To All You Conservatives

[enlightenment06]

Hi. For those of you who consider yourself "conservative," how do you view "liberal" views? I use quotation marks because I think people aren't that easliy boxed, but let's roll on generalizations. What is wrong with being "liberal?" Ann Coulter in her new books says that people who opposed U.S. action in Iraq are "treasonous" (except of course if you're a conservative, then you just have a differing viewpoint- from her interview on the O'Reily Factor).

I tried to join the Republican Part (which has become out and out hard right conservative) but I just couldn't agree. For me, I see some conservative viewpoints as selfish and lacking understand and compassion for others (I won't get into specifics for threat of a thread hijack and there are other threads for them anyway).

NOTE: If you are "liberal" and want to bash "conservatives" please don't do it here. I'm trying to gain understanding, not an audition for Jerry Springer.

[bruinaphi]

Originally posted by enlightenment06
For me, I see some conservative viewpoints as selfish and lacking understand and compassion for others.

I am very liberal and have always thought that this is the critical difference b/w liberals and conservatives but I am interested to see the viewpoints of a conservative on this issue.

[MTSUGURL]

WOW. Lacking compassion... That is something that I have NEVER had anyone describe me or my views as. I look at it this way - I believe in absolutes. I not only come from a strong Christian background, but am a strong Christian myself. I think that there are many views that are seen as "conservative" that are Christian beliefs and convictions. I am not rigid on many things, but there are a few that I am. I won't go into detail because I don't want to chase rabbits.
What I think of liberal views - you have the right to them, just as I have the right to hold conservative ones. I respect others' views and opinions no matter what they are as long as the person has intelligent reasons for having them, not just, "My daddy's a liberal so I am too." (Yes, someone has actually told me this before). I respect others' views and opinions and will not insult or belittle them for any reason, and I expect the same.
I think to say that "I see some conservative viewpoints as selfish and lacking understand and compassion for others" is just as belittling as if I were to say "To me, soime liberal viewpoints show an ignorance or dismissal of right and wrong". No, I do not believe this, but you get my point.

[sugar and spice]

(Sorry if this is a thread hijack or too much bashing, I am trying not to do either. Feel free to tell me to delete this if it gets too far in that direction.)

MTSUgurl, I'm not trying to attack you or anything, but just because one is a Christian does not make them compassionate . . . in fact, I've seen many cases to the contrary. I don't think this is true in your case because you seem like a sweetheart who is legitimately concerned with others. But to think that Christianity and compassion go hand in hand is not necessarily the case. It is often the case in theory, but far less often the case in practice.

I think the reason that many people see conservatives as lacking compassion and understanding of different viewpoints is that conservatives often seem to take their experiences as the only true ones, and are very dismissive of others' viewpoints. Some are very quick to point out the cases where the welfare system is abused, where women use abortion as birth control, where affirmative action is abused. They are really quick to dismiss any situation where the "systems" are a success (and by all research, the systems are successes more often than they are failures).

I see conservative viewpoints as seeing the world in absolutes, in blacks and whites, where liberals are more prone to seeing things in shades of gray. Obviously, both can go too far in the wrong direction.

[KillarneyRose]

When I think of the Liberal viewpoint (not "Liberal people", necessarily as many are my friends and one is even my mom!), the phrase that pops to mind is, "Keep an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out".

[AlphaGamDiva]

Originally posted by sugar and spice
just because one is a Christian does not make them compassionate . . . in fact, I've seen many cases to the contrary. I don't think this is true in your case because you seem like a sweetheart who is legitimately concerned with others. But to think that Christianity and compassion go hand in hand is not necessarily the case. It is often the case in theory, but far less often the case in practice.

this is how you have to look at things when dealing with Christianity. some ppl will say they are Christian, and act accordingly.....some ppl will say they are Christian...and that's about it. so if someone says they are Christian, but primarily doesn't act in accordance with Christian ways....you can't hold that against Christianity itself, that's just that one person. make sense or did i ramble?

