People, when it comes to being Hazed and being Pledged there are many diffrences...
 

If I were to say, wether I was a pledged or hazed associate, of course I would say, "pledged." Pledging means to do things that make good men better. You only get a bid in my fraternity if we want you, and all we want to see in your pledging is your, "realness." So many kids lie and act a certain way to make the frat/sor. believe they should be a part of the organization. Studying fraternity history, studying local history, and working as a team with your pledge brothers is ideal in a associates pledging. For all these frats. beating up pledges and doing worse things, y'all some bitches! If I associated with your frat. and you laid a hand on me; you'd wish you never had a hand! Every time I hear of frats. physicaly hurting a associate, it makes me pissed. Why would you want to hurt a person? Unless, your a bully, that makes the only sense to me. Pledging is a important aspect of fraternity growth and structure and needs to stay, but hazing is a fraternities weakness and sooner or later the chapter will fold. Let's make pledging hard, real hard, but with dignity and laughs, of great memories. I feel sorry for sororities that can not have associates learn their history because their national feels that is hazing. In a way no wonder why sorority girls I have meet always talk shitnik about their sisters behind close doors. When national puts those type of rules out there, that sorority becomes more like a club, and more like the statement, "buying your friends." There are ways of stopping hazing and that is not the way. Frats/sors. need to use my fraterntiy as an example of pledging the right way. "Hard and Dignified, a Man Not an animal."
-Heath
oh yea, what the hell are these high school kids doing joing frats and sors. in high school. That is funny hearing these high school kids parents getting mad, and trying to sue the high school when they know something is wrong in the getgo when their kid comes home smelling like shit, and looking like shit because another student told them. That is false on the parent. You people that know of this stuff first hand, where are y'all from? In Los Angeles we don't have that stuff. Call it what you want but I see LA dogs and cats are more aware of stupid shit than y'all. We are way to smart to do things some other child says. Street smarts is what I'm talking about!
[COLOR=Red]FKT[/SIZE=4]Epsilon Theta chapter SFSU[COLOR]

Re: People, when it comes to being Hazed and being Pledged there are many diffrences...
 

I wonder the same thing...why would you want to hurt someone, especially someone you're spending a lot of time with, getting to know, and who likely will become your brother or sister? Hazing doesn't seem to make sense, but I had it explained to me by my ex-boyfriend who was pledging at the time (he was never beaten or hurt physically that I know of) that if they were not forced to prove themselves they would never earn the respect of the brothers. He said that next year he plans to be the good guy and not be too rough on the pledges, but that he understands that each new pledge class must go through what the previous classes had been through. An eye for an eye, if you will. Or you can call it tradition, if you support it.

For the sake of argument, ok, you do it because it was done to you. But where did this cycle of useless viciousness begin? How did a group of guys decide one day, "Hey, you know what would be really fun? To torture and humilate our soon-to-be brothers!"

That's an unfair assumption, that just because most NPC sororities do not haze that is the reason girls do not always uphold the sisterly ideals. I am so glad that sororities at my campus do not haze (again, this is just to my knowledge) because if they did, I nor probably 99% of the girls in the Greek system would not be initiated right now. I'm not saying the fraternity men who did get hazed and put up with it were weak in any sense, but they had to deal with the status quo and their own personal pride.

The girls I go to school with would NEVER let their fat be circled or whatnot. There's no way I could know for sure how we would really react in a hazing situation, but I just know that more headstrong girls would be like "Peace out" the first second hazing reared its ugly head. But with guys it's different...more guys will stay and do it because it's a part of the culture sometimes, that they need to do it to earn their letters.

My sisters and I do not "talk shit" about each other. We chat about who we're dating, what so and so was wearing, etc., but when it comes to voicing disapproval about something, we don't just cattily gossip about each other. We either tell our closest friend something is bothering us and they offer ways to not obsess over it and let it die, or we go to the source and tell her what is going on. We are sisters. There is no need to sugarcoat everything if someone is doing something we really really don't approve of...not only do they have our letters at stake, but we love each other and care about each other's well-being.

I'm not saying sorority women are ALWAYS more mature than gossipy 6th graders, but to say that we are merely a club and buy our friends is totally ridiculous. When I was in high school I already had it in my head that I wanted to join a sorority, even though I knew all of my best friends were going to college with me and there was technically no need to join a social organization. I wanted the sisterhood, the campus involvement, and the lifelong bonds.

The dues are not set to provide a system that will set apart the "haves" and the "havenots" but for practical purposes such as meals at the house, social fees, national and panhellenic fees. You're in a fraternity yourself, you should realize that the money is not used to make people like you. They liked you to begin with and invited you to join their brotherhood and as a result now you are paying dues for things that have nothing to do with buying friends. If you stopped paying dues tomorrow and had to turn your letters in, would your friends stop being your friends?

To say that I "buy my friends" when I am in a non-hazing sorority is like saying that in my 9 years of Catholic school I was buying my religion. The true friends you have and your spirituality have absolutely nothing to do with money.

Don't quote me wrong....
 

Rowdysister don't quote me, and twist the statment wrong! WTF, you straight quote me wrong! Do you know how to quote? I said it about pledging not hazing! You got to read the section about Sors. harder. If I am talking bad about hazing with fraternities, what makes you think I would say it would be right with sororities? Come on, get your shitnik right. I'm out and going to sleep, damn, I hope I can sleep.
-Heath.

You know prophet, I'm sorry if I offended you or misconstrued your post, but feel free to pm me and we can straighten this out. Yes, I do know how to quote, and if you feel like I took what you said incorrectly, then I'd like to know what you really meant. Sorry for possibly making you lose sleep over this.

Re: People, when it comes to being Hazed and being Pledged there are many diffrences...
 

ROWDYsister - here's what you were really looking for:

here ya go kid - turns out, you and prophet were arguing for the same cause the whole time. Prophet's point was that hazing doesn't make sense. So was yours. Now we're all happy.



And the last one - he wasn't saying that non-hazing sororities are wrong, ace. Quite the contrary - he was just trying to reinforce that history is an important part of pledging, and that tests for new members can be beneficial (and not hazing).

ROWDYsister - he was saying exactly what you were, wouldn't you agree?

Context is key - so let's take the whole statement into our thought process, not just one line.

We have two very simple rules we apply to determine if something is pledging or hazing: if it doesn't directly relate to some important part of a pledge's education, it's hazing, and if it prevents a pledge from doing his or her school work, it's hazing. That's it. There have been many, many practices we've either crushed at the suggestion stage or nixed later on, perfectly harmless and silly things, even, because they didn't comply with those rules.

Our definition is actually a lot more exclusive than the university's- they use the state's legal definition of hazing. (Hazing is a felony in Massachusetts.)

I jumped the gun and responded too quickly. It looks like we're on the same page, Prophet, so sorry for unnecessarily pissing you off. I had visions of better-than-thou-because-I-earned-my-letters-through-hazing, like a post from someone else from a few days ago. Bygones?