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Is mutual selection really mutual?
I am really upset and am wondering why this happened to me...
Our school's greek life is really laid back. No one ever needs recommendations, and last year every girl that rushed got a bid from their first or second choice. My GPA is above a 4.0 and I have tons of community service and a few extracurriculars that I am extremely passionate about and dedicated to. Every night I got invited back to all the chapters I selected. I put down my 3 choices on pref night. I told my Rho Chi that I really really really wouldn't be comfortable with my 3rd choice and she said there was only a slight chance of getting it and I should put it down anyway. So I did and then I signed the sheet saying that I would accept a bid from any of my top 3 and that if I didn't I couldn't pledge any other Panhellenic chapters for a calender year. So come bid day, I was fairly confident I would get one of my top 2. I opened my bid and it was my 3rd choice. I talked to my Rho Chi and she said that I should try it out anyway. I was so shocked and broken-hearted I just couldn't bring myself to do it. Later on my friend told me that the longer a sister knows you the more voting power they have. I have known two of the sisters in my 3rd choice for over 5 years. Could their votes have overridden my rankings? Or did my top two choices just not want me? It would actually be better if my top two just didn't want me because then I wouldn't feel like it was my fault. Did I screw myself over just by going to my 3rd choices pref night? |
I honestly don't know how other sororities do it, (i would think votes would be anonymous) but I doubt any sister could have more voting power than another...maybe they can just push harder for you, and influence others?
And the way you get your 3rd choice is if you're low enough on the other 2 groups' bid lists and they reach quota before they get to your name... ETA: WAIT - Did I read that right?? You only went to Choice # 3's pref ceremony?? You can't get a bid to a group if you don't go to their preference night. Or are you only thinking that you SHOULDN'T have have gone to # 3's pref in addition to the first 2? Going to group #3's pref night wouldn't have affected your ranking on the other 2's bid list. |
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...why would you not show up at pref night?
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Thanks. That actually does help a little bit.
I went to all 3 different sororities pref nights. Then I ranked those 3. Yeah I was thinking that I SHOULDN'T have gone to my 3rd choices pref night. My friend is in my #1 choice said that her vote really did count more because she had known me for over a year. All this stuff is just really weird. |
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When you put 3 groups down, there is a chance no matter how small or great that you will get your last choice. Quote:
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To answer your second question - It's not so much that your top 2 choices "didn't want you". They invited you to Pref. When you invite someone to Pref you are pretty much saying "We think you're awesome, and we could definitely fit in with our group" to the pnm. From what I understand women invited to Pref are all on the bidlist... it's just a matter of where on the bidlist you are. There are also many factors that contribute. Maybe you had pretty good placement on their bidlists, but the groups met quota before they got to your name? Matching is a complicated process and I'm not even going to try explaining it b/c I will confuse myself. Quote:
I'm guessing if you didn't put down the 3rd group you would have went bidless and would have received "that call" from your Rho Chi. You really have to look at the bright side here. A group really liked you enough that they invited you for membership. You should give them a chance. If you're not really feeling them, then you should probably drop before initation. Either way, you are ineligable for another bid for a full calendar year, so you might as well give it a shot. |
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I would say that it was mistake to put down Choice #3 on your Preference Sheet at the end of the night, if you had no intention of ever joining that group. Also, if anything, if you didn't want Choice #3, skipping their Choice #3's Preference would probably have send the message, loud and clear to them.
That being said, I do think that your Rho Chi was also somewhat in the wrong to direct you to still put down choice #3: "I told my Rho Chi that I really really really wouldn't be comfortable with my 3rd choice and she said there was only a slight chance of getting it (bad advice) and I should put it down anyway". I also don't know what your campus is like, but if you are extended a bid and then don't join, you could be viewed as...ahem..."damaged goods" next year and it might be even more difficult to get a bid from your top 2. I don't mean to be harsh, but I think it's important that you are aware of all of the possibilities. |
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Yeah. That's what I was asking. Thanks y'all. Sorry for being a drama queen. |
One girl's vote counted more than the others? That doesn't sound right to me...
However, one member can have more more influence than another member simply by virture of her office, or year in school, or personality, or anything else that makes people follow others. |
To answer your first question, yet it is mutual.
You ranked your sororities first, second and third. The sororities ranked those attending their pref parties in a similar type manner. How they arrived at their rankings is confidential. Anyway, there were two chapters that you liked more than the other one. Unfortunately, those two chapters appear to have ranked other PNMs higher than you, as you were too low on their bid lists to receive a bid. They filled quota before getting to your name. It has nothing to do with attending that third party, and on some campuses you would be removed from recruitment for skipping a party. (not to mention this is R-U-D-E!) Both you and the chapters had a say in the rankings, thus the mutual selection. I am sorry that it did not work out the way that you wanted. However, that third house did see something that they liked in you, so they may be feeling just as rejected as you are. We don't always get our first choices in life. |
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Also. It's too late. I already rejected my bid. I got my bid at 10 and we had to decide by noon. And I didn't know what to do. I didn't want to go to bid day crying so I just went home. |
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That's what I was about to ask....whether you decided to give Choice #3 a chance or not. Ahhhh.....I wish you hadn't turned down your bid. You could have been surprisingly happy there! |
Well, sorry to hear you already rejected the bid. That's really too bad.
