Computer Errors???
 

I'm new here...I introduced myself in the Ole Miss thread...I have been reading this site for a couple of months and feel like I know y'all pretty well! I am wondering about something that I have heard about for the past several years at Auburn and Alabama and sure enough the same story reared its head at Ole Miss this time: Rhonda Rushee loves the XYZs and they love her. She goes to their pref and puts them first, but come bid day she gets PDQ. The XYZs find out about this and are hysterical because they are certain for a fact that Rhonda was on their first list--must be a computer error! A variation on this theme: Rhonda Rushee is a XX legacy. XX has a legacy policy that states that if said legacy comes to pref she goes to the top of the bid list. Rhonda knows this and puts them first, but come bid day she gets OMG. I know for a fact that this happened at Auburn several years ago. Baby Bird has a friend in each of these situations. I have maintained that the actives of a particular house don't actually see the bid list and therefore have no idea where a particular pnm was ranked, but with the legacy issue there really does seem to be a problem.

Thoughts?

It isn't a perfect system and computer and human error can and do occur. But if a chapter isn't looking out for the legacies it preffed to make sure they end up on their bid lists if the legacies have preferenced the sorority as their top choice, then that sorority has some bigger issues.

We had a girl who we dropped after the second day of recruitment on our list for the 3rd night. We were a bit surprised, but she went from so-so to loved by everyone and she was given a bid. It was a bit unorthodox but sometimes it works out ok. In the case above, it's not so good.

I don't know if this is a national policy or just a policy of certain chapters, but not everyone puts legacies at the top of their first bid list...

Also, I know that I have never personally seen our bid lists. These chapter members may *think* that Polly PNM was number one on their list, but they may not really know.

A situation occurred at Auburn several years ago where the legacy's mother showed up with a bouquet of the GLO's flowers and was waiting at the dorm but the girl, somewhat confused and not really sure what to do, ran to the "other" dorm anyway. The mom called Panhellenic and they offered to let her go to her legacy house, but the girl felt that would be a slap to the GLO that actually gave her a bid, so she stayed put and did fine. They were both great houses, though!

Computer errors can and do happen. So can human errors. There was a situation at my school where there were two PNMs with the same first and last name, and hence, consecutive PNM ID#s. ABC wanted to invite Susie Smith #1 back, but not Susie Smith #2... unfortunately, they cut the wrong Susie Smith after open houses. Susie Smith #1 approached ABC's front desk in tears - "Why wasn't I invited back?" - and ABC realized their error and hastily (with Panhel's ok) invited her in, so she attended part of a round 2 party. Long story short, Susie Smith #1 became a happy ABC.

Unfortunately, generally speaking, when a computer error occurs, no one will ever know it. Rhonda Rushee who gets PDQ instead of XYZ will assume that she was too low on XYZ's bid list to match to them; XYZ sisters will assume the same thing, or will assume that Rhonda listed PDQ first. Only in certain cases - like the legacy who listed her legacy sorority first and still matched to her second choice - would anyone know for sure that something went wrong.

You are right, not all sororities have this legacy policy, but some do. As for the bid lists, that is what I think also, that when the actual voting happens nobody really knows who ranks where. Rush brings with it plenty of emotions and anxiety on both sides, but fortunately it seems that in the end everyone settles down and winds up happy wherever they land. At least I like to think that they do!

I know that not all nationals have the "legacies must be on the first bid list" rule because I've seen it on some official websites. Nevertheless, I keep hearing of SEC situations in which PNMs who were legacies to groups who did end up in their second choices (not their legacy groups). PH should at least check up on this; legacy ties are too important to just blow off.

I love rush. I hate hearing about unnecessarily broken hearts.:( Y'all start giving me strength so I can make it through our sixth rush....

Legacys are never a sure thing no matter what the old tales were.

The men/women of each group have to make the individual decission for their chapter.

Basically, is this person right for the chapter?

They can make mistakes as has been seen and those who do not make it can go on and become great members of other GLOs.:D

Well, my sorority DOES have a legacy policy. If a legacy is invited to pref she goes on the first list, no matter what. If you are not willing to offer her a bid, you don't invite her to pref. My daughter's GLO has a different policy, but they still give legacies special consideration IF they invite them to pref. Our policy also sort of mirrors the whole "release figures" idea--it is kinder to let them go earlier in the process so that they can consider other options than to carry them longer when you know that they are not a good fit.

