Chronicle of Higer Education Greek discussion

[SilverTurtle]

The cover story of the new issue of The Chronicle of Higher Education features an article about recent controversies involving the Greek systems of the University of Alabama and Dartmouth College. At Alabama, a black woman failed in her attempt to become the first black student to join the white Greek system. At Dartmouth, a sex newsletter kept by a fraternity detailed the alleged sexual practices of named, female students. In both cases, critics of the Greek systems are calling for the administrations to take tougher stands against what are perceived to be the detrimental effects of the Greek influence on campus. The Chronicle is sponsoring an online discussion on the issues raised by these controversies and invites members of this list to read the article and to join the discussion at: http://www.chronicle.com/colloquy/2001/greek/greek.htm

Disclaimer: I haven't even visited the discussion board yet... I thought many of you would be interested. But I have nothing to do with any opinions expressed there!

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SilverTurtle

Phi Beta Fraternity: National Professional Association for the Creative & Performing Arts

[Tom Earp]

One must remember, that there are certain parts of the world that still hold many things dear to their beleifs. Even though archaic as they may be!
It is not up to me to judge the individual group.
I know my Fraternity as had amny members from differing backgrounds and religions. I feel that my Brothers judge the person as himself. I have had variing Brothers in my house and respect them all as Brothers. I met the fellow who is setting up our web site last night, and he is either Indian or Pakistani. He is also a Sig Ep from Iowa State!
I felt it was my pleasure to meet him along with a fellow Sig Ep who is Asian from the same school.
Bigotry and racisim will never die but there are those who do what they can because of the person who is a person!

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Tom Earp LX Z#1
Pittsburg State U. (Kansas)

[33girl]

Re Alabama, while I am not disregarding the racial factor, I'll tell you this much: I wouldn't give a bid to ANYONE who says things like "I expected sororities to jump all over me."

Confidence is one thing; arrogance is another.

[PiPhiAlum]

I agree with 33Girl.

In addition, you do not know all the circumstances at UofA on why the young lady was dropped. It truly might have nothing to do with race.

A similar situation happened in the early 90's at my school. We had a young mixed lady who went through NPC rush.

Her resume was glowing, high academics, outstanding extra-circular activities, and had even been given a key to the city (of her hometown) by the mayor. On paper, she is the type of prospective new member everyone looks for. All eight GLOs were briefed before rush began, because she was the first black woman to go through NPC rush.

Now that is what everyone on the outside sees. What others did not see were the discussions during rush workshop and behind closed doors. And guess what?... It had nothing to do with her race... She grew up in the same town that several of my sorority sisters grew up in. Though her resume was terrific, her actions and attitude on the weekends often left something to be desired.

Unfortunately, when she was dropped, we had to have all our Ps&Qs in order (as did any other chapter involved). Why? Because the local news channels showed up at school, nationals called to check on rush, etc. How could the salutatorian of XYZ High School and someone who had such high credentials be dropped?

She was offered a bid, but not to her top choices. It became a race issue, because that is the only way anyone not involved saw it. Outsiders played it up as if she would have received a bid from the sorority of her choice had she been "white."

That is just not so.

[KillarneyRose]

From "New Scrutiny for Powerful Greek Systems":

"Evidence of her sorority credentials is the white Jeep Grand Cherokee that her father bought her as a Valentine's Day gift."

What the.....?????

I think that a ridiculous statement such as that severely undermines the writer's credibility.

[This message has been edited by KillarneyRose (edited June 05, 2001).]

[Corbin Dallas]

Originally posted by KillarneyRose:
"Evidence of her sorority credentials is the white Jeep Grand Cherokee that her father bought her as a Valentine's Day gift."

I meant to comment on that line, but forgot.

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Steve Corbin
Lambda Chi Alpha
Theta Kappa Chapter
Rose-Hulman Inst. of Tech.

[UNFSigmaChi]

Why should you be forced to accept someone you don't want in your organization??? I don't think it was race related personally but if it was that is not cool. There was something similar that happened here with PHC. This girl got turned down by every sorority on campus and said it was racial. Then when the media started to get involved an older sister who was black said it wasn't and nothing happened after that. But I do have a question. How come black fraternities and sororities refuse white people from joining their organizations? I asked some friends of mine who are Kappa's and said white people wouldn't understand. Why?

[AlphaChiGirl]

For various reasons, I've kept up with the UA situation. The first article I read mentioned her upper-middle class status...using the Jeep her father got her as evidence that she was indeed upper-middle class (and in the eyes of the media, sorority material). The CHE article seemed to be an overly generalized summary of the articles I had already read. Either way, the statement does not smack of journalistic integrity.

As for the "I expected sororities to jump all over me", that is a pretty cocky statement. She could have said something to the lines of "I expected Rush to be a better experience than it turned out to be"...or better yet, she could have said nothing about her chances.

