identical twins, different universities, overlapping recruitments...
 

jab your eyes, hit your head, stab yourself with a sharp instrument... or just totally ignore this thread...

is there any interest in "our" thread...
identical twins, we were separated for the first time in our lives, we went to different universities and the style of our individual recruitments varied but our recruitment schedules overlapped slightly... which created a great deal of drama as pref and bid day came for one of us before the other finished recruitment...

is there any interest in yet another "retro" recruitment thread?

and, again, for those members of gc that are thoroughly sick of "retro recruitment threads"... jab your eyes, hit your head, stab yourself with a sharp instrument... or just totally ignore this thread...

cheers!

Yes, of course!

identical twins
 

This sounds like it will be a very good story. :)

Please! Pretty please! :)

I want to hear it! I too am ignoring the friendly posters who hate these, love being told I am crying out for attention!

Now this should be a good one...we get twice the bang for our "buck"

Were any of the same chapters at your schools?

Wasn't there more here last night?

i was thinking the same thing hc. maybe she wanted to edit it a bit more?

i want in!

the first predicate...
 

first, twins.

i really do not wish to get into all of the psychological dynamics and all of the studies regarding identical twins. however, to understand this recruitment you have to understand that even though my sister and i look exactly alike (honestly, we are really identical... people still cannot tell us apart!) however, while we look exactly alike... we are separate, distinct individuals and we are unique people with our own separate, distinct and different personalities. i will be the first to admit that our basic personalities are very similar... yet very different. it is just an odd dynamic that people who are not twins really do not fully understand. yet there is this synergy that cannot be explained... we are and will always be connected, it is just part of being identical twins that loved each other. add to that we were the only children my parents had... so we had no siblings to interact with, it was always just the two of us. we had our own world... and to an extent... still do to this day. it is just something that cannot be fully explained. it is exasperating... and yet it is wonderful.

there are things about being a twin that i will never fully understand... nor will anyone. because of the personality differences... we were different. some of those differences can manifest themselves in subtle ways... whereas others are very overt. our high school was very, very social... excellence and perfection was expected of all of us. my sister and i were the classic "over-achievers." we were cheerleaders in high school (large school, but a highly select small cheer squad... very competitive!) for some reason i was the twin that was the one who was always the attendant to the queen... and our senior year was the all school/homecoming queen... but, thankfully, my sister was the senior attendant. and yes... we actually switched off and no one ever knew it... typical thing most twins have to try... and do. i never really understood why one of us was considered differently than the other... and that is something that still causes problems. it did not bother me... but it bothered my sister terribly. as this thread develops... it will definitely come into play. here we look exactly alike... but one is the all school queen and the other is not. i also say this to let you know that we had the perfect credentials to successfully compete in highly competitive recruitment.

secondly, our mother. i daily thank the lord that our mother did not know "patsy ramsey!!!" (sorry to my panhellenic alpha xi sisters) our mother had been homecoming queen in high school and in college. she was also "miss state" where we grew up and was a finalist in the miss america pagent, first runner-up. she is definitely a force to be dealt with. she is a beautiful, classy and driven woman. highly social and highly skilled at being social. she was from a very prominent family. our family backgound is an important factor to remember with our recruitment thread, it will most definitely come into play in this recruitment saga. i honestly do not remember not being in dance, cheer, modeling or etiquite lessons. we were raised to be her perfect twin daughters... her pride and joy. yes, we were dressed alike for many years... which drove us crazy. thankfully... we were not subjected to the "beauty pagent" ordeal. even though our mother was "miss state" and a finalist at miss america... that would never have been "socially appropriate to her and her friends... far too "plebian." that was our mother... we love her dearly... but we also understand her. she was and is a different generation. although she worked all of the time... she did not work "outside the home"... even though she has a law degree (she had to do something with all of that miss america scholarship money!) she never practiced law a single day... that would not have been proper in her highly social world. our father, also an attorney, was more of the balance in our family and attempted to keep her somewhat in check... if that could be possible. he was definitely one of a kind... an extremely handsome, elegant, classy gentleman. he was absolutely wonderful.

so... we were groomed from infancy to succeed at any and everything we ever did... to be elegant and and yet "refined." we were indoctrinated from birth about the "right sororities," junior league, proper social skills, the proper country club and what social obligations were necessary and demanded and expected of us. there is much more to our mother and how she affected our recruitment.

