Legend of Blackfoot/Whitefoot

[ATOtnBetaTau]

Hey fellow Lexington Triad members,

In my chapter, we learn about the Blackfoot/Whitefoot legend between ATO and Sigma Nu. I was wondering if any of you learn about it and how the story is told from the Sigma Nu side. I'm guessing that we tell it differently. Also, I was wondering if any of you do a Blackfoot/Whitefoot Dance with ATO chapters or a Lexington Triad party involving KA as well.

I've always been interested in Sigma Nu and KA because of our relationship in the Triad, but there is no Sigma Nu chapter near me to learn.

Fraternally,

Jason

[Kevin]

Here's an excerpt from our public written history:

"At the end of his first year Hopkins [one of Sigma Nu's 3 founders] was awarded the highest rank of the class, the office of First Corporal. At the beginning of his second year, while on duty as Corporal of the Guard, Hopkins encountered an incident that left a long-lasting impression. After receiving a report of a disturbance, Hopkins was obligated by duty to investigate. After arriving at the source of the disturbance, he quickly realized that he had intruded upon a secret meeting of cadets completely disguised in white robes and black boots. Hopikins was immediately ejected from the clandestine meeting and quickly prepared a report of the incident in which he referred to their outfits, particularly their black boots. The society soon became known as the "black feet" among the cadets."

From what I know of our history, Sigma Nu was founded essentially in opposition to the hazing culture at VMI that was promoted by the black foot society (later known as ATO). The groups ended up within a couple years of that incident being serious rivals. The fore runner Sigma Nu group probably took on the name "white feet" because they were opposed to the point of appearing as direct opposites to the culture that the black feet perpetuated. There were several violent confrontations between the two groups. Sigma Nu and ATO have enjoyed a slightly less violent (sometimes just as violent) relationship from each group's genesis. The groups that get along sometimes hold "Black Foot/White foot" parties together.

Not on my campus though

[mattpike]

that was a really interesting story. im with you on the ATO's. i was a Pike at UCO before transfering to Ada. Pikes and Sig Nu's are cool though. we always tried to support you guys. you have a great group, good luck in the future.

[ATOtnBetaTau]

Hey ktsnake, wow, your reply has been here for a while, and I just noticed it. Anyway, our stories are more similar than I guessed. Of course, ATO's history has less focus on Hopkins and more focus on the "secret meeting" you described. For instance, the secret meeting was actually a foot-washing ceremony (used before Founder Glazebrook wrote our Initiation Ceremony) which could be why the emphasis was on the black boots.

I am, however, a little disturbed that what you learned from your history is that ATO created a hazing culture at VMI. From all I have read of our three Founders, they were also opposed to hazing (They saw it has childish, silly, and dividing). However, all three Founers graduated within the year, and there is no telling what the younger group could have done.

All in all, I enjoyed it. Thank you for putting Sigma Nu's side of the story up. It's great to learn a little more meat about that part of my own Fraternity's history.

edited to correct spelling

Jason

[Kevin]

I don't believe that ATO necessarily created the hazing culture. That has always been a part of VMI. From what I understand (and what I stated in my original description), the Blackfeet just reinforced the hazing culture.

I've made it a point to learn a lot about ATO. My younger brother ended up an ATO. From what I can tell, ATO holds Sigma Nu in high regard. However, I did work with an ATO alum once who referred to Sigma Nu as ATO's "bastard child"

Thanks for sharing information. Very enlightening. Come back anytime.

[SnuKnight172]

This movie is an alleged good representation of the hazing that occurred at the Citadel but many think that this is the same as what was going on at VMI and other Academies during the late 1800s to present. As Sigma Nu candidates in our chapter we watch this as a class during our pledge period.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by SnuKnight172

This movie is an alleged good representation of the hazing that occurred at the Citadel but many think that this is the same as what was going on at VMI and other Academies during the late 1800s to present. As Sigma Nu candidates in our chapter we watch this as a class during our pledge period.

