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-   -   Michael Richards aka "Kramer" racist? (https://greekchat.com/gcforums/showthread.php?t=82606)

BetteDavisEyes 11-20-2006 10:45 AM

Michael Richards aka "Kramer" racist?
 
Check out the video & accompanying article.

http://us.video.aol.com/video.index....mmsid=1772645#


http://www.tmz.com/2006/11/20/kramer...tape/#comments

Reds6 11-20-2006 11:56 AM

I have to laugh at the question mark behind racist. Are you asking if he is racist? Well he told the black dude that 50 years ago, he would have happily hung upside down with a fork in their ass and called then countless number of the n-word. I would say racist. I would alos say I'm disappointed but yet not surprised.

_Opi_ 11-20-2006 01:27 PM

man, that's kind of f-ed up. Sounds like he was losing it on stage.

REE1993 11-20-2006 03:01 PM

Yikes. I had to turn it off after the first few seconds. What a moron.

Senusret I 11-20-2006 03:05 PM

Has-been.

macallan25 11-20-2006 04:28 PM

Has Been? The guy was in over 20 films and was making over 1,000,000$ an episode on Seinfeld.......the most succesful TV show in history. Obviously he is satisfied with taking it easy.

Pretty bad.....bud it wasn't any better for the guys to call him a "cracker ass mother fucking white boy."

lilbay77 11-20-2006 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reds6 (Post 1360262)
I have to laugh at the question mark behind racist. Are you asking if he is racist? Well he told the black dude that 50 years ago, he would have happily hung upside down with a fork in their ass and called then countless number of the n-word. I would say racist. I would alos say I'm disappointed but yet not surprised.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senusret I (Post 1360358)
Has-been.

What they said.

Unregistered- 11-20-2006 05:33 PM

I think he made a poor choice in using racial slurs like that, but unless he makes it a habit of doing that...I wouldn't necessarily call him a racist.

blackngoldengrl 11-20-2006 08:36 PM

WOW.Talk about out of control...I can't even find words to describe it. I'm still steaming. Clearly he has some deep-seated issues.

kddani 11-20-2006 08:45 PM

I question his mental health after seeing the clip... but then again, it seems sometimes that one of the qualifications for being a comedian is mental instability!

shinerbock 11-20-2006 09:08 PM

Yeah I think its pretty rough, total lack of control. But I agree, I think that simply because somebody uses racial slurs doesn't mean they have a racist personality. I'm pretty sure we've all been in a situation where we went for the jugular, and for the non-creative, maybe the N word is the best they could do.

OtterXO 11-20-2006 09:12 PM

No matter how drunk I was or if I was super pissed at someone I still wouldn't reference lynching or use the n-word. I think the fact that he found the choice of language to be even in the ballpark of what's acceptable makes him DEFINITELY racist....and a jackass. This is BEYOND a poor choice. It's not like he didn't know he was in front of hundreds of people.

Unregistered- 11-20-2006 09:13 PM

Jerry Seinfeld's sick about it and George Lopez blames his lack of stand-up comedy experience

But anyway...

He apologizes for his remarks

OOhsoflyDELTA#9 11-20-2006 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OTW (Post 1360442)
I think he made a poor choice in using racial slurs like that, but unless he makes it a habit of doing that...I wouldn't necessarily call him a racist.

wow....

AlexMack 11-20-2006 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OOhsoflyDELTA#9 (Post 1360535)
wow....

Dropping the n-bomb doesn't make you a racist. What makes you a racist is believing that another race is inferior to you. I don't know if Richards, in his heart of hearts, believes this. I do know that he used the wrong words to flip out at his audience...
Take this as you will, I'm white so I have limited perspective on this incident.

macallan25 11-20-2006 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OtterXO (Post 1360519)
No matter how drunk I was or if I was super pissed at someone I still wouldn't reference lynching or use the n-word. I think the fact that he found the choice of language to be even in the ballpark of what's acceptable makes him DEFINITELY racist....and a jackass. This is BEYOND a poor choice. It's not like he didn't know he was in front of hundreds of people.


Dropping the n-word doesn't make you a racist. I wouldn't call a black guy racist if he called me a cracker or something like that....

Despising another race with the upmost hatred and putting your own above everyone else is what makes you a racist. Was he racially insensitive?, absolutely. It was shocking and inexcusable...but I don't think you can call him a racist.

AlexMack 11-20-2006 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by macallan25 (Post 1360554)
Dropping the n-word doesn't make you a racist. I wouldn't call a black guy racist if he called me a cracker or something like that....

Despising another race with the upmost hatred and putting your own above everyone else is what makes you a racist. Was he racially insensitive?, absolutely. It was shocking and inexcusable...but I don't think you can call him a racist.

It's kind of creepy that you wrote almost the exact same thing as me...unless you meant to...

Unregistered- 11-20-2006 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by centaur532 (Post 1360544)
Take this as you will, I'm white so I have limited perspective on this incident.

And I'm brown and yellow. :p

Quote:

Originally Posted by macallan25 (Post 1360554)
Dropping the n-word doesn't make you a racist. I wouldn't call a black guy racist if he called me a cracker or something like that....