I think the reason that many people see conservatives as lacking compassion and understanding of different viewpoints is that conservatives often seem to take their experiences as the only true ones, and are very dismissive of others' viewpoints.

this can be said just as easily with liberals, too, though....both sides are guilty of being this way.

Some are very quick to point out the cases where the welfare system is abused, where women use abortion as birth control, where affirmative action is abused. They are really quick to dismiss any situation where the "systems" are a success (and by all research, the systems are successes more often than they are failures).

I see conservative viewpoints as seeing the world in absolutes, in blacks and whites, where liberals are more prone to seeing things in shades of gray. Obviously, both can go too far in the wrong direction.

personally, i see things both ways. somethings are definitely black and white, but then others, gray. as far as being conservative and how i look upon liberal ideals.....i like being conservative b/c i see it as more of a hard working group <flame>. let me try and explain what i mean while i get my flame retardent gear on.....you WORK to get where you are and don't rely on SOMEONE other than yourself to get you there. ppl do it everyday......not saying the gov shouldn't help at ALL b/c that's crazy....but as far as affirmative action and welfare and stuff.....yeah, it may work in some cases......but you gotta look on where those can IMPROVE. some heavy tweeking obviously needs to happen b/c they ARE abused systems and it's not fair to those who work hard and make the good money to have to give it to those who ABUSE the system.

i am pro-death penalty, anti-abortion, but yet i am all about gay-rights, equality among men, women, and ALL races......i see most liberals as anti-death penalty and pro-choice and those are two big things that i don't understand. someone can't be ok with punishing someone who has killed someone else and given up their basic human rights, but can be ok with killing an innocent unborn hasn't-done-anything-wrong child? makes no sense....to me. plus, let's talk about this environment issue. lol kids, the world isn't going to end anytime soon. hate to tell ya....been around a while, will be around a while longer. you WON'T STOP THE HOLE IN THE OZONE LAYER. can't. impossible. WHY waste money trying to do so when you can spend it on something else?!?! that you CAN fix!? like, i dunno....education. YES....volunteer to pick up trash, take public transportation...friggin recycle like a mad-man....but please don't spend my tax dollars on a tree-hugging expedition. (joke, ppl...i realize ppl don't take tax dollars to rent a bus out to the biggest tree to go hug it) there are things that can be done to not make things worse, but the problem won't be fixed. do what you can, lil by lil....it adds up. don't take my tax dollars and blow it on something un-fixable. take it to re-vamp welfare or arkansas' education system ......[/rant on the environment]

there just has to come a point where i'm like, "look....i worked hard for this money......i want to be able to keep it for my own use, and have it go to the things that are worthy in my eyes"....like, is there a lil check box i can mark that makes sure it goes to what i want it to? shouldn't there be??? like, have a minimum number of boxes you have to check, and then get a receipt showing that your money went where you want it. or is that like affirmative action and just a nice thought? -sigh-

in all seriousness.....i think welfare is a good idea, and when not abused, is GREAT. i just have a problem when someone keeps on gettin knocked up to get a bigger "pay check"....these ppl with 20 baby daddies get no sympathy from me when they can't pay for isht. their kids do....but they don't. and i know ppl don't wanna just "get by"....but sometimes you HAVE to take a menial job to have food put on your table and a roof on your head for the sake of your family. and ppl wanna say that republicans and and conservatives are stingy and selfish?? what about those ppl who are just blatently taking tax payer's hard earned money b/c they are too LAZY to go work for it themselves?! i mean, honestly ppl!

hard work pays off....rich ppl aren't rich just b/c....they are rich b/c they worked. (or b/c they know ppl, but there's a loop hole in every situation....good and bad). poor ppl are either poor b/c: they are lazy.....they can't find a job....they don't have an education. i have no sympathy for those who are LAZY and those are the ppl who abuse welfare, who STEAL from my pay check, and need to be b*tch slapped. makes me all kinds of testy to think about....

not meaning to get off onto welfare so much, but i am chattin with tke at the same time here and we're kinda talkin about that, so ya know. why do i chat with so many damn liberals?