and the final step in the foundation... for the time being. why on earth we would go to separate, different universities... separating us for the first time in our lives? because of how things happened in high school... my parents very carefully determined that my sister should go to a smaller, exclusive private university where my mother had gone. my parents felt as though she needed a chance to "shine" on her own and not be part of a "matched set"... it was time that we would each become our own person. they knew i would succeed wherever i went, whereas my sister was a bit more insecure. so it was determined that she would stay close to home and go to the expensive school... while i went to the favored comprehensive state university.. together with many of my friends. to complicate matters even more, if they were not already complicated already... there are some apsects that i will discuss as this story unfolds. there were several of the same sorority chapters at my sister's university... that were also at my university, something that caused a great deal of "drama" becausing of the different timing of our recruitments. my university... though not strictly southern... definitely is and continues to be a very, very competitive greek system. huge mansions... and huge chapters that ruled the school.

we both had excelled in cheerleading. we are both very petite and very blonde... but at our mother's insistence we had to be proper young ladies at all times. that is really hard when one is out in front of everyone doing front lay-overs and back hand-springs... and dancing. our mother had to do something with all of her energy and her education... there are only so many years of active service in junior league... and she tended to limit how much she did as an alumna of her sorority. remember that because it is one of the "twists" that makes this entire recruitment saga more comlicated. we both were recruited by our respective universities and both received full scholarships for cheerleading. so... not only did we cheer in high school... we both cheered at our respective universities.

sorry to have belabored so many facts that are not part of recruitment... but most certainly played a very critical role in our respective recruitments. i am no where close to revealing everything that effected both of our respective recruitments. however, i felt a basic foundation was necessary in order to understand the dynamics of what we were under when we went through recruitment.

and finally... i felt it necessary to give a bit of a background. everything sounds logical and orderly... however, as we all know... reality seemingly never follows what you think it will do and should do... our recruitments most certainly did not...

that is one of the most important factors to remember in our respective stories. more later...

cheers!

Uh, Patsy Ramsey was NOT an AGD. She was a member of Alpha Xi Delta.

i am very sorry OTW
 

i am very sorry OTW... but i know that i have read somewhere that patsy ramsey was an agd... i presume that it was not a "reputable tabloid." i do apologize... and i apologize to my alpha xi panhellenic sisters.

my sister and i are just grateful, extremely grateful... that our mother did not try to emulate her! people were always trying to get our mother to have us enter pagents. however, with twins... your own children who look exactly alike... would have to be competing against each other. talk about the problems that would present... ugh! it does get old at times being a "matched set." i can only see that as excerbating the "twin dynamic" and raising it to ever newer heights.

cheers!

You beat me to it, I didn't post because I wasn't positive if she was an AXiD or not. However I know that we have never had a chapter at WVU, and that would automatically rule us out regardless of any affiliation Patsy Ramsey has. Even wikipedia has AXiD listed.

More please!

Hijack: Patsy Ramsey was an Alpha Xi Delta. Remember, the media is the one that has painted her in the "crazy pagent mother light". There are plenty of other crazy pagent mothers who span all glos and non-greeks as well. But also remember that the woman lost her child and died last year from cancer.

Ok, done with the hijack...now get on with the story!

sorority chapters at our respective schools
 

when our mother attended the same univeristy that my sister was going to attend... it was primarily a "commuter school." they had a visionary president about thrity years ago who completely changed that school and turned it into a very classy and exclusive private university. it was terribly expensive and much smaller than the large state university i was to attend. her school also had a large number of out of state students.

since we have skiied forever... i am going to name the chapters at our respective universities after some of our favorite ski resorts. those who ski will definitely catch the differences in the ski resorts... and the names are specifically chosen for that reason... albeit not "panhellenically correct!"

the six sororities at my sister's school were:
ASPEN
DEER VALLEY
KEYSTONE
SANTE FE
SUN VALLEY, and
RED RIVER

my sister knew several members of ASPEN, DEER VALLEY and KEYSTONE. like me, she had to start cheer practice during the summer session and begin learninig all of the cheers, movements and the dynamics of the style of cheerleading at her university. most of the cheerleaders were in fraternities and sororities, so in addition to her friends who were in those three sororites... she met several other members during the summer. she had a great summer and the squad at her university did not do as many complicated routines as the squad at my university did (ie: she was not going to be thrown into the air twenty feet... praying to be caught!!!)

