Standardized Testing and Merit Pay
 

Houston Teachers' Pay Now Tied to Scores By JUAN A. LOZANO, Associated Press Writer
Thu Jan 12, 8:43 PM ET



HOUSTON - Houston became the largest school district in the country on Thursday to adopt a merit pay plan for teachers that focuses on students' tests scores.



By a 9-0 vote, the Houston school board approved a plan that offers teachers as much as $3,000 in extra pay if their students improve on state and national tests. The program could be expanded to provide as much as $10,000 in merit pay for teachers.

The vote came after several teachers told the board at its monthly meeting they believed the plan was flawed and unfair because some teachers will be eligible for larger bonuses than others.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060113/...BhBHNlYwM5NjQ-

It's a double-edged sword. The bonus will make some teachers work harder to prepare their students so that they will be eligible for the bonus, while some instructors will work hard and still get nothing, simply because the students may not suceed, regardless of what the teacher does. And what about teachers that are already in high achieving areas? They get the bonus automatically?

I think that Houston needs to rethink this merit pay jive....

Exactly.
Some students will not succeed like others will because of disabilities or they do not test well.

I do not think it's really fair, but I understand what the bottom line is.

High achieving areas: they probably receive the automatic pay. If so, you will probably have a high influx of teachers trying to get into that district.

I'm sure Soror Wonderful will be able to elaborate on this.

Thats how most teachers feel. I mean instead of measuring how well or how much students grow, they are going to take test scores and use as a means to pay teachers who supposedly work harder more money.:mad:

That sounds great but what about if I teach inner city kids who are all below the poverty line and haven't been given the proper foundation for education walk in my ninth grade class and I can produce growth from scoring in the 21st percentile to the 63 percentile? Thats 42 percent! That is huge growth, but you teach kids who have been wealthy their whole lives goes from scoring in the 83 percentile to the 87th percentile? Your kids grew 4 percent. Surely I am the better teacher, but because my kids did not score 70% you get a bonus! Thats crazy!! I don't work in Houstin Independent School District, I teach in a district in Houston, north of HISD. Teaching is so under appreciated, if people really knew the students we deal with today it would trip you out! :rolleyes:

Believe me, I know. That's why I QUIT!!!

I give props to teachers. I know that there are some who don't do squat, but there are a lot who works their butts off everyday, only to get kicked in it every chance the students, parents, principal, school district, state, and nation gets the chance. Teachers are already working for peanuts and now they are going to add MORE pressure to a thankless job by basing whether a teacher gets a bonus on students' test performances? It's a shame....

Nooooooo. IF folks knew what TEACHERS had to go through everyday. Teachers cannot teach because they are too busy being the doctor, nurse, nurse's aid, counselor, police officer, pastor, friend, mother, father, sister, cousin, aunt, grandmother, guardian, referee, social worker, hair stylist, etc.

I'm not being funny. This is REAL!

ETA: Our problem: Elected Officials. They make these decisions without knowing what's REALLY going on. If you had elected officials on ALL levels to substitute in the classroom for ONE day, they.could.not! They probably could not make it 1/2 a day.

For real! I mean I love the perks like long vacations, and being paid year round. More importantly I like the relationships I create with my students BUT man sometimes.....:mad: I wanna bust a cap in them kids behinds!

I am ignorant to this subject. Tell me how does wher eyou come from equate to test scores.? You said kids from the inner city score less than wealthy kids. I know a few inner city kids (including myself) that do well on test and went to college and everything.

You have got to be kidding right? :rolleyes:

I am sorry for my sarcastic reaction? :)

I am not saying innercity kids can't and do score better, I am saying that paying teachers bonus pay based on test scores and not how much students grow is stupid. Since you are from the inner city and you had teachers, whose job do you think would be harder? That teacher teaching inner city kids trying to score a 70 on a state test or that teacher who teaches wealthy kids tying to get them to a 70 percent?

You are the exception, not the rule.

Like my Soror stated, it is NOT that inner-city students CAN'T learn, score well, graduate, go on to college, etc. However, reality and statistics show that the test passage and graduations rates are far lower in the inner-city than in the suburbs and the dropout rate is higher. Thus, this makes the job of inner-city teachers much more difficult, as they are dealing with all of these working against them.

When this first came out, a parent was on the news complaining that teachers will end up teaching the test, and not really teaching the subject.

The merit pay is not bad with all things being equal.......but we know that this is not always true.

Another reason for this is that many inner-city kids tend to have jobs after school to help support the family, so that really cuts into study time.

