NPc Compact and interest groups?

[James]

From what I understand, the local PC has to unanimously approve expansion to a school.

When I see most of the threads talking about expansion, its from the point of view of the local PC looking to exapand and inviting groups to give presentations.

But what happens when you have a group of girls that want to create a sorority and have already decided they don't want to join the existing ones? Why does the local PC often stand in that groups way?

Lets say on a campus total is 70 and an interest group forms around some dynamic girl(s) and has like 60 members. This is a population that wasn't going to join an existing sorority. They have been on campus and looked around.

Why is the Local PC going to prevent them from affiliating? ?Is it just to be mean? Or is it a failure to understand economics?

I have seen this happen several times.

[PenguinTrax]

Is it a matter that the local group wants to affiliate with an NPC or that the local group wants to stay local and join the local PC?

The the case of the former, the local PC may not have the statistics that show the campus can support another group. Yes, in the example you've shown, the startup group has 60 members. But, can they maintain those numbers in the long run? If the campus statistics show that the number of women going through recruitment won't be enough to maintain those kind of numbers, then expansion shouldn't happen.

In the second example I mention, there are facilities within the NPC agreements that allow local groups to become associate members of the PC, but only if the local PC has allowed for that within their own Constitution & Bylaws.

[James]

I am talking about where the group wants to affiliate with an NPC group.

In two of the cases I know of the interest group was forced to jump through hurdles for a couple years by the local PC and basically strong armed into letting them on by the administration.

Both groups are at or near total years later and the actual membership of all the greek orgs stayed the same except fort he weak group. The groups at total stayed at total, the groups struggling actually increased in numbers. And a higher percentage of the school is Greek.

I would question the . . . uhm . . science a local Pc is using to judge what is "sustainable" on a campus.

I know thats anecdotal but still its a measure of concern because a lot of local PC's would never have allowed those two groups on and a lot of administrations wouldn't have gotten involved.

[shadokat]

Local PCs will keep statistics on recruitment, retention and the like so that if a situation arises where an opportunity to expand presents itself, it has the data to review to be able to determine if the campus can support and sustain another chapter. Just like with recruitment, the NPC has these rules in place to help the chapters that are already on campus to remain.

If I were on a campus with a very weak chapter and had an interest group of a large number, I'd go through informal COB at the weak sorority and then take it over. You can then turn it into the sorority you want it to be, barring you aren't planning to become a hazing and risk management nightmare to an NPC group. I've seen this happen at 2 schools, with a LOT of success.

[33girl]

Did these groups want a *specific* NPC or just any NPC in general? If a group keeps saying they want to be (for example) Phi Mu and Phi Mu wants nothing to do with that school or that group, that's not the panhel's fault.

[James]

No it was an NPC in general. They just didn't want to belong to an existing sorority on campus.

They had no trouble attracting National interest, the local PC was the log jam.



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Originally posted by 33girl
Did these groups want a *specific* NPC or just any NPC in general? If a group keeps saying they want to be (for example) Phi Mu and Phi Mu wants nothing to do with that school or that group, that's not the panhel's fault.

[James]

I can see this being an option, although it would be a distant second preference to starting a fresh new sorority without a reputation or members that you didn't want.

The initial idea was to not join an existing organization.

Plus, I am not sure how ethical it is to bum rush another organization with the sole purpose of minimizing or ousting its existing membership as well as rewriting its entire place on campus. Seems deceitful.

Originally posted by shadokat
Local PCs will keep statistics on recruitment, retention and the like so that if a situation arises where an opportunity to expand presents itself, it has the data to review to be able to determine if the campus can support and sustain another chapter. Just like with recruitment, the NPC has these rules in place to help the chapters that are already on campus to remain.

If I were on a campus with a very weak chapter and had an interest group of a large number, I'd go through informal COB at the weak sorority and then take it over. You can then turn it into the sorority you want it to be, barring you aren't planning to become a hazing and risk management nightmare to an NPC group. I've seen this happen at 2 schools, with a LOT of success.

[carnation]

Originally posted by shadokat
If I were on a campus with a very weak chapter and had an interest group of a large number, I'd go through informal COB at the weak sorority and then take it over. You can then turn it into the sorority you want it to be, barring you aren't planning to become a hazing and risk management nightmare to an NPC group. I've seen this happen at 2 schools, with a LOT of success.

How did they do this? Did they get a bunch of friends to join when they did or did they rush and recruit strong people later?

[James]

Another way to do it . . .

