UCF Sig Ep suspended
 

Were the guys not doing these kinds of things when I was a student there, or has it just gotten worse?

http://www.local6.com/news/10724862/detail.html

I think it's probably getting worse. It's also funny how most of the fraternities are getting in trouble.

They were doing those things but they weren't stupid about it so they didn't get caught. By the time my senior year rolled around, the guys weren't afraid of publicly hazing their pledges.

At this rate, Greek Row will become Sorority Row by 2010.

It is not fun for the sororities when this happens on campuses (many fraternities getting disciplined). Two of the six fraternities that opened on my campus 10 years ago are no longer there...they were kicked off for hazing and other serious matters. And at least one other fraternity has a history of being placed on probation by the school. One new fraternity has been brought in to replace one of the two that closed, but the greek system still feels very lopsided. The sororities are so well put-together, and the fraternities are chaotic.

What a shame, there seems to be a history at the school!

When was Pi Kapp suspended???

(Add to kicked off campus: Pi Kappa Alpha)

Still plenty of fraternities, but aside from LXA, Sigma Chi, Kappa Sig, ATO and possibly DU, the rest have very small numbers. Acacia closed a few years ago; down to one member.

That's really unfortunate. It also may be part of the reason Florida recently enacted its tougher anti-hazing law.

What happened to Delta Gamma? I know they did not participate in Formal Recruitment this year, but are they totally off campus? I thought they were still around trying to re-organize their current chapter and be able to recruit this semester or something like that. I hope they do not completely go off campus since they have been there for so long.

According to this, the DG chapter at UCF closed on December 10, 2006.

The DG chapter members themselves made the decision to close. The good news is that since they were not closed by their nationals, there would be a more immediate opportunity for recolonization when UCF conducts future sorority expansion. DG is a great sorority, and I'm sure I speak for many UCF alumni and students when I say that I look forward to their return.

Bummer about Pi Kapp. I was a student when they colonized. They were really good guys back then. Hope they come to their senses and can come back.

What is the difference between "Suspended" and "Kicked off"?

According to a press release posted on Sigma Alpha Epsilon's IHQ web site:

"The chapter’s charter will remain suspended, not revoked, for an indefinite period of time. Depending on what university officials decide, Sigma Alpha Epsilon may choose to return with a new group of students in several years."

Perhaps it is the indefinate time period vs a specific one (such as four years or so?)

Why does it make a difference whether the chapter decided to close or national made the decision? I'm guessing it closed because of numbers?

Perhaps.

Frankly, "suspended" and "kicked off" are the same thing. As such, why is it necessary to make a distinction in the list above (i.e. two chapters were "suspended", one "kicked off" and add this chapter to "kicked off") if both end results are similar?

I have to disagree.

When I hear "suspended" I think of "they're gone but they're allowed to come back later".

When I hear "kicked off" I think "they're gone and most likely won't come back".

OTW;
I would agree with you.
My POV is Suspended is being on hold or pending while kicked off is just that.
As the story itself says:"The Sigma Phi Epsilon fraternity, which is different than the Sigma Alpha Epsilon fraternity that was disbanded in November, is under summary suspension at UCF while allegations of hazing pledges are investigated, Local 6 News reported."

and from the outside, Sig Ep one of the nicest looking houses I have ever seen. Its sad that all those guys have to move out (I'm assuming) when school just started.

FWIW, chapters can be suspended by acclimation of their own alumni. It happened w/Lambda Chi @ Northwestern.

Back in 1996, they were down to 12 men & had a number of boarders (some of the football players lived there @ the time). Since the University owns the houses, the alumni board wasn't getting enough rent $$$ to pay the bills.

The alums made a decision to suspend operations and came back to campus in 1998. During the downtime, the chapter house was converted into a women's dorm.

When they returned, LCA's expansion team helped them to recruit candidates. The "Founding Fathers-Part II" did a great job of rushing on their own after that--they got to 40 members & surpassed all-men's GPA in just 18 months.

Just last summer, they won LCA's highest chapter honor: the Grand High Alpha award. Quite a far cry from the dark days of 12 guys & the Wildcat offensive line living @ the house.

If the DG alumnae & UCF's Greek Affairs office felt it was in their best interest to go dark, they may have had a good reason...

