Gray Areas of 'Hazing'

[moe.ron]

Link to the Article

Discuss among yourself.

[PhoenixAzul]

The writer makes a good point. Every team has initiation rights...even rowers! We call a person's first flip out of a single their "baptism", you have a pissing contest, where you literally row till you can't row any more, some teams make their freshmen wear costumes during races...it's pretty funny, and it's very similar to what Greeks do.

[Tom Earp]

It just goes to show, that there is Hazing as it were in any group or type of group.

But, Greeks seem to take the most heat for a hazing incident on a Campus.

The really sad part is that having been under the gun so much, We as Greeks Strive or try to Strive Harder to not do Hazing or point out and try to educate our members more than anyone else.

Still, We are the ones who take it in the shorts. But, too, when will We as Greeks ever learn?

[preciousjeni]

I definitely believe there is a difference between a trial and hazing. While I don't believe in destroying people, emotionally or physically, I believe that we are letting New Members/pledges down by not testing them in preparation for the way Greeks are tested on a daily basis.

In most cases, I imagine political correctness has more to do with those judiciary decisions than common sense...Nonetheless, administrators continue to admonish the practice and hammer those unfortunate enough to get caught. That's wrong. Forced drinking is never acceptable. Anything activity that puts a person in clear danger is unacceptable. And any activities which have no beneficial outcomes and serve merely to humiliate or scare another are unacceptable, because those are just the things which put people in the hospital and give sports teams and the Greek system bad reputations. On the contrary, those things which may be hard but have a a purpose and conclude with success have their rightful place among us.

I agree wholeheartedly! It seems very odd to me that we are collegiate GLOs (my comment works only for collegiates - I'm not commenting on non-collegiates because I don't have any experience) but we don't use classroom-type situations to teach our New Members/pledges. When you're in class, you have tests which you either pass or fail. In some classes, you might be able to retake the test, but often with stipulations, or you might simply flunk altogether. You have to sit through long lectures and you are expected to KNOW the information. If you do not know it, you are not a good student. (And, if you do not know your GLO's info, you are not a good member.)

In P.E. type courses, you are expected to work out your body. There will always be exceptions where there are people who are unable to complete and exercise and are excused. That's fine.

Nowhere in school classes - except in ridiculous circumstances with evil professors - are you degraded, beaten, made to do anything harmful (drink too much, eat bad foods, etc.), made to exercise until you are sick - nothing! So, why, as collegiate orgs, would we ever condone such activities?

[lyrica9]

" Anything activity that puts a person in clear danger is unacceptable. And any activities which have no beneficial outcomes and serve merely to humiliate or scare another are unacceptable, because those are just the things which put people in the hospital and give sports teams and the Greek system bad reputations. On the contrary, those things which may be hard but have a a purpose and conclude with success have their rightful place among us. "

i think this would be a much better definition of what hazing is/isnt than what i was taught in new member education. which was something to the degree of "hazing is anything that causes you mental, physical or emotional harm." and somehow includes things like scavenger hunts (not the scary ones, but just around the house or something) and other activities that are usually fun for everyone included.

ive noticed, unlike the writer's campus, that its only the greeks that get admonished/punished for hazing-like activities, while honor societies, service groups and spirit groups have been hazing for decades and no one gets booted for five years.

[tunatartare]

Originally posted by lyrica9
ive noticed, unlike the writer's campus, that its only the greeks that get admonished/punished for hazing-like activities, while honor societies, service groups and spirit groups have been hazing for decades and no one gets booted for five years.

This is very true, and I'm glad you posted this. Sports are pretty big at my school and freshman year one of my guy friends went out for the hockey team. He had an initiation that lasted all night long, when we asked him what happened he said he doesn't remember because he passed out. I've heard of stories from friends in other schools where sports teams and other clubs haze yet are left alone. Can you imagine what the newspapers would say if the same standard was applied to all collegians, and not just Greeks? After finding a freshman boy with alcohol poisoning, the school has broken up the Glee Club, got rid of the men's basketball team, and forbidden anyone from living on the 6th floor of the dorm...

[preciousjeni]

Originally posted by KLPDaisy
Can you imagine what the newspapers would say if the same standard was applied to all collegians, and not just Greeks? After finding a freshman boy with alcohol poisoning, the school has broken up the Glee Club, got rid of the men's basketball team, and forbidden anyone from living on the 6th floor of the dorm...

FOR REAL!

[PureGoldF2K1]

I definitely would NEVER want to haze any of my new members/future sisters (this wasnt so true the first semester I was a full sister and we had new pledges! I really wanted to have some fun with them, but its been 3 years since then I have since realized that its not cool, healthy, beneficial to the chapter in anyway) but I HATE how strict everything is. We're not allowed to hold new member sleepovers (which was an awesome part of my new member experience), quiz them (which in my belief is not in anyway hazing as long as they arent being punished for a bad score....its not considered hazing when a teacher gives you a pop quiz, its a learning tool!) or really do anything besides read information about the sorority off. New members arent even required to attend events which are mandatory for the sisters, which i find ridiculous.

