What do people think about ethnic GLOs
 

I've always knew I was going to join an Asian fraternity growing up, maybe because of close peers and classmates in High School.

So when I got to the University of Texas, it was a no brainer. I've been active for a year now, and expect to be President soon. While my goal is to keep expanding and getting more Nationally recognized, I can't help to wonder: What do other organizations think about us?

The other night, this house across the street from us were approached by police cars because of a noise complaint. They blamed it on us, and walked with the officers to knock on our door. I just couldn't stop thinking about what these big fraternities would think about a smaller ethnic one. What do you guys think? Men in larger organizations, I was hoping to hear your opinions the most.

My personal opinion is that it strongly conflicts with the traditional southern fraternities. They're usually incredibly new (including the BGLO's), don't support traditional southern style, and do not attract the needed attention from the campus as a whole. That being said, I think they are necessary in campuses which are naturally de facto segregated. They provide a place for the ethnics which they would not regularly get in the traditional fraternity.

This is "object language" that is objectifying and offensive. If you're talking about racial and ethnic minorities, just type that.

This contradicts this:

If you realize that it's "object language" then it's smallminded to act is if someone's a tool for being offended by something you intended to be objectifying and dehumanizing. I'm not offended by what you type because you're you. But if you go out into the real world and use that type of language to get your rocks off, you need to understand what you're perpetuating. If you don't care, then just say you don't care as opposed to pretending that no one should care.

Can you elaborate on those statements?

This is the first time I have heard BGLOs described as 'new'. I mean some have been around for almost a century! :rolleyes:

Apparently being around for 80 - 100 years is "new" now....

Just curious, but what are traditional southern fraternities? Are they only the ones founded in the south, like SAE or KA (Order)? If you are a DKE or a Zete at a southern school, does that not count?

Just curious.

Compared to several which are over 250 years old, yeah it's new. A chapter founded a century ago at many southern campuses is considered new row.

By traditionally southern fraternities, I mean fraternities who don't do step shows and take pride in the social aspect rather than the philanthropic aspect. Furthermore, fraternities who have usually had houses for over a hundred years and so on. I can go in great detail, but I don't think it's necessary to enumerate.

It is not important for these fraternities to be founded in the south (See: DKE at Alabama), but it is important for them to consider traditional southern values as important.

I think it really depends on the organization jaynu. Certain organizations have certain reputations or "stereotypes" for their membership.

Frankly, I could care less what the "mainstream" Greeks think of "ethnic" Greek organizations. The reason "ethnic" Greeks exist is because of the "mainstream" Greeks conservatism and de jure and then de facto segregation.

BGLOs, LGLOs, AGLOs, to me, serve a HUGE purpose because they provide members of those groups with organizations that give back to their communities and provide brotherhood/sisterhood for their members.

As for what people think of your organization, I really don't know since I don't know who you are a part of. :D However, some Asian Greeks have earned a reputation as being very similar to gangs because of the inter-organization rivalry (see 2003 SJSU LPhiE & PAPhi fight).

Asian Greeks are "new", and the vibe I get from not just mainstream but also BGLOs and LGLOs is not exactly respect. Respect is earned, and in time, I think AGLOs will be among the most respected in the country, but it is going to require their members working towards the goals of their respective organizations and really being leaders within the APIA community.

Just my .02.

I don't care about "traditional" or "southern" fraternities. The only orgs I care about are all members of the NPHC.

PDP, my friends pledges yall at Stony Brook...

While our parties have attracted the mainstream at the University, I sometimes feel that we've (all three AGLOs at UT) have been limited to being semesterly entertainment. I've talked to my affiliated friends around the country and can't help but notice that the main things expected of Asian organizations have been parties, performances hosted by Asian organizations, and random hazing acts.

I really feel that other organizations, and even the University in particular, don't take the Philanthropies, community involvement, and the simple concept of a Greek organization done by AGLOs seriously.

How do you guys perceive the Asian organizations on your campuses? Thanks, everyone, for the insight.

I had never seen an AGLO until I found GC...neither my undergraduate or graduate campuses had any AGLO's.

....okay?

Do you want a cookie for that? I only care about traditional southern fraternities. It doesn't really matter. You asked how I could consider BGLO's new and I told you why they are incredibly new.

You're an idiot.

Do me a favor and put me on ignore. Please.

Okay I'll do this to you the same way I do every GreekChatter because they always back down and are always pathetic. How am I an idiot?

I don't really like the idea of ethnic GLOs. Having seperate fraternities and sororities for the seperate ethnicities creates additional seperation between races, and I think that's detrimental. At the same time, I do realize that many ethnic people are interested in joining ethnic GLOs because they don't believe they would be accepted and respected in traditional GLOs (and sometimes, this is true), they have a lot of pride in their race and want to show it, or they simply feel more comfortable with people who come from the same racial background as they do. So, in short, I can see how and why people might feel the desire to join ethnic GLOs, but I hope that at some point in the future we become colorblind enough as a society that those reasons are obsolete.

My guess would be because the majority of AGLO's are still in its first decade (with the except of less than a handful). I'm sure in another decade or two, many, if not most, would have joined a council and become recognized.