Interfraternally,
BF

I completely disagree with you. What is "sad" is what they did. What is "sad" how they are feeding the negative greek stereotype. Forget their house and what it looked like and how they have to move out, they broke the rules and hazed. They will be lucky if moving out is the worst that will happen to them.

Agree.

I'm going to add one more big ME TOO to that

That's a good question.

Then again...from reading that article one MIGHT get the impression that that is a kid who got kicked out during pledging and is upset over it and is now trying to paint the fraternity in a negative light. Not saying that's the case, just that that is how it could be interpreted.

Regardless, this hazing BS needs to stop at UCF (and everywhere for that matter)

Yeah, forget pledging.....lets just initiate everyone that walks through the door.

Well obviously, making sure that all of the potential members would jump into a garbage can full of crisco, cottage cheese, syrup and sardines is a fine way to make sure that organizations initiate only the finest!

Well, I know that our Sigma Chi chapter voted to close (they had $$$ issues) because apparently, they can come back sooner than if the national council would have voted to close it. This I guess is the same sort of thing.

Although, I would like to see if this is really true in practice or if it's just something the HQ tells them to get the matter over and done with. Sorry to sound like a bitch, but like I said, when I see this actually happening I'll believe it.

I think it has always gone on, but now the school has every greek orginization under a microscope, and are now looking for any little thing to get them in trouble

If the chapter is warned by either The School or Their National and do not follow the rules of both, whose fault is it?:rolleyes:

Hazing on Campuses
 

I think that it is completely sad that fraternities are getting kicked off campuses nation wide. In fact, I think it's pathetic. I realize that there are some things that go too far, but some things are just tradition. We just had a chapter get in trouble with their nationals for having their pledges go and retrieve composites from each fraternity. They were split into groups and this has been tradition for as far back as anyone can remember...things like this is just fun, tradition, and should be left alone by nationals and the media alike. I realize that getting your pledges unbelievably drunk is not the best idea, but sometimes (if no one is getting truely hurt), you've just got to leave well enough alone. Greeks are an exclusive part of universities for a reason.

Have you bothered to read some of the crap that has been going on? Organizations get kicked off for a reason. Hazing is illegal, and for good reason. The HQ of these organizations are finally coming to their senses and are trying to put a stop to it, not only to save face, but to potentially save the lives of the young men/women looking to join their organizations. I agree that some acts are harmless in nature, but who's to say that breaking into another organization's house to take composites won't lead into something more serious?

Just my opinion.

First of all, the pledges were committing theft and vandalism by taking the composites. That is a crime. If organizations are now beginning to recognize that is unacceptable for the supposed elite of the university to commit breaking and entering, then I applaud their efforts to control crime. Because even though it is a tradition, that doesn't make it right or acceptable. Genital mutilation of young women is a long-held tradition in some parts of Africa that is sanctioned by those parts of Africa and respected village elders; does this mean it is right? I realize that theft and mutilation are not the same, but you invoked the name of "tradition."

"If no one is truly getting hurt"-- people are actually getting hurt and we must draw the line somewhere. If Greeks truly embody the best of campus scholarship, leadership and potential, then we must begin to hold ourselves to a higher standard and conduct ourselves as role models, not anarchists who don't hold with the laws and policies of our governing organizations, universities and local/state/federal laws.

Hazing hurts. People get hurt. People die. People get scarred for life, emotionally, physically, even financially. Hazing effects the hazers, the hazed, and their familes. It may start off innocently, but things have a tendency to go wrong very quickly. Hazing interrupts lives, and can go on to have major effects-- do you want to be sued and have your future wages garnished because one of your new members tripped and crippled herself in your harmless blindfolding game and chose to retaliate? It happens and this is one way hazing can affect you, even if you were not directly involved. We may live in a PC, lawsuit happy society, but that can't really be changed. So rather complain about being PC, why not make the best of it and create new traditions that are legal, safe and satisfy everyone's needs?

