'Branding'

[SilverTurtle]

My question is obviously about the act of branding, especially during pledging & initiations. I know that many fraternities (especially traditionally black frats)practice this, at least 'secretly'. (I have rarely heard of sororities practicing it).
While I understand the idea is that you belong to the frat and your brothers for life, I don't understand why it is still practiced. Aside from obvious reasons (anti-hazing policies, health concerns, etc.) a lot of folks believe that the concept originated from slavery. Many American slaves were branded, just as cattle, to show ownership. Since branding at least seems most prevalent among black frats, I think it is interesting that they would practice it, given its history.

I know that many people will defend the practice, but I was just curious as to how you view it in relationship to slavery and ownership.
I believe the membership owns the fraternity, not that the fraternity owns them.

-carrie

[bellsouth7]

I don't actually know the exact history behind the branding. But I am in a black sorority. People don't always get brands while they are pladging and some do. Most of the people I know did it because they wanted to. I know sorors who have tattoos which represent the sorority. This has nothing to do with the slavery issue, but both are permanent. Its like wearing a shirt with your letters on it. Why do you do that? To show that you a part of your organization and demonstrate your pride. Except with the branding and tattoos, you always have your letters or symbol on you. And, it is a permanent sign which shows your lifelong devotion to your group. All and all I believe it is something to be proud of and show off and not a sign of ownership. We know that "The sorority doesn't make you, YOU make the sorority".

[AKAtude]

They do not practice branding "secretly". It is up to the individual whether they decide to be branded or not. It has nothing to do with the history of slavery, but as a permanent reminder of their love for the organization.

[SilverTurtle]

AKAtude,

From what I have been told (both by those who have been branded and those who haven't), it often takes place during or around initiation.
As for it's secrecy, I don't think it's anything members announce they will be doing to their governing bodies, even though these bodies have to know it goes on.

Thanks for your insight.

[Aka190820]

Actually branding does have a relationship to slavery (simply because branding was used to identify slaves and establish ownership). Current fraternity and sorority branding is done for similar reasons. Members want to show pride and of course mark their organizations on their bodies as a sign of eternal membership. I know a lot of people with brands and they all have their "hits" done after they were members, not during initiation. My father has a brand and he basicially did it because that was the thing to do. It is a trend that is not endorsed by the national organizations. It is a sign of solidarity. I think its unfortunate that people want to associate branding of free people in the 20th century with something that was done to people who were viewed as property almost two hundred years ago. Branding is simply body-art in support of an organizational affliation. Nothing more, nothing less. By the way, women get branded too! The only similarity is the act of branding, not the meaning.

[Alabama]

Why do you relate everything to blacks and slavery? Good god get over it already. They branded cows and horses before they did anything to slaves, so are we going to relate what happens to animals now, that we treat pledges and probies like animals? This is shit, No one can be forced to do anything, remember, if someone doesn't want to do it they don't have to and nothing is held against them. If they can't stand up for what they believe in do you really want them in your greek organization?

[west coast pretty boy]

Here we go again!!!

AKAtude and Alabama.
Thank you for explaining to these cretonnes the meaning of this ritual. The bottom line, as you have put it, is that it is body art, symbolizing our eternal membership and love for our organization. It has absolutely nothing to do with slavery. And those of you drawing a line of comparison to the slavery practices should be ashamed to call yourselves educated. That means your ass Turtle Boy. Peace to those who can "feel" what I mean.

Turtle Ass
Its not a practice of the organization as a whole, and neither is pearcing ears or getting tattoos or anything else done for its cosmetic effect. So therefore it does not have to be reported to the governing body.

Damn. SOME PEPOLE ARE JUST STUPID!!!

The WCPB
The WCPB
The WCPB K

[SilverTurtle]

west coast pretty boy-

For your information, the reason I brought this up was because of a conversation with some friends who happen to be AFRICAN-AMERICAN GREEKS AND PERSONALLY THINK IT REFLECTS THE ATTITUDE OF OWNERSHIP associated with slavery. I could care less if you want to brand your body in 50 places to show what a diehard fratboy you are... it's a shame you have to cling to your frat so much that you can't exercise any free thought.

I think it is an interesting hypothesis about the act of branding, so I wanted to hear some other opinions. I expected folks to defend it, and I just wondered if they saw the same association or not.

I also think it is great to have pride in your GLO, and if that is one way you want to show your pride, more power to you. (As long as it is your decision).

To the rest of you folks who responded,
thank you for acting like mature adults & speaking w/ open minds. I guess on the west coast that is considered ignorance or something.

[MetroMonday]

West Coast Pretty Boy--
ROCK ON!

To everyone else that started this crap...

Why does everything have to do with slavery? It ended last millennium. Get over it. You weren't affected by it, so stop using it as a cop-out. People started branding to show their LIFE-LONG assosiation with their GLO. If you can't handle the fact that when you join GLO's you are in it for life (or at least the ones that mean anything) then you shouldn't have even started the post.

