Alcohol-free debate

[Alumnus who cares]

I was wondering if there are members out there from chapters that have banned alcohol, smoking, etc. from their chapter houses. I am interested in finding out if it has helped or hindered your chapter, what changes have come about, how you make it work, etc. My chapter (not the national, just the chapter) banned alcohol and smoking from the chapter house about 5 years ago, and it really has had no significant effect on the fraternity in terms of membership, improved GPA, social schedule, etc. It is now leading to some major problems with the chapter. Can anyone offer their insight, based on personal experiences or what they have observed?

[SilverTurtle]

My chapter doesn't have a house but does have a chapter room in the basement of one of the residence halls (as do all GLO's at the campus). We never used chapter funds to purchase alchohol, nor did we ever serve it in the room. We did have events, our Spring Formal or Fall Hayride for example, where alchohol was available for individuals to purchase or bring themselves.

As a chapter we don't support substance abuse, or even substance use. However, we also respected the fact that our members who were of age were responsible enough to make these decisions for themselves.

My personal view on dry houses is that it's unrealistic and unfair. GDI's, even those underage, can get away with alchohol (+ worse) in their dorm room, house, apartment, etc. As Greeks, we are supposed to be leaders, and responsible leaders at that. Yet we can't be trusted, even those of us who are 21..22..even 23 years old, by our own national board to drink responsibly? Granted, many chapters have proven otherwise. But I think with our current awareness (both alumni and undergrads) of the problems that exist is growing.

I would much rather see nationals implement rules and guidelines for substance use. Even strict ones. At least then you're acknowledging that your members are adults and that they can act responsibly. Rather than looking like their big babysitter. And I would be all for my nationals implementing guidelines. I would also suggest that if these rules were broken or compromised, the nationals then had the right to make individucal chapters dry, at least until they can get their act together.

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SilverTurtle@greekchat.com
Phi Beta Fraternity

[33girl]

Our chapter house banned smoking, or rather our sister who was house manager did without anyone else’s input. It was pretty much a bust.

The thing that scares me about alcohol free houses is this: when I was in school, we’d go to keggers & it would be so crowded we’d sometimes only get 1-2 beers before it kicked. Well now IFC forced all the houses to go BYOB. People do not bring 1-2 beers, they bring a freakin’ bottle of Captain Morgan! This is the even scarier part: people experimenting with over-the-counter stimulants (i.e. taking 5 Vivarin at a time). John Lennon once said pills were bigger drugs than pot, and he should know. That people are getting on this track frightens the crap out of me.

We had a Phi Delt colony at our school and they were going great guns, till their national announced the alcohol free thing. Then their numbers plummeted, and they’re gone. So obviously for them it didn’t work, or help.

[Alumnus who cares]

It seems to me that there are just too many negative things associated with banning alcohol and smoking from the chapter house. Right now, the biggest problem for my chapter is dealing with the people who break the rules and continue to drink and even smoke pot inside the chapter house. Nearly everyone drinks inside the house, so what's the point of having a rule like that? When the time finally comes to punish those who are breaking the no-alcohol rule, these members retaliate by threatening to quit the house. So this policy hurts our membership in more ways than one.

As a member of a fraternity that has been dry for almost three years I am aware of some of the problems that arise. When a house goes dry the amount of new members that they rush tends to go down and some of the older members of the house may leave. You just have to be able to "stick it out" untill the idea of being dry is not that bad catches on.

Our Chapter went dry in 1997, as a matter of fact we were one of the very first Phi Delt chapters in the nation to do it. We are currently the strongest chapter on our campus, that has 9 total fraternities including Sigma Alpha Epsilon, Beta Theta Pi, Lambda Chi Alpha, and Pi Kappa Alpha. Our rush numbers have been the highest on campus for the last three years. We won 14 out of 17 IFC greek awards. We have been outstanding fraternity for the past 4 years. We've one The Kansas City Trophy for outstanding Phi Delt Chapter in the nation 2 of the last 3 years and have an excellent chance of winning it this year. Our house is absolutely emaculate, it doesn't smell, it's not dirty, and it's not a place that you're afraid to bring someone into. If you want to drink, there are many places to do that, without doing it in the house. We have parties at least once a week at local bars. Our going dry has presented us with many more opportunities than it has taken away from us.