Alcohol isn't the only killer-- a freshman fraternity pledge died from an overdose of WATER not too long ago. Yes, that's right. He died from water intoxication. I'm sure it sounded like a fun idea and safe to the brothers who thought of it. They're serving jail sentences now and the young man's family and friends will never be the same. There was serious talk of closing the school's Greek System. Not such a great idea after all. Think about that the next time you dress your pledges up in fairy wings, have them drink mystery concoctions, send them on "quests," or require anything of them that hasn't been approved in your new member education plans. You can still have fun, establish traditions and bonds and form memories, but there is a right and responsible way to do it. Act like adults and the community, media and your peers will treat you like adults, instead of coming in and closing you down because you decided to act like children... or worse yet, like common criminals.

Sorry you don't feel the same way. Your nationals has embraced this policy, but if you don't agree with your own sorority policies, you should really reconsider your oath and pledge to your organization.

Best post of the day.

The problem is also, not just Fraternitys, but also Sororitys and that is the problem.

It is a greek wide problem.:o

We as Greeks are our own worst enemies and wonder why!:rolleyes:

People and schools are getting tired of seeing this type of thing (hazing) in the media and wonder WHY!

There used to be no rules or regulations about hazing. But it seems to becomiong more pronounced and reported.

That is why Nationals, Schools. and the public are more concerned.

"Dad/Mom to Son/Daughter, I do not want you joining a group like these Greeks!" " You could die, you will not make your grades"!

considering that most of you took what i said COMPLETELY out of context...
 

Did you ever stop to think that the fraternities knew that the girls were going to come take their composites and that they pretty much just gave the girls a hard time and then handed them over? Or that these girls have the option to not do it? I'm not saying that fraternities or sororities should be allowed to shove anything down anyone's throat, but there is always the choice of the individual, and if these individuals can not find it in themselves to say no, then they are not greek material anyway. We need strong leaders, not followers, and not all tradition is bad. We've got schools like the one in Florida that have problems with it, but we've also got schools that don't. Should their traditions be sacraficed because of the mistake made by others? No. The problem we're having is that there is too much involvement by the media. Greek life is exclusive for a reason...and the problems we have should stay within the family. Too many chapters suffer because of the mistake of one, and that is completely unfair to everyone. I'm sure that every chapter has some tradition that could be considered hazing, that the chapter that has it, does not think about it as hazing. I'm all about NOT hazing our pledges, but when a scavenger hunt is considered hazing haven't we gone too far? What about the rituals? What if the new memebers have to dress up in certain "costumes" or wear masks or whatever, or the initiated members can't shower, or shave, or whatever for a certain ritual...is that too hazing, or is it just ritual? Pretty soon we're going to have nothing left to our chapters because someone, somewhere will consider it all hazing and we will be left with nothing but a name, some letters and memories. The point I'm trying to make, is that we need to really take a look at what we all stand for...we're a family, we're love, we're greek...these hazing incidents should NOT happen, but somewhere we've got to take care of our own. Why aren't we helping the chapters that are in trouble, giving them alternate ways to take care of their pledges, actually put people in there to HELP them instead of kicking them off campuses, and putting them on probation with no one to give them any resources? I just believe that we are going about this in all the wrong ways...i'm not saying ignore hazing, or that it's right, i'm saying that we need to fix it instead of just hacking every chapter we possibly can, because all we are doing that way is giving those who are against greeks, for whatever reason they hate us, some more bullets. What we need to do is have a facilitator come in, clean up the chapter, and see who is truly detrimental to that chapter on that campus. There has to be at least a few good apples in every bunch that truely want to be there, that didn't take part in all of this, and that have a true heart for the chapter they are in. Ridding the campus of every one of them takes away any opportunity they have to help themselves with a better name or a new reputation. If you are not willing to take a true look at what we could do to HELP instead of KILL a chapter, then I suggest that YOU take a look at what you pledged and your oath and consider why you exist in the greek community.

When I was a sophomore in HS, I took Intro to Word Processing in the Fall. In the Spring, I took Intro to Computers (PC Crap). That was over ten years ago.

Both semesters I learned that Enter/Return was your friend.

HOLY HELL MOSES TEN COMMANDMENTS!!!

You haven't been a member of your sorority long enough to observe this, but actually every one of the national organizations have ongoing meetings with individual chapters (IE: Traveling consultants, district workshops, advisers, etc.) to maintain good chapter health, and provide support to chapters (international directors, workshops, probationary terms to meet and paperwork to file) who have fallen off track in order to help lift them back up. Sometimes, despite everyone's best efforts, the chapter has been permanently derailed and cannot be helped. It is best for all those concerned, from the collegiate members of that chapter the parent organization and the university, for it to close. These ongoing touches also help ensure that members are safe, which means sometimes modifying traditions. A chapter is never arbitrarily closed. It is the result of when consistent activity and many, many opportunities and hands to help it back up have failed.

