Why Anti-Expansion?

[Firehouse]

Some of the undergraduates at my fraternity chapter mentioned last night that the campus really needs more Panhellenic sororities. There are twenty IFC fraternities of varying size, but only thirteen sororities. All the sororities are large with one exception. We are a large southern campus of 36,000 students, mostly residential. The sororities have big houses and large memberships. There is no shortage of prospects.
Here's where I fail to understand Panhellenic thinking. Since 1960 no new sorority has colonized our campus (one left and came back successfully within a year or so). Almost all are consistently large, strong and successful. No matter how many sororities there are, there is always someone who doesn't recruit well and has trouble.
Since 1960, like clockwork, every five-to-seven years we lose another sorority. Who will be lost each time is very obvious; there is always someone occupying the bottom rung of the system. Low membership is always the culprit.
In forty years we have lost five sororities, at regular intervals, each of whom at one time as large and well-housed. None of those sororities have come back, one assumes because they have not been allowed/asked. No new sororities have been added.
Right now, we have thirteen, and everyone can tell you who is the next in line to go under. There were once large, and they still have a nice big house.
The system is strong, but when pressed for an answer as to why no new sororities, they say 'Well, we can't expand until everyone is at total'. Do they not understand that SOMEONE IS ALWAYS going to be struggling?
It seems obvious, to me anyway, that adding new sororities will bring increased energy and a more competitive dynamic to the system...and might even help the one on the bottom get back up to where they once were.

[33girl]

Originally posted by Firehouse
In forty years we have lost five sororities, at regular intervals, each of whom at one time as large and well-housed. None of those sororities have come back, one assumes because they have not been allowed/asked.

Don't assume - they may have been asked back and said "hell no" cause of the previous bad experience they had.

I agree that there will always be smaller chapters - I'd also argue that there are women who LIKE being in smaller chapters, but if you talk to the national HQs of sororities they would vehemently disagree. A lot of times it's not the size itself that is the culprit - it's the constant pressure to increase numbers from HQ, which stresses out the sisters and makes it hard for them to recruit effectively. Which makes the sorority smaller, which leads to more pressure etc etc.

So when you take out the sororities that have been there and don't want to come back, and the sororities that are nationally smaller and cannot afford to have comparable housing, you aren't left with anyone willing to take the chance.

Why is it always numbers, numbers, numbers? I mean I understand if you only have 5-10 and everyone else has maybe 50 or 60 but if you're only a few behind other sororities on campuse you're labeled as the underdog and unpopular. We have a sorority on my campus and they never get the numbers but they're just as dedicated as any other sorority, maybe more so. I have just always wondered why national headquarters push numbers over quality?

[adpiucf]

Originally posted by scpiano211
Why is it always numbers, numbers, numbers? I mean I understand if you only have 5-10 and everyone else has maybe 50 or 60 but if you're only a few behind other sororities on campuse you're labeled as the underdog and unpopular. We have a sorority on my campus and they never get the numbers but they're just as dedicated as any other sorority, maybe more so. I have just always wondered why national headquarters push numbers over quality?

1) Dues to support HQ
2) Cost of Overhead is less with more members, lowering local dues
3) Longevity and membership retention-- the more members, the better to recruit with and the lower the blow when people graduate or leave the sorority for other reasons

[WhiteDaisy128]

Haha, we have you beat! We have 23 IFC fraternities and only 6 panhellenic sororities. During IFC recruitment the sororities are doing mixers every night! It's crazy!

[Eirene_DGP]

Firehouse this is not uncommon. I know at our school the NPC orgs have had a hard time meeting numbers, but from what I have heard from the student body it is because they are not interested in those particular orgs. So basically it is a no win situation where the current orgs will continue to struggle and as a result, other great orgs are being kept out.

[33girl]

Originally posted by adpiucf
2) Cost of Overhead is less with more members, lowering local dues

I don't think that has anything to do with it at some campuses - we had one of the smaller chapters on our campus and also had the cheapest dues. Of course if you build a San Simeon-esque house, your dues are going to shoot through the roof to support it.