If what you said is true (The Rho Chi telling you to put it down anyway since there is only a small chance and that the computer would freak out if you only put down 2 choices) I agree with someone else who said that is bad advice. In the end though, if you went back in time and didn't write down the 3rd group, like we've already said, you would have gone bidless. So now that you've already rejected the bid that was given to you, you have the same conclusion. Questions answered. End of thread :) |
I dunno it just really didn't feel right. Ugh. Oh well. I just feel stupid now.
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As for the computer "freaking out" if you put down 2 choices only, that's Panhell's problem, not yours. FWIW, I do feel your pain. I think you were giving some bad advice by the Rho Chi, as was I, when I rushed and I also ending up turning down my bid. I do not regret it, but I do regret listening to the advice of the Rho Chi. I would rather have gone bidless, than received a bid from a group that I didn't want. Quote:
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Panhellenic recruitment bid ranking is a process and I can tell you from experience that because your friend has a vote it does not count more in bid matching from a Panhellenic stand point. And yes, it does sound weird. What I can tell you is that while your 3rd choice may not have been your favorite. it would have been great to give them a chance. I do wish you the best. |
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I'm glad I went through recruitment because I did meet a lot of great girls and it totally shattered all the stereotypes that I had before. At least I came away with some new friends. |
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Seems like you have a good attitude about the whole thing after reflecting on it. Good luck to you. |
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You can't rush again until next year. So it may have been a good idea to give #3 a shot. But what's done is done at this point. This serves as some good advice to PNMs, really think before you sign your final card because if you do, make sure you're willing to take a bid from any group you list. |
Do you think I could talk to the Greek Life office about letting me do informal recruitment in the spring? Even though I signed my pref card? It said that if you turn down a bid (like I did) that you're ineligible for a year. My Rho Chi really led me to believe that I had to put all three of the sororities I went to on my preference card. Even though after she went over the rules I told her I wouldn't be comfortable with my 3rd choice.
I don't know how I'm going to feel about joining a sorority a semester from now, but I feel like I was misinformed. I doubt the Greek life office will care that I misunderstood. But I wanted to get y'alls opinion on trying to go that route. I really don't want to get my Rho Chi or anyone in trouble though. Would talking to Greek Life be stir up more trouble than it's worth? |
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If you receive a bid and decline it, you cannot participate in formal or informal for an entire year. Yes, it sucks that the rules were not explained to you properly (and Rho Chi's should know better), but that does not change the rule. This is a national NPC policy If you wish t talk to the GL office and tell them that you were misled, that is up to you. They can make sure that next year's Rho Chi's understand the rules better, but it doesn't change the rule. |
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Also, by spring you may have changed your tune and find the group that you rejected to be more appealing and something you would like to pursue. It does happen.
(And this is just a wild guess, but I'm betting that the groups that you didn't get won't be doing informal in the spring anyway, and the group that you turned down will - so the result is exactly the same.) |
I hate dumb Recruitment Counselors!!!:mad::mad::mad: Well, I don't know if she was dumb or intentionally deceitful. Either way, it's BS that she told you the "computer would freak out" if you only put 2 choices. Not true in the least. You deserved honesty.
Definitely let the Greek Life Office know about your situation. It won't change your situation, but it might make them reconsider their Recruitment Counselor training, whether the RCs simply need to be more knowledgeable or if there is a "you MUST rank all the chapters so we can place every PNM no matter if some are unhappy" attitude. Maybe your story will prevent this from happening in the future. There is still no way you'd be able to do informal recruitment in the spring. The only thing you might be able to talk Greek Life and/or 3rd choice chapter into is you wanting to reaccept your bid to 3rd choice chapter if possible. That is, if there is still space available. One year my chapter had a girl drop out the day after bid day (we made quota so there was only one spot), and we filled her spot with a PNM who had dropped out after pref. ETA: Your other questions do venture into the realm of membership selection, and you'll never know how any chapter does it other than the one you're in. It's doubtful that certain members votes count more, but certain people are better at explaining how they feel about a PNM and convincing others to vote with them, so it may be this reason that one may think that certain members' votes carry more weight. I can tell you that 3rd choice chapter liking you didn't ruin your chances at your 1st or 2nd choices. You were simply not high enough on either of their lists. If you had not ranked 3rd choice chapter, you would have ended up bidless. |
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SIGH. |
Some schools and Greek systems are really into maximizing your options. I know at the university where I advise a chapter, they very heavily stress that not putting down the max number of chapters on your preference card can negatively affect your recruitment results. Of course, your results would have been the same either way... as others explained, you did not match with your first two choices regardless of any chapter members' voting power.