Something a friend pointed out to me today: some GLOs count only daughters and sisters as legacies. Others count granddaughters and nieces...some girls may be a legacy to XYZ because their grandmother was an XYZ, but not a legacy to PDQ even though their OTHER grandmother was a PDQ....this might be one explanation for the "legacy dropped after pref" situation.

Carnation...when does #6 go through? Where is she going? Sheesh....I thought having 2 daughters was hard! Didn't you go to Auburn? When were you there?

Please don't speak for sororities. You are not a member of a sorority.

#6 will rush next fall at 1 of 3 universities--no clue which she'll choose yet!

Panhellenic doesn't have a responsibility to verify each organization's individual legacy policy, though. IF an organization has a policy that states that a legacy must be on the top of their bid list and IF the legacy also ranks that sorority first and they are not matched, it's not because of PH being unaware of the legacy policy- it's because their system isn't matching properly. It is just as likely, though, that the organization doesn't have said legacy policy or DOES have said legacy policy and didn't follow through on it- and neither situation would fall under PH's jurisdiction.

This exact same thing happened to me, we only had the same last name though. I got cut from a house after round 1, then before round 3 I got a call about an error in my invites. I had gotten reinvited to that house, and I hadn't ranked them since they had cut me. I felt kinda sorry for the other girl.

Any of which have Pi Phi???

Hypothetically speaking - and without getting into specifics of membership selection - what happens if quota (i.e. the first bid list) is going to be ten. Yet going into the preference round, a chapter has twelve legacies that the chapter would love to have (perfect fit as it were) as members - i.e. willing to offer a bid.

The chapter is at total and the campus panhellenic is only going to allow the chapter to extend ten bids (i.e. quota). If the legacy policy states all legacies invited to preference round must go on the first bid list, would the chapter be required to drop two of the legacies before preference? Or would the chapter be allowed to invite all twelve legacies to the preference round and put two of the legacies on the second bid list?

Really, I don't know
 

TStephen, I don't really know the answer to your question, but I would guess that they invite them to pref and place them on the second list.

I suspect that it's is done this way because you don't really know in advance that all the legacies are going to rank the legacy GLO group first. So in your example, if two of the group's top ten choose a different number one choice, the eleventh and twelfth girls would match.

As I said, I have no expert knowledge about bid list formation, but I do know that there are some groups at big southern schools that have more than a pledge class of legacies go through rush each year. I doubt they drop girls that they would want before prefs in anticipation of 100% matching the first list.

(Something else to consider is that these girls are frequently legacies at more than one groups: a Chi Omega mom, a Phi Mu sister, maybe a grandmother or aunt at a group that includes these relationships as legacies, etc. They can only match one although they may pref. three.)

The year I rushed there was the "Susie Smith" situation... 2 girls, same name. Apparently it was really confusing for the chapters. They weren't in the same Rho Gam group becasue the computer bumped the first one when the second was added and she had to be re-added..

Anyway, they are both in my pledge class. We always joke that if a woman named "Susie Smith" shows up during rush we're going to have to let her go because 2 is confusing enough!

My feeling was this might be the scenario. All twelve invited to the preference round with ten going on the first bid list and two on the second bid list.

Don't always be so sure that suzie PNM put her legacy chapter first on her bid card, either.

No-oooo!!! Arggghhh!!!:(

At one, she'd be a legacy only to Chi O; at another, Chi O and Zeta; at another,
AOII and Zeta.

So....I'm working on the 2 12-year-olds.

I say you demand one of these girls to go to a school with Pi Phi! lol. Its your right! lol.

I heard rumors of a computer mistake one year when a particular sorority on my campus had a bunch of girls show up to Pref that they hadn't exactly expected, because they had cut these girls before that round. I'm not quite sure on the specifics or what eventually happened, but I guess they worked it out because nothing was ever said about it after rush was over. I have often wondered about how much of this goes on...with all the activity during rush week, I can understand how it would be hard to know if that girl everybody thought would "shine brighter in another house" :p just sort of slipped through the cracks and got invited back or if there was some kind of computer glitch somewhere along the way.

