1. RUGreek you wrote: "I'm jewish, pledged a non-jewish house. Nobody had a problem there, I guess you guys live in skinhead land to have such a serious debate on religion. Nobody's house denies anyone based on race, religion, nationality, etc. If they did, who care, go pledge another house, if they want to be stuck up, let them. I'm tired of people whining about being discriminated. I agree with Karen, just go join where the people are cool and stop placing so much emphasis on your beliefs. It's time to diversify yourselves..."
If it's whining to you, then please just don't read the thread as you would simply avoid a house based on a religion. And don't make such empty statements like "It's time to diversify yourselves".
2. KSig you wrote: "you must be willing to accept that those who do NOT desire to live their lives according to Jewish idealogy must be respected for that choice, just as they must respect your decisions and beliefs. "
Please look at my post again. The fourth paragraph in the Need for Jewish houses section, should clarify my standpoint on this. I state that " I believe Carnation was the one who discussed what happened at her convention. Personally I feel if your fraternity/sorority was built on certain ideals then stick with them. I wouldn't ask an organization to change for me and would question why it was that I wanted to join so bad, and if the reasons were really solid, I wouldn't mind the "discomfort". Integration is always great, but assimilation is not. "
Perhaps my words are hazy so I'll try and make it as clear as possible. Everyone in our society has an undeniable right to practice whatever faith they would like. We can understand that a person might join our chapter and be uncomfortable with the fact that there are Jewish rituals. Generally that doesn't happen because we make it very clear what our fraternity is about and those that feel the practices are outside of their own zone of comfort, just simply don't pursue it much more. Obviously Mizzou-Rolla felt they were comfortable. When we do rush, we say "hey we're from AEPi - The JEWISH fraternity" so as to minimize any future misunderstandings. We feel there are many fraternities that either offer rituals based on Christianity or totally disregard religious background of any nature, but only ONE Jewish fraternity. Just like a black, asian, multicultural, latino fraternity is able to effectively support the beliefs of their communities through their events and rituals, so do we. This support also extends into the Pro-Israel arena. 7% of our fraternity nationally went to the largest such rally in DC several months ago with less than a week's notice. It was our strong beliefs that allowed us to pack our bags from chapters all over the country during school and attend. This summer we have two trips to Israel for AEPi's only, funded by our national office, and make up the majority of Birthright travellers going to Israel as well in these scary times to show support - clearly again, this would not happen at any other house.
3. Cream there is nothing wrong with NY women. I was only joking but that is a good topic to bring up in the ChitChat section
4. Shadokat, you could not be more right in your post. "If you are a Jewish house, I don't find ANYTHING wrong with that. But if you're looking to recruit only Jewish women, then by all means, let rushees know that ahead of time, and save them from some grief." Generally, chapters try to at some point throw that in there at the beginning. Jewish houses are a bit difficult to understand though because we want the best of both worlds: a strong voice in the Jewish community as well as the ability to be a part of the general greek community. At many schools, greek councils and panhells do let them know if a chapter is Jewish. At certain schools, I suppose they don't because they are afraid this will turn kids away. I would also expect the rushee to want to do more research on an organization where they would invest so much time and money into and perhaps look at the website or something (take a look at aepi.org and tell me if you can't tell we're Jewish immediately). Even our coat of arms, our Cofa, has the menora with a star of david. However, I should still say that any doubt should be removed asap and agree that you ARE right. Unfortunately, this may not happen at certain schools. I don't know all their reasoning, but perhaps the panhell could discuss it with them and pick a direction to go in.
5. GreekGuide - you asked for an opinion so I think I can give you the best one. As a future advisor, I think it would be best to discuss this at the campus you are going into. Furthermore, since these are all national organizations it is imperative to involve the national office in some way (perhaps talk to the advisor). Personally, I think it might be best to provide some sort of history or a link to national websites on a rush pamphlet.
6. Deltajas. I respect your comment as much as I do not agree with them in the slightest sense. I would appreciate it if you read my first post once more to pick up on certain details to discuss this further. I have reread all your comments several times now and thank you for clarifying my misconception on your remark. I appreciate it. However, once again I will say two things:
A) You capitalize the word "MY". Think about this. How can that be your experience if you are not a part of the sorority making the decision? You're own experience seeing campuses nearby does not qualify you to make expert judgements. You are not involved in the discussion process and have NO idea if some other factor was involved. It is not even on your campus but at nearby NY campuses that you base your opinion on. You state a 90% statistic that is meaningless as my comment on Uganda. Please understand I mean no disrespect. I and Cream, are both from NY and both testified to the fact that we know non-Jews in Jewish houses also.
B) You seem to have been able to define discrimination in a certain biased manner. If you read my section on the need for "Jewish" houses, and can come up with points to argue, then please do. But sometimes, you seem to talk like a small town politician that throws comments out without addressing specific points. Discrimination is bad as you say, but please address the points put out for you. Sometimes it's difficult to make your point in situations that aren't face to face, but I feel we can come to better understand each other in time if you agree on that. I will say once more that because you are a jewish house, and most of your members are Jewish, does not mean you discriminate. The fact that we're Jewish attracts people to us and also makes us more prone to have interactions with Jewish people moreso than any others.
Most chapters, if not all, will take non-Jewish members if they espouse Jewish ideals. That is not discrimination. But again, I put a lot of time into my comments so try to streamline your argument along those points.
Also, let's just drop the JAP remarks. It makes people uncomfortable and there is no need to do that if we all respect each other.
And in regards to you being Jewish, I have just a bit to say on that. I will not tell you if you are or you aren't based on the fact that your father was as you said in an earlier post. According to reform Jews, you most surely would be. However, I do ask you to consider what it is that makes you Jewish. Do you ever go to services? Are you involved in the Jewish community? I was only bothered by you adding this in because it seems that once you throw that in there, you are qualified to make remarks on the religion as an expert. I am not judging your experiences at all though so please understand.
You hope that this topic can be closed, and I don't feel the need for that. There is no need for saying anything that makes people feel bad, and as long as we don't stray from the topic, then there is no reason to close the thread.
If any of you are actually truly interested on more details on Jewish houses being founded (such as ZBT meaning Tsion Bamishpa Tapodah: Zion shall be redeemed in justice), let me know. I also have another fact: "the first fraternity founded for the purpose of bringing students of like religious persuasion seems to have bee Phi Kappa, established at Brown in 1889. Whether this came about because of the exclusion of Catholic students from existing fraternities or whether it was an effort to maintain the religious faith of its members, the fact remains that it was the first fraternity founded specifically to serve the needs of a religious community. After merging with Theta Kappa, they were called Phi Kappa Theta and admit non-Catholics, although the original nature of the society seems to have persisted."
-Rudey
--If I get addicted to this site, I will not be happy Mr. Hammel