What's wrong with our youth? Is it a psychosocial disorder? Is it the parents?
 

I'm sure it was posted here but when I saw the video of the 16 year old girl getting beat up by 6 or 8 obvious sick individuals, I was outraged. It just seems like it's an occurance that happens so often now. Look at the psycho morons shooting other innocent children in the United States. Then I ask how long until another shooting occurs from some sick child.

A lot of people think it's background or environment. That may be true to an extent, but I no longer know if I actually believe that anymore. I think it could be a number of things. It starts early in life and it doesn't necessarily have to be the parent(s) fault. I think it could be from poor nutrition, birth complications or even low birth weight. All of this can cause poor neural development, which can result in bad behavior.

Sometimes children that are antisocial get ignored, and then they end up becoming some hardcore criminal. Maybe a lot of this can be prevented if people would catch this early on in a child's development.

The problem is GreekChat. I rebuke thee.

As someone who works with children on a daily basis in a family health clinic, I will say that half of the problem is that of the parents. Some children unfortunately do really have psychological imbalances, but a lot of the behaviors i see at the office are mostly a result of the parents...and I'll leave it at that.

Most doctors who treat these children give them medicine that the doctors have invested in, and only those medications.

Parents.

I'm sorry, but the only thing "new" about a kid being beat up by a group of 6-8 bullies is that it gets videotaped and posted on the internet now. Do you seriously mean to tell me that nobody in your highschool ever got beat up by a group of students? It happens, they are kids. They didn't used to be made famous by it, they just used to get suspended.

People always freak out about the awful behavior of the generation or two below them when, in fact, the behavior really isn't a new phenomena. Parents never like their kids music (except me.. I tend to like the same music that my kids do), they always think kids dress in ridiculous fashions (ironically, the 14 y/o is wanting to wear the same stupid 80's fashions that I used to wear), etc.

Should we as an adult society stop this behavior? Will it ever stop--the use of violence to solve problems? I'm sorry, but I have given up on that idea long time ago and have lost hope.

I agree. It's just like any other social ill. Child molestation, incest etc have been happening since the beginning of time and probably at times much worse than now...it was just that no one ever talked about it.

But I do think the growing dependence on meds doesn't help.

Too many kids are getting put on meds for things that are just....CHILDHOOD...and then if they go off them or change the dosage, needless to say it's going to freak a developing brain/nervous system out.

I totally agree AGDee!! My mom made pretty much the exact same comment as you when we talked about all these things today. She just thinks these kids want to be able to go back and see how "cool" they were when they beat up someone.

I believes, its the PARENTS! Seriously, it is getting pretty ridiculous nowadays. I don't know if any of you remember George Lopez's comedy routine about the Mexican mother vs the American mother in a store w/ the crying child. Race/ethnicity aside, this analogy holds true. You have more and more mothers nowadays who think that by taking away a "gold star" will teach their child how to improve their behavior.

Kids aren't afraid of their parents, in fact many parents are afraid of their kids. They want to be the kids best friend and not give the kid any guidelines or rules. Its beyond ridiculous. I mean, I am going to want to be my kid's friend, but not at the expense of my role as mom.

Huge co-sign. I've talked to some parents who have put their children on meds for being hyper or being sad every now and then. I always look at them like "Hmm...that's called LIFE."

I had a great mini-conversation with Rashid (Senusret I) about this just yesterday. If he finds his way over here, he might be willing to give his take on it.

My response: PARENTS

Co-sign.
Co-sign.
Co-sign.

True. Being bullied is nothing new, but being hostpitalized or almost killed over it is. Going around shooting other people like playing some violent video game is also insane. I think specific genes and the social environment interact to produce changes in the brain that influence emotional control and violence in kids. The V-Tech killer was taken off of his meds and look what happened. It's starts early, and if it isn't caught there's a possibility the kid could bacome a lifelong violent criminal. Antisocial behavior is what I think parents should start noticing. I think understanding whether a child is hyperemotional, or unemotional allows psychologist to identify high risk children early and to intervene with treatments before the child gets involved in serious crimes. I think things are different now because 20 years ago it was just general therapy and counselling, then waiting a few months to see if the kid got better. Yes, I do think parents are part of the problem but may not be the whole problem in some cases. In some cases improving parenting can be among the main tools of approaching antisocial behavior.

I beg to differ. Again, it just isn't talked about as much or hyped as much in the media.

If you've ever seen Death of a Cheerleader or River's Edge, those are both true stories (although River's Edge was changed from a guy being killed to a girl so they didn't have to pay off the author). Both of those happened over 20 years ago.

Now there is where you are wrong. You might not have ever seen someone getting beaten up that bad, but happens. It happened a lot when I was younger.

I'm in the library a lot, so I'll have to do some research on this topic, because I honestly don't think I'm wrong at all on this issue.

I agree largely with this assessment based on my daily experiences.