bottom line of why i think being conservative is right....for me. i believe that ppl have the RIGHT to keep as much of what they earn as they can. i believe it is the the RIGHT of every American to help out our fellow man, our country, our world.....but not to the extent that just allows ppl to abuse that RIGHT. i don't think the gov needs to give all these hand outs like they are cheap candy. i don't think all things republican/conservative are RIGHT, but i think they have the right IDEA.....the idea is to promote hard working citizens of all classes, races, and genders....hard working....not money grubbing, selfish, blah-bi-de-blah's. it's not ALL republican conservatives who are selfish. sure, there are your major businessmen who are all about their big fatty tax cut....but there are also your unemployed who are all about their big fatty unemployment check. yes, on different levels....both equally bad to the economy.

thanks, tke for an interesting conversation. i hope everyone knows i mean not to offend...i hope everyone gets what i was so trying to say.....and i hope that kinda clears some things up in a positive light about conservatives. i hope, i hope, i hope.

ETA: i don't hate the environment, i don't hate attempting to keep America beautiful......i would just like for some of that money spent to go to some other things that could use a lil more funding as well....that are probably more easily fixed than the ozone layer. the environment rant is not 100% non-joking, either....i so dread reading this thread later.....gotta find my fire extinguisher. lol

[justamom]

WOW, GREAT posts ALL the way around.

I honestly think most of us start out as "liberals". What happens?
LIFE! We choose our own direction. Think of college. We are surrounded by so many social issues and our passion for concepts
and idealism rages. Upon graduation, we step into the world ala "Man of La Mancha". You have people who choose a service field and you have people who choose a supply field. People who choose service LIVE each and evey day with sadness, needs and injustice. Those who, for example, enter business see another kind of reality. They see the "tab" for supporting government programs that aid the underprivaleged. The tab is pretty high and the reality as well as the passion of our budding liberal roots tends to fade. We DO see the graft, corruption and abuse of the system and it angers us.

We mirror those ideologies that envelop us.
Each group needs to step forward and away from their limited perception. On the great issues-abortion, welfare, environment
taxes-my personal stance has more to do with my God than my political affiliation. I give what I can give, do what I can do. "The poor will always be among us." "Render to Ceasar what is Ceasar's" "Thou shalt not kill." Yet aware of "An eye for an eye..." These are some of the guidlines and I guess THESE are what make me conservative to some. It's all in the interpretaion, I understand this.

Edited Ann Coulter-I've seen her and our paper hs picked up her column. While she has some good things to say... I don't want to be considered in HER camp. She spews hatred and sometimes I think she does more harm than good.

[valkyrie]

I think that the discussion so far on this thread makes me realize that conservatives and liberals will just never understand each other. As everyone probably knows by now, I am extremely liberal and I think that I am as likely to understand conservative views as I am to understand Japanese.

What I would really like to understand is how each of us comes to believe what we do. I know that many people believe that you're liberal when you're young and become more conservative as you get older, especially when you're working full time. My parents (both mostly conservative) have been telling me this for years, and saying that someday I will be a Republican. I find that the opposite is true -- the older I get, the more liberal I become and the more I become sure that my views are the only views I could ever have or even understand. I'm not sure where this comes from, especially considering my background.

Sorry, I'm getting off topic...

[KSigkid]

I myself am moderate; a registered Democrat but with some conservative views (pro-death penalty, not really sure how I feel about many types of welfare).

I will say this - I went through a pretty liberal stage in high school, and during that time thought of conservatives as crusty, set in their ways, and narrow-minded.

Fortunately, I grew out of this. Much of it was because I grew up in a heavily Democratic household, where my parents were never really fans of the Republican party. We always had money struggles when I was younger, and it seemed like I had a lot more in common with liberals than conservatives.

As time has gone on though, I've realized liberals are just as set in their ways as conservatives are, most times. If you want to stereotype one, you can stereotype the other.

I'm still a registered Democrat, and still agree with some Liberal viewpoints. However, I've found myself agreeing with some conservative views as well. I've even realized that my parents have some of those conservative views as well. I've just tried to tell myself that things are never as cut and dry as people make them.