Sometimes sororities or fraternities will sell their chapters out by absorbing a large interest group and doling out officer positions to the new people as well as offering/forcing alum status to active brothers/sisters that don't like it or don't fit in with the new chapter ideal.

I think they only do it to chapters with numbers issues. Seems . . . uhm . . unfortunate to say the least.

Originally posted by carnation
How did they do this? Did they get a bunch of friends to join when they did or did they rush and recruit strong people later?

[33girl]

Originally posted by James
Another way to do it . . .

Sometimes sororities or fraternities will sell their chapters out by absorbing a large interest group and doling out officer positions to the new people as well as offering/forcing alum status to active brothers/sisters that don't like it or don't fit in with the new chapter ideal.

I think they only do it to chapters with numbers issues. Seems . . . uhm . . unfortunate to say the least.

I can assure you that isn't what Heather meant. You're talking about a recolonization - she means the members of a smaller chapter and an interest group reaching out to each other. It takes a lot of respect and work but it can be done. It all depends on the campus how well this works.

However there are times it might not work - i.e. if the group of women is looking for a sorority with a Jewish background and the group in question has oodles o' Christian references.

It seems that fewer and fewer recolonizations are being done while the "old" members are still on campus. No matter how delicately it's handled, there are people with hurt feelings and with all the new venues out there for people to voice their displeasure, it's just not worth it. Even if you lose your spot in Panhel and can't get back in.

[shadokat]

No, what I mean is that a group of women on a PA state school campus (West Chester), and when I say group, I mean like 30 or so, wanted to start an new sorority...the campus said no. They said to themselves, ok, what's the weakest sorority on campus? XYZ (I'm not naming names). So they all went and rushed the sorority during spring COB, and all 30 of them took their bids. The chapter itself had about 20 women, so with more NMs than actives, their NM program went by pretty quickly. At the end of the spring semester, the chapter had elections, and by block voting, the new 30 women got all of their girls into the leadership. Then, those 30 women went out before the end of the spring, got about 15 more of their friends to commit to pledge in the fall, adding more to "their side" than the other side. During fall formal recruitment, they got quota for the first time in years and from there, well, you can figure it out. The chapter is now one of the largest on campus, has a GREAT reputation and is doing incredibly well.

Now, was it unethical of these women to go into this, knowing that they wanted to "take over" this group? I don't think so. They went into a chapter who obviously couldn't help themselves and turned it around. The 20 or so women who were from the "other side" stayed active and are now alums, and from what I know, are fine with it.

Originally posted by carnation
How did they do this? Did they get a bunch of friends to join when they did or did they rush and recruit strong people later?

[shadokat]

The situation I referred to in my previous post is what I was talking about. As for what you mean James, 33girl is right. I did help my own chapter through a recolonization, and yes, it was hard, but it was the best move we could make for that chapter. The active members were told upfront how the program would work, and were all offered early alumnae status if they weren't on board. Only 3 took it. IMHO, you can only let a chapter sit out there and flounder for so long before you take the reins and say, hey, we need to help steer this ship the right way. I have never done a recolonization of a chapter that involved MAKING women take alumnae status, although it does happen. If I had my choice, I probably WOULD have done that, but it wasn't my option to say.

As a national/international organization, all of the chapters are ultimately responsible to their HQs for paying their fees, following the required standards, etc. If the international/national sorority isn't getting what is expected from the chapter, I believe they have the right to try to make realistic changes to the group to help them become successful.

I know a lot of people won't agree with me on this, but basically, without your national organization, you aren't a member of a national sorority. If you look at your chapter of XYZ as all there is of that group, then you're making a big mistake. National/International organizations have the obligation to make their collegiate chapters aware that they are all members of the same national organization, and their chapter is just one part of the whole. If chapters don't like that, they should've gone local.

OK, off my soapbox, because I've gone WAAAAAAAY off target here

Originally posted by 33girl
I can assure you that isn't what Heather meant. You're talking about a recolonization - she means the members of a smaller chapter and an interest group reaching out to each other. It takes a lot of respect and work but it can be done. It all depends on the campus how well this works.

However there are times it might not work - i.e. if the group of women is looking for a sorority with a Jewish background and the group in question has oodles o' Christian references.

It seems that fewer and fewer recolonizations are being done while the "old" members are still on campus. No matter how delicately it's handled, there are people with hurt feelings and with all the new venues out there for people to voice their displeasure, it's just not worth it. Even if you lose your spot in Panhel and can't get back in.