Quote:
Originally Posted by ASTalumna06
I don't think there's a problem with religion affecting people's thoughts, beliefs, decisions, etc., but I have an issue when people use that as the ultimate reason for creating policies and enacting laws.
I'm not religious, but I can respect the fact that other people are. In my opinion, to have faith, go to church, and pray when you need/want to is all fine and dandy. It's those people who take the words in the Bible (or whatever readings/teachings they follow) and take them so literally and think that's how things should be, and that even those who don't follow their religion should live the way they do. And of course, there are many people who pick and choose the things in those readings/teachings that are "most important," and only follow those in their most literal sense.
I'm all for gay marriage, for example, and I understand that there are people who are against it, or don't agree with it, or think that it's morally wrong (for both religious and non-religious reasons). That's their opinion, and they're entitled to it. However, I don't believe that anyone has the right to tell someone else who they can love. There is nothing about allowing gay people to marry that would affect a straight person who disagrees with it. And there are many people who start the argument with, "Well in the Bible, it says..." I don't care, because I don't live my life by the Bible. And we shouldn't create laws based on what it says in the Bible, either.
Look at it this way: Let's take one of the 10 Commandments - thou shalt not steal. We have laws against stealing. If one were to make an argument about why stealing should be illegal - BASED on their religious beliefs - they could say it emotionally hurts the person from whom something was stolen, that person may not be able to get that item back or purchase a new one, it could truly financially burden the person if the loss was big enough, there would be chaos and looting if nothing was done to stop it, etc. Those are good arguments for why stealing should be illegal. To make such an argument, religion would never even need to be mentioned.
Now make an argument for why gay marriage should be illegal.
I think the truly amazing thing to me is that people can question the genius of some of the greatest minds of our time; they can read a newspaper article, and they can roll their eyes; they can see a huge hole in the side of the Pentagon and deny that a plane ever hit it; but they can read a book, written thousands of years ago, which at times, talks of things that don't even seem possible or plausible, and they believe that that is the word of the world, and all who don't follow that word are destined to go to hell.
Regarding the abortion debate: as MysticCat basically pointed out, the vast majority of people look at murder as being morally wrong, regardless of their backgrounds, faith, experiences, etc. However, the question isn't about whether or not murder is wrong, but about whether or not abortion is murder. In a sense, religion should have no place in such an argument. But again, people use it as a way to force their ideas and desired policies/laws on others. I'm not saying that everyone does, but it obviously happens frequently enough for the majority of us to notice.
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There are several good issues in your post that could keep this thread going until we are all too old to type and living on social security- LOL. I’m not going to go any farther off topic and than I already have and delve into those. Instead, I’ll stick to the one I’ve been posting about.
People can vote for or against things for any reason they choose. There is no stopping that since we cannot know why a person is voting a certain way unless they choose to tell us, and we can’t stop them from telling us why they will vote a certain way or why they think others should without violating their freedom of speech. Whether or not it might be more politically expedient to give non-religious reasons for voting a certain way is another issue all together.
There is nothing I know of in the Constitution or the law that prevents a person from voting, speaking out, joining groups, and /or peacefully protesting on the basis of their religious beliefs in the same way any one else votes on the basis of their non-religious beliefs. There is no way that I know of not to vote on the basis of your beliefs, religious or not, since we all have them, so if voting on the basis of religious beliefs is the equivalent of “forcing” your beliefs on someone, voting on the basis of any belief is the equivalent of “forcing” your beliefs on someone and if that’s the case, the only solution I see is to forego laws.
You used that example of recent gay marriage laws as an example, I think, of passing legislation, on the basis of your beliefs that do not affect anyone who may disagree with the law. If every piece of legislation passed would only affect those who voted for it and agree with it that example would work, but that’s the exception and not the rule. In other words, we’ve all had a part in passing legislation we believed in and we knew would affect others who might disagree with it, but we voted for it anyway because we personally thought it was right. Does this mean we forced our views on others? I don’t think so.
Here’s an example. I live in a state where many consider themselves environmentalists and that belief system governs much of the way they vote and most of the people they vote for because they feel strongly about the environment. Recently in Portland a regulation passed that said everyone in the county had to compost or they would be fined. Some people resent the heck out of this and feel they are being “forced” to go along with someone else’s environmental beliefs. I don’t particularly want to compost either (looks disgusting, hate the smell), but I disagree that they are being forced. The environmentalists in our state have done a fantastic job of speaking their mind, protesting, getting their message out to the media, forming action groups, hiring lobbyists, voting, and voting for people who agreed with them. Those who oppose had every opportunity to do the same, but they chose not to – bad on them, but they haven’t had a viewpoint forced on them. The county voted on a law that reflected a group’s viewpoint about something they believe was a good, moral thing to do, and it passed. Welcome to America. This is what we do and the process is the same for everyone – religious or not.
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My opinion is: Religion can play a role in what you (the general you) believe to be right, but it shouldn't define everything you do, everything you say, and every interaction you have with other human beings. It can guide you morally and it can give you faith and hope, but it shouldn't make you believe that everyone should be just like you, think exactly like you do, and want all of the same things that you do.
It's totally possible that I'm entirely missing your point here (it's late) and please feel free to correct me, but the bolded comes across like this, "Don't tell me to think like you, but in my opinion, here's how you should think and feel about the role of religion in your life, so in other words, you should think about it the way I think you should think about it."
And yeah, we should probably all step away because we all must have lives out there somewhere that we need to get back to.