Collin

[tcsparky]

As a conservative, I believe that the government has neither the right to nor the responsibility of micro-managing my daily life. I believe that I can make decisions for myself that will be more relevant to me, than some remote politician. I believe that I can manage my money, my time, my family, and my own morals (thank you) better than they can be legislated. I believe a broader range of rights are guaranteed by the Constitution, and that I should be allowed to cope with those who abuse them, rather than government limiting everyone's rights.

I feel that the liberal viewpoint asks the government to take over every aspect of daily life, wants too many "freebie" programs in place, and takes away individual responsibility and autonomy in the name of make life "better."

There are situations the government should not regulate.

[damasa]

Originally posted by tcsparky


There are situations the government should not regulate.

There are also situations the government should regulate. Of course that is my opinion. As our government has a duty to look out for the best interests in all of its citizens, not some of them but all of them.

I know while growing up I was actually more conservative due to my father and his family. Once I started growing older and growing apart from my father, I noticed my views started to change. I had feelings I had never had before, and I notice that the older I get the more liberal I become. I do believe that our country should have a strong military and I am pro-death penalty. But I have a liberal outlook on just about every other political issue I can think of.

[Munchkin03]

Originally posted by valkyrie
I know that many people believe that you're liberal when you're young and become more conservative as you get older, especially when you're working full time.

People tell me that a lot...that once upon a time, they were anti-war hippies who smoked pot, and now they're "productive" members of society just because they joined the GOP. Sure, a lot of people veer to the right as they get older, but tend to fall into one of these three categories:
1). They never really believed what they were doing in the first place, and were swept along with the spirit of the times.
2). They saw what happened to their friends who went too far, and were scared off.
3). They became allied with the US Armed Forces.

That wasn't meant to be bashing, it's very true of the people I know who took that middle-aged turn to the right. These are the same people who tell me that soon, I will shed my liberal ways and become a "productive" member of society. Usually, I refer them to my parents, who have also gotten more liberal as time goes on and they realize that the world isn't as cut and dry as it seems when you're young.

Originally posted by tcsparky
As a conservative, I believe that the government has neither the right to nor the responsibility of micro-managing my daily life. I believe that I can make decisions for myself that will be more relevant to me, than some remote politician.

Funny, you just summed up for me the reasons I am a liberal. I always thought it was absurd that some white, Christian male was trying to tell me what I should or should not do with my body when I am neither white, male, or Christian. If anything, I feel my rights have been limited by the government more and more.

You have a good point. It's just that I realize that conservatives and liberals are more alike than most of us on either side want to admit

[lovelyivy84]

I am totally with you Munchkin

THe government SHOULDN'T be so involved in my life on a day to day basis, and the things they should have no say include whther or not my children should practice religion in schools, what I do with my own body, and whether my male friends can marry their boyfriends.

That is why I am liberal. Not a democrat, but liberal.

[Tom Earp]

HMMMM, I at my dotoring age am not sure which is which! Can you Poly Sci explain each to me?

Was: Dem.
Now: Rep.

Dont really know what the rules of stupidity are!

For what ever a Party Goes by, "They are all Sheep in Wolves" clothing!

The main worry is getting there and after that , it is gravy train!

[MTSUGURL]

I look at it this way - I vote for the political candidate whose platforms, ideals and key issues line up with what I believe, my convictions, and my conscience. I am pro death penalty, anti-abortion, (I have sat with women during abortions and counseled them after and have seen the effects) and believe we need a strong military. Typically, I like Democrats locally because of educational issues, but only if their voting records (if they have one) lines up with the 2 issues that are most important to me. I have always voted Repblican nationally. I don't believe either is right all the time, and I think extremity in either direction is wrong as well. Each side has strengths to offer; however, each side is to busy looking for fault with the other. Each is convinced they have cornered the market on intelligence and the knowledge of "how things should be done". I personally think that the words conservative and liberal have become out-dated labels that only serve to make people defensive to each other.