Soror-Frat/Sister-Brother
 

HI I just have one question. Are Phi Beta Sigma and Zeta Phi Beta Frat and Soror or merely sister and brother?

I am asking because I remember me telling someone that my boyfriend (a Sigma) was going out with his Sorors and they told me that only ladies have Sorors and guys are Frat and they were sister and brother not Soror and Frat.

Just asking!

Re: Soror-Frat/Sister-Brother
 

As it has been mentioned a million times on this site...Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated and Phi Beta Sigma Fraternity, Incorporated are the ONLY brother/sister/soror/frater organization. Your friend was incorrect in his/her statement. Just as I have sorority sisters, I have fraternity brothers.

"Merely" Sister-Brother? Do you think of a sister/brother as just merely so? Maybe there is something I'm not getting.

What about Sigma souls then?

Sigma Souls
 

What are Sigma souls; what about them anyway? If they are one of these auxillary groups like the kappa sweethearts or alpha angels, Sigma "knows" nothing of them. Actually, it does not matter who or what they are, if you go to the national website for Sigma (and Zeta if you desire), you'll find out what organizations Sigma and Zeta "recognize".

Like everyone has said, Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, INC is the sister organization for Phi Beta Sigma Fraternity INC and Phi Beta Sigma Fraternity INC, is a brother organization to Zeta. As such they (Zeta Phi Beta) are our sorority sisters and we are their fraternity brothers.

Six_Three_Sigma

Just to respond to the soul thing
 

There are a few forums out there dealing with the topic but I recommend going to my chapters website. I think I took the most professional approach to addressing Doves/Souls/Sweethearts/etc...

I have to agree with you Frat@six_three_sigma.

Zetas and Sigmas are Brother and Sister...Soror and Frat...Doves, Sweethearts et. al are NOT in this relationship.
I mean, it'Z cute to have them around I guess, but when it comeZ down to it...ZPBS is the brother/sister phamily..NOT ZPBSandFriends.

Legacy, I clicked on the link and didn't see anything. Is the url correct?

Re: Just to respond to the soul thing
 

Frat, I didn't see where you really addressed it. Unless I missed it, don't you just describe who they are and what they do? I didn't see mention of Blue "Souls" at all.

I did like frat'Z explanation of the Bond between Sigma and Zeta though. :)

I think I should add the word Soul, even though Doves & Souls are in essense the same thing,in there & a line that says when Doves as an organization was disbanded. Will that do soror. Oh by the way I love my sorors to death. Especially the one I plan on marrying and the one that gave birth to me.

Okay Frat lagacypbs,

I went to the sight and took a look at what the doves (or souls) are. So, now I have an answer to my question about what they are.

Now I have other questions. At the top of the your site's dove page, there is a note which reads "Nationally Phi Beta Sigma does not endorse sweethearts but it is acknowledged as an important part of our history."

If Sigma does not endorse sweethearts, who acknowledges them as an important part of our history?

Also, it is stated on the site that doves "assist the men of Phi Beta Sigma with ...., the in-take process.... Is this correct? Do we (or should we) really have an organization out there that helps out with the intake process? (I realize that when you're actually going through it, any help would be appreciated though. ;) )

Finally, it was stated that the organization was founded at the 14th Conclave in Chicago (1933) by brother Bro. Carl Turner. Was this organization founded there or did Brother Turner put it up for discussion at the Clave? In my small amount of time in Sigma, I have not read nor heard of anything of the sort. I do believe that this Brother wanted to found the organization, I do not really believe that the brothers at the conclave voted in favor of this. (I do not know either way though.)

Anyway, I am just trying to get a better understanding of this organization. I am not trying to "grill" or anything like that.

As a side not, I will be marrying a soror also.

GOMAB

Six_Three_Sigma

Legacy, I didn't even know what a Sigma Soul was but it seems to be what a Dove/Sweetheart is. I've never heard anyone use Soul to describe them though. Don't change the site over that...It's tight as is.

:) @ frat marrying sororZ. How Blue-tiful!

6'3"
You make a good point frat. I'll check with some of the historians in the frat and find out if they can better answer the question. I also think my "disclaimer" is misleading. They are a part of our history but I don't know about the important thing. I wonder what nationals even says about them. I have seen the word disbanned before so that does acknowledge an existance.

