People that you would NOT recommend.
 

In one the the threads, we started a discussion of "no recs."

And to maybe complement the weird rush stories thread, I thought a list of the circumstances for which one would or did send in a negative recommendation on a PNM would be interesting.

For instance, I know that had she rushed, I would have sent in a no rec for a girl who was arrested* for embezzling from her part time job. (Fortunately, she didn't rush, as far as I know.)

ETA: I certainly don't mean for people to name names.

* she was either convicted or pled guilty. There was no real question of guilt.

Oh, this is easy for me. I have sent in soooo many positive recommendations. I have sent in 2 no-recs.

Several years ago, I traveled overseas with some Senior Girl Scouts. Two were super, one had me coming apart every 10 minutes and wanting to call the national office to scream at them for choosing her. Apparently, she looked good on paper.

We were in a very conservative country and she showed up with green hair in a freaky spiked haircut. Of course, she was literally stopping traffic everywhere. She kept trying to pick up French sailors. Then at the end of the campout--conservative country, remember--she made up a dirty song for the closing. And a few months later, she called to ask me for a Pi Phi rec!!!!!

The other one was a counselor at a camp where several of my older daughters and I worked. She had a violent temper and screamed at several campers and counselors. She slapped some counselors and later the assistant director. She gouged her with her fingernail when she did that.

So she asked for recs from us and told us that she was a legacy to one of my daughters' groups. We could not write our no-recs fast enough (only no- rec my daughter has ever written). Later, an alum from the legacy group called to thank my daughter and told her that she found out that the girl had a police record.

Now get this--a year later, another daughter went and visited that campus and we met a sorority member. She told us that an administrator had all but forced her group to pledge the girl, who had caused major drama and been kicked out within weeks.

And ladies, this is what you save your no-recs for!

Absolutely! And at least you all had the peace of mind of knowing you did your best to warn them.

ETA: Do you think green haired girl just really was that clueless about what was appropriate? It just seems that if she called and asked for the rec. that she had absolutely no idea how bad her behavior was.

Wow, this really relates back to some of the discussions we were having earlier this week in the quota thread.

As was mentioned in the previous thread by others, it would take a lot for me to write a no rec. I would be more likely to ask the PNM to ask someone else for a rec if I did not feel comfortable recommending her. The girl would have to have some serious baggage that would reflect poorly on the sorority, like a felony or really risque photos online or something, for me to feel like I should write her a no rec.

A friend of mine told me once that her chapter often received no recs from older alumnae who did not want girls pledging because the girls drank or something like that. I think this is a perfect example of different alumnae taking membership criteria differently... some might see this as worthy of a no rec and others might think it makes the PNM a fun-loving girl! This is where multiple recs would come in handy... if 2 alums say "no," then it's definitely not just a personal opinion of one woman.

In some orgs (I'd wager most), it is extremely difficult if not almost impossible to pledge a PNM for which a No-Rec has been received, though. So whether one or two alums sent a No-Rec in doesn't matter.

I wrote my one and only DO NOT RECOMMEND on a woman who said nasty things about my sorority and chapter to my face. It wasn't like she was repeating rumors because she was clueless about rush or had no idea I am an Alpha Gam. She then proceeded to say she only wanted to be an XYZ or an ABC and said unsavory things about the other chapters.

It blows my mind that women think we only have friends in our own chapters and wouldn't give a heads up about their behavior to our friends. If I wouldn't want a woman as my sister, to the point I'd no rec her, you best believe I pass along the info to a friend and let her chose what to do with it.

Carnation beat me to it. I wrote two non-recs interestingly for the same girl.

She was one of my students. She looked great on paper, varsity cheerleader, but in my class her behavior was abhorrent. She neglected work, refused offers for tutoring, and often tried to sit in the lap of one of the football players rather than in her seat. She distracted class to no end and was off task almost continually. I wrote her up and mother was shocked that I would actually refer her daughter to the office. I ended up having to defend my classroom policies and documentation of her daughter's poor behavior and lack of character.