the eleven sororities at my university were:
VAIL
DEER VALLEY
ASPEN
KEYSTONE
SANTE FE
PARK CITY
LAKE LOUISE
RED RIVER
TELLURIDE
BRECKENRIDGE, and
TAOS

i knew many members of several chapters at the school where i would attend from high school and other area high schools. i had close friends in VAIL, DEER VALLEY, ASPEN, KEYSTONE and SANTE FE. we had both been to several parties and events our senior year in high school... therefore i was quite familiar with the campus and many of the sororities. further, just as with my sister... cheer started in earnest during summer school. we were enrolled and worked and trained really hard during the summer session and beyond. being one of only two freshman cheerleaders... i had a great deal of work learning the rountines, the cheers... and then i had to learn to trust, really trust... while i was being thrown like a "rag doll" into the air about twenty feet by very muscular guys... whom i continuously prayed would catch me, catch me... we always had a spotter... but it is still terrifying when you first start with that much intensity. most of the cheerleaders were in fraternities and sororities, so i got to know several members from a few different chapters. it was a long, hard summer comprised of long hard days physically pushing ourselves beyond our limits.

we both worked so hard that summer... we were very grateful that our mother had already begun working on our respective recruitments when we were infants. she had managed to secure several wonderful and highly connected recommendations to the "acceptable sororities" in her opinion. we could not have possibly been fully ready for recruitment had it not been for her organization and her drive (compulsion!) of course... it was "rush" to her... and we would "pledge"... so we had several terms that we had to delete from our individual vocabularies. we did have a week to finish our wardrobes. luckily... since we were attending different schools... we could choose several dresses that were similar and not look like "twin pnms" who had not ever separated themselves. the thought of going through recruitment at the same school dressed exactly alike... totally haunted both of us... for obvious reasons.

and... if i lose this post another time... i am going to quit and just tell you what happened! ugh! ugh!

cheers!

patsy ramsey...
 

i truly meant no disrespect for patsy ramsey. i cannot imagine a more horrible scenario to have happened to anyone. she just "personifies" the pagent mothers... which was the point i was trying to make. some people love pagents... to each their own. our own mother pushed both of us and demanded so much of us. she had certain standards and we had no choice but to meet them as well as her social agenda.

patsy ramsey was vilified, tried and convicted in the public press. one has to remember this was a lady who lost her beautiful little daughter in a horrible death and never escaped being the "subject" of that death. i truly felt sorry for her... what a horrid ordeal... and then to die of cancer at such a young age. i truly feel she is someone alpha xi can be proud that wore their beautiful quill.

these "retro" threads always seem to "derail" themselves into some totally different subject... i suppose that child beauty pagents and patsy ramsey will be the focus of our recruitments.

again, the comment was meant with no disrespect.

cheers!

I can't wait for the next post...
 

If you posted all of it at once, I wouldn't be disappointed. Please don't stop writing.

Oh the old compulsive mother, you really don't understand that they're just trying to help you until you're looking at everything from a different perspective. I'm sure having a twin sister subconsciously doubled all the pressure you felt! Please write more soon!

I love this thread! There were two sets of identical twins in my pledge class as well as a set (who, incidentally, dressed alike...I know...kinda weird!) in the senior pledge class that year. One set in my group were high school cheerleaders who had won the National Championships for High School Cheerleading and been UCA cheerleaders. I hadn't thought of all of them in years!

Keep posting! I love this story!

seemingly, our recruitments were among the longest and most drawn out...
 

with only six sororities... one would have thought that sydney's recruitment would have been shorter. no. they had their "pnm orientation" on a wednesday and then recruitment began on thursday. their bid day was on tuesday. so, sydney... and our !!mother!! would know what house she joined on tuesday. our schedules were strikenly similar.... except mine did not begin until the saturday after she started on wednesday. bid day for me was not until the following saturday... almost 5 full days after sydney would hopefully receive her bid. talk about the pressure on me! there is a reason i say that...

sydney loved her "pnm oreintation"... the sororites planned it and their rho chis really gave them a wonderful prelude to the week that followed. thursday and friday they all went to all six houses. saturday was four party day... and then they had sunday off, which to me is cruel! monday was prefs and then bid day on tuesday.

