getting rid of bigs/littles?
 

A friend of mine mentioned this morning that her (NPC) org's HQ was beginning to discourage the practice of big and little sisters because it promotes seniority. Does anyone know if their HQ's are actually pushing for this?

I haven't heard of orgs discouraging the big/little program altogether, but I have heard of orgs using terms other than "big" and "little".

I can understand the move to different terms (although I'll probably always refer to them as bigs and littles, but I'm still struggling to hop on the "recruitment" bandwagon), but I would be disappointed if my org abandoned the program as a whole.

This to me would be a very foolish idea as the bigs are there to help their littles.

Maybe they are just going through a name change?

If I'm not mistaken, KKG got rid of big/little then brought it back. (Please correct me if I'm wrong, KKGs)

The "seniority" argument is silly. If a big is doing things like saying "you have to do my laundry because you're my little" it has nothing to do with seniority or the big/little program - it has to do with her being an a-hole. A-holes shouldn't have littles.

No matter what, we are going to have members who have been in the chapter longer, and cliques within chapters. Getting rid of big/little or families doesn't change that, it just makes it take on a different form.

I agree. I think it's silly to put different names on it. No offense, but whether you call them diamond sister, mom-kid, or big-little, it's still a sponsor member-new member relationship. Calling it by any other name doesn't change that.

I can understand wanting to discourage anything that would appear to put new members in a subordinate position or imply hazing, but I have yet to meet an ADPi who doesn't say, "This is my big diamond. Or this is my great-grand-lil diamond."

Things can look great on paper by proposing to change the name of the mentor/sponsor program, but let's keep in mind that these organizations have had big-little programs for longer than most of us have been alive. The name isn't going anywhere--- case in point: Rush has been "recruitment" for more than 20 years and most people still call it rush.

Hmm.
I know the Phi Sigma Sigma Chapter at my school doesn't do a big/little program...I can't remember what it is that they have instead(so the girls don't feel left out 'cause all the other chapters here have Big/Lil's of some kind), But I think, because our chapters aren't super huge, they have something that just encourages New Members to think of all actives as mentors...like "you can ask any active for anything and she'll help"
I mean I'm not certain..but I kinda remember that from recruitment.

Yes and no. With the implementation of the shorter new member program, we switched to something called Kore groups, which is basically like a pledge family. It's a new member, sophomore, junior and senior who are grouped together. The sophomore or junior member is call the "Key Sister" and acts as the direct mentor to the new member, but the other actives in the Kore group still interact with the new member.

In theory, it's supposed to be different than bigs/littles/families, but most of the time, it still ends up being similar.

Humm... I've not heard of a chapter not doing Sapphire sisters ( it's bigs/lils, but that's our "new" term for the program) but that doesn't mean there's not a chapter that doesn't

This sounds like a great idea because it ups the chances that the new member will have close connections in the group from the beginning. It also sounds great because it keeps seniors involved and values their role in a different way that just expecting them to take another little sister.

I can't imagine doing away with bigs/littles in some form.
In both theory and practice it works pretty well.


In fact my son's school just started a "mentor family" program for the new parents to the school. The principal even described it as a "big/little type program". I have my first mentoree family and next year, they will take a mentoree family and so on until we have built a network of older and newer families. in theory, when my son reaches 8th grade, there will be 8 other families that we are linked with as part of the mentor family.

I think it is sad that we have to be so careful when it comes to certain aspects of Panhellenic life. This just seems like another example where people are going too far to insure other's feelings are not hurt. I am not suggesting that any NPC sorority haze. I am just saying that getting rid of bigs and littles is silly and ignores the positive things that bigs and littles do. I think people need to quit complaining and loof for the positive!

Kind of a hijack - I am confused when people say how many littles they have. Like I was talking to an AXiD from another chapter and she asked me how many littles I have and I said one. She looked absolutely puzzled. I asked how many she had- she had 3. When people say they take more than one little - are they talking about taking twins or their little taking a little (which would be the original bigs grand-little)?

Did I confuse everyone with my question?

They're talking about taking twins. Her chapter experience just may have been such that having only one little was the exception rather than the norm.

For us it's 2 littles at one time. Rarely happens.