Despising another race with the upmost hatred and putting your own above everyone else is what makes you a racist. Was he racially insensitive?, absolutely. It was shocking and inexcusable...but I don't think you can call him a racist.


I definitely agree.

Senusret I 11-20-2006 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by centaur532 (Post 1360544)
Dropping the n-bomb doesn't make you a racist. What makes you a racist is believing that another race is inferior to you.

Which is what he did by referencing lynching.

He's a racist.

I'd call for a boycott of his work, but he hasn't got any.

AlexMack 11-20-2006 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senusret I (Post 1360571)
Which is what he did by referencing lynching.

He's a racist.

I'd call for a boycott of his work, but he hasn't got any.

Please don't go after me for this because I mean nothing by it, but I interpreted the comment differently...when he referenced lynching, I thought he was pointing out what that kind of behaviour would have resulted in 50 years ago. Of course, at the time he may have meant it the way you took it and I'm just objectifying the situation too much.
I already boycott his work, I hate seinfeld :D

Reds6 11-20-2006 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by centaur532 (Post 1360575)
Please don't go after me for this because I mean nothing by it, but I interpreted the comment differently...when he referenced lynching, I thought he was pointing out what that kind of behaviour would have resulted in 50 years ago. Of course, at the time he may have meant it the way you took it and I'm just objectifying the situation too much.
I already boycott his work, I hate seinfeld :D

No he meant if a black had talked to a white man the way he did 50 years ago he would have been lynched. :(

macallan25 11-20-2006 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senusret I (Post 1360571)
Which is what he did by referencing lynching.

He's a racist.

I'd call for a boycott of his work, but he hasn't got any.


So you know for a fact that he hates the black race and thinks whites are above them? I doubt it. Why are you getting so sensitive over this? It is her opinion.....which I agree with.

jon1856 11-21-2006 12:07 AM

He is on the Late Show with Dave Letterman TONIGHT!
With Jerry.

Senusret I 11-21-2006 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by macallan25 (Post 1360599)
So you know for a fact that he hates the black race and thinks whites are above them? I doubt it. Why are you getting so sensitive over this? It is her opinion.....which I agree with.

Why are you so sensitive about how I feel about this?

DSTCHAOS 11-21-2006 12:56 AM

The great "what is racism"/"is that person racist" debate. When will folks get tired of it.

I think that he appeared flustered by the heckling and went for the jugular--either because he really feels the words he said or because he knew that would really get to his target. No point in debating what that man thinks in his heart of hearts or what he's said and done in his personal life regarding race. Maybe he has mental problems, maybe he was caught off guard, or maybe he's a Grand Wizard in the Klan. It doesn't really matter. The man went on a tangent--a looooonnnnnng, racialized one and unless he was mentally too far gone, he knew what he was saying and even mocked the audience for being in awe. The fact of the matter is that comedy shows attract some audience members who don't mind heckling and often the audience and/or comics have been drinking.

The "cracker" response to him was also uncalled for--whether it came before or after Kramer's comments--not quite the same "umph" or social relevance as what Kramer said but uncalled for nonetheless. I'm glad that many in the audience left or expressed disgust, after they realized that it wasn't part of the act.

DSTCHAOS 11-21-2006 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jon1856 (Post 1360607)
He is on the Late Show with Dave Letterman TONIGHT!
With Jerry.


LOL. Nice try, Michael Richards but this one will have to die down on its own. An apology is an expected formality but people aren't going to just laugh and forget about it. Why's Jerry there? Is he some kind of race ambassador now? Will he testify that Michael isn't racist and that "some of his best friends are black?" :D

Even Mel Gibson could say he was drunk when he talked about Jews. What he said actually wasn't that inflammatory but people still attacked him because they said drunk minds speak sober hearts.

DSTCHAOS 11-21-2006 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by centaur532 (Post 1360575)
Please don't go after me for this because I mean nothing by it, but I interpreted the comment differently...when he referenced lynching, I thought he was pointing out what that kind of behaviour would have resulted in 50 years ago. Of course, at the time he may have meant it the way you took it and I'm just objectifying the situation too much.

Nah, he meant what Reds6 said. He's a comic. He should keep the unfunny history lessons out of his acts.

Maybe that was supposed to be shock-humor that some other comics have gotten away with to lesser extremes.

shinerbock 11-21-2006 02:00 AM

I mean I think those guys calling him a cracker is racially insensitive i guess, but its not like i'm outraged or offended. I just think you can go for something that would be the most hurtful in an out of control situation (n-word) without being a racist. I think most people wouldn't do such things, but some people have better control than others. I have been around people who you could say were racially insensitive, but I don't know that they were really racist. They didn't think they were better than people because of their race, but they were against certain parts of black culture, and used generic racial slurs to describe them. I don't know what i'd call it, but I don't really know that I can say they're racist. Also, note that i'm not apologizing for anyone, its still pretty bad no matter what you're motives are. However, I think a lot of people who would use those terms (not just racial, any type of slurs) often will use them because terms like "motherf*****" really don't have the hurtful affect people may be looking for when they're enraged.