[Alumnus who cares]

Sounds like your chapter has really made the most of going alcohol-free. I know that Phi Delts are one of the fraternities that is leading the charge for alcohol free. I think the Phi Delts on my campus will be dry by 2001 or 2002, if they aren't already.

To your knowledge, was there any "secret" drinking going on in your house? That's been one of the biggest problems in my chapter. We tell the public and rushees that we're a dry house, yet almost all of the members who live in house are stashing alcohol in their rooms. It's as if we give the impression of being dry just for the sake of setting ourselves apart from other chapters when it comes to rush. Then, once our new members pledge and initiate, they find out the real truth--that there's just as much "secret" drinking going on in the house as there was "out in the open" drinking before our house went dry.

There is a core group of brothers who really want to uphold the rules, and are strict about "no drinking in the house." But I think they are the minority. And it's not doing our chapter any good to have people taking sides against each other: the ones who want to uphold the rules vs. the ones who are going to drink inside the house, even though it's against the rules. I don't know how my chapter plans to stop this problem, because every year it's the older members who corrupt the younger ones and encourage them to go ahead and drink secretly inside the house. Unfortunately, I am four years removed from the active chapter, so it's not really my place to tell the actives how they should run things.

One more question for Phi Delts: what was your chapter like before you went dry? Were you one of the bigger chapters on your campus before that? That can make a difference too...if you're a popular chapter on your campus, you have a good reputation to go on, and being dry shouldn't be as much of an issue to rushees. My chapter was one of the smaller ones on my campus, and we've always had to fight for recognition, so it's really been an uphill climb. It's easier to make a dry-house policy work if you're an established chapter to begin with.

[33girl]

AWC-

Nail hit firmly on head!

That can make a difference too...if you're a popular chapter on your campus, you have a good reputation to go on, and being dry shouldn't be as much of an issue to rushees. My chapter was one of the smaller ones on my campus, and we've always had to fight for recognition, so it's really been an uphill climb. It's easier to make a dry-house policy work if you're an established chapter to begin with.[/B][/QUOTE]

I posted in another thread about IU’s sororities banning alcohol from mixers. That system is so big and so popular, they could pass no-smoking and no-pizza rules, and people would still join. It’s more of a social “must.” Plus the Greek system is also looked upon as a source of housing in a crowded market. But at a school where it is not a “must”, I think people will think twice about joining organizations whose rules seem to get more and more restrictive, especially if you can get nice off-campus housing and do whatever you want.

I think everyone here has realized the lasting benefits of Greek life. I just attended one sister’s wedding this weekend, came home & went dancing with 5 other sisters. And keep in mind, I’ve been out of school 10 years! We have such an instant-gratification society today, it’s getting harder and harder to sell Greek life as it is, because it is something you have to WORK at, and you really don’t realize how much you got until you’re away from it for a while. I joined for a collegiate social life, period. I could have given 2 craps about philanthropy or lasting friendships. But the thing is, the social part was “the icing.” It was only after I became a sister that I realized how many layers of cake there were!! If you remove the icing, a lot of people might not taste the cake.

We weren't one of the worst chapters on campus but we weren't the best either. What we have now is what we turned it into. We have a faculty advisor that was a Phi here back in the late 80's and he is more and more impressed with it everday. As for secret drinking I can't say that it NEVER happens, but it's a rarity. If you're caught you are fined $100 and recieve a warning...2nd is a higher fine and some sort of suspension i believe and third is deactivation. People seem to stay pretty strict on this, and for the most part increasing your numbers and being dry is just a matter of being smart. Let the campus know you're there, you can succeed and party at the same time. Just don't be dumb and ignorant about things.

I'm a Sigma Nu at MIT, and my chapter voted to go dry last year, and it hasn't been a serious problem. We were one of the smaller houses on campus, and our presence has actually increased since we went dry. One of the factors influencing our decision was that we had an opportunity to move into a new house by going dry, so it was widely accepted by the Brothers.