Yes, it is two littles at one time. I have seen this happen quite often as some members aren't able to afford to take on a little sis, or the new member class seems to bond more with certain older members.

In response to a different question from an AXiD above - in some chapters not just the sophomore class takes on littles (which it sounds like is what happens at your chapter - correct me if I'm wrong). Sometimes the new member class is very large and juniors (and even seniors) take on littles, thus enabling a upperclasswoman to have two or more littles.

In our terminology it was just 2 littles in general, who had the same big. This probably varies from chapter to chapter.

I had 4 little sisters! One my sophomore year, one my junior year and two my senior year!

I think big/little programs are very important. My big sis was an amazing mentor and so were her friends from her pledge class.

Yeah, it varies. I had 3 littles, two that were twins, and one that was a transfer in the spring semester and I adopted her. Twins had to be in the same pledge class. (No one ever took triplets except for one year when the soph. pledge class was tiny.)

My chapter did big-little in a cool way. For the "new member period" they had "sis-mom" (sister-mother) and the older members took "sis-dots" (sister-daughters.) Then, you got your permanent big usually shortly after initiation.

Anyone of any grade could be a sis-mom, but only the sophomores took littles.

Most of us took littles as sophmores, and most only took one little. Occassionally if we had a large fall COB class or qouta was very high, some people took a second little. Even if they weren't in the same class, they would be considered twins.

I don't remember money ever coming into play when getting a little. It was more about how active you were in the chapter and that you were in good standing. Most of the gifts littles got were from the whole family (even alums!) that would pitch in together to welcome the newest member.

My chapter was pretty big, so we never had twins. Some of the Sister-mothers (bigs) did take on 2 daughters, but it was the rule, not the exception.

I agree, big and little is something that even if "banned" would pop up in some other form informally. If the big is a good big, it can really help integrate the new member into the chapter and can be a very positive influence.

I was blessed to have 5 little sisters, two sets of twins, senior and super senior semesters (must be from same pledge class on my campus) and one last minute blessing right before I graduated. I love them so much and couldn't imagine not having them or my big either! I also feel that it really helped me to stay involved with my chapter as well.

The sister-mom I got at the beginning of my Pledge period is the sister-mom I still have today. In my chapter, the sister-mom you get at NM ceremony is permanent.

I had three lil sisters during my collegiate years. My first Lil dropped out after initiation because she had a hard time keeping up with AOII while maintaining her softball scholarship. My second Lil sis was going to them be my only Lil sis, and we are still very close today. I took a third Lil sis only because we went from a pledge class of 25 one year to 36 the next when recruitment numbers shot through the roof, so obviously we needed some extra people to take a new Lil sis. No one took two at one time....we also avoided that!

Same. I've never heard of anyone having two littles at once..

Except in our chapter, it's always twins, no matter how many of you there are. If you have five littles, each of them has four twins :)

It still is permanent, but it was more of an active relationship during the new member period. It just isn't as important in my chapter as big-little. Also, in my chapter people generally weren't as close to their sis-mom, who chose them, as they were to their big, since that relationship was mutually chosen.

Also, since we didn't allow people to take more than one sis-dot a year, there were always juniors and seniors that had to take them, so there were cases of sis-moms graduating half a semester after initiation. Having a soph. as a big ensured that they would still have an older sister who was active.

My sis-mom was a good sister, but wasn't as close as my big, however, one of my littles was one my sis-dots.

In our chapter, we have a "Momma Bug" - what the "Pearl Class" calls their VP of Membership Ed.
Then, each girl has a "Ruby Sis", who sponsors her through the Phoenix ritual, and is her temporary Big until the Big Sis revealing ceremony.

Sometimes, we have true twins...when one girl takes 2 littles at a time, but I try to discourage this. Quite often, a Big will take multiple Littles during different semesters.

What's y'all's opinion on the max. number of littles a member should take?

Twins and Triplets
 

"Twins," at least with the chapters I've dealt with, is when a big sister gets more than one little sister throughout her tenure in the chapter. The little sisters call themselves twins (triplets) even if they did not get their Big at the same time. This is common with small or growing chapters as the sisters of a small chapter may have to take numerous lil's. Bigger chapters where there aren't enough NM's for the actives probably have only one lil sister.