You know, I never considered the possibility that her being rejected could have been an issue of standards. She went to a very popular, prestigious high school in Mobile, where kids from all over Alabama are invited to attend. At least one person she met during Rush had to know her, or know someone who did. Whether or not she had a good reputation, her reputation probably preceded her in Tuscaloosa.

It still blows my mind, however, that the UA Greek system has not been integrated, but it also surprised me that the UGa system had not been integrated, either.

[Corbin Dallas]

wow i just read the first article. i can't beleive that there has never been a black person in the "white" greek system. of course i do realize what school we're talking about here too. from the article, it seems that neither NPC and NIC or NPHC care to change the way things are. I don't like how they compared the two groups though. I mean it's like comparing apples and oranges. i mean, the part about the "white" greeks recruiting high schoolers, and the NPHC getting people when they're sophomores. that's just the differences in how the two recruit right? it is crazy about how which groups they hang out with can dictate who you marry. this whole thing just blows my mind, and i'm rambling

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Steve Corbin
Lambda Chi Alpha
Theta Kappa Chapter
Rose-Hulman Inst. of Tech.

[This message has been edited by Corbin Dallas (edited June 05, 2001).]

[Steeltrap]

Originally posted by Corbin Dallas:
what? maybe i'm not reading this correctly, but there's never been a black person in the NPC or IFC at Alabama?? or is this an old story? i'm confused here. i'm gonna check out the discussion anyway.

That's correct. Besides the discussion Silver Turtle referenced, there's also some things on the situation in Salon and the Tuscaloosa, Ala. daily paper.

[shadokat]

Yeah, whoever would say something like "I expected them to be falling all over me" is just slightly on the arrogant side. The sad thing is that you gotta wonder why she didn't get into one sorority. I'm not saying their system is racist, but it's 2001 and not ONE black woman or man has been in traditionally white fraternity or sorority? Sounds a little backwards to me and slightly scary.

[UNFSigmaChi]

People have said they are suprised that schools like UGA and UA haven't integrated yet. But you also have to ask how many black college students there have gone through rush as well. We were the first fraternity on my campus to rush a black guy and once the black fraternities saw him pleding a "white" fraternity they gave him a REALLY hard time and basically shunned him. I remember people telling him to stop acting white. Unfortunatly he dropped because of it and wend Kappa Alpha Psi. But anyways, you gotta think that when people come to a school and would like to rush a predominatly white GLO but feel out of place or get austrisized because of it, thats why they just go ahead and join a BGLO. Thats why you'll unfortnatly always see no african americans in GLO's at schools like UA and UGA.

[shadokat]

I hear what you're saying UNF. I guess I didn't think about that. I know that we had a woman pledge my sorority who was black woman, and she got a lot of flack from her friends saying she was "selling out" or that she couldn't handle being in the traditionally black sororities. But she said that she found the place where she felt she belonged and finished. She helped another black girl go through rush, and she became one of our sisters as well. And on my campus, out of 8000 students, there were about 400 black students, so it must have been hard.

[alphachiohmy]

I am a member of a Panhellenic sorority and understand that each sorority
has its own beliefs and criteria when selecting members. But when I first
read the article, I was miffed that out of 15 Panhellenic sororities, not
one invited this woman back after the first round. I am not saying any
discrimination took place, but it does make you wonder?

I understand that there are several Pan-dash and other organizations
designed to promote cultural differences, but that is not a reason for
discrimination in Panhellenic and IFC chapters.

I also think the article is written in a way that uses greek cliche's and
stereotypes, which shows irresponsibility on the part of the
reporter/writer. One of which is the line about the jeep. For example:


"Despite these many vestiges of the South's segregated past, Ms. Twilley,
17, says she had no qualms about coming to Tuscaloosa, which she chose
over Duke and Georgetown Universities when Alabama offered her a
scholarship. Eager to experience the friendships and camaraderie that
Alabama's storied Greek system promises to members, Ms. Twilley imagined
that she would fit in easily at one of Alabama's 15 sororities. After all,
she had attended the prestigious Alabama School of Mathematics and Science
in Mobile and hailed from what she describes as an upper-middle-class
family. Evidence of her sorority credentials is the white Jeep Grand
Cherokee that her father bought her as a Valentine's Day gift."


Rhonda



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Alpha Chi Omega
Iota Upsilon

[RUgreek]

Ok, lemme get something straight. We have an all white female sorority that didn't accept a bid for a black female student? Alright, that in itself appears to be racist, but at the same time, what would be said if the situation was reversed. Would an all black female sorority that refused a bid to a white female student get blamed for reverse discrimination? I'm not trying to put down the current situation at all, you're absolutely right to claim discrimination if she fit all the standards any other person, regardless of color, had to get in. But I just want to know if there is a double standard out there, does anyone care to comment?