Our pledge classes started watching that show (I think) 2 years ago. I've been semi out-of-touch with the day-to-day operations of the chapter since law school started. One of our guys helped with some revisions in the history part of LEAD I. I believe he included something about that movie in those revisions. Did that ever make it into the book?

-- Also, the Whitefoot/Blackfoot story was greatly enhanced. I don't have anything but the copy of his final 'pledge manual' that he forwarded to IHQ (I helped him do some editing). He was working with Tony, the D.C. from (I believe it is) MTSU. It'd be interesting to know what happened with the final product.

[KyleMcGuire1983]

Yeah, apparently the black-feet thing was a footwashing ceremony with some kind of Christian significance.

Not sure how Hopkins interpreted that as hazing, I think it was his ejection and the secrecy that made him feel something suspicious was going on. The Legion of Honor was an anti-hazing vehicle that was used to fight off bullies at VMI though, and we all know what became of the Legion....so it's all good.

ATO was founded in 66, right? That's three years before Sigma Nu and apparently hazing was still widespread by 1868....

[UWGATO]

Alpha Tau Omega was founded on Sept. 11, 1865 in Glazebrook's father's home in Richmond, with Marshall and Ross present.....probably before they reported back to VMI in Lexington. I had never really heard the Blackfoot/Whitefoot story done that well. We'll probably never be able to separate fact from myth, but either way it's told, it's still a good story. To quote a newspaper editor character in the movie, "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valence," starring John Wayne, Jimmy Stewart, and Lee Marvin, "When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."

[Zipcreature]

Interesting story. I've actually never heard this "Blackfoot/Whitefoot" story, nor did we get to watch the Lords of Discipline movie while pledging, but our new pledges will certainly be watching it.

- Dan Cameron

[banditone]

We all heard the story of black foot / white foot, and we had to know the Lexington Triad info.

We also watched that movie... Which was pretty funny. It was shown at our chapter pretty much when it came out.

[BillS]

Everyone is looking at the official version of the story. You have to read between the lines of the ATO history. First the fraternity was founded after the Civil War to bring young men together from both sides. Second the fraternity lost its way and started to only admit members from old southern families. Third the members were in a secret meeting dressed in white robes. Lets put all three together now. After the civil war southern members of ATO in white robes. Think of D. W. Griffith’s “Birth of a Nation” and you have what was going on in the meeting. I don't think many people today can appreciate how different the South was many years ago.

Am I knocking ATO? No, I was an active member back in the late 60’s and still keep up with the few fraternity brothers still living. I believe fraternities can be a very positive experience. Fraternities, even those based on good moral principals can lose their way and that is what happened to a particular chapter of ATO many years ago.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by BillS

Everyone is looking at the official version of the story. You have to read between the lines of the ATO history. First the fraternity was founded after the Civil War to bring young men together from both sides. Second the fraternity lost its way and started to only admit members from old southern families. Third the members were in a secret meeting dressed in white robes. Lets put all three together now. After the civil war southern members of ATO in white robes. Think of D. W. Griffith’s “Birth of a Nation” and you have what was going on in the meeting. I don't think many people today can appreciate how different the South was many years ago.

Am I knocking ATO? No, I was an active member back in the late 60’s and still keep up with the few fraternity brothers still living. I believe fraternities can be a very positive experience. Fraternities, even those based on good moral principals can lose their way and that is what happened to a particular chapter of ATO many years ago.

Interesting stuff Bill.

This kind of makes me wonder about the 'official' version of our history, i.e., that we were founded "against hazing." I'm beginning to come around to the fact that the anti-hazing thing might be a good message for undergrads to hear as it gives more impetus to the LEAD/anti-hazing movement, but I think it [the founding] is probably a much more complicated story than most of us really know.

[BillS]

Our version if my memory serves me is Sigma Nu was founded to give ATO healthy competition. I even heard people say there were versions of the Sigma Nu crest where the snake was spitting out an ATO badge in disgust. I don’t know how the rumor got started or if it is still out there. No doubt it was from some drunken fraternity party.

[banditone]

Everything good comes from drunken fraternity parties.