mine started with a "pnm orientation" and what seemingly felt like an endless series of "lectures" on the saturday... the rho chis each telling what not to do... over and over and over. i thought about sydney and knew that she was at four party day. we did not officially start recruitment until monday... all eleven houses in one day. then the same thing again on tuesday. they felt it better that we see all of the houses twice before the cuts began. all i remember was that it was horribly hot, it was august and we had a very "dressy" recruitment... so it was full make-up, hair done, hose and heels for what seemed to be forever for two days. by the end of tuesday evening i though i had died and would have gladly let the "guys" (cheerleaders) throw me in the air at least thirty feet... than to ever have to do that again! wednesday the cuts began as we had eight party day, thursday was four party day, friday were prefs and bid day was finally on saturday. that still has to be the longest week of my life!

i realized... that due to the nature of our mother and the fact that sydney would be fully finished by wednesday... that they would all come down to my recruitment at some point. were it left to our mother... they would have all been there on wednesday. i knew that when they all showed up... sydney would be there and that would totally confuse everyone who did not know us... and i most definitely did not want to dress alike... so we had to coordinate outfits to make sure when she did arrive we did not ruin my recruitment. suddenly... out of the blue... there would be two of me running around... and totally offending people because when everyone would see sydney at my university they would think it was me... and she had no clue who any of them were. i realized the potential for total disaster that held. i begged all of them not to come... please. our mother would not hear of it, period.

instead of waiting until later in this story i will let you know another of the unique twists in our recruitments. when i said all... i really meant to emphasize that... all. we come from a long line of greeks on both sides of our family... luckily my father's family was not as intense as our mother's. even though our mother and our grandmother had thoroughly "schooled us" on what to expect and what was expected of us... i really do not think that i fully understood what they were talking about until eight party day... sydney found out on four party day and when we spoke she tried to give me a dose of reality. no. for one of the few times in our lives i really did not believe her. no...

cheers!

awk...awk...more more more!

This is like waiting for Book 7 of Harry Potter!

i almost forgot...
 

i am sorry... i almost forgot my worst nightmare. what if sydney showed up wearing her new letters... right in the middle of my recruitment?!? oh my...

and... everyone who knew us would know which sorority that she had already joined... which would mean that the sororities would know which one she chose. oh no...

the possibilities just got worse the more i thought about it. how on earth would i ever explain that? i was suddenly in a panic... i had never even thought about that. what if they all showed up wearing their badges for pref or something like that?!? oh no...

cheers!

LOL - that was the first thing I thought, when I read that your sister's R would be completed before yours and would probably come to visit!

Keep it up - there are a LOT of twins in my family, but none of them went Greek (to my knowledge).

i can't wait to hear what your sis discovered on 4 party day and you on 8 party day.

I'm an identical twin and I don't think I could have said it better myself. I always hate when people ask me what it's like to be a twin because I don't know any different.

And, like you all, it was just me and my sister. I always had an instant best friend no matter where I was.

a few more details... 'legally blond' meets the south?
 

lol... hijack! my favorite resorts are aspen and deer valley, i love both of them... they are both so elegant. i am glad you choose those for sydney... but i am not giving anything away yet. i also like the glitz, glam and "new money" of vail... i really love skiing the canadian rockies and skiing that area, especially lake louise... looking down at that azure blue glacier lake and then the chateaux with the ice castles on the glacier lake... dreams are made of visions like that!

a few more details...
we both had a bit of a hard time finding just "the right clothes"... as i have previously mentioned... we are both very petite. we both tan well and have really long blond hair. our eyes are blue but colored contacts really can make them vibrant violet, green or really blue. so, in addition to coordinating every detail of the clothes that we wore... we also attempted to match out eye colors... i know, very vain... but in a competitive recruitment one has to do something to set themselves apart. we had always drawn attention being identical twins... that was not going to be a distinquishing factor since we went to different universities. luckily our mother has impeccible taste and thought she knew our sizes and but did know our individual taste... so while we were working hard all summer preparing for cheerleading at a division one university... she was buying lots of wonderful things. she even had a friend get her into market in both dallas and atlanta... and she purchased some really wonderful clothes... tre chic!

it seems when one is really petite... the clothes in the petite or junior section of even really great stores... are just not a glamourous and a bit too "cutsey" for our tastes. we both knew this was going to be hard. and... i had worked so hard in cheer, lifting weights... my body was changing and getting more muscular and i was now down to a size zero, that makes it really hard to find something elegant that does not drag the ground. when sydney saw how much i was changing physically... she immediately started weights... and really toned up as well. our mother about had a fit... lol... as almost everything she purchased would need to be altered... even more.

