total problems

[AlethiaSi]

recently the sororities on my campus have been.. uh.. fighting about total. now... alpha phi (i'm only saying the name b/c i'm curious to see if other chapters have heard about this) is at total... is actually past total.. so i've heard..

anyway

Pan-hell wants to lower total to 60 or so to give the other chapters a chance to catch up b/c they are at or around 50 but 75 is a bit too high for them (numbers have been low all around... but aphi has been at total for years... ??) and a phi has offered to contact the nationals of the other sororities to see if its ok if the school can keep it at 75. They have created a severe divide between themselves and everyone else. the thing is- they are the biggest sorority and have serious campus connections... so i'm really not sure what will happen

now- my sorority has kind of kept out of the debate since it doesn't really concern us being a local and all- but the general consensus has been that aphi is being.. well... a bit selfish in this. i don't really know any other way to say it- and granted i don't know that much and am not supposed to know as much.. but word gets around.

my question is... are other campuses experiencing something similar? and i don't mean to "attack" alpha phi- they are a wonderful group of girls - but they are the ones waging this "war" and i'm curious to see if other alpha phi chapters know anything about it...

thanks

[roqueemae]

Since Alpha Phi is already above the 75 total, how would it help them by keeping total the same?

The other groups can pledge up to total. If APhi is above the 75 total, they would be fine where they are and would not be able to bring in any more pledges until the next FR period. It would only be a problem if the total would be raised to higher than they already are, then they would be able to continue growing.

By putting a lower cap on the other sororites at 60, they would be limiting themselves--they would never be able to reach the 75 that APhi has. APhi would be able to remain the largest group because they would get quota at FR and keep building.

Did I read this right? It seems that by lowering total, the system could suffer by not having an incentive for chapters to bring in new girls to reach (a higher) total. I know nationals always encouraged my collegiate chapter to COR if we had the chance, even for only 1 or 2 girls, to take advantage of every slot available.

[Tom Earp]

WOW, another Hot Potato!

YES, why not lower the Chapter numbers, yes, give others a better chance to grow?

Oh, We cannot do that as We want to be big.

Well, the stronger the Greek System is, the stronger We all are.

What I dont understand, is why Sororitys have to be so big? Is
it that so no others can grow?

Got Mein, I need to Let Erik know about this thread!

He would love it!

[SplitzSTG]

Here at YSU, ZTA is the front-runner. They've been at quota (40) for as long as I can remember, but the other sororities are staging a comeback. For a while, only ZTA had a house, but I think all of them have one now.

I know from the fraternity standpoint, we dont have quotas thank god. My chapter has just under 40 guys, and will probably be above 50 by this time next year. We do it by recruiting year round, kind of unofficially. A brother will invite a potential to the house just to hang out. We dont even mention rushing for a while, until a consensus amongst the brothers that the guy should rush. Usually takes a semester of 'courting' before we actually initiate rush talk. Usually, the potential will bring it up first. I actually think around 2% of our brothers were aquired during rush week. It's just not a good forum to bring in new members.

I know that Panhel operates differently than IFC on every level, but it's something to think about. A lot has to do with visibility on campus and in the community. We've actually installed a University Relations Chair under our Programs Department. It all comes back to PR.

We've always been more concerned with initiating quality brothers, and not just numbers. I think once you move into that mentality as a group, you'll find that the girls you bring in will have a very positive effect on Rush.

Hope some of this helped.

[Firehouse]

Gosh, let's take the most popular group and hold them back so that the less popular groups can "catch up". It's not "fair" that they get more pledges. Thank God the fraternities don't think like this. Let competition determine who the big dogs are.

[Tom Earp]

Mike very well put! What is YSU?

STG at PSU, Ks, is a Great Chapter!

Damn, a Fraternity started at Warrensberg Mo. Who would have thunk it, and still growing!

[LightBulb]

Originally posted by Tom Earp
Mike very well put! What is YSU?

Youngstown State University - it's in his signature.

[valkyrie]

Originally posted by Firehouse
Gosh, let's take the most popular group and hold them back so that the less popular groups can "catch up". It's not "fair" that they get more pledges. Thank God the fraternities don't think like this. Let competition determine who the big dogs are.

Agreed.

If people want to join Alpha Phi more than the other groups, that's not Alpha Phi's problem. What are the other groups doing to make themselves more appealing?

[SplitzSTG]

Originally posted by Tom Earp

[/B] STG at PSU, Ks, is a Great Chapter!

[/B]

Sig Tau is a great fraternity, what can I say. I think it's because we put so much emphasis on academics. We never say it, but "Student first, brother second" is pretty much the vision.

[AGDee]

The NPC Green Book gives a few options for specific methods of calculating Total on a campus. If there are not enough women going through Recruitment to support the current Total, then it should be re-visited. While one chapter may be at Total "for as long as anybody remembers", most people who are local to the campus only remember the past few years. In my experience, on most campuses, this will cycle through different groups. A few years ago, one of the AGD chapters that I oversee were fighting lowering total. Two of the chapters on their campus were at Total for a few years in a row, two of the chapters were at about half of total. So, we had two chapters at 50, two at 25 and quota was around 9 every semester. We strongly encouraged our women to vote to lower total because it was clear that the campus wasn't supporting Total. The two bigger chapters voted against it, so it was deadlocked.