As karma would have it, the following year (her senior year) I was asked to write a rec for this girl. I wrote a no-rec and had no regrets doing it.

This year I was asked to write yet another rec for the same girl. Apparently she did not get a bid (for whatever reason) to the sororities at her university, so she is rushing again this year as a sophomore. I had the privilege of seeing her freshman transcript and it was less than stellar. I wrote another no-rec. I sincerely do not want this girl having any possibility of being my sister ever.

I think there are probably wildly different standards about what it would take to no rec, and I think that actives and recent alumnae and then really conservative significantly older alums are probably the fastest with the no rec.

I think people who really know a lot of high school aged kids or college kids but are at least five years out of college are probably a little more tolerant of normal indiscretions or unfortunate trends (joke facebook groups for example), which is why the PNMs who are REALLY out of line for one reason or another stand out.

She seemed to be going out of her way to shock people. The weird thing was that if you looked at her application--on which she had a regular hairstyle-- you would have thought that she was this kinda dumpy, geeky kid. Okay, that would have been fine. Trying her best to offend people (her newly created persona, I suppose), even strangers out on the street, was horrendous.

The only thing that kept me sane was that the Australian leader had a Maori kid who was doing the same thing and we banded together for support.

It also seems that overnight trips bring out the weirdness in some kids too. And the kids you might have wondered about as you got ready for the trip are angels.

And this was no overnight trip!:eek:It was a 3-week trip to 3 countries representing the Girl Scouts of the USA! When we dropped her off on the return trip, one of the other girls was literally crying in relief.

I almost forgot!!! This is the worst! We were landing in California and she said, "You know that ivory shop we were in in Hong Kong? Well, after y'all left, I went back and bought some and that suitcase over there is full of it." ILLEGAL IVORY! AAAAHHH!!! WE'RE ALL GOING TO GET ARRESTED!

We stepped up to customs--we were in uniform-- and the agents waved us through, saying ,"Girl Scouts! Like you're going to smuggle anything!":eek:

And she asked for a Pi Phi rec....

Wow. I don't think I'd ever sign up for a trip like that unless I could hand pick the kids.
Do you think she really bought any ivory or was she just going for maximum stress on you?

What ever ended up happening to her in rush?

She decided to stress us all out by pulling out some of the pieces in the airport and I backhanded her. (Okay, she did that but I didn't really.) Then she pulled out her whole haul at our host's house. :eek:

All I know, and this was because our magazine used to publish our pledge classes' names, is that she didn't manage to slip through and pledge us!

Just curious--when you write a "no rec" for someone, do you elaborate on your reasons/concerns, or just send in your rec form and literally write "NO REC" on it and leave it at that?

I almost fell off the couch laughing!!! What a peach!

In, oh, 34 years of writing recs, I think I've written 2 or 3 "no" recs. I don't really remember the reasons now, but I'm pretty sure they were fairly lurid.
There have been girls I was, um, reluctant to sign on. Not because they were so awful, but because I really didn't think they would fit into the chapter, or there were grade problems.
When that happens, I send in the rec as an information-only form and ask the chapter to call me before recruitment starts. I can then tell them my concerns, and let them make their own decision.
Back when I was a collegian, we pledged a girl who had a "no" rec because the alum didn't like the town she was from. Another "no" on a girl that the alum felt would not complete college. In both cases, we should have listened to the alumnae!
Another chapter pledged a girl who had serious mental and emotional issues. There was no rec on her from the alum in charge of getting recs for that high school.
Why?
Because the chapter didn't bother to ask the alum for a rec.:rolleyes:

No doubt she's in PETA today despite her ivory loving past.

I agree that she was a NO REC waiting to happen.

I just hope that nobody else pledged her.

What was so telling about the town she was from? That just seems a little random that it would be actually predictive.

