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Originally Posted by blueangel
Fair enough. The reason I didn't comment in detail on my initial post was because I provided a link and wanted to first hear what others had to say.
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No worries, I'm glad we've gotten more in-depth, regardless.
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Originally Posted by blueangel
A point of clarification... it was Merck.. not Pfizer that marketed Vioxx.
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Ha - bad brainfart, but I think you can probably guess what I had been researching all day . . . whoops.
Also, I'm going to cut the FDA part out - I don't really have a ton of faith in the FDA, but apparently I have more than you . . . I don't discredit or disagree with the links you've posted, I just don't agree with the ways in which they are relevant to the conversation.
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Originally Posted by blueangel
I am against genetic manipulation of our crops, and unfortunately, due to cross pollination, it has become virtually impossible to know which are "pure" and which aren't. This lack of labeling (and now the impossibility to accurately label due to "frankenfood") poses a problem for people with food allergies. Again.. this could be a thread in itself.
It's not the cost that concerns me... it's the fact that my choice is being taken away from me. We will not know which foods are sprayed with this virus combination, and which are not.
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Again, I actually agree with the labeling part (in an ideal world), but I can see two viable reasons why they would NOT be labeled (from the FDA's standpoint), and little to suggest any other reason.
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Originally Posted by blueangel
The other problem is that we really don't know what the long term effects (or short term for that matter) of ingesting this virus cocktail will be. The viruses are grown in a culture with the very bacteria they're meant to kill (Listeria bacteria). The FDA had concerns that the preparation of the virus cocktail could produce residues. It found none in its study. However, the agency says that as long as its used "in accordance with regulations, we have concluded its safe." Again.. do we trust that these viruses will indeed be used "in accordance with regulations?"
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The former is a legit concern, and a (probably necessary) flaw in the entire FDA system - there is no chance for discovering long-term problems.
The latter point (re: "in accordance with regulations") seems like a specious argument - you could very easily make this same argument against any sort of human vaccine, or really any perishable food product. Do you trust that any sort of inactive virus injected into your body will be developed according to regulations? Do you trust that milk is kept properly cool? How about the meat department's handling of poultry? While I see your concern, I think it's something that is too broad and requires too much cynicism for my blood. It sucks that this kind of trust is required, but that's 100% the "purchaser's bargain" with manufacturers, and it is self-regulated by the marketplace (if not the government).
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Originally Posted by blueangel
I'm all for capitalism, but not at the expense of our health. Going back to Vioxx.. Merck knew about the link between cardiovascular disease and Vioxx, yet it kept it quiet. We all know the end result. Therefore, I *do* have anger towards Big Pharma. I'm all for the drug companies making money, but not at the expense of our health and well being.
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This is what I meant by "pooped the bed" - Merck's documentation of the problem was meant to ensure that any litigation would be quashed by the age-old "The government approved it!" line . . . one which no longer works for GenX/Y jurors (trust me on this, no time to cite but I have a paper currently up for review). However, the incidence of the link in their research compared with the number of cases filed are not even close to similar - and the first few big victories have been on the back of deaths from people who used the drug for a year, 18 months, sometimes less. This is a massive hijack, but I think there's a happy medium where we can rail Big Pharma for the legitimate wrongs they've done, but not buy into the hype machine created around lawsuits and plaintiffs' attorneys that accuses some of worse than has really happened.
Once again, the meat companies have to buy this product - there has to be a reason why they would purchase this. I think that's important to keep in mind.