Are NPHC orgs Christian?
 

Hello to all.

I have a very serious, and quite possibly loaded question to the NPHC Greeks out there.

I have heard at various times and in various forums that several, if not all the NPHC orgs were founded on Christian principles.

So, I ask this with a very serious intent to "use" this information to guide me down the right road.

Seeing your organization as it is NOW (NOT as it was founded or what it was, but right now)as well as seeing it's vision for the 21st century, is your organization a Christian fraternity/sorority? If yes, what is it that makes it a Christian organization? If no, why not?

Serious, thought out replies only, please. No Springer drama or hatin'. I'm in a very focused mode right now and I can't have any "mess".

Rain Man

I would think that those founded on Christian principles would still be using them. The Christian principles are not to teach the Bible or such, but to help you fellow man--in that sense, we are all following those principles through philanthropy projects.

Rain man, yes many orgs, incl mine, were founded on Christian principles but members need not be Christian to join.

If you think about it, most "Christian" principles are universal--charity, service, fellowship, dedication.

But to go as far as being a "Christian organization" would seriously alienate many members and potential members and reduce the ability to carry out the national projects and goals.



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MCCOYRED

Dynamic
Salient
Temperate

Mu Psi '86
BaltCo Alumnae

While I understand what you are saying about being founded on Christian principles, and that members need not be Christian to join, please understand that being founded on Christian principles means nothing unless all members actively put those principles into practice.

Let me explain. Alpha Phi Omega Fraternity was founded by (and originally ONLY FOR)former Boy Scouts and thus the fraternity was founded under Scouting principles. After the Scouting requirement was dropped and the organization went coed, the Scouting principles headed south. Now with APO proudly proclaiming that they even admit gays and atheists as well as presently trying to officially break ties with the BSA, it is fair to say that APO is no longer a Scouting fraternity as it was 75 years ago.

That being said, I ask: Do you feel that all Deltas (assuming you are a Delta) actively exemplify the principles of Christ not only in DST, but in their own private lives as well? I am using this elaboration as a basis of determining if NPHC orgs are Christian GLOs or not, regardless of their founding principles, because time passes and changes can and do occur, even unintentionally.

Rain Man

From what you have told me, Delta Sigma Theta is not a Christian organization. I am basically looking for a simple yes or no answer. I am not making my above conclusion to disgrace or "snub" my nose at Delta in any way. It is very good to have moral principles to follow in ANY organization. I just wanted a definitive answer to my question from a fellow member and I am looking for similar responses from other NPHC org members.

Thank you Deltas for responding.

What about the other eight NPHC orgs. Are you Christian organizations?

Rain Man

If what you are looking for is a simple yes or no answer, then I will say no. We are community service organizations who's foundations happen to be based off of Christian priciples and teachings (ie. service to mankind, fellowship...)

But we are not Christian organizations - we were not founded as such.

Hope that answers you question...

1922
Sigma Gamma Rho




[This message has been edited by prettypoodle6 (edited November 29, 2000).]

The only fraternal organization that I know of that requires its members be Christian is masonry.

I understand what you are saying with regards to Christian principles and teachings. But based on the examples you and others gave, I feel that those are actually MORAL principles, it's just that Christ exemplified those principles very well that He was rightfully put on a pedestal. You do not need to be a Christian to have morals and IMHO I think the two principles (moral vs. Christian) people confuse one for the other.

But no matter. I got my response from the SGRhos and thanks a lot.

sorry to mislead you, I'm not a Delta. I am a Delta Zeta though. We also are not a Christian organizaion, we are a community service organization.

Mccoyred and 12dn94dst are Deltas.

I wasn't sure if he/she thought I was a Delta too or not, so I just thought I'd clear it up, just in case. Ya know what, I totally didn't see the title either, I just jumped into the convo even though it said NPHC. . .whoops--sorry!!!!

[This message has been edited by mgdzkm433 (edited November 29, 2000).]

Since all Deltas do not follow the teachings of Christ (some are Muslim, Buddhist, Agnostic, etc.) it is pretty hard to determine if they exemplify the principles of Christ in their personal lives. They may exemplify the principles of Buddah, or Muhammad as given to him by Allah, or some other set of principles that may be very similar to the teachings of Christ as we know them. As my Soror said, we are not a "Christian" organization. We were not founded "for" Christians as APO was founded "for" former Boy Scouts. We were founded "for" college educated women who have a commitment to serving their community.

If you really take the time to think about it, the principles we were founded on are not Christian per se. Principles of charity, service, fellowship, dedication can be found in all religions and more importantly in all PEOPLE. Just because, for example, someone does not believe in God does not mean that he/she does not wish to associate with friends and family (fellowship). It does not mean that she/he will not do regulary help someone less fortunate (charity, service) and it does not mean that person will not see a cause out to it's end (dedication).

please understand that being founded on Christian principles means nothing unless all members actively put those principles into practice.