_Opi_ 11-21-2006 02:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by macallan25 (Post 1360554)
I wouldn't call a black guy racist if he called me a cracker or something like that....

Actually, he would be a racist.

In this case, Kramer was racist.

You shouldnt use these racist terms if you don't want to be thought of as a racist. end of story.

macallan25 11-21-2006 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _Opi_ (Post 1360648)
Actually, he would be a racist.

In this case, Kramer was racist.

You shouldnt use these racist terms if you don't want to be thought of as a racist. end of story.

No actually, he wouldn't be a racist...he was racially insensitive. Whether or not you think he is racist because he used the term is besides the point. Just because a person thinks something about you doesn't necessarily make it true. You don't know him well enought to deem him a racist.......if he went on a spiel about how he thinks whites are superior to blacks, then I would call him a racist.

macallan25 11-21-2006 02:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senusret I (Post 1360619)
Why are you so sensitive about how I feel about this?

haha, you don't have to turn it around on me.....it is quite obvious that you got somewhat flustered over us saying that we didn't think he was a racist.

_Opi_ 11-21-2006 04:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by macallan25 (Post 1360650)
No actually, he wouldn't be a racist...he was racially insensitive. Whether or not you think he is racist because he used the term is besides the point. Just because a person thinks something about you doesn't necessarily make it true. You don't know him well enought to deem him a racist.......if he went on a spiel about how he thinks whites are superior to blacks, then I would call him a racist.

I'm sorry but if someone said nigger or "nigguh" to me I would think he/she would be racist. I wouldn't dwell on their why they would say something, but as long as it was "unwelcome" and "unnecessary", I would deem them to be racist. Otherwise, WHY would that person say something racist if they didn't want to be seen that way???

Reds6 11-21-2006 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shinerbock (Post 1360645)
I mean I think those guys calling him a cracker is racially insensitive i guess, but its not like i'm outraged or offended. I just think you can go for something that would be the most hurtful in an out of control situation (n-word) without being a racist. I think most people wouldn't do such things, but some people have better control than others. I have been around people who you could say were racially insensitive, but I don't know that they were really racist. They didn't think they were better than people because of their race, but they were against certain parts of black culture, and used generic racial slurs to describe them. I don't know what i'd call it, but I don't really know that I can say they're racist. Also, note that i'm not apologizing for anyone, its still pretty bad no matter what you're motives are. However, I think a lot of people who would use those terms (not just racial, any type of slurs) often will use them because terms like "motherf*****" really don't have the hurtful affect people may be looking for when they're enraged.

So saying a black person should be basically lynched for going at a white man isn't racist?

cutie_cat_4ever 11-21-2006 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by macallan25 (Post 1360650)
No actually, he wouldn't be a racist...he was racially insensitive. Whether or not you think he is racist because he used the term is besides the point. Just because a person thinks something about you doesn't necessarily make it true. You don't know him well enought to deem him a racist.......if he went on a spiel about how he thinks whites are superior to blacks, then I would call him a racist.

Well, nowadays, even if you said the n-word, you may not be seen as a racist due to the fact that the entertainment/music world has been overusing this word that people have been become insensative about it.

However, on the other hand, saying that a certain race 50 years should be hung upside down and have a f- fork stuck in their a--? If you don't call that racist, seriously, then what would you call it?

33girl 11-21-2006 10:42 AM

There are lots of ways to call a heckler an asshole (starting with, well, asshole) without commenting on their race. If he's definitely guilty of anything, he's guilty of being a lame-o who can't think quickly under pressure.

CutiePie2000 11-21-2006 12:31 PM

His career is done. The End.

DSTCHAOS 11-21-2006 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shinerbock (Post 1360645)
I mean I think those guys calling him a cracker is racially insensitive i guess, but its not like i'm outraged or offended.

I figured that much. Many if not most white people aren't that offended by racial epithets directed at them. They may raise an eyebrow but white people know that words used against them haven't historically been used to oppress them. So they can in a sense go in one ear and right out the other.

Racism is a system of differential opportunity and treatment that goes beyond hurt feelings or being offended. It isn't contingent upon being prejudiced toward a group of people to the point of disliking them. You can never ever use or even think the N word and still be a racist white person.

DSTCHAOS 11-21-2006 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutie_cat_4ever (Post 1360686)
Well, nowadays, even if you said the n-word, you may not be seen as a racist due to the fact that the entertainment/music world has been overusing this word that people have been become insensative about it.

Incorrect.

Even with the derivatives of the word, the N word will always have a place in history and in the hearts of many Americans. The entertainment world hasn't made it appropriate for white people to say the N word. The only white people I can tolerate saying that word in any form are white sociolinguists and even these professionals try not to overuse that contextual privilege.

DSTCHAOS 11-21-2006 12:52 PM

Did anyone see David Letterman last night? How did it go? :D

Drolefille 11-21-2006 12:58 PM

The guy actually apologized. Didn't blame alchohol/drugs/bad parenting. Just that he messed up and he was wrong. I give him credit for that. But it seemed the wrong forum for an apology.


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