I don't think ethnic GLOs create additional racial separation, but rather create more cohesive ones within an ethnic culture. I would imagine that African Americans earlier last century needed to have their own brotherhood, or perhaps, didn't have a choice but to.

If it was easy to break racial boundaries, I think it would've happened already and these ethnic GLOs wouldn't be so popular as an alternative.

I highly doubt that blacks and other minorities join these groups because they feel they wouldn't get accepted. Its all about preference. Noone wants to join something they wont enjoy being a part of. For example, go to a predominately white frat party and it consists of lots of alcohol use coupled with lots of people standing around talking and random crazy things happening. Go to a predominately black frat party and there is usually very little alcohol with lots of dancing and strutting. Take a person from each party and switch them and they probably wouldn't enjoy themselves. I know partying is not the main reason for joining a greek organization but that is just one aspect that I thought of.

Touche. However, when you look at the NPHC orgs, you see orgs who are in the same form now as they were when they were founded almost 100 years ago. Many, if not the majority, of IFC/NPC groups changed/evolved/merged/consolidated/etc. to their current forms which flies in the face of your 'traditional' argument.

I won't even go into 'Southern Traditions'...:rolleyes:

And lots of fighting.

Black fraternities on campus here now have to have their parties at the HPER (gym) because all their registered parties end in fights in the parking lot.

Ok well if we are gonna go that route, look at how many deaths there are involving white frats and parties due to alcohol poisoning etc. And there is a very high incidence rate of rapes at these frat houses as well, many of which go unreported.

And why exactly was this brought up anyway? I thought we were discussing the reasons a minority would want to join a minority based organization, not the shortcomings of greek life.

Threads like this are never a good idea.

And we've discussed this topic in some form or another on this board numerious times.

Because BGLOs are not traditional Southern fraternities based on the white standard of "Southern tradition." We fight, dance and stroll too much. We need to fight, drink, and rape more to be considered traditional.

Since what ignorant members of any GLO do is about the organizational structures and not about the ignorant members themselves. It's a given on many campuses and in many cities that the mixture of alcohol, testosterone, group rivalry of some sort, and even local area nonGreeks in many cases often results in violence.

I think racially based GLOs make sense on some campuses, but needlessly divide students on others. At my school, in California, all the NPC/IFC groups were racially integrated anyway, so to add BGLO/AGLO/HGLO to the mix might have actually led to the NPC/IFC organizations becoming more white. From what southern GCers have said, though, these groups might have more of a basis/draw in the south or on other campuses.

I swear, I am so tired of the "ethnic GLO's are just reverse racism, blah blah blah" speech. Get a new tune people.

The FACTS are that in 1906 - 1922, NO NPC or IFC organization was open to non-White members. Most weren't even open to non-Christian White people. Obviously there was a need for organizations for African-Americans. In later years there was a need for organizations for Latinos and Asians.

Now it is 2006, and these organizations have been around for many years, and I seriously doubt that any organization is going to want to close up shop just because a few misguided people (who have no idea what these organizations do in the community or even their purpose) think that they should.

I personally think that everyone who is in the "Let's get rid of ethnic GLO's cause they cause separation!" club should go kick rocks.

Agreed with GPhi, not idiot above.

While the sororities are more accepting, to my knowledge we only have one ethnic GLO which is Gamma Eta the hispanic sorority (besides the BGLO's). However, I have been down to Texas and other SEC schools where I have seen the ethnic GLO's. The Gamma Eta's tend to function basically like the BGLO's on campus.

But you are looking at it from the stand point of campus life. Because BGLOs continue to function after school there is a totally different reason for joining. The BGLOs are cultural institutions of the African American community, which is why the collegiate and alumnae membership processes are basically the same.

I envy this about the HBGLOs: whenever blacks gather, and it doesn't matter on what social level, if someone is introduced as, say, "an Alpha man", everyone in the room knows exactly what that means. All the black fraternities and sororities are known and admired throughout all levels of black society.

Black Greeks may have originated because blacks were not rushed by general fraternities and sororities, but they have successfully created their own organizations with their own unique culture, parallel to the "general interest" Greeks.

I think multi-cultural Greeks were founded, not because they were denied admission to the other groups, but because they wanted the same things the rest of us have and also to be around other minorities like themselves. In time they'll develop their own familiar profile and signatures.

One thing that would help the Multis is increasing their membership. Some of the chapters only have a few members. That doesn't attract attention or build prestige.

I think this is not only why blacks prefer BGLO but also an increasing number of whites. No matter what campus you go to the BGLO are the same: AKA, DST, ZPhiB, SGRho, APhiA, Ques, KaPsi, and Sigmas. So no matter where you are likely to find a brother or sister.

The way I see it, IFC/NPC orgs were founded with Christian whites (mostly Anglo-Saxon) in mind, and for the greater part of their history and development (and still today, the largest part of their membership) deals with that racial/ethnic group. They're as much "ethnic" orgs as any other, in that regard. No matter which group you choose, you're picking something with racial overtones. I don't understand why people somehow think that the IFC/NPC orgs are race and ethnicity neutral. White history is not neutral history, and historically white (yes, I said it :eek: ) GLOs are not racially neutral (even if their current policies are non-discriminatory - the GLOs everyone are labelling as ethnic also have these policies).