If you speak in the terms you are asking, then no, they are no longer acting on those christian principles. Why? Becuase the non-christian members will not follow the 'christ-like' process it takes to be Christian, so in their everyday life, they will not carry out Christian principles. However, that shouldn't be the question here, it should be does the GROUP carry out it's Christian Principles--because it is the sorority that we are talking about, not sara, jessica, martha, and mary. If these girls are all buddhist, then they themselves were not founded on christian principals, it is the SORORITY that is founded on those christian principles. In this sense (the group), the answer would then be yes. The group as a whole is not responsible for the individual actions or beliefs of one member. The group as a whole DOES, however, take part in furthering their ideals involving helping their fellow mankind in many endevors such as feeding the hungry, helping with child care programs, cleaning up trashy highways, volunteering at hospitals, helping build a home for habitat for humanity, and so on. Those are the Christian principals that we were founded to DO. We can't base the groups purpose on the actions of individuals. The group functions as one while they are representing themselves but the function as individuals at all other times.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you are asking, but that is how I understood your question.

With regards for if NPHC orgs are Christian, I have only heard from the sororities. What about the fraternities? Lemme hear from yall. I am very curious.

Rain Man

As a LXA, Yes our principles are founded on Chrisran beliefs. I am also a non practicing Mason which is also founded on Christian beliefs. While I know there are many religious beliefs in our world, none of them are wrong or right! I live in Kansas City Kansas and this is without a doubt the largest melting pot in the world where cultures, races, and relegions have intermarried. The moto that I chose when I started the local was cogito ergo sum. I Think Therefor I am. Not I am better than. There is some one or thing out there but we know not of which. It makes not what difference death is final as being an ex-police officer, death is final. No matter who you are and where live life is precious. That is why I care about all Greeks! We join learn and meet the world. I have had many great freinds in all walks of life and if they are blgo or glo what the matter they are my freinds!

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Tom Earp LX Z#1
Pittsburg State U. (Kansas)

what right road are you refering to? if you are looking for a greek/church/any organization for that matter where ALL the members "consistenly" reflect christian prinicipals or even "moral" prinicipals then stop looking, cause it ain't out there. humans are by nature flawed and even if taneka is being moral/christian today chances are that sheniqua http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif may not be, but they are all in the same organization and if they do a sucessful food drive that feeds a hungry mouth then the purpose is served. The real question may be are YOU practicing the principals that you are looking for in an organization that will guide you down that road? as for AKA we were founded on christian prinicpals in order to provide a sisterhood in which college women could support and bond with each other and serve their communities as a result of their committment to one another. and we continue to strive and practice those principals today. sorry we are not a simple organization, so a simple yes or no will not do http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Thanks for responding, Positively.

I started Part II of this thread, entitled "Are NPHC Orgs Christian (Why I originally asked)". It explains what prompted me to ask the question originally and thus should answer your initial question.
Check it out and respond in that thread (It is on Page 2 of the Greek Life thread--posted 12/5/00 @ 1:48 pm)

Lemme know what you think

Rain Man

Rainman
I would like to believe all Fraternities and Sororities are based on Christian principles and values.
I am sure all NPHC use the Bible in some point in their Rituals of Initiation.I am also sure all these organizations have a national prayers.
You must take into consideration the founding of all of these organizations,they were all founded at the turn of the century when conditions were not the greatest for the Black student(AT the time we were Negro).AS the history of our people portrait we have always turned to GOd for our strength and guidiance.Just because we are now on a College campus we would never abandon the basic principles instilled in us by our forefounders.
I know we do not always show the christian values that we are based on,and that is because we are still secret( private) organizations.
I hope this answers your questions.

Not really, Justmyo; and that is because everyone is saying that their org is founded on Christian principles, but that does not mean that the org in question is Christian. IMHO it is no more different that me asking you if you are Christian. Would you answer with "Well, I was born in a Christian family" or "I was raised with Christian principles." No, because those answers do not determine if you are a Christian or not. You would answer with a "yes" or a "no". As far as serving God, be it individually or collectively, there is no middle ground. You either are or aren't. I have already resigned my posting of questions with the answer being "No, those orgs are not Christian" if for no other reason than I could not get a simple definitive answer to begin with.

Personal case in point: My fraternity was founded on Scouting principles. If someone was to ask us if we are a Scouting fraternity, I would answer "No". That is because with the former Scouting requirement being dropped, along with the mass admittance of women, gays, and atheists, combined with our org and the BSA being at odds with each other about the admittance of such individuals left the principles of Scouting largely abandoned and thus we are not a Scouting fraternity.

Rain Man

Actually, MWD, the requirement of Masonic fraternities is that the potential member believes in a Supreme Being. Not necessarily the Judeo/Christian "God". http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif
(I don't usually comment, since I'm not Greek...But I AM an Eastern Star.)

NicoleRey

Rainman
I think the answer you are looking for must come from the individuals in the organizations.Am I a Christian?the answer is yes.Are all my brothers Christians?the answer is no.Over all are most of us Christians?the answer would have to be YES.So does that make us a christian organization?Can we all become Christians?yes.Then I must ask you are you referring to serving God and practicing Christian principles.Would we knowingly allow someone who does not believe in God to become a member?Do we try to get our members to become Christians?Do we only accept Christians as members?
There are a lot of questions that you must ask.If a person was looking for an organization that was Faith based,they should probably look in the church.(you still won't get 100%)