our mother was wonderful with "loaning" us distinct pieces of "family" jewlery... the "real stuff"... it tended to make me really nervous... what if i lost something? i certainly did not need any more stress. but both of us had some killer pieces of heirloom jewelry and that set us apart... very distinctive... i have really grown to love it. diamonds are a girls best friend!

also... i have determined in my professional life that height for a woman is very much of a plus. when you are petite... people, especially professional men... seemingly tend to treat a petite woman like they are a child... and do not take you seriously. we weren't that easily dismissed... we were co-valedictorians, so grades were not an issue for us in recruitment. so... even though we were these tiny cheerleaders... we were also "smart girls"... a definite plus.

somewhat like elle woods in 'legally blond'... i wanted everything to perfectly coordinate... but in a demure and elegant fashion. sydney is a bit more "flashy"... lol... so her style tends to really stand out... she mixes colors i would not do and pulls it off extremely well. i prefer a classic, timeless look... but felt as though i needed some of sydney's fashion flair for the first few days... to really stand out. i knew i could pull off prefs... and sydney would want to follow what i chose. i loved the houses where we were lined up alphabetically... not by size, i absolutely hated being the first one in line... and the first one in the house. and... that anticipation factor... were they going to be a "quiet, elegant house"... or just as you enter scare you to death with their "enthusiasm and contagious spirit"... somewhat like we tried to do cheering! different styles... and seemingly there was no pattern to how each individual sorority did their initial greeting... but i presume that is supposed to be part of the fun. for me.. being first just made it worse... i never knew what to expect and how to react... more stressssssss!

to all of those i have now bored to death... there is only one more background scenario that i will have to discuss... a bit later. that particular point turns out to be the most dispositive element in both of our recruitments... i have alluded to it, but more later... as it is now time for sydney's recruitment to start...

cheers!

At the end of every post. I LOVE IT!

sydney's recuitment begins...
 

i truly wish i could get sydney to actively participate in this thread. she is incredibly busy with a very complex matter at work and does not want to be bothered... not that it stops me. we work for the same firm (i know!)... so i keep pestering her for details... give me details... i call, text her... and then just go into her office until she tells me some of the details. i can tell i am starting to get on her nerves... as she is very nervous about this matter at work... more about that later.

sydney's recruitment begins!
she loved her orientation and was really excited and enthusiastic about the start of recruitment. i also think she was was very, very thankful i was not going to school there... although she would never admit that. our mother had instilled in her the drive to succeed at recruitment and that this was her time to "shine" and "shine" she did. i was still in town as my recruitment did not start for several more days so i got to help syd with her make-up and her hair (heaven forbid our mother was trying to do it all, so i knew i had to intervene... lol... she is wonderful!) she was absolutely gorgeous and was actually glowing and was so excited... and as she left to see all six sororities at her university... i was so proud and so was our mother! i was so nervous... nervous for syd and nervous for me. she looked wonderful and i prayed she had the most wonderful day she had ever had. i have to admit i thought how it would be for me... my university was much larger, there would be so many people from all over that i did not know... and also so many more sororoities.

as life has twists and turns... her first house to visit was red river. i am afraid that i had totally influenced syd about red river. at my university red river seemingly had a giant magnet that attracted all of the "mean girls" from all over our state and entire region. that was one of the things that i totally dreaded about my upcoming recruitment... having to go to red river. i had dismissed the "mean girls" in high school, so they dismissed me. that was the house that i positively knew i would cut immediately... and i already they would cut me even faster. i always hated skiing at red river! i know that is not polite and is inappropriate... but at a large university with several sororities... i think there is always one chapter that a pnm just does not care for... and my mind was already made up. period. syd had an open mind... or at least tried to have an open mind and was somewhat relieved that red river was the first house she would have to visit. red river was the smallest chapter at syd's university and she could easily tell it was really struggling. sydney felt sorry for them... but she liked them and thought they were very sweet... but they were not her. they tried really hard... but nothing seemed to go together for them. bad, really bad... everything had to go together for sydney, she was and is an absolute perfectionist. she left very disappointed and relieved that they were not the "mean girls" i had led her to believe.

next for sydney was the polar opposite... the positively wonderful and highly rated deer valley. syd knew about half of this chapter. this particular sorority is very popular with all pnms and is a huge "powerhouse" nationally and especially in this entire region... all of their chapters are top rate, just an excellent, excellent sorority. most of the other cheerleaders were members of deer valley. she loved it and had a wonderful time. they were the homecoming queens and the class officers and favorites, just a truly top rate and wonderful house. deer valley had an elegant, but fun first party and syd visited with more members than she could remember. syd had a wonderful experience and they were so excited to see her. however, there was that other thing... there will definitely be more about that later. but syd definitely left a part of her heart at the truly wonderful deer valley...