But, I do see what you are saying. I think that if a child comes from a home that vaules education, no matter the financial status of that home, then whether they are from the inner-city or not should not matter if the child wants to be successful in school.

Aside from the fact that I don't see how this would affect art/PE/music teachers.. :mad:


I wouldn't be. It's the truth, LOL.

It's fairly unrealistic to think that (a) all inner city students will fair as well as 06pilot. He (i'm assuming this is a "he") simply proves that there are exceptions to an acknowledgeable norm. I love to see kids like this, but it's damn near irrational to believe that it always happens this way. Don't be offended, it's just rational thinking.

Compare the test scores for your average inner-city area to those of your average suburban area . I'll tell you one thing. I went from one type to the other, and I'll put it like this: my suburban alma-mater had a 93% "success rate" (meaning out of the 848 i graduated with, 93% of my class went on to college). My inner city school district? A whopping ONE PERCENT. Now, why I think that is, is a whole other story. But that's still major.

To me, it's all too reminiscent of someone's bright idea to pay the school systems in Indiana who were (coincidentally already full of money) succeeding in test scores lots of money, and take money away from schools that actually may need it.

I specified Indiana because while one high school used the extra new money to buy their choral department more satin for their performind gowns, there were schools in another area who didn't have air conditioning (for one reason or another) and couldn't afford fans or afford to have someone work on it.

Why is this mess okay? Do plans like this really work? Do they really motivate teachers to do more than they've always done? Are there republicans *cough* excuse me, people out there who think that in the inner city, all the teachers just sit on their tails and do nothing.. so the promise of more money is going to make them do some magic? Am I missing something here??

I work as a math specialist in my school (inner city), I can tell you with great confidence why our students underachieve:it's because the bar is not raised to address the need. What I mean is, we have waaayyyy to many teachers who dummy down the education. Once a teacher (both black AND white) get it into their heads that these children aren't going to learn they quit trying. Why? Because they are undersupported. Damned if you do damned if you don't. Bottomline.

Parents don't attend PTSA meetings, for example, alot of times 'cause they can't because they are working late shifts or two sometimes three jobs to make ends meet. Then the flipside is lazy goodfornothin' parents who just get that check off their child....take that money and go get their hair, nails, and lashes done. :rolleyes: :mad: ....

Then there are the I'm-in-my-suit-too busy trying to micro-manage-I'm going on lunch-too pretty-unconcerned--highly-paid to do nothing but watch t.v. in my office and play solitaire administration. Now I am fortunate that my principal is a grass-root person but not every school is like that....

Let's not forget Sheniqua and Deontay who have absolutely no home training and potty mouths and still in grade 8 don't know how to do fractions or basic mutiplication facts....

And the few innercity students that do well leave and go to charter or private schools (here) instead of parents demanding that the problem be fixed. Too many of the persons who sit on our school boards have a political agenda and dare not to come into any classroom except on special occasions.

It's truly sad. :(

This is one of the dumbest 'reforms' I have seen in a while.

Obviously the richer, whiter school districts and teachers will get the extra money and the raise, whereas the struggling inner city teachers...but they are probably already used to that, and expecting it, sadly.

Besides everything that you sisters (and brothers) already listed, there's also the matter that when a child in the suburbs is failing or not doing well on tests, his or her parents can afford private tutoring or special classes for them. Inner-city kids' parents typically don't make enough for that, and even if they did, the kid is possibly working and wouldn't have the time to take the class/tutoring.

I agree that you shouldnt pay teachers more just because their students score hire on a test. Thats not fair becauase differant students learn at a differant rate. I dont believe however that has to do with where you come from. Just as ther eare smart kids in the inner city, ther eare dslow learners in the suburbs as well. Just because a family has money doesnt make their kids smarter. But thats just what I believe. I am sure many of you disagree with that statement and thats cool.

No, I actually agree with you. But the thing is is that there is a disparity in education and our (inner city)children get the brunt of it.

the incentive pay has 3 "strands" to it and the first strand is school-wide improvement. if the school meets the requirement, then ALL teaching staff receive a bonus on the first strand.

No I don't think more money makes you smarter, it just opens up the door in some many areas including education.

So... you believe that "your situation" is how it NORMALLY happens?

I don't think anyone is disagreeing with you there.

There are extreeeeeeeemely smart kids in the inner city. However, because there is little to no money in their school system, it's hard to create or maintain programs that mentally and educationally motivate those inner-city children.

