Quote:
Originally posted by saetex
she was speaking for an entire group of people that she thinks went through those problems, when in actuality it was more like a specific group of blacks that endured the worst of it.
|
This is a huge thread hijack.
In actuality, the within-group division of blacks does not negate the overall struggle of blacks (or the fact that the social structure only provided equal access to upper class blacks in certain contexts) which is why I was asking you why the distinction you made is important for the present discussion. While upper social class can buffer some of the negative effects of racism and discrimination, we aren't debating William Julius Wilson's "declining significance of race" in this thread.
The fact that the middle and upper class blacks were some of the more CREDITED individuals at the forefront of the Civil Rights Movement (meaning, they were the ones given the most credit, which doesn't mean they were the most profilic or that they were doing the grunt of the work without the help of the "lower classes") means that the struggle for equality goes past social class boundaries. It did then as it does now.
In fact, a case has been made in the literature that middle to upper class blacks dealt with racism and discrimination more frequently (while it may not have taken the form of dogs and firehoses, "enduring the most" is a matter of comparing within-group struggles---not a fruitful endeavor) because they mingled in white social, economic, and educational networks more often. This gave them greater opportunity to be singled out whereas lower class blacks were isolated and segregated into lower income and racially homogenous communities (then and now). Of course, you should also know that many black communities have also been a mixture of lower class blacks and middle class blacks living next door to one another--not much class divide in that regard.
Quote:
Originally posted by saetex
i understand why they are upset, but I don't see why they should blame every part of their troubles on the white man and what they did forty and fifty years ago. some of their problems stemmed from the fact that they had no unity or resolve between their upper and lower class.
|
Do you really understand? If you truly did, you would not be on this tangent and you wouldn't think that Blacks (as a whole) blamed every part of their troubles on white man. The "don't blame us" argument has been made for decades. As I said in a previous post, it is NOT about "us" versus "them." It isn't about the "white man." We are talking about structural and cultural issues here. If people in this country are too sensitive and paranoid to detach their PERSONAL issues from the topic of racial stratification and discrimination, they need to leave the discussion to those of us who can. If some whites (or blacks, or Hispanics, or Asians) think everyone's pointing the finger at them and theirs, it's best that they watch from the sidelines.
As far as where some of "their" problems stemmed from, I am still asking you what that has to do with the general topic of discriminatory practices. Black people know about class division then and now. Black people also know that you can be a physician with a mansion and a BMW, but still get watched when you go to a department store because of the color of your skin. So, while there is a degree of disconnect between the social classes, there will ALWAYS be (and always has been) a connection between the social classes and a shared struggle.