Computers are only as good as the people who programmed them.:(

*crossing fingers that ADPi is at all three of these universities!!*

AMEN! I have known many PNMs at Ole Miss that lie to their mothers, their sisters, their friends in houses, etc....afterall it is their choice and their business. Perhaps they don't want to upset mom or sister or friend...

My sister was a legacy to Theta, double legacy to AOII, and then had courtesies to Kappa. She ended up going AOII but still, she could have lied to me and put something else!

Side Note: This year Panhellenic did not release legaices to the sororities. Meaning the ICS Recruiter program used to list all of the legacies a members had. (i.e. Mary is has an AOII mom, Theta sister, Pi Phi sister, AOII aunt.) This year it only listed the legacies your own sorority had. Therefore, all PNMs were probably given a more fair chance and their legacies were not held against them. (Some houses will assume you are going to your legacy and drop you.) There were a few big legacies who joined other houses because they were given a more fair and equal recruitment. On the flip side, if the PNM had a rec her legacies were most likely written on the rec or her resume, so the chapter could find out that way and if they did some good research.

Name Game
 

The year after I went through recruitment, there was a girl with the same first name (fairly unique) and last initial as my (non-Greek) roommate. When my roommate was seen with one of our Kappa friends on-campus, our Kappa friend got in trouble for violating silence rules. It took some time to convince her chapter that the girl she was hanging out with wasn't the PNM Susie S.

This thread topic is a perfect example of why it is SO IMPORTANT to double and triple check invitation lists, bid lists and preference/priority ranking cards! We had a similar issue this year (which I won't elaborate on to keep confidentiality), which initially looked like a computer error but in the end was human error and could have been avoided if those involved had checked the lists. It turned out great in the end, but if no one had said something about it, the issue would have never been resolved.

I think that in using any type of computer program (ICS, CampusDirector, CAR, etc.) that it is both the chapter and Panhellenic's responsibility to check and double check that the data entered is correct. I love that ICS and CampusDirector put the accountability on the chapter for entering information correctly, but in the end, it should always be checked more than once for accuracy. Human error can lead to a compromise in the program.

(p.s.- sorry if this came of as a rant at all... I'm still a little bent about the aforementioned situation was handled on my campus. But it's all good in the end :D )

That's what happened to one of my daughters. She wasn't a legacy to the sorority she pledged but she had 2 cousins who were alums of another chapter. Her big later told her that they'd considered her a courtesy legacy!

If your biological sister is an active in a sorority at ABC University, can she help her sibling if she rushes the same sorority at DEF University? I ask simply for curiousity's sake (no one else in college for some time to come).

well, her sibling is a legacy, and while actives can't always write letters of recommendation (depends on the sorority) she can usually write a letter of introduction (or somehow contact XZ chapter of QRS). It can help, but is certainly not a sure thing.

different sororities have different rules concerning collegians writing recommendations for pnms. for instance, zta allows collegians to write a recommendation, however an alumna must also sign the recommendation.

if nothing else, older sis could invite younger sis to the house, and introduce her to some of the chapter advisors who might write a rec. for younger sis. younger sis should mention on her recruitment application that older sis is a member of ___ sorority. even if that sorority has no chapter at younger sis's college, it lets the sororities that are on her campus know that she has an idea of what membership in a sorority entails and that the parents do too.

BIG-TIME GLITCHES REPORTED AT U of CALIFORNIA - SAN DIEGO

Whoah. Sounds like major glitches at the University of California – San Diego (UCSD). The school paper reports that the Greek Life adviser ‘fessed up to fouling up some things involving upperclass PNMs, but there are still reportedly questions about other “glitches” and whether or not problems were appropriately rectified:

http://ucsdguardian.org/viewarticle....onth=10&day=26

Excerpts from much longer article:
Two weeks after sorority recruitment, questions still linger about computer glitches, "misbids" and the resignation of Panhellenic Council President Megan Christopher that followed shortly after. . . .

The largest question involved women receiving “misbids,” or acceptances into the wrong sororities — a situation that affected 40 to 50 girls and impacted every sorority, Revelle College senior and Alpha Chi Omega member Rachel Corell said. . . .

Oops!

OUCH. Wow.

Yikes. I think that's a bit more than "computer error".

Oh, my. I can't even imagine. I can see mistakes like party invites getting mixed up or whatever, but bids????