I think that the key issue is that you have to have the support of almost all of the Brothers if you want to make it successful. If you're not serious about it then it does no good except getting brothers upset and causing tension.

[Alumnus who cares]

You're exactly right about needing to have the support of all of the brothers. And this is something my chapter has never had. There have always been a few in-house brothers who make a mockery of the policy by continuing to drink inside the house and encouraging younger members to do so. And just like you said, this has caused a LOT of tension between the two sides (obeying the rules vs. breaking the rules).

One of the major problems was that my chapter didn't have any benefits (such as moving into a new house) to look forward to. We were extorted into banning alcohol by a couple of key members of our alumni organization, and we had no choice in the matter. So that definitely got things off on the wrong foot, because it pissed off a lot of brothers, and several of them decided to move out of the house. I was pissed myself, but I chose to remain in the house and actually abide by the rules, hoping to set a good example for the younger guys. Didn't seem to do much good. The ones who were especially against the policy project their attitudes onto the younger new members, and it snowballs from there.

[Bottom_Line]

Has our integrity degraded to the point where we have to ask others to enforce a no-drinking standard. We emphasize responsibility, but everyone is creating rules upon rules as if we were childeren that did not know how to behave. Drinking should be a responsibility that we uphold in our own way, not conforming to a University or National standard. Anyone can follow the rules. True responsibility lies in making sound judgements on your own. This is also the root of our freedom, something which everyone should contemplate. We work hard and we play hard. Besides, we're young.... enjoy it because its a once in a lifetime opportunity.

[Stefan_WSU]

I say make all the houses dry. Yeah it sucks because you can't party in them anymore. But i just transferred and i've been going around to different Fraternities and its great to see a clean organized house with nice furniture and no holes in the wall.
All in all i think that its also a plus as far as liabilites go.

[UNFSigmaChi]

Well i've been to several regional, state and national IFC conferences and Alcohol-free housing is always a big topic. Phi Delt and FIJI always seem to be the big pro alcohol free people there, and Sigma Chi, EN and PIKE are usually the pretty big against alcohol free people. I have to agree overall with my fraternity that alcohol education should be done instead of banning it. But also it depends on the school. For instance at my college here in Jacksonville FL we shouldn't ban alcohol from fraternity houses because the closest bars frome UNF are about a 15 min drive from campus. So i think its a lot safer having a party at the house and walking back to your dormroom then having a party 15 min away and then a bunch of drunk people driving home. Now if you go to a University where you can walk across the street to a bunch of bars, then yes it would be a definate positive for you. People always say that your house would look better. And thats both true and not true. If you have a house manager that doesn't do a good job and doesn't make sure the house is clean and taken care of then ya...your house is gonna look crappy. If you have a good house manager then it shouldn't be much of a problem. You just gotta make sure during elections that person is going to be a good house manager. A lot of people also say that even though your campus isn't near the bars then you should get a charter bus and drive there and back. Ok obviously they musta had a lot of money to play with or they have never checked into getting a charter bus cause those things are $500+ for a night easily. Thats why i feel that as far as alcohol free initiatives go it shouldn't be done on a national level, but at each individual college. Some colleges and chapters it would be a definate improvement and others it wouldn't.

[matthewg]

Originally posted by Stefan_WSU:
I say make all the houses dry. Yeah it sucks because you can't party in them anymore. But i just transferred and i've been going around to different Fraternities and its great to see a clean organized house with nice furniture and no holes in the wall.
All in all i think that its also a plus as far as liabilites go.

Stefan_WA, you are not seriously suggesting that having alcohol means automatically having a sloppy house, don't you?
Sorry, but that is complete rubbish! From my personal long time experience (more then ten years, and I have seen a lot of fraternity houses) it totally depends on the spirit within a chapter, common sense and responsibility of the members whether the house is in good shape or not and definitely NOT on the amount of alcocol involved. If you teach your pledges to be responsible for all they do then you start a tradition of responsibility around the house and won't have a lot of trouble with excess alcohol. It is always a matter of watching over each other.