BUT I was New Member Educator of my chapter for many many semesters and we stuck to the rules...and I've had EVERY single one of my new members ask why it was so easy to get in and that they wished it had been challenging in some way. These are all dedicated sisters and I feel badly I couldnt give them the NM period they desired.

I guess I'll end my rant saying that I thoroughly respect my Headquarters decisions regarding our no hazing policy, I just wish things were a little different for Greeks in general

[tunatartare]

Originally posted by PureGoldF2K1
We're not allowed to hold new member sleepovers (which was an awesome part of my new member experience

Are you kidding me? NM sleepovers are the BEST!!! We had one as a sorority a couple of weeks ago and it was great.

[PSUSigKap]

i think back to some of the things i had to do during pledging that are now considered hazing, like manditory study hours and doing sister interviews can be beneficial.

we didn't have to memorize the sisters info and repeat it back or anything, just talk to a certain number and get them to sign a book. i think it helps you get to know sisters who you wouldn't necessarilly talk to, like the seniors if you were a freshman.

looking back i wish my pledging experience had been a little "tougher". though, the women who came after pledged after my class had an "easier" time because of all the policy changes.

[tunatartare]

My school still does mandatory study hours. They're required for NM's of all the GLO's and also for all freshmen on any sports teams, I think they're a really good thing.

[AGDee]

All chapters of AGD are encouraged to have mandatory study house for EVERYBODY. Most chapters have developed a system where, the higher your GPA, the fewer proctored study hours are required. They count computer lab time, tutored hours, set times that are available for the chapter in the library, and study groups. There is nothing wrong with this and should be encouraged for EVERYBODY. That's the key, for everybody. You're all in college/university for the same reason, school.

KLPDaisy: You said the sorority did a sleepover. That's fine too, the whole chapter, all the women, not just the new members. A new member sleepover indicates that it's just the new members and, historically, has involved activities that aren't in accordance with NPC GLOs standards.

Greeks are under a microscope, fair or not, this is the reality and we must behave impeccably to avoid bad publicity and risky situations or else we will cease to exist. If bad things hadn't happened due to scavenger hunts, sister interviews, etc., they would still be allowed. But bad things did happen, repeatedly, at campuses all over the country, so they are no longer allowed. It's like everybody losing lunch recess because 5 kids beat someone up. It's not fair, but it's reality.

Dee

[Wine&SilverBlue]

I don't know how I feel about mandatory study hours. We (all GLOs) had them during lot week for Thurtene Carnival and I found it a pain. I barely got anything done and it was so inconvenient. I have a 3.5+ and like to study on my own, in my room. I think study hours might be a good idea if you have under a 3.0, but I don't think they should be mandatory for the whole chapter.

How do they work anyway? Are there specific times you can go? etc. My chapter DOES have "study hours" where if someone from exec volunteers to be at the library/etc for a certain time span on a certain day, you can earn points for going during those times.

[tunatartare]

In my school it's up to the individual org to decide how they wanna do study hours. Some do it every weekday from a certain point that you have to be in the library. We do ours that the girls can go whenever as long as they do their hours and get them in to the NME. Study hours are also mandatory for anyone who's on academic probation. They have to email their hours to the secretary and the sorority's advisor to make sure that they get them done.

[AGDee]

Originally posted by Wine&SilverBlue
I don't know how I feel about mandatory study hours. We (all GLOs) had them during lot week for Thurtene Carnival and I found it a pain. I barely got anything done and it was so inconvenient. I have a 3.5+ and like to study on my own, in my room. I think study hours might be a good idea if you have under a 3.0, but I don't think they should be mandatory for the whole chapter.

How do they work anyway? Are there specific times you can go? etc. My chapter DOES have "study hours" where if someone from exec volunteers to be at the library/etc for a certain time span on a certain day, you can earn points for going during those times.

I was better at self studying too, but, as a result of a good GPA, I only had to attend like two hours a week, where someone with a 2.2 might have to put in 10 hours. I would plan to do things that didn't take too much concentration or that required library resources anyway (this was before the internet, when we had to go to the library for EVERYTHING!). Each chapter works it a little differently, but yes, the scholarship committee sets up proctors (everybody has to take a turn at that too) who have people sign in and out during a certain time period. Like I said earlier though, they would also include time spent with a tutor, in a computer lab, or in a study group (some majors do a lot of group work). The details are up to the chapter to come up with what works for them. Sometimes any time spent studying in the presence of a sister would count, so sisters with like majors or in the same class could study together. For chapters with houses, the study hours could also be held in the house, say, in the dining room, during certain hours. Some chapters set up study buddies with upperclassman paired with underclassman, etc. Each chapter I oversee does them a little bit differently, but they all have them in some form.

Dee