I think that if an effort would be made among all the sororities at the national level to decrease the emphasis on numbers, it would be a beneficial thing for everyone. The reason sororities on a campus think smallest = worst is because that is the attitude passed on from HQ. Fraternities on the other hand, from what I've seen size doesn't always matter and sometimes is inversely applied (i.e. the smallest fraternity is the most exclusive, and therefore the best).

I agree with you 33grl because the one sorority that doesn't always get the numbers on my campus has the cheapest dues. So in their case, no, more members don't mean cheaper dues. I happen to know my sorority's dues is the highest on campus whereas the others fall in the middle of us and the cheapest.

EDITED TO ADD: Even though my sorority has the correct numbers, etc., if I was in the position of not always getting numbers I'd much rather have quality girls than get numbers. Why you might ask? With a quality, dedicated new member class that's small is much better than a bigger one where there's members that don't participate and give their all and/or drop out.

Don't get me wrong. I love each and every new member that has come into our sorority. There's just been some to drop, etc. I don't have anything against them. Maybe the smaller new member classes have a better advantage because the sisters of that smaller sorority can focus more attention to each new member.

[AchtungBaby80]

Maybe some people are so anti-expansion because they see another chapter as a threat?

Maybe who knows, right? I don't know if anyone would openly admit that or not.

[Erik P Conard]

some campi discourage expansion, waiting 'til the bottom ones
get "quota" But then with 2,000 girls going thru rush for ten sororities, there is a build up of considerable animosity. And a
90 girl pledge class is hardly a close group. Rarely do you EVER find the smallest group more "exclusive" Girls and guys would rather be GDIs than join the wimpy group(s) unless there is a concerted effort to re-build. When it takes three or four men's groups to combine in order to have a function with one of
these large sororities then something's awry and much is lost in terms of a good greek experience. And if your weenie small group truly has quality you will quickly not be small as everyone will want to join you. Quotas have been proven detrimental and the free enterprise system works when the door is open. We wonder why our kids do not join...we loved our chapters and no
matter how hard we tried, we could not sell it to younger kids...
and the 'dumbing down' of the colleges...have perhaps let a lot in who do not belong....I simply do not know, but do know that the 150+ chapters have horrendous attrition and darned little closeness. The IFCs and PanHels ought to do what they were intended to do....help each other, not make stupid regs and rules and exercise quotas...duh...but good luck....the system is still worth savin' Old Teke, hopin' for comebacks....

[SmartBlondeGPhB]

Originally posted by WhiteDaisy128
Haha, we have you beat! We have 23 IFC fraternities and only 6 panhellenic sororities. During IFC recruitment the sororities are doing mixers every night! It's crazy!

Now THAT'S crazy...........

[Firehouse]

By your use of the word "campi" and other philosophy, I sense you are a follower of Heller. Me too. I corresponded with him some but never met him. Greeks made a huge surge in the 1980s, then faded in the 1990s. Now, it seems to me that we are making a pretty dramatic comeback.

[Erik P Conard]

I met Wilson Benton Heller many times, dined with him and wrote to him, have kept most of his letters, er, papers...
The word campi was in my vocabulary long before I was a TKE or even a collegian. It is the Latin plural for campus.
I would like to agree with you as regards a great rebound, but
I simply do not see it, and from where I sit today's Greek
undergrads yet do not understand the words discretion, manners or consequences. Until all chapters have functioning boards and chapter advisors, the slide will continue.
Sure wish that the comeback trail would be near, and that we will have a self-fulfilling prophecy.
HOWEVER, chapter losses continue, and today's Greeks still do
not seem to understand what we are trying to say...us alums. Huge chapter losses continue, and check with your HQ as to those numbers, if you can get them. NIC has them. Men, we must have size to pay our mounting bills and the dinky 40
man chapter simply does not cut it.
SO, let us continue to try to get back on track, huh?

[madmax]

Originally posted by Erik P Conard
Quotas have been proven detrimental and the free enterprise system works when the door is open.

If quotas have proven to be detrimental then how come the sororities on a typical campus are larger, have more PNM's go through rush and have less inactive chapters?


On one hand you tell us bigger is better, but then on the other hand you tell us the quota system is detrimental even though the sororities are bigger than fraternities.