Oh, by the way, I am on the east coast...I guess it is everywhere that people aren't mature, huh?

[SilverTurtle]

Actually, if you talk to any Sociology or Political Science students (among others) you will find out that slavery indeed *does* affect us even today.

To give you an example..
When U.S. slaves were first 'free' they lived in forced segregation. Then folks like Rosa Parks began fighting that idea. And there was the beginning of the civil rights movement. But at the same time, there were the faction of blacks that agreed with Malcolm X that blacks and whites *should* be segregated (not to mention all of the white folk who felt this way). Anyways, as a result of all of this, African-Americans and white Americans lived in separate parts of town. Since African-Americans hadn't had the chance to start building their own free lives for long, they naturally had fewer marketable skills, had harder times finding good paying jobs, little acceptance into the work force, other than w/ other African Americans, etc. So they could only afford to live in certain areas. To this day (all of this is on a national level, and GENERALIZATIONS), blacks live in lower income housing than whites, get paid less (even for the same work!), and have fewer opportunities. Their overall socio-economic status is a direct result of their being slaves 200 years ago. And that affects ALL of us, in good and bad ways. There are of course exceptions, but this is just the ways it is.

The same kind of think is true when you look at ANY minority group (Native Americans, Hispanics, etc.).

No, it isn't affecting me like it would have had I been alive in 1850, but I still live with the results of it daily, as do the rest of you. I'm glad that we are a generation of Americans who are ready to look forward and *change* the current situation, but you can't deny that it exists.

[PiKappGSU]

I know its a shiity topic to relate everything to slavery. But it is important to understand our history so that we don't repeat the mistakes.

[the411]

I actually understand where each one of you is coming from. I am a PROUD member of Delta Sigma Theta Sorority, Inc. (a BGLO), and I have been engaged in conversations regarding this very topic. As the sister organization of Omega Psi Phi Fraternity (of which branding is an attribute), I have pondered the significance of branding myself. On the one hand, I agree that, given the history of branding slaves (Yes, I'm bringing up slavery!), one would wonder why an African American would voluntarily brand himself. But, on the other hand, I can understand why it's important as a means of showing the lifelong commitments we've made to our organizations.

I founded a Black Greek Council at my alma mater because the BGLO's on my campus were not recognized and appreciated for their uniqueness, protocol, traditions and intake processes. When I began the legwork to "break away" from the IFC and Pan-Hell governing bodies, many people accused the BGLOs of perpetuating segregation. The fact is and always will be that WE ARE DIFFERENT! When we become members of our organizations, we vow to be lifelong, active, members forever engulfed in our culture and in service to our people. I can truly understand why one would want to acknowledge that attachment with a brand. And, have you ever thought that perhaps the use of a brand symbolizes the pain, bloodshed and stuggle of our ancestors? Maybe it's our way of "connecting" with them and remembering what they went through and where we came from. I personally am not disgusted by or pulled against branding because white slave owners used the method to show possession of their slaves. I am simply reminded of my heritage and of the huge distance my people have travelled over the years.

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Pi Kappa
#3 SPR97
QUINTESSENCE

[SilverTurtle]

the411-

THANK YOU for finally answering my original inquiry--> you are the first person who actually related how/why/if slavery had any impact on your thinking of branding, and then explained it. And I can definately understand your opinion. Thanks for the insight!

[KDRSCOTT]

411 and SilverTurtle. I am in an IFC frat, and my chapter does practice branding for *BROTHERS* who want one. Notice, that it is something completely up to the person after pledging. I never gave a thought to the aspect of slavery when I got mine. I thought of the heritage of the act in my GLO chapter. That is the only history that matters. I thought of how much my GLO meant to me, and how much I wanted to show that. I haven't regretted it to this day. The thing that worries me most about this topic however is 411's comment that when people complained about them pulling out of IFC/Panhel that it was justified because they were different. This shows the double standard in todays society. If it were an all white glo pulling out then it would be on the news and broadcast as the most ugly incident of racism in years. I agree with Silver Turtle that racism and slavery still have a negative effect on todays society, but it's effect is two-fold, although it is rarely seen because AA on White racism is often looked upon as no big deal or even appropriate by society. At my school, which I'll call CDU, there are two paegants. one for MIss CDU, and one for Miss Black CDU. Last year both were black, but why was the second even necesssary? Greek life in general is dying in this country. It's time for blacks and whites and everyone else to quit squabbling about petty differences to get together and make sure we all have someplace to go back to 20 years from now on homecoming.

Scott

[the411]

Scott,

You are echoing those same ignorant responses we received when we began the groundwork for establishing the Black Greek Council. Before educating you, let me first ask you-- How much do you REALLY know about BGLOs and how/why they differ?!?!?!?