By all means, chapter business should remain chapter business. But one person's actions can and have brought down chapters before and will continue to do so. The consequences of your actions, good or bad, are felt by every member of your organization. This is the byproduct of becoming part of the organization and wearing the letters of which we are so very proud. One bad action can bring down everyone, which is why there are measures in place to protect these organizations from members who would otherwise seek to cling to "tradition." And as has been stated, if we are to survive as a Greek community we need to keep up with the times. Something that was tradition 10, 20 even 30 or as early as 5 years ago may now be an illegal act TODAY. And we must focus on today.

I know of no ritual which prevents members from keeping themselves clean... I wonder if perhaps you have been misled. The bottom line is that many of our organizations have existed for well over 100 years. We remain alive because we keep current with what is happening in the world. We are run by a dedicated and extensive team of alumni who in their real lives are working professionals and committed volunteers-- lawyers, doctors, teachers, accountants, consultants, you name it. They have seen the big picture and the big picture is that we will give the collegiate chapters the resources they need to succeed. But when the chapter continually snubs its nose at that help and acts like a spoiled child who disregards the rules, that chapter is a liability to the health of the rest of the chapters and it will not last very long. I am sure that if a chapter of your sorority on another campus acted in a manner that would threaten to close ALL chapters of your sorority, you would see it otherwise. This is a reality.

It isn't the media's fault that Greeks have a negative reputation. It is the insular ideas that an illegal act is just a harmless prank.

I encourage you to get involved with your sorority's leadership to see the big picture. Right now, you are looking through the perspective of a new member. There is a lot of good you can accomplish.

^ Word.

Your reply (adpiucf) I actually appreciate...I'm not a new member, I'm actually Ritual Chair and Song Leader of my chapter...we just don't have this stuff around here and what we do have isn't anything to ever be alarmed about. To all of you, it may seem like we're disregaurding nationals on our campus, but when when you are as small of a campus as we are we just don't have these problems in such a high amount, therefore it is extrememly difficult for me to see the benefit of destroying chapters. I know that you said that some of their nationals comes in and tries to help, but that rarely happens here. You either make it or you don't. There is a large difference in small universities and large ones...I've been to both, I've seen it. I think we have it better here. I just wish more people could appreciate instead of demeaning other chapters. It is not our job to bad mouth them all. It seems ridiculous that we would call ourselves greek...family...and do this to each other.

I think what you are taking offense to then, is our discussion of these events online? I can appreciate your concern. Take it with a grain of salt-- by discussing these events with other Greeks from all across North America, we can better alert one another to know what is happening with our fellow brothers and sisters. And we can take measures to not allow the same things to occur in our own communities, as can be the case when traditions outlive their usefulness and safety. We aren't exposing any chapter secrets or incidents that are not already a matter of public record.

I applaud your efforts to maintain discretion, and that is certainly something that you should do if there is a chapter incident. In this case, our discussion has come from public attention. It is a matter of public record if an organization has been suspended, and the circumstances surrounding it. All nationals receive national publications from their HQ, as well as IFC/NPC dealing with new laws, proposed legislation and legal outcomes regarding hazing, housing, individual health and wellness, leadership development and more. Exec board usually receives these and is more in the loop on the big picture outside of the university. This is in addition to the general media at large.

I'm also sure that each of your nationals on campus has a traveling consultant pop in once a year as standard practice. They assess the chapter, interview the officers and members, observe and make recommendations. Sometimes they see what they are allowed to see; other times they can really make a difference. That is why it is so important to have alumni/ae advisers and to attend trainings in your district/region with other chapters and alumnae. These opportunties exist for all nationals.

I think it is great you have taken on a few roles within your chapter and that you are passionate about your chapter. Ritual and Song Chairs can do a lot to boost chapter morale and a sense of history and responsibility. I definitely encourage you to seek out an executive board position when the time comes. You will learn so much in a year from the experience and give so much back, as well.