And honestly, many girls would much rather get a bid to their 3rd choice than go bidless. I'm sorry that you were disappointed. And... on the off chance that you went through recruitment at the school where I advise... we have done very well over the past few years at placing almost all the girls in their sorority homes, but it's not true that everyone gets their 1st or 2nd choice. |
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I agree with VioletPretty. The chapter you rejected may still be willing to accept you into it's new member class. Often times a chapter can re-extend you a bid if it hasn't reached total. A humble request such as this could work. “I enjoyed meeting your members but I just wasn’t sure about joining when I received the bid, which is why I declined. But I’m afraid that I reacted hastily. After more thought, I’ve realized that I am interested in becoming a member of Beta Beta Beta sorority. Based on this, are you interested in re-extending the bid to me?” This message would be best delivered on your behalf by a member of your Panhellenic Council. Fortunately, many or most of the women in that chapter have been through formal recruitment and fully understand the stress and emotions of it all. They will empathize with your feelings. Let's assume that you want to give it a try. The benefit of your current position is this: You can experience GLOs in that 3rd choice sorority this year and still walk away from that chapter at a later date. Right now you can't participate in recruitment until next fall. If you give the chapter a try, and later resign your membership, you will be in the same position. You can participate in formal recruitment next fall. Let’s look at your other option. You may choose to remain disaffiliated altogether this year. Again, you can participate in formal recruitment next fall. You'd likely do so with sorority choice 1 and sorority choice 2 in mind. If so, it wouldn't hurt to develop friendships with women in those chapters during the school year. Demonstrate that you are a quality potential member. Get involved on campus with some "visible" organizations. Take on leadership roles. Show your ability to be a good time manager. Demonstrate your maturity. Don't let your fantastic GPA slide. Try to exude a positive attitude all the time. Be the great representative now that they are seeking in their membership. Of course, I hope you will see if you can reverse your bid rejection situation. In case you are wondering, there is no rule that prevents a sorority from extending a bid to a woman that it released during a prior recruitment. You should also know that it is possible that another woman who DID want to join that chapter (your third choice) did NOT receive HER bid because she was the next person on this chapter's bid list after it closed/met quota. So, there may be another woman on your campus who was released from that chapter, or worse, released altogether from recruitment as a result of your taking that quota spot that you did not want. It is possible and it has happened. Keep us up to date and good luck with your decision. |
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I know you're just trying to be encouraging, but keep in perspective that (as you know) recruitment is complicated and you can't say that if girls do certain things that "a sorority won't be able to resist them." If you look in the Recruitment Stories forum, you'll see that involved women who have good grades don't get their first choices or get dropped from recruitment entirely. So all of those things do not = a bid. |
Couldn't one argue that the mutual selection is a bit unfair? Sure, you and PNM #2 both talked to two actives individually, but PNM ##2 has a best friend in the house, whose influence is probably stronger than those that met her for only a few minutes - thus, PNM #2 would have an advantage when it came to ranking PNMs...? Unless I am wrong about the whole friends part - do active friends/relatives in the house have a say even though they don't necessarily get to talk to the PNM?
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Since everyone has done a nice job of answering RN3s questions, may I make a slight hijack?
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Bid Day was at 4:30 and so the PNMs had that evening and then most of the next day to make up their minds. Was it common for someone to take 24 hours? No, but there were definitely times when it took more than 2 hours, and every year there were a few that accepted thier bids the next morning. Anyway, it just seems that with a mere 2 hour window that exactly what happened with this PNM would happen. Emotions are running high, fear that people would see that she had been crying, etc I think would sway many of them to just go back to the dorm. |
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To the OP: I'm sorry things didn't work out the way you wanted them to. I'm sorry you were given and followed bad advice from your Rho Chi. Even moreso, I'm sorry you didn't give the chapter that extended you a bid a chance.
You can contact Panhellenic to see if you can change your mind. Honestly I don't know if this is possible either by NPC or your campus Panhellenic rules. It is worth a shot. The worst they can do is say "No." Please keep in mind though that even if it is within the rules, the chapter may no longer have a spot for you. Since you officially declined the bid, that chapter may have already snap bid someone to fill their vacancy in quota. But if that's not the case, please do not pursue this if you seriously have zero interest in being initiated into XYZ and only want to soothe your broken heart a bit. By accepting a bid with no intention of initiating you would be postponing that chapter's ability to COR up to quota. |
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Oh and SureSister, please go elsewhere and plug your blog - to say to a rushee who is upset "they won't be able to resist you next year" is absolutely deplorable and shows you know NOTHING about rush. |
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