Not trying to step on any toes here, just stating the facts as I see them.

With all due respect to the politically correct members of this forum, I find it hard to believe that race is not considered an issue with Greek fraternities and sororities on practically all US campuses. Among other memberships I've held in life, I joined Tau Epsilon Rho while in law school, an historically Jewish law fraternity, whose members include many Gentiles like myself. I understand that Tau Epsilon Rho is currently returning to its religious roots. This comes from the official Tau Epsilon Rho web-site:

Beginning with the mid-1950’s, Tau Epsilon Rho Law Fraternity welcomed into its membership every member of the legal profession, regardless of their race, religion, or gender. In 1985, the organization formally changed its name to Tau Epsilon Rho Law Society to more accurately represent its diverse membership and to promote group solidarity. In recent years, TAU EPSILON RHO has made a conscious decision to reemphasize our Jewish roots, and to promote our particular moral and ethical standards as they relate to the legal profession and our personal lives. While TAU EPSILON RHO remains strongly committed to the principles of inclusion and equality, which were our founding ideals, we believe that these religious imperatives also enforce the proper, highest moral aspirations of attorneys and judges throughout the nation.

Under this philosophy, I would be less likely to join today. I respect the religious ideals of Judaism as much as my own, but I feel the religious and racial emphasis on being Jewish becomes slightly more exclusionary. The same holds true for any (hypothetical) Protestant, Buddhist, Hindu or Islamic fraternity or sorority.

I understand this thread involves ethnic Greek organizations, but I cannot help but think that religious affiliation bears a similar, perhaps overlapping, influence on membership issues. Under the theory of homophily, birds of a feather naturally flock together. Its not racist, just natural segregation. So long as people remain homophilous, separate ethnic and religious Greek organizations will likely endure, if permitted by law and social practice. Check out the following link for a brief discussion of homophily.

http://www.ciadvertising.org/SA/summ...;20Theory.html

I am not advocating one way or another with respect to ethnic or religious Greek structures. I am simply tossing a few thoughts into the forum,

Happy New Year!

I agree and our Founding principles are still salient as long as race, class, and gender are salient.

I agree with Ladygreek, DZ, and Firehouse. :)

Not me?

I'm sad :(

LOL. I quoted you directly and cosigned.

I didn't feel like quoting 3 other people.

;)

...............

I tend to think of it as let people go where they feel the bond. Obviously, my sorority was the best fit for me. But, I understand that it isn't for everyone. I probably wouldn't be a fit for some NPC's, probably wouldn't fit in the NPHC and probably wouldn't fit in a lot of other councils and groups. But there are women for whom those organizations are fabulous and fulfilling fits (wow, check out that alliteration!). And I think that every woman should have a chance to experience what I've experienced through my sorority. It sounds Pollyanna, but I'm alright with that.

Furthermore, I think organizations like my own need to be making an effort to reach out towards groups outside AND inside our systems. We can't keep waiting for others to reach towards us...no one ends up connecting that way. Taking the first steps towards bonds, and sometimes REextending the hand of friendship repeatedly, is sometimes what is needed to bring about real unity.

And while I'm at it, I think an effort needs to be made to diversify our membership. I'm not 100% talking racial, although that is a part of it, but I'm talking about in terms of background in all areas (socio-economic, geographic, physical, educational). I think that a house full of 100 blonde, thin, underwater basket weaving majors from Anytown, PA would be really, really boring. I think part of the point of sisterhood is to find that common bond in uncommon places. Part of what I liked about my own sorority is that people looked at them and went, "wow, they are nothing alike". But when you got down to it, we were alike in that we cherished the same ideals taught by our sorority, we cherished life in the same way, we cherished school and education and dialog. We didn't need to be the same coming into it, we gained common ground through our growth in the sisterhood.

I dunno, now I'm rambling.

Short version: Let people find sisters and brothers wherever they can.

I have meet several members of predominantly Asian greek-lettered organizations on my campus.

I see that these greek-lettered organizations are sorely needed for the sharing and cohesiveness within the respective group.

The young people tell me that their parents may not understand but are very caring. The kinds of activities they do on campus are political in nature due to the sheer number of Asians that have graduated from the school.

Look, not every organization, even mine, can provide ALL the needs of the community. We call ourselves living in a capitalistic soceity and free-market economy.... And the last I checked, the United States is governed by a constitution. That we are a UNION with 50 states...

Many people died so that we can all be here to say some of the chit we say to each other when there are so many people that suffer in the United States!!! Aside from the world.

Let's this New Year count our blessings--no matter what new year time we count...

I know what you are going through in Texas. Believe ME, I know... What you need to do it bring forth some controversy on campus with numerous Adult supervision to guide you... Be prepared... You will be a witness to U-G-L-I-N-E-S-S!

But, that is the price of freedom is not always free...