Do some schools not get information about grades separately from the PNMs? It surprises that it would be necessary to make a recommendation based on academic weakness; it seems like that would be evident from other info the chapter would get.

pinkyphimu, glad you liked my absolutely true story! I could not have made up anything wilder.

What I ought to do, UGAalum, is find out what groups are at her school and then do like I did on a thread about an author--ask GC alums if her name appears on their rolls. By pm, of course.

The alum felt the town was 'wrong side of the tracks." I believe she actually said, "Nothing good ever comes out of that town."
Seems like back then, the only grades they got came from the girl herself. This was before Panhellenics asked for transcripts. Our alum Panhellenic had just started asking for them, so I had a little more info than the chapter had gotten on the info form the girl had filled out.
The grades weren't below the minimum, but they weren't far from it.
Does that make sense?

Oh dear!

The one time I No Recced someone, I first talked to a friend - who is an International Officer. I explained, and she told me to No Rec her, and she would handle it from there.

FWIW, we don't have to write an explanation. I just wanted to make sure that this was not seen as a frivolous act for me.

What? No gossipy reason for me? You're missing the point of this thread, Honeychile. ;)

I don't think we have to explain either, and I probably wouldn't. My internal standard would be is she likely to do actual harm to the chapter, and if I thought based on real evidence that the answer was yes, I'd no rec.

If I just didn't think she was a particularly good candidate, I'd just reflect my lack of glow in the rec itself.

It sounds like the beginning of a short story.

Yes, it makes complete sense. Fortunately, I've only been asked to do recs for girls that were pretty well matched academically to the campuses at which they were rushing so I never worried about that aspect.

But gah, what if she is?

Who wants to live with that knowledge?

Although we can hope that as she matured, she grew out of that stage.

Most No Recs I've received over the years simply have "CALL ME!" written on it. Either they don't want to put it on paper or the reasons are too long to write out, sometimes both.

I've been fortunate enough to have never had to write a No Rec, as yet. I'll share the hardest ones I ever had to deal with from an advisor standpoint. In one of my first years advising, an in-house active's younger sister was going through Recruitment. I received No Recs from 2 highly respected and trustworthy alums, women I knew personally who were also well respected in the Inat'l org. Seems that in the year since the older sister left for college her younger sister had ... well let's just say went completely wild. I guess she managed to hide it from the older sis.

I had to inform the older sis that we would not be extending her a bid and would actually be dropping her before Pref. (Normally we would drop No Recs even earlier, but we wanted to extend as much courtesy to the older sister as we could.) Older sis blew up and ended up turning in her pin to protest.

I later heard through the grapevine that the 2 sisters got an apartment together. Older sis then discovered younger sis was no longer the little angel she thought. She ended up regretting her decision to resign.

I sent in one no-rec. I had known of this girl for years (she is 6 years younger than me) and met her on several occassions - she was the daughter of one of the VPs my mom used to work for. The few times I had met her I thought she was a real brat. She had been kicked out of one public high school and one private school for drugs and violence (she apparently assaulted other students if they even looked at her the wrong way). I then found out she was going to attend my alma matter for college! I wrote a No-Rec to my chapter and did tell my alumni friends in other orgs about this girl. Luckily for the chapters, she didn't have the grade requirements to go through recruitment and transferred after the end of her freshman year.

Interesting - when I was in school, our chapter policy was that anyone with a 'No Rec' from an alumnae was cut after first round - no questions asked. Of course I wasn't Rush Chair or President so I don't know what went on behind the scenes.

I think most people are trying to avoid what may be considered membership selection. (my chapter did so, too)

Well, when I was Rec Chair, we did have a few No Recs. One that I do know about was a PNM who had an abortion when very young.

Which brings me to another story: a woman nearby was getting recs together for her daughter, and a few of her acquaintances agreed to meet her and her daughter for lunch one day. They arrived at the restaurant, and the acquaintances gasped when they saw the daughter. DD had been shopping at the mall (for Recruitment clothing!) and had treated two of the ladies so rudely that they had been taken aback.