then to the huge and mighty keystone. they have chapters everywhere and at about every school, large and small, in our state and region... and are a wonderful sorority. just like the resort... you can ski from daybreak until midnight... they are everywhere and they are good. keystone was pleased to see her... but not as welcoming as she thought they would be. sydney definitely wanted to go back... but she already knew that keystone would not be her home. it was pleasant, their theme was cute and she enjoyed herself, but she was somewhat ignored... which concerned her greatly. we love skiing at keystone... but she had this feeling that keystone did not love her. and there still was this thing...

from there syd went to sante fe. this is a real powerhouse sorority all over... except in our state and this region. they were definitely a smaller house and had lots of "smart girls"... and even though syd is really smart, this was not the place for her... she decided she would cut sante fe before red river. she felt ignored and dismissed because she was a cheerleader... she was highly disappointed in sante fe and her reception and treatment. she said that was the longest party of her life... and she felt that sante fe had already dismissed her before she even got there and they had met her... and syd definitely did not want to go back. period.

next she went to sun valley. they did not have a chapter of sun valley at the university i was soon to attend... but there was one at the other major comprehensive state university. we both knew several members at that chapter, it seemed to be an excellent chapter. sun valley was the house that all of the prominent legacies to the top chapters who were cut joined sun valley. sun valley always took in several truly great young ladies who had their hearts broken... but they all quickly loved sun valley. she did not know a single member of this house at her university... so she was a bit apprehensive. she thought they had the cutest theme party of the day and syd had a wonderful time and she loved them... much to her surprise. this house was her surprise house of the day. she definitely knew she wanted to go back to sante fe on "four party day."

finally sydney, tired from five houses... went the final house of the day. the classy, elegant and "old money" aspen. this was the single most elegant house at her university and the most beautiful, classy, refined and wealthy young ladies. aspen is a truly wonderful sorority with a great reputation and wonderful chapters. aspen was the house that most everyone, including sydney, had dreamed about. of course, everything they did was fully catered and as elegant as any pref. however, syd was first in line at aspen and as she entered... she paused for a moment... as she looked she saw an entire room full of tall, very tall... very elegant blonds... she immediately felt very small, very... very small. she said she came to most of their waists (i really cannot say what she really said, it is totally true... but totally politically incorrect... lol... we still laugh about it to this day!) syd said that she had to constantly look up when having any conversation. luckily several wonderful members of aspen graciously greeted syd, made her feel immediately at home... and had syd sit in the chair while three of them sat on the floor (so they were at eye level... lol!) and they had a fabulous visist. she was truly given the "royal treatment" and she loved... absolutely loved aspen. aspen was everything she had ever imagined and more... syd definitely loved aspen. but, again, there was this thing... definitely, most definitely more about that later...

she was tired... while we could have talked for hours... syd wanted to visit with her new friends and all of the other girls in recruitment who were on her floor of the dorm they stayed in, so i respected that. i so wanted to go over to that dorm... but this was syd's recruitment... not mine. of course... our mother tried to interrogate syd about every single detail... especially one particular house. syd had a wonderful day and was so excited about going back to most of the houses the next day. she would have gladly skipped going back to sante fe if there was any possible way other than a serious injury... as like mine, it was mandatory that all pmns attend every house on all house day... both days.

cheers!

someone who really understands!
 

hijack! jocelyn... i have to admit that i about died when i saw your post... lol. jeans are the absolute worst. you can just about forget it and count on trying to find a specialty store or ordering them... but do ordered jeans always fit? certainly not in my experience and syd's.

honestly... our best store had some cute jeans in the junior department recently... at least i thought they were... i was so excited, at long last... pulled them out... and they were "bratz" for a little girl, albeit a big little girl... "bratz" in the junior department... what grown woman is going to wear jeans like that? and getting "tight fittin' jeans"... to discretely show off ones assets... well, just forget it! i did not know you were that petite as well, i have loved your posts for years and how truly sincere and compassionate you are... now we share something that you just have to be that size to really understand. i know where you can get some really cute "bratz" jeans!!! lol!

cheers!

I can't take it anymore. Please post more Tell us what the "other thing" is :-)

I third the motion. Update please! Especially with what "the other thing" is.