At my university, all fraternities and sororities were governed by IFC and PanHell, who received annual budgets of $8,000 and $6,000 respectively (I attended a very small school with 2,000 students). Those funds were distributed to GLOs based on membership size to fund Rush and GreekWeek activities. I trust that, being a member of the greek community, you know that the membership intake processes for BGLOs are very DIFFERENT (yes, I said "different") than the intake processes for traditionally/predominantly white fraternities and sororities. Our process is much like a college application process, and what we call "rush" is, at most, a 2 to 3-hour informational for interested individuals to receive necessary info in order to pursue membership. See, we don't do bids and have our prospects visit houses-- our prospects seek and pursue only ONE sorority or frat based on the research they've done prior to the rush/informational. So, by coming to the rush, they are announcing, publically, that they want to join our organization. There is no party, no booze, no socializing-- we use the rush as a means of outling the criteria for membership, anti-hazing policies and giving deadlines for the application process.

SO... with this in mind, and because our organizations tend to be quite small in number (it is not uncommon for a BGLO to have only 1 or 2 members in a given year), the IFC and PanHell on my campus was not giving us ANY of the money that was to be distributed among all organizations. And, although we voiced our complaints on many occasions, the answer we were consistantly given was that because we didn't participate in the kind of rush activities the white GLOs did, we could not get the money, since the money was alloted only for that purpose.

When it came time for GreekWeek, we faced the same issues. The money for GreekWeek was to support the many social functions the white GLOs sponsored, at which alcohol was allowed. As a part of our strict protocol and traditions, collegiate BGLOs are NOT to sponsor events at which alcohol is served. So, because of the nature of many of the Greek Week activites, we (the BGLOs) had no other choice but to decline from participating because we were never able to get funding from IFC and PanHell for the kinds of activities we wanted to sponsor.

BGLOs are community service oriented, with social life being LAST on the "to do" list. Social life was first on that list at MY school, and IFC and PanHell, since they consisted of 98% members of white GLOs refused to recognize that DIFFERENCE. So, we petitioned to established our own governing body for fiscal and political reasons, and NOT because we were black!!! This was a business decision-- we weren't getting any money because we didn't do the same things the other groups were doing.

You, Scott, have a lot to learn about what it means to be DIFFERENT. I am so sick and tired of people refusing to recognize that if a white person and a black person stand side by side, they are still DIFFERENT no matter how you look at them. BGLOs are predominately black and are committed to service to and uplift of African American people. If your organization does not share those characteristics then we are DIFFERENT. You are acting as though there is something wrong with being different. You jumped to the conclusion that we broke away from IFC and PanHell because we were black, when that was simply not the case. With a Black Greek Council, we received a budget of $6000 and were able to do much more. We finally had a representative in our student government (we NEVER had that as a part of IFC and PanHell), and were able to fund many more community service projects than ever before. In addition, we could now participate in Greek Week because we had our own budget. We were also able to co-sponsor activities with other GLOs and student organizations-- we could never do that before because we couldn't get the money. We could invite speakers and attend greek leadership conferences all over the world.

The only way we could get the approval for the establishment was to have the support of IFC and PanHell. They (along with Order of Omega) backed us 100% because they understood that we were not able to get funding because of the DIFFERENCES between the intakes processes, focus, protocol and traditions of our organizations!!!

I was in a conversation the other day, and a white male told me that he is colorblind (doesn't see race). I think anyone who is colorblind is racist because as a black female, when you see me I DO want you to see African American. That is a part of who I am, and to not see it is to not see me. The fact is that BGLOs are indeed different-- not just in the demographics of members, but in many other ways. Just because you choose to get a brand doesn't mean that it is for the same reason that a black member of Omega Psi Phi or Alpha Phi Alpha chooses to get one. He might really be doing it for cultural reasons, while you may not.

I do not appreciate how you've associated our establishment of a black greek council with racism. If a white GLO decided to do the same, for the reasons we did, then I would be in support just as IFC, PanHell and Order of Omega were of our initiative. There was never any "squabbling over petty differences" and I am offended that you consider the differences and uniqueness of BGLOs to be "petty". You, sir, and those who share your sentiments, are the the reason racism is still a disease in this country-- you haven't bothered to seek the understaning you need in order to RECOGNIZE and APPRECIATE the value of our DIFFERENCES!!! You are content to watch everyone assilimilate to the popular culture, while I am content to cherish all those varying and contrasting attributes that make us a diverse people. I have MANY, MANY friends in white GLOs, and I ENJOY learning more about them and what makes one DIFFERENT from the other. Surely you don't think Fiji is the same as Sig-Ep is the same as Beta is the same as Delta Chi DO YOU?!?!?!? They are each very DIFFERENT, just as Tri Delt DIFFERS from A Chi O DIFFERS from Pi Phi! FACE IT--Black Greek-Lettered Organizations DIFFER from white GLOs!!! That does NOT mean we are perpetuating racism or segregation-- that simply means that we are NOT THE SAME. You seem to be the one who thinks that there is something wrong with being DIFFERENT!!!



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Pi Kappa
#3 SPR97
QUINTESSENCE