dues and it worked. the only other thing i have heard is the monitary fine, and makign them pay for somethign if it breaks or needs to be fixed.

[ThetaxiUW]

It's gotten to a point of fining that nobody cares. We came up with a system last year that if the police came we would fine them. That really doesn't work though. The police only catch about an 8th of what really happens. As for the social ideas, we have that for only people who don't pay dues in time. Plus, we have a significant less number of socials because of them. And when we tell them that their actions are responsible for it, they blame it on something else, and the immature half of the house agrees.

Here is what we tried:
(I was house manager for 2 quarters and implemented a couple of these)

work weekends - They get a a day of work instead of fines and it is voted on by the executive board

Lockbox - (being re-implemented on a trial basis) Lock them out of their room until they pay their fine or do their work

Work-off Deal - People who don't have money can work off their fines for minimum wage or around $5 an hour. Someone actually had $70 in fines.

Apology - Never implemented but a good idea. Have them apologize formally to all the brothers in chapter.

The problem with fines is that it brings about lots more fines. We have rules for everything and more fines means more wasted time in meetings. The work weekends could work a lot better in the fall due to warmer weather, but consists of working the people very hard on a Saturday as punishment. They were never really worked that hard, plus it costs the house money for supplies to fix things. The moving rocks from the back to the front of the house for a new wall was a good one!

Are their any other ideas?

[hoosier]

In my opinion, being "extreme" (as you bragged about and challenged others to compare in a recent post) and well-behaved don't go together.

Try to pledge a little better guy - "you can't take the country out of a country boy, and you can't make an idiot behave." If your problems are being caused by guys from the big city, don't take any more from there.

Your choices are about two:

1 - fine
2 - expel

Just do it

[DRau]

Hmmm....
Sounds like my ex-boyfriends fraternity. They (my ex and roommates) decided to scrape a dead skunk from the middle of the street and put it in our mailbox - wearing their letters and in the middle of the day!!!! Needless to say I was on the phone with their president by the time they ran back to the house.

Have you tried social probation? You can start with exchanges for small offenses and work up to formals and weekend tricks for the really bad stuff. Maybe just prohibit your guys from attending if they can't shape up - it my experience this should do the trick (no parties with girls = better behavior)

[ThetaxiUW]

Extreme and immaturity are two different things. However, I think they may be mixing the two up. Just because we are the extreme house, doesn't mean we hang dead squirrels from trees and drop them in front of girls when they walk under the tree. I agree about the pledging part for sure. I have been trying to make it out to Rush events this fall so we don't sign bad guys. I think part of the problem (and you'll probably agree) was that our rush chair was one of the bigget instigators in these stunts. Maybe the new chairs will do better. I think they are and maybe next year the freshamn class will be a more mature class.

[SKRae]

I am a good friend of some of the Theta Xi's on my campus. It really sucks what you are going through this. I have heard of immaturity, but this is bad. Maybe you could get some help from nationals, ask them some suggestions. If you don't want to go that far, then steepen the fines. Make it $25/offense, not $5. Good luck, I hope that something works out for you.

[Betarulz!]

I think that there may not be a quick fix, and yet that fact may prevent a true solution.

I know that in my own pledge experience a lot of the time we talked about how our actions not only represented ourselves, but also our pledge brothers, our chapter, our org, our alumni, etc., etc. Almost every single pledge meeting I think this was brought up in some form or another.

My idea would be to stress in your pledge program, however you may run into problems when your older members behave as they always have - setting poor examples for your new members.

[auakl]

Our chapter experienced a similar problem years ago with a handful of Brothers that just refused to act in a manner that the chapter overall considered acceptable. Again, the problem wasn't with the new members, it was the 4th and 5th year senior who for one reason or another, just decided that the rules didn't apply to them. We tried the private conversations, chapter announcements of expected behavior, etc... We did not implement a fine system however because it had been largely ineffective with the people who were being fined for other reasons (i.e. the ones typically behind on their dues anyway). Regretfully what finally corrected this situation to a large extent was the (painful) decision to expel a handful of brothers from the fraternity. A final warning was given and then one night, those brothers whose actions and behaviors had failed to meet our standards of brotherhood were expelled. End of discussion, you're gone. That sent shockwaves through the chapter. Those who had previously been some of the minor troublemakers straightened their act out, promptly. I don't recommend this path to others, but sometimes it must be done for the good of the brotherhood. The key to this saga for other chapters is this - recruit quality men. At one point, we let our standards drop (sacrificing quantity for quality - sound familiar to anyone else?) and many of the men described above came from that timeframe. A lesson painfully learned for our chapter that I hope other chapters will dutifully avoid.

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Alpha Kappa Lambda - Beta Phi
"An Affiliation Kindled for Life"

[SigmaChiCard]

Just one point in passing....you glorify half the stuff you do as making you seem cool for being "extreme," then whine when it spreads and makes you seem immature.

[shadokat]

My advice is great rid of the riff raff and make sure when you rush guys, you choose some who aren't as dickheaded as these. It's one thing to be extreme...it's another to act like a complete moron. These guys add no value to your fraternity.