That's how it is done here as well, though there is another woman who is referred to as a Delta.

I took 4 littles. Three of them are in the same new member class, but I only took two when big sis revealing came around. The other girl was adopted when her big turned in her badge. My 4th little came my senior year when we doubled our chapter size and many people took twins they asked the seniors if we would mind having one more. My last little has been "adopted", since i graduated, by her twins. In our family tree she is still under me though.

Wow. I guess when I was in school, our pledge class sizes were pretty stable, so pretty much everyone had one big and one little. If you wanted a second little (which was rare), you usually got them during informal recuitment in the spring. Spring pledge classes were 5-10 women versus fall which was 45-50.

We also had a rule that you had to be active for at least two quarters before you could take a little.

So a spring initiate couldn't take a little that fall, they had to wait until spring or the next fall.

It may depend on the chapter size.

My undergrad chapter was small. I had three sis-dots (sister-daughters), each in a different pledge class, one from formal recruitment and two from COB. Mind you, that was in the early 1970's and gift-giving most likely was less elaborate than it is now.

I maintain Christmas-time communication with all three, with some e-mail correspondence in between. OTOH, I have no idea what happened to my sis-mom, whom I last saw at her wedding in 1973, or my sis-grand, whom I last saw at her wedding in 1971.

-slight hijack

I'm curious - how much do/did people usually spend on their littles/daughters? And I'm referring to time and/or money. When I was in the chapter there was quite a bit of gift giving, as well hours upon hours spent on making a book full of poems and letters to be given when the little was initiated (which I realize was a tradition with our chapter as I haven't encountered many other chapters that do that). This is why some people in our chapter were hesitant or didn't want to take on littles.

<sorry if there's another thread on this and I've missed it>

When I was active and got my little (1998) there wasn't an abundance of online greek stuff and easily accessible greek paraphenalia to be purchased in our area. Our littles usually got stuff that was passed down -- from what I can recall, what I passed down to my little was a lavalier, a teddy bear, a plaque, a some passed down t-shirts from the founder of our family (our chapter was a few years old at the time). I bought her a set of family letters, a key chain, window decal, buttons, and other small chatchkis. Our chapter was also paint pen crazy, so I am sure I made her a couple of mugs and pic frames with our family stuff on them. I probably spent about $75 - $90 total - the letters being the most expensive.

I know my grandbig and big also gave my little some little things - passed down letters and t's and made her some mugs or something.

As for time paint penning paraphanalia or making welcome little signs - I couldn't tell you. I used to do the paintpenning for my roomate because she wasn't good at it and it kind of all runs together.

I honestly think this is one of those things that varies w/ every person...one sister might be able to be a fantastic, attentive, supportive big to 3 littles, and another sister might not even be able (or should I say care enough) to handle one.

What happens a lot of the time is there is a sister who takes on too many littles, feelings get hurt, so rules get put in place to prevent it. I don't believe that if a sister hasn't had a little, she should automatically get one over a sister that has had a little - it might not be a good match. But if it IS a good match, then a sister w/ out one should definitely be at the head of the list. Sure there are going to be times where the whole class wants someone for a big...but if she's had her chance for a little already, she needs to step aside.

That's probably what they do...I just remember that being something they said every time I went to their house was "Our new member program doesn't have have the big/little system like other chapters"...which maybe I misinterpreted it 'cause I knew other groups had different names for big/littles, but explained that it was basically the same thing. I probably just lost something in translation.

In my chapter the big usually but not always buys his little a letter jacket. And of course you should spend time with your little, but it's not that bad even if teh jacket is a bit pricey.

A nearby AΣA chapter buys jackets for their littles...what do y'all's jackets look like?

In our chapter, the big-little relationships are very tight knit it seems. I'm insanely close to my big, and I know a lot of other girls in my chapter are too.

As far as taking a little, our chapter wants everyone to take at least one, but you can take more. It just depends on if a new member clicks very well with the active. For instance, my grand-big has 4 littles (she adopted one of them) so our family is HUGE because almost everyone else has 2 littles.