Most of "my kids" are on medicaid and come from families that unfortunately will always be dependent on that program. Our state medicaid program here apparently writes checks for an extra $500 a month (approximately) to parents with children who are diagnosed with ADHD. More and more parents are bringing their kids into our office to be diagnosed with this disorder. I'll grant that some of these children genuinely do have ADHD but most do not and dont even display any kind of hyperactivity while in the doctor's office atleast. We've had parents go as far as bringing in 6 month old babies to be diagnosed with ADHD--no joke. A lot of the behavior begins in the home with parenting or lack of parenting.

You can do all the research you want on the topic, but you might not know it happens unless you've seen it in person. In middle school, i've seen kids heads bashed in on the blacktop. Cops were a regular occurance there. In high school, our star track athlete severely broke a girl's nose because they were fighting over a boy.

Things like that happened often when I was younger.

Violence and amorality/immorality isn't new, but you can find studies that show that rates of arrest and incarceration for girls particularly have increased.

I think the nature of media, especially the internet, may make us more aware of news stories we wouldn't have heard about 20 years ago, so some of our sense of an increase may be because we just hear about more, but there's data that points to a trend too.

I work in retail at the moment. I don't know how parents were, but wow ... Most of the ones I encounter make me cringe. Still, I can't imagine that each generation doesn't have its own parenting issues. Maybe it is the drugs.

You need a license to drive, but anyone can have kids. Parents.

I just love the things I have seen from years of babysitting, albeit not necessarily violent behavior being referenced. When I was a kid, we went out side to play, amused ourselves. You could give me a 6 inch piece of yellow string and I'd have a blast. Nowadays, kids will sit and stare at me asking what can they do next. I have to lay out a $30 craft that will be destroyed in 10 days. They just don't know how to entertain themselves anymore.

One family just decided not to deal with their girls yelling and screaming. My first day, I was told to give them candy if they got upset or fresh with me because it would make them stop.

Last semester, I had a mom who actually asked me to teach her kids things. Fine and dandy. Apparently I was teaching them the word "no" because they had never heard it from their parents before. The son also, I swear, must've had ADHD. I would drop hints to her about my cousin with similar symptoms, and she'd reply with something like, "Well it's a good thing my son would never behave like that."

The girls I have now are so refreshing and .. normal. They have friends that come over from time to time, however, that are not even close. Just today I had to teach one of their guests that ripping things out of someone else's hand was wrong. "I want it. It's mine. I'll tell my mom and you'll be sorry." Seven years old. Mom comes by to pick her up, "Oh. Well she doesn't like to share. Nothing I can do."

WHAT?!

hyperactive behavior isn't neccecary to have ADHD, they just realized that, neurologically speaking, ADD and ADHD are the same thing, so they combined them.

i agree that the 6 month old babies having it is absurd

Wow! What kind of neighborhood was your school located in? Geez.

o.k. I did a little research on this topic. Here's what I found.

I was right. It has gotten worse. What you guys said about this not being new material was correct, but the problem has gotten worse. There's a book on psychosocial disorders in young people. There's a child psychiatrist and a criminologist that both said there has been a steady rise in youth crime following the 2nd World War averaging a fivefold increase from 1950 to 1990. They weren't just talking about the U.S though. They were talking about developed countries including the U.S.

There was also a psychiatrist that said there are two distinct types of teen criminals. She said that one very common type takes up petty crime in adolescence, based on peer pressure. The other is what I was talking about earlier. She said the other was more problematic, and they start showing signs of antisocial behavior in kindergarten. She said that these kids have biological predispositions to behavior problems. That was pretty much my point. I want to add something to what she was saying. I think this paired with an environment of bad parenting, poverty or abuse puts these kids at high risk of committing violent crimes and spending their lives in and out of the prison system. I don't think it's all genetics.

I also looked at more data from other material, and I found that in both boys and girls who went on to become criminals were likely to have shown some kind of early onset neurological impairment or difficult temperament early in life as young as age 3. The graph that I was looking at also showed an increase.

So how am I wrong. I'm not saying you guys are wrong, because you've made some valid points, but I'm not wrong on the whole issue either.

I think its a bit of both. We now have names for behaviors, which leads some parents to make an excuse for "normally bad" behavior. You also have the proliferation of prescription drugs and a lot of doctors who are willing to write those prescriptions. A lot of times simple parenting and child development classes would do both the child and the parent some good.

Re: Medicaid and checks. I do this every day. Many parents are quick to get their kids labeled ADD, ADHD, Autistic, or *insert issue here* to get a Social Security Disability Income check. Thetaprincess, is that what you are talking about? Medicaid doesn't write checks to recpients if they can avoid it at all. If a person receives SSDI, which is currently $637 per month, that person can also receive Medicaid. I've seen children with very minor developmental issues whose parents go through hoops to get that check, and they don't need it, finanacially and vice versa. (Kid born at 27 weeks, blind, no swallow reflex, needs help breathing and has a DNR on her medical reports--do not resuscitate--and mom thinks she's completely normal)

hijack:

my personal case study/history published as memoirs with commentary/introductions by a docotor would make a lot of people a lot of money

/hijack

Definitely the parents! Very few parents want to discipline their children these days. They would rather medicate or allow someone else to deal with the problem (I cannot STAND the parents who are in denial). We need more accountability for the parents and the children.

