potpourri...

[Erik P Conard]

wrote a coupla replies and somehow lost 'em. Someone was
commenting big schools vs . little ones, big chapters vs. small,
etc. There seems to be a smaller chapter at the streetcar colleges, or in big cities. Housing often a problem. The old
teachers colleges, some state U's now, have never been able
to amass the bucks to build nice houses like the private schools
or the state Universities or Aggie schools. Chartering extensions schools almost always guarantees a small chapter,
even tho the larger, "mother" one has a great chapter, the one at
the extension or former junior college one, never seems to rise to the style of the parent.
Size...Pike is rather widely known to have the largest man per chapter size. SAE the most initiates (living and dead counted),
Sig Ep claims the most undergrads, TKE the most chapters,
Sig Ep first to charter in all 50 states (not all active now, though),
Zeta Psi is king in Canada, the so-called exclusive nationals, like the Union Triad, are dying on the vine, and the co-eds aree
generally the biggest conglomerations of nerds and hoggers you have ever seen...check one of their composites...
It is real hard to beat SAE as regards beautiful houses. But we
all love our own, and strive to get better.
Finally, even Harvard has said the Greek system is by far the best means of undergrad living. The four-eyed ones at Berkeley
and Chicago and some of the fruitcakes in New England have
not yet figured it out, but they certainly have nothing to brag about. Take care, though, in spreading charters to old junior colleges, trade schools, streetcar colleges...if you want to have a
traditional system. And remember, most of the faculty never did
join anything...and the green-teethed, knuckle-dragging, bottom
feeding press is always out for a story. Ethics is only a course
taught in college, and, yes, we are elitist. We are not a rehab society. And if the cheapest were the best, we'd all be driving
Yugos. Happy new year from an old Teke in Colorado.

[Tom Earp]

Damn, E C, you put a lot in your pot pooring the hell out of it but once again so right on the Nose!

We had a Brother (?) at International Hdq. Who wanted nothing but Major Big Time schools, none of the State or Affiliated school to be on the rolls of LXA!

There was enuff stink raised that he is no longer there! Guess who was very vocal on that one? Brother Lenoxx from Shippensburg and I talked and he and I are a lot alike! That should tell you something about him!!!!

As all National's are in financial conditions like any business, the only way to grow is to expand!

The problem is unless these schools come to the realization that the Greeks do more while on campus and upon Graduation for the school in service and money then we have a problem!

No homecoming but horse s*&( and high school bands and empty staduiams, and less money for the merchants!

If LXA was not on campus I damn sure would not be back and I know same goes for the TKE's as I have not seen any of the Alums there for functions!

[Lil_G]

Originally posted by Erik P Conard
Zeta Psi is king in Canada

Where'd ya get this information from champ?

[NeonPi]

Originally posted by Erik P Conard
Zeta Psi is king in Canada

Sorry, Erik but it's actually Phi Delta Theta who has the most number of chapters in Canada (13, 10 open; Zeta Psi has chartered 11, 10 open)

For more information, check out canadiangreeks.com

Thanks for the insights, Erik - right on the money ....