6 years later, same campus... Now there are two chapters at 40, AGD has around 35 and there is one chapter around 25. They still haven't lowered total. These chapters are doing COB year 'round, which I think is exhausting for them and detracts from all the other things that they do, because everybody is focused on recruitment ALL the time. Total should be fluid on some campuses. It can be looked at every year if necessary. If suddenly almost all the groups are very near total, then they can raise it again.

The biggest group on campus will always be resistive to this, but the Greek system as a whole tends to be more healthy when the sororities are more equal. NPC isn't about "survival of the fittest", it's about cooperating and fostering strength for all.

Dee

[AlethiaSi]

Originally posted by AGDee
The NPC Green Book gives a few options for specific methods of calculating Total on a campus. If there are not enough women going through Recruitment to support the current Total, then it should be re-visited. While one chapter may be at Total "for as long as anybody remembers", most people who are local to the campus only remember the past few years. In my experience, on most campuses, this will cycle through different groups. A few years ago, one of the AGD chapters that I oversee were fighting lowering total. Two of the chapters on their campus were at Total for a few years in a row, two of the chapters were at about half of total. So, we had two chapters at 50, two at 25 and quota was around 9 every semester. We strongly encouraged our women to vote to lower total because it was clear that the campus wasn't supporting Total. The two bigger chapters voted against it, so it was deadlocked.

6 years later, same campus... Now there are two chapters at 40, AGD has around 35 and there is one chapter around 25. They still haven't lowered total. These chapters are doing COB year 'round, which I think is exhausting for them and detracts from all the other things that they do, because everybody is focused on recruitment ALL the time. Total should be fluid on some campuses. It can be looked at every year if necessary. If suddenly almost all the groups are very near total, then they can raise it again.

The biggest group on campus will always be resistive to this, but the Greek system as a whole tends to be more healthy when the sororities are more equal. NPC isn't about "survival of the fittest", it's about cooperating and fostering strength for all.

Dee

wow- so true. Everyone's feedback has helped me to put this into perspective. It is true that we do COB all year round... and it is exhausting- as the smallest chapter we have had a few large classes and a bunch smaller ones- almost every sorority has put through two classes a semester except for alpha phi...

This past fall something weird happened- all of us had a weird rush- low numbers- lots of freshman (they can't pledge 1st semester) but each sorority got about 5 plus one in particular got 16... however, as the weeks passed by... everyone started dropping like crazy... the 16 turned to 1 -7 turned to 3... and so on.. (we kept our girls- luckily) but alpha phi declared they had 5... but 8 were showing up to the house for call-outs

(the greek system is small and they haven't exactly been BFF with the other chapters- they kind of watch each other... sad as that is... so everyone talks to one another)

however- they were already above total... i'll leave you to make your own conclusions....

i hope they lower total so it gives everyone a chance to catch up- the system isn't supported and its very one sided... but... i'm not pan-hell... so.. again... i was just curious about this...

i appreciate any and all feedback... thanks again

[Tom Earp]

Thanx, LightBulb!!

Sometimes I forget to pull the chain.

[roqueemae]

Is your sorority a part of the College Panhellenic?

You say that you are not a part of the Pan-hell, are you referring to the Pan-hellenic Council on your campus? Or that since you are a local, your organization is not a part of the National Panhellenic Conference? If you are a part of the College Panhellenic, you have every right to bring up concerns that you have. Recruitment issues would be a part of the College Panhellenic's domain.

I agree with AGDee about if all of the sororities are significantly below total that it should be lowered. I doesn't make sense for all chapters to be recruiting year round. The new recruitment resolutions recommend figuring total by averaging chapter size, largest chapter size, median chapter size, or the amount it takes to maintain the chapter functioning. (I believe) It also states that quota can be revisited every year. Determining quota would be a majority vote of the College Panhellenic. If all of the chapters besides APhi want to change total, it shouldn't be a problem.

I still think lowering total would keep the other chapters from having the opportunity to grow by putting a limit on them. FR will keep coming and if APhi has a good retention rate, they will always remain larger than the others.

BTW how did that chapter get 16 if quota was 5? Did they COR that many after Formal Recruitment?

[AlethiaSi]

yea- they did COB like crazy- very rarely do any chapters get a lot of girls from formal- or even informal... its a weird system...unfortunately since we don't have as high numbers- we don't have to worry about quota- (keeping fingers crossed for this semester though... at least 8 are def interested... )

as far as my comment about being a part of pan-hell- i meant me personally lol- my local is a member of the college's pan hellenic group- but not national... does that make sense? lol sorry for the confusion

[sigtau305]

Originally posted by SplitzSTG
Sig Tau is a great fraternity, what can I say. I think it's because we put so much emphasis on academics. We never say it, but "Student first, brother second" is pretty much the vision.