I am sick and tired of children getting in trouble and their first reaction is, "My Mother/Father is not going to do anything!" There are a lot of people who do not believe in spanking or whatever, but when I was growing up 20+ years ago, I knew the consequences for my actions...getting my a** beat. No questions asked.

My thing is I am reading several psychology books--not textbooks--but folks personal perspectives and they asked how does smacking a child around teach him or her anything about better behavior?

And the trainers do not do it with the animals they train... Hence their minds are not much more than a human 4-6 year old--therefore, if we can do it for Shamu then how come we cannot do it for humans? At least this is the current thought for disciplining children in the books I am reading.

I think corporal punishment should be in place for kids. I do not think it should borderline abuse, be it physical or verbal. However, that the child will know when behavior is appropriate and when it is not. When it is acceptable and when it is not.

Also, the animal trainers also ignore a baby's cries when everything has been done, such as feeding, burping, changing diapers (if a primate) and bedding. Babies do need coddling for appropriate neural connections to form. Most people barely give them that, so the connections fail to form. However, animals and humans are strikingly different--animals are always in survival mode; whereas humans are thought to use higher ordered intellect to outsmart their would-be predators. :confused: We are not always taking flight or fighting--yet...

Its not about the neighborhood...even schools in the "good" areas weren't perfect. You'll always have rotten apples in the bunch.

I know. I was only kidding with you.:)

What I bolded is SO true.

I think normal behavior problems require praising for good behavior and punishing for bad behavior. I think for problem kids the strategy is slightly different. I think sometimes punishment can be ineffective. As children are punished (the ealier the better) they improve overall and begin to know how far to go. The problem kids would probably only improve slightly if at all. This is when I think it's time for the meds to be prescribed, or otheriwse we're looking at another highschool or college shooting spree.

So I was reading over Why you crying? by George Lopez again, so I thought i'd put the excerpt up that I was talking about earlier.

Kids these days talk back, man they talk BACK. I never talked back. You see Anglo kids in the store. "No, I wont."
"Now you listen to me, Dakota. I'm the parent here. You will. Believe me. Do you want a gold star when you get home, Dakota? Because you're going--you won't get The Lion King on DVD. You're not. Do you want a consequence?"

I love going to the stores and seeing parents actually get down on one knee. "Can you understand me, Tyler? This behavior is inappropriate. Well I need to aoplogize to you because I was using my outdoor voice inside."

My grandmother was old-school. She would pick me up. "Vamanos, cabron, we're going. Mira, como no, que no. Vamos. Mira, you don't want to go. Bullshit, you're going. Mira well, you know what, wait in the f--- car. Wait in the car. Wait in the car! Why you crying? Why you crying? Well, roll down the window so you can breathe."


The part I bolded is the way I feel many of these parents act towards their kids.

A lot of parents are trying too hard to be friends with their kids or go out of their way to not have their kids be afraid of them.

WTF is that?

Well, now the cops will come if you hit your kid.

Some parents definitely still hit their kids. I don't know how much good it does, though, to threaten your kid with a heavy metal picture frame to the head in the middle of a Target :(

It seems like around here the parents are in two camps - they are either yelling and hitting their kids like crazy, or they're just letting their kids run wild. There has to be some middle ground there.

I remember parents could slap their kids in public and get away with it. If they tried that now, some moron would report it and the cops would show and try to take the kids from the parent(s).

I think "Time Out" works. It worked for me when I was a kid, and I turned out great.

That pretty much sums it up.

One of these days I'm just going to snap and scream even louder than one of these kids who's pitching a fit because he can't have a toy or something, just to see what happens. "I can scream louder and longer than you, and I can probably sing Journey's greatest hits while I'm doing it. So give it up."

Time out works for some kids. My child gets spanked, sparingly. Taking things away from her is more effective for HER. If I have other kids, it may not be as effective for them as it was for her.

Cops can't take my child for DISCIPLINE. ABUSE, yes.

33girl, bwhahahahahaha at the last sentence.

That's true. I know my mom would shoot me that, "Don't make me give you a spanking when we get home look," and that would normally straighten me out. If all else failed, she would turn into an a** sniper and find some covert way to get in one good lick when we least expected it and no one was looking!

It seems like children are no longer afraid of their parents anymore. My brother and I hated to see our parents upset with us. I guess a lot of it was psychological because we never wanted to feel like we disappointed them.

I wanted to quote this because it's so true. I see that in the school where I teach...daily. I also see too many parents wanting to be "friends" with their kids...and these are parents of all races, not just whites. Part of me wants to say, "Your kid has enough friends, be a parent!"

I too was more afraid of disappointing my parents than anything else...so when I'm angry with my students, I tell them that I am disappointed. It works better than yelling anyhow. :)