You ever sat in class one day and was stuck listening to a teacher teach a subject that you already know? It was a boring experience and you probably didn't pay attention to squat that the teacher said.. played with whatever you could find to entertain yourself.. or maybe slept. For a lot of those "smart kids" in the inner city, that's what it's like EVERY day. Teachers even run the risk of losing the SMART kids (ala Lisa Simpson) because they start to feel like they don't belong where they're at.. and unfortunately sabotage themselves (ala Bart Simpson).

No one is denying that there are dumb kids in the suburbs.. but thanks to the weird programming and plans in place, the suburban schools can afford things called "resource classes" where they have teachers (not teaching assts, but real certified teachers) who do nothing but sit one on one with students for an entire class period and teach them. They can afford to sponsor the child's tutoring. Those schools can even afford to send you to Sylvan Learning Center (or a reasonable facsimile) to get the help you very well may truly need.

I don't know of ANY inner city areas that can do those things.

I think we all can agree that money opens doors that knowledge and even connections can not. If I am a high school junior/senior who wants to go to college, I'll take the SAT, right? Let's say that a suburban area-based student takes it and scores a 950.. and that happens a LOT. That kid's parents say "that score is unacceptable." What will they do? They'll go out and buy SAT study guides, sponsor their child to take SAT study classes, purchase the time of a tutor, all that. I know kids who had to borrow money from Grandma or Friend to take the SAT and be STUCK with the one score they got.

For the entire article:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060119/...llege_students


WASHINGTON - Nearing a diploma, most college students cannot handle many complex but common tasks, from understanding credit card offers to comparing the cost per ounce of food.


Those are the sobering findings of a study of literacy on college campuses, the first to target the skills of students as they approach the start of their careers.

More than 50 percent of students at four-year schools and more than 75 percent at two-year colleges lacked the skills to perform complex literacy tasks.

That means they could not interpret a table about exercise and blood pressure, understand the arguments of newspaper editorials, compare credit card offers with different interest rates and annual fees or summarize results of a survey about parental involvement in school.

The results cut across three types of literacy: analyzing news stories and other prose, understanding documents and having math skills needed for checkbooks or restaurant tips.

"It is kind of disturbing that a lot of folks are graduating with a degree and they're not going to be able to do those things," said Stephane Baldi, the study's director at the American Institutes for Research, a behavioral and social science research organization.

Can anyone spot the problem? :rolleyes:

Is there blame to place? Do we place blame on parents, or teachers?

Are we placing blame on teachers, and using the good ol' capitalist call of MONEY to bribe teachers into somehow pulling student proficiency out of their derrieres?

Am I lost?

Here's what I find interesting about the article:

Who are these students that they are testing who attend college?

Once can tell they did not test HBCU's ...

So, I am left wondering who are these students?

^^
I'm confused because they are using that sample to state:

More than 50 percent of students at four-year schools and more than 75 percent at two-year colleges lacked the skills to perform complex literacy tasks.

:confused: :rolleyes:

I'on no! :p
:D

While in the lounge today, a 12th Grade English teacher mentioned that she was NOT going to require her students to complete a research paper! :eek: I nearly fell out of the floor. Teachers are soooooooo trying to prepare for these mandated tests that they are not touching the "basics".

How are you not going to do a research paper? Okay, the percentage of students who go to college directly after graduation (at our school) is low, but still...I did not understand that! One day, he or she may decide to go on, but they won't have the experience of conducting research, etc. :o I know I used my HS MLA book throughout college. I would have used in in grad school, but I had to move on to APA. :rolleyes: :D

Browsing through the study I was a little disappointed that they didn't name any of the schools where subjects were educated, nor did it seem that they offered any regional breakdown of results either...

For those interested in the study; don't worry it's actually pretty simple and light reading ~ I guess those tested had to be able to understand it too ;):

http://www.air.org/news/documents/Th...l%20report.pdf

I can believe this. Students are so low on the basics she probably CAN'T assign the research paper. I mean if my job is tied to test scores and a research paper is not on that test, guess what, we are gonna get what is on that test mastered before anything else. It's a catch 22, teaching really is so hard..... :(

Another way of looking at this is that research papers can be purchased on-line. So even if she did assign a research paper, I'm sure a student or two would purchase their paper on-line and the teacher could not be sure if all of her students actually wrote the paper.

But, as the teacher I would still teach how to do a research paper, since it is critical preparation for college.

It's not hard to determine if a paper was plagiarized, bought, copied, etc. If you have had a student all year, a nine weeks period, one week,or even ONE day you WILL know what the student is capable of doing (vocabulary, usage, sentence structure, mechanics, etc). If the high school student writes on a certain level (let's say 6th grade), then ALL of a sudden, the student turns in a paper that is stellar, you become suspicious.

True. Just trying to offer another perspective on the issue.