I have no idea if they No Recced her or not, but it IS a lesson to PNMs: those little old ladies at whom you flipped the bird or slammed the door on may be the same ladies who you may need for a Rec!

I have an interesting one regarding a girl who decided to transfer colleges after freshman year and was going to rush at her new school as a sophomore.

I didn't write a no-rec for her, in fact, I recommended her, having known her and her family for years.

What happened was the alum group didn't let her rec go to the college.

Apparently, she had had an "interesting" year at her 1st college - sleeping her way through the guys, and that is why she was transferring. Of course, I didn't know any of this being apart from the situation. REALLY SAD because she was a sweet, intelligent girl who just went off the deep end - too much freedom that she didn't know how to handle, I guess.

I found out because I got thank you notes from the chapter for all the girls I had recommended except for her, so I contacted the alum club and they let me know.

Goes to show, reputations matter and follow you around wherever you go...

Holy shite! She had some chutzpah! I can hear your thoughts as she asked for a rec:

"Honey, I got your rec RIGHT HERE" ;)

Aww. This is awful to me on a couple of levels.

First of all, no one can really know this woman's real situation. A lot of times people who have abortions at very young ages are victims of incest or molestation or rape. And people on the outside might not necessarily know it was the case - it can still be a BOYFRIEND who rapes a young teenage girl.

My other point would be is that this is fundamentally her choice and perhaps in some respects a responsible decision, but I know a lot of people would disagree with me there. Whatever your view is, I doubt this young woman was proud of this situation and probably learned and matured a LOT from this decision.

I wonder if the decision to No Rec this would still have been made if this young woman had put her baby up for adoption.

I really hate this kind of thing, and I don't think it's appropriate. I know every individual alum can do what they want, but I think this kind of thing is awful. It's a shaming type of behavior that makes people feel bad about getting pregnant in the first place, and drives them to have abortions.

/soapbox

Best. Thread. Ever.

Makes me wonder - what would it take for Chuck Norris to "no rec" someone...

I often wonder the opposite. When I've heard gossip about collegians wanting to release a girl immediately who had a baby in high school and placed the baby for adoption. I always think (and often say), "You know, if she had an abortion in high school we probably wouldn't even know about it."

It’s a double standard for the same “questionable” behavior. I place questionable in quotations because such a high percentage of high school students are sexually active, that I feel it’s like the pot calling the kettle black to judge a girl because she got caught.

I get what you are saying and agree.

However -- and I have nothing to back this up other than annecdotal experience -- the girl whose abortion winds up being public knowledge is often the girl who doesn't give a flip about her reputation anyways since she's running around with every guy in town. I have never received a No Rec solely for having an abortion. It's always been accompanied with trampy behavior.

I've written one No-Rec in my life and it was one of the hardest things I've ever done. It was for my cousin...who also happens to be my God-daughter. (Oh, the guilt!)

She was such a sweet little kid but in her teen years she became an absolute nightmare. There wasn't anything scandalous; no criminal behavior or sexual escapades. She just became an unbelievable snob; an arrogant, rude, self-absorbed, brat. She started looking down on her former friends who didn't have "enough" money. She was completly incapable of any sense of loyalty, compassion or decency.

I had cut off any communication with her before she graduated from high school. When I found out where she was going to college I started to panic because I knew she would want to join a sorority and there was a KD chapter at her campus. I really agonized over writing a No-Rec but, in the end, I knew that I'd go ballistic if she became a KD. I really wasn't too thrilled with the thought of any NPC ending up with her. She simply lacked the ability to be a good sister.

What worried me was that she not only looked great on paper (good grades, cheerleader, lots of extra-curriculars) but she's a very pretty girl and it takes a little while to see her true character. I had a feeling she'd be highly sought-after.

After Recruitment, I was incredibly relieved to find out that she wasn't on KD's bid list. She did end up pledging another NPC though. About a year later I learned through the family grapevine that she actually never became an XYZ. She either depledged or they wised up and gave her the boot (probably the latter).