Dopenezzz:
Changing the site is just the Sigma in me. I love the site but it is not perfect. I'm about to redo the site with new pictures new info more on my sorors Rho Nu and the other 3 undergrad sigma chapters 3 grad sigma chapters 3 undergrad zeta chapters & 2 grad zeta chapters in my area. Plus I got some tricks to unleash on the site.

Also on the origional topic there is a good discussion in Yahoo clubs Club Link I think

Here is some info from one of the authorities on Sigma history

Doves, as most chapters use them, are nothing like the way doves used
to be.
(pre-1980) The reason for this is because of the changes in times and
such.
Things that are done now are different in many cases than why, and
how
they were done 10 years ago, 20 years ago, 30 years ago, etc.

Doves used to be, (pre-1980's), either the girlfreinds or wives of the
brothers. Depending on where you were in the country you either had:

1) Sigma Shadows
2) Sigma Doves
(and there may be more that I can't remember right now)

Likewise Zeta's had Zeta Knights who were either their boy-friends or
husbands.

Pre-1980 a women did not pledge to be a Shadow or a Dove, she basically
just
had to be dating a brother or she might have been the chapter queen.
Being
a dove or a shadow was basically a conferred title, and most of the
time
nothing was really expected of them, yet it was used in many cases as a
recruiting tool on the collegiate level. The idea, if your Doves were
good
looking more guys would want to join your frat. Most of the
competition
(pre-1970 or so) was on fraternities out dressing or out performing
(community service - campus programs) each other. The other aspect was
if
the women around them looked good, and dressed well the more prestige
the
fraternity would get.

In some cases the Doves or Shadows, pre-1980 again, would be encouraged
to
become Zeta's. Not all the time, but due to the contact this would
sometimes be the case. I have found that more of the collegiates
called
their girlfriends and such Doves, and graduates most of the time called
their girlfriends and wives, Shadows. All of this I have just
explained is
because of the how the social environment was pre-1970.

Now we get to the 1970's and 1980's. In the 1980's fraternities and
sororities saw an increase in membership that had never been seen
before.
Some of this possibly was due to more people be able to attend college.
Where pre-1970 anyone attending college was considered elite. Social
trends
and such began to change. Pre-1970 more people were prone to wear
suits or
business casual type wear. The 1970's and 1980's brought on a change
in
style and fashion. Also, society changed as far as relations between
male
and female. Things considered unacceptable for dating became
acceptable.

Now we get to fraternities and sororities in the 1970's and 1980's. It
seems that somewhere in the 1970's and 1980's Doves became less of the
special women in the lives of the brothers, but the women that were
just
around the brothers. As campus life, and dorm life changed you begin
to see
more chapters pledging Doves and such. This follows other trends since
in
the late 1970's is when the hand signs started. The 1980's is when
doing
the calls started. Steps shows became more and more prominant in the
1970's. Hazing increased with the numbers in the 1980's. In line with
this
many chapters had Doves who were basically, and excuse the term, "the
hoes
for the chapter". In about 1990 and 1991 the NPHC scrapped the whole
auxillary deal. Some of this is because of the changes I noted earlier
which were changes in society. So officially there are no Doves. Even
though some graduate chapters will call their wives either Doves or
Shadows
depending. That is only because their wives aren't pledging to be
this.

Well, I hope that helps. Let me know if I need to go into more depth.

Ahab El'Askeni ** Life Member #1429
Phi Beta Sigma Fraternity, Inc.
CPT. AHAB the PuPPeT MaStEr
Fall 96 ** LEGION OF DOOM ** #5 of 11
Initiated Dangerous Delta Theta Chapter
@ Prairie View A&M University

Now Kappa Beta Sigma Chapter
Brooklyn, New York

The Sigma Historical Society
http://www.sigmahistory.cjb.net
sigmahistory@ureach.com

In line with this many chapters had Doves who were basically, and excuse the term, "the hoes for the chapter".
--------------
Ooh..Frat is going to get it for that one. lol

:D

Frat,

Thanks for "hitting" me with the "knowldege" about the Doves and the shadows. It makes since to me given what you have put in and what I know about Sigma history.

GOMAB