Legal question?

[madmax]

Half the fraternities on my campus are not recognized by the college.. We are all still operating as normal. We still hold rush, fundraisers, and social functions. We have all been successful. 5 of the 6 largest organizations are unrecognized. Our houses are off-campus and we are not breaking any laws.

Here is the problem.. The school has recently threatoned to expel any student who pledges and unrecognized frat and expel members of unrecognized frats that take pledges.

Is this legal? Aren't we protected by the Constitiution and Freedom of Association? If a college can't stop a student from joining a radical hate group then how can they stop someone from pledging?

I know all the unrecognized organizations are still going to operate. We are going to take our chances, but I want to know the law in case we get busted.

Anyone have any advice? thanks...

[G8Ralphaxi]

Do you and the other unrecognized fraternities have the recognition and authorization of your national organizations?

For example, do you still have your charter, are your members listed in good standing, do you send dues to nationals, does nationals list your university as an official chapter (i.e. my house was listed in all of the magazines, websites, etc. sponsored by nationals as the "Zeta Omicron chapter at the University of Florida).

If so, you have a much stronger case. You should contact your national officers for assistance and they will be able to answer your questions.

If you do not have the authorization of your national org, then you have a much weaker case.

If you are a local fraternity then the issue of national recognization is irrelevant.

If you don't get any funding from the school or hold events on school property, I don't see how they can threaten your right to association. If you are off campus then you aren't doing anything different than a group of guys calling themselves the "Party Maniac Gang" and inviting people to come party at their house or a student group that meets at someone's apartment for Bible study.

You may want to consult with an attorney since the school is threatening your members with expulsion.

I don't see how they can expel anyone, but I'm not aware of all the facts or your local statutes/school rules. Especially if you go to a private university, they may indeed have this right. Although it would probably be challengeable if they were not applying it fairly - i.e. OK to join a hate group but not XYZ fraternity.

You may also want to look into what the university's motivation may be for this action. Have there been problems with the unrecognized groups? Was someone injured or arrested at a function held by one of these fraternities? Is the behavior of some of these groups seem to present a risk management/liability problem? If that is the case, then that can hurt you.

It may be helpful to do some "good will" public relations on campus. Since apparently the threat of expulsion is only for pledges and organizations that take pledges, your initiated brothers are free to be out in the open.

Talk to your brothers and organize a philanthropy or event on campus. You could wear your letters and set up a table in the main square on campus and collect donations for the Red Cross to help for last week's tragedy. Hold a canned food drive. Donate to a recognized campus organization's event or charity. Even just having your brothers wear letters on campus (MAKING SURE TO BE ON BEST BEHAVIOR) can help. Consider getting together with the other unrecognized fraternities and having a public forum on the main campus square to dispel myths about your organizations. Think about it - if several fraternities are there, singing their brotherhood songs, openly talking and answering questions from other students, you become real people to them and public support from the main student body can prove invaluable.

Best of luck to you all and be sure to keep us updated.

G8Ralphaxi
University of Florida
Levin College of Law

[33girl]

http://www.dke.org/conf.html

Getting through all the "legalese" basically it says you can join any off campus group you want. The school can choose not to recognize you or deny use of campus facilities, but they cannot prevent you from pledging any more than they could stop you from joining the Jaycees or the American Nazi Party.

Plus if you are at a public university, the school has even less leeway to discipline you for something like this. Our school (part of PA state system) blew smoke about expelling members of an underground fraternity on our campus but it NEVER happened.

DKE was very involved with fighting this, email their national HQ and they could probably get you some info on it (or just look through the news section of their website).

[James]

The Freedom of Association Act protects your Rights and basically reaffirms the Bill of Rights.

A lot of the college's power over you is ignorance (yours and theirs), and perspective.

You are not their to accomodate the personal preferences of the administrators, learn your rights and assert them.

Public institutions open themselves to civil rights violations by limiting your association, private institutions may have a bit more leeway BUT the law applies to ANY institution that receives any types of federal funding. Trust me, almost all private institutions do.

So if the institution doesn't want to "recognize" you which is their term, not a legal definition: You should still be able to request and receive space as well as other considerations.

IF the administration chooses expulsion or some other type of retaliation on students that choose to join the organization of their choice they open themselves to liability.

I recomend you contact the ACLU and talk to someone knowledgeable at some length.

Also, for everyone, the right of people to assert unquestioned authority over you and yours only exists so long as you are both ignorant of your rights, and fearful of asserting them.

[Tom Earp]

I know of different Campuses that have trouble with the Admin. but To tell you that they are open for one hell of a lawsuit!

As much as at times I dislike the ACLU, they can have a very strong influence on many things!

It amazes the H--- out of me that the supposedly Learned Bastions of Knowledge cannot seem to come to the realization that the Greeks do more , give more and ETC more!

I really get tired of hearing what Schools want to do to and with Greeks that I want to scream to the heavens and say, pardon me I am a Greek Alum and You just got any funding from me cut off!!!!!!

So be it!

[DeltaBetaBaby]

I am a little confused. Why is your group unrecognized when others are recognized? Have you done something to upset the administration? Why don't you just become recognized? I don't know what it is like there, but it is pretty easy at most schools. We just have to sign a form every year with our new officers.

[CrucialCrimson]

It depends on a lot of things - if the school is public, private, etc., but also what led them to such a decision - if they have been held liable for frat/sorority conduct they may be doing this to comply with some order/settlment or to protect themselves from future liability. Just because a private school has federal funding doesn't automatically make them an "arm of the government" so they can get away with a lot more than a public school in terms of dictating what their students can or can't do - i.e. enforce a dres code, kick out a student who works at a strip club, etc. You should contact an attorney in your area or someone who knows all the facts of your situation.

[shadokat]

madmax,

If you're at Bloomsburg, the reason that they are trying to implement this policy, which will of course be found to be unconstitutional, is due to the significant number of tragedies that have happened within fraternities that are not recognized by campus.

Here's an example: A fraternity member is found dead in his house, and an autopsy reveals it is alcohol related. That student's parents decides to sue, and they do so by suing the fraternity and its members, and then the University. They sue the University because their child is a student there, and while it is not the responsibility of the University to play "mom and dad" to the student, parents often go after Universities in these situations and win.

Sounds to me as if the University is trying to protect itself from any more damage with regards to unrecognized groups. Also, by providing unrecognized groups to reaffiliate with the University, you regain all of the benefits of doing so, and thus can be under the rules that apply to those recognized organizations.

Make any sense?

[bolingbaker]

Sigma Chi Fraternity sued Purdue University 120 years ago, and won, on exactly the same issue. The power that administrators have is assumed on the basis that most undergrads don't know their rights. Of course there are cases where university officials correctly act in the interests of safety and good order. Too often, however, administrators assume the power to make sweeping pronouncements with no legal standing to do so. Greeks are starting to fight back. Take the good advice others here have given you. Seek legal help, or the help of the ACLU.