Shala

~~~~~~~~~~
Shala Berry
President
Canadian Interfraternal Association

[Tom Earp]

Shala to the defense of E C!!!! He may be getteing Maturer but still sharp as a flat headed pin! Kidding E C!

I may have to check with Schmedrake LXA from W Onterio who has fled the upper regions to the Land Down Under and who Cutiepie hopes to hook up with,( Damn Mark you better be good looking) as my butt is on the line on this deal!

I have NO clue about North of the Border as would not give me visa!

All in fun anyway so dont flame me! Write me but dont Flame as I tried to burn the house down one time cooking!

[KSig RC]

Erik, to an extent I must disagree with your stance on greek systems in NE - you're right on the money for some of it, but miss badly on other points.

MIT boasts a large fraternity system, and I feel should be the role model for expansion into New England for any national GLO.

The New England area is not rich in Greek Life historically - so the trick is to expand to schools that pull students from other places, as well as from New England. MIT, Harvard, Dartmouth, etc would fit this bill, as would most of the large private universities in the area. These campuses tend to have more students from strong Greek backgrounds to form a foundation from which chapter expansion can be based.

The other options would be at the large state schools, such as UConn, UMaine, UVm and UNH. These tend to still retain the greek system in large numbers, although declination is occuring at some.

Overall, I agree with your statement that NE should be avoided - IF the nationals don't come in with a solid expansion plan. Campuses must be selected very carefully. I attend Boston University, and our chapter has been named in the top 10% of KS chapters nationwide. LXA's founding chapter thrives as well, even as they intentionally keep pledge classes small and retain a tight brotherhood that way. However, I've seen many colonies fail, and many charters revoked, b/c expansion was attempted at a campus that just won't support greek life, for whatever reason. Care must be taken, and colonies not just added as a number for a brochure.

[Erik P Conard]

First, I yield to the northern brethren about the Zetes not being the kingpins in Canada any longer. They were the pioneers but
I was not aware of the Phi Delt growth. So, stand corrected, and
will go to my corner and lick my dish. The Canadian site should
be attracting more than it is, on the net, and the NIC greeks might do well by entering Canada, Oh Canada~!
About New England, the birthplace of early fraternities, Wm &
Mary excepted. I hardly see Dartmouth as a paragon for Greeks,
and I sure as hell do not see much in Williams, Bowdoin, Union, Middlebury, etc. Sporadic attempts to enter Harvard and
Princeton are made, yes, but despite the heroic efforts of some,
they have not attracted much attention. Kingman Brewster and
his ilk have not helped. The UConn, UMass, UNH, URI, UVt schools have not set the woods afire either, housing a veritable embarrassment, too. And Amherst...hah! Not even worth a response. MIT and PENN have, arguably, tried to be in
the old mold, but bad boys and Dean Wormers have hurt 'em.
The southern mold we oughta look at again, and we'd hope they would not enlist en masse in the Confederate service, we
do think they have some attractive facets.
This site is getting to be fun, and this old Teke is not too old to
change or yield to superior sagacity! Thanks all! Erik P Conard

[Lil_G]

np, champ...we're here to inform.
I don't see any one dominant fraternity in Canada, there are some that are consistently strong and the miami triad orgs rank among them. There are others like KS and LXA that may be strong at one campus yet smaller at another. The Greek site is good, but even if it was advertised to the heads of the NIC (NAIC), i doubt they would jump at the chance to expand considering how skaky the greek system is here.

[NeonPi]

Good points Little G . Not too worry - NIC groups are very aware of canadiangreeks and the system as a whole in Canada - it's not for the lack of desire to expand, it's just that the Greek tradition is not as prevelant in Canada, and they recognize that having more groups than can support a system will only be detrimental to all in the end (i.e. the U of Western Ontario - too many groups, small number of members each)

On the upside - there has been more NIC expansion in the last 3 years than the last 10 years with Zeta Psi colonizing 4 campuses last year, and Laurier colonizing 2 NIC groups in 2 years (& looking to add 1 or 2 in the next 2 years). U of Manitoba is also looking forward to expansion this January, and the University of Calgary will be having Delta Upsilon re-colonize there in January too. 2002 is going to be an exciting year to say the least!!


Shala

PS - Little G - where did you do undergrad? PM me ...

PPS - Tom & Little G - you should come to the Canadian Interfraternal Greek Conference (CIFC) next Nov 1-3 in Montreal - it's going to be great!!

[BrianMUDU]

Erik,

Williams College got rid of their Greek System years ago. I know because that is where we were founded. It hurts to lose your first chapter. So much history, and they decide to just get rid of it.

[lifesaver]

Originally posted by Erik P Conard
There seems to be a smaller chapter at the streetcar colleges, or in big cities.

Whats a streetcar college? I have heard of a suitcase college (where everyone goes home on the weekends) but never a streetcar college. Please explain.

[Erik P Conard]

Streetcar college is an archaic term used to describe a college
where the student leaves home, hops on a streetcar to the college, gets off at the college. When classes are over, he hops on the streetcar or inter-urban or bus and rides home, never to be included in collegiate activities 'til the next day.
These kids are often called townies today, most do not join a thing, continue to mingle with their old high school buddies.
They are generally not Greeks.
There are exceptions, and these are generalizations, so don't get all het up about this. Some of these chapters manage to
thrive in spite of a house or any semblance of a meeting place.
But not many. Today most are called "inactive chapters," and
even though the big U may have taken over the school and changed the identity, they're usually poor sites for chapters as
we have known them, as the type of student is not conducive....
The 'suitcase schools' were generally ones which had no social life until the Greeks, and the fraternity system helped to
keep some on campus for the weekend in spite of little to do in
the shitty little towns.
But the 'high school Harrys' still would pack their bag and head
home to see their high school girl friends. Generally these guys
were not Greeks, either. They usually learned very few social graces, married their high school girlfriend, did not graduate, and ended up clerking at Ace Hardware with five kids. And,
the whole scene has changed, we have gone into technical colleges, business schools, trade schools, many of them having matriculates who are older or who are not into a social scene at all. Again, usually a poor place to charter.
Please do not confuse these with townies who pledge a house
who has a full range of programs. They participate, graduate,
and run their dad's bank or Mercedes dealerships, and when the brothers graduate and leave, they stay, help out the local chapter, serving on boards and organizing alumni reunions. These guys are often overlooked and that is a mistake, as the
"townie" should make up at least 20 % of your chaper if you are
smart...they remain in the community, protect our interests...
Gosh, we are now in 2002...speedometer at zero. RUSH!

[DukeBlue]

"four eyes", "nerds", "hoggers" - how old are you, 12?

[Erik P Conard]

Originally posted by DukeBlue
"four eyes", "nerds", "hoggers" - how old are you, 12?

We live in interesting times

[Tom Earp]

DukeBlue, I am almost a contempory of EC! He is so much right on if you read between the lines!

Today in the so called real world Greek Orgs are Bad! Ha! I will not give a dime to my ex sccool, I paid my hard earned money to go there and I pay my taxes!

According to many of the Schools, we are the scum of the earth!

Would you have Homecoming with High school bands and Horse shit down the main street?

It is a totally different life than when E C and i were there! But we are still here!
We beleieve in what we stood for, can you? Do you proudly wear your Badge or your Fraternity Letters or do like most do and wear NASCAR or Beer Symbols?

I for one am Proud of what I did and am still doing! I am Proud that my chapter is still there after 36 years! This is when so many are gone and some that will be gone to soon!

We may not always be right but we were there and have lived this long to be with you here!

While in many minds E C is the most obnoxious, oppenuated, SOB on site, besides me, I have known this Man longer than you are old! And Yes Just what I said above is true, I love this man as My own Brother!

In one of the few insights I will tell you about my Ritual, I had lost my Brother but he has been found!