The Race Card
 

Let me say up front that I have a biracial cousin, who identifies more with being black than white - even though she could easily "pass".

During the OJ trial, we got into a discussion, and I asked her why most of the black community felt that OJ was innocent, and the white community felt that OJ was guilty. I naively asked, "Why does it always have to be a racial issue?"

She responded, "Because to us, it always is."


My question now is WHY? Why do we have to state someone's race in any given situation, as if it's that's the "real" issue? Have we not yet learned that we're all people, not a representative of our entire race? While I understand a return to heritage, in this case, is it a good thing, or a bad thing?

Happy Belated b'day by the way!

Your cousin was just being honest in a sense. But it's not always about race in just the AA community. Perhaps after being slighted so often - we're quicker to call people on it (let's see if this can be an intelligent discussion w/o the eye rolling and name calling).

I think backgrounds and experiences shape what many of us believe and how we see things. Some simply can't fathom that there are still racial issues because they've never experienced racism (and that's anyone of any race - some AA's with different backgrounds don't believe it). Some see race in everything.

Look at the Susan Smith case. When she first described her children's "kidnapper" my supervisor at the time & I had a major disagreement (we were like that - we could disagree, still like each other, & still work together). She was all up in arms as were alot of white people at work- looking out for this assailant - going off at the lunch table. I told her (& everyone else there) the pic looked like a stereotypical "Sambo" and I thought she made it up. They looked at me like I was crazy. I was so mad. I didn't think she was racist - but I couldn't understand for the life of me why she couldn't see the image as I saw it. Turns out - that heffa.... I mean woman... drowned her children.

Anyway, that's my opinion. Oh - & I don't think OJ killed Nicole either. :eek: Too old & decrepit. But I do think he was involved and he's not completely innocent - and I don't know too many people that thinks he's completely innocent either.

Re: The Race Card
 

This is a good question, and a discussion I had in an American Race Relations class I once took. I think that for minorities our race (and on some level with women, our gender) is constantly on our minds, because that is how most people in society view us. For example, a friend of mine was describing my research group, and I'm the only African American, and my race was singled out in the descriptions, but no one else's was. Add to that the many negative stereotypes of minorities that continue to persist today, and you have a situation where certain people must always be "on guard".

In general, I don't see race/heritage as a bad thing. I am proud of my history and my people, and I would expect anyone else to be the same way. The problems begin when people say "I'm better than you because I'm (fill in the blank)" or "You can't do XYZ because you're (fill in the blank)". And yes, things like this still happen.

I think you got it right the first time, TP.

because as the minority, people of color are almost always identified partially (as completely) by their race by the majority.

I think the phrase "playing the race card" in and of itself is insenstive and is indicative of the larger problem of dismissal of race related issues that are important to us and not to others. When I hear people say "so and so are playing the race card" it bothers me becasue who are they to say, as I assume they mean, that a person's perception that race is the central issue of a particular situation is less than valid or real? That by itself highlights the oblivion and nonchalance that a lot of people who have the luxury of a larger population with which THEY identify relative to our smaller population with often a smaller voice live in.

Off-Topic Somewhat: I have driven on the road Susan Smith took to John D. Long Lake (I live in SC) and saw the "starting point" for her car. She had a looonnnnggg drive from the "starting point" to the end. You get on this one road and you have turn off of that road and there's still a ways to go. It was a good 45 minutes or so drive for her. 45 minutes to really think about what she was going to do.

Along the lines with Susan Smith, I don't think it was a racial issue. I believe it was just a crazy woman doing something unimagineable. She had to think of a description of someone that didn't look like any of the people in Union because everyone knows everyone in Union.

With OJ Simpson, I believe he was the one that planned the whole entire crime and hired someone to commit the murder. He has bad knees from his football career. Granted, he's strong enough to beat someone up, but the way the prosecution described the crime scene, I don't believe he could have ran fast enough or been nimble enough to climb anything to get out of sight.

I don't identify anyone by their race. I don't know many people that do identify someone by his or her race, and I know a lot of people. I also live in the Southeast, which still has the stigma of having racial issues. Granted, there are areas in the Southeast that are racially-charged areas. Every geographic area of the United States has somewhere that has groups of races which don't get along or they have some kind of preconceived notion about another's race or gender. Other races have precconceived notion about white people, and so on and so on.

I identify someone by their character and personality and intelligence. I don't care what gender, race, religion, or sexual orientation you are. If you have the qualities I seek in a friend, then, so be it . . . let's be friends and go on with our lives. I may be one of the few people that have that attitude. I just see people as people. If I were hiring someone, I am not going to hire you because of your gender or race. I will hire you because you have the qualities and qualifications for the position and the company.

I'm sincerely sorry to have offended you. I was seeing red after the thread about the Congressman, and that was the first phrase I thought to use. Obviously, I should have thought a little harder.

I think it's a disgrace that ANY politician uses his or her power to save his or her things, and hangs the rest of the population out to dry. I think that Susan Smith is a waste of DNA, and photos of the lake where she drowned her children should be in her cell, not photos of her precious children. She needed a scapegoat, and chose the one which would rile the locals the most. And as for OJ, I feel that he's cupable to some extent (if not completely), but I also think that Nicole's family used his connections to the max.

I place nurses aides in peoples' homes. If I had a dime for every time I've heard, "I'm not a racist, but my mother..." I could retire tomorrow. I've heard things that have so appalled me, I've called the authorities.

Yet, I love how some of these same people just love Oprah, Montel, and the athlete of the moment! It's really time that the hypocrisy ends.

Oh, I apologize. I wasn't referring specifically to you. I just took the opportunity to speak on something that has bothered me for some time.

the only way a white person could possibly understand the racial dynamics and truly know what it is to walk in a person of color's shoes is to travel to a country where

a. they are the severe minority
b. the racial climate is similar to america

and this is what I am talking about. This sort of strange hypocrisy. It shows how people who are racist on the not-so-overt level but who effect people everyday and don't even see it! Meanwhile, when a person talks about how they feel about things like this, they're told in so many words that they're overreacting or somehow making these things up. Its just a matter of people not being able to relate to the plight or feelings of others and that fact being the cause of the dismissive attitudes.

I think also since so many people identify actions based on race, they are quick to defend their own. If a black person does something, there are going to be dumb hicks who are like 'silly black people,' and so suddenly, if your a black person, your a murderer, cause one other black person is, so its kind of second nature to hope for their innocence for your own sake.

well, I say silly niave hicks!

I don't think the murder was racial, but the fact that she implicated that a black man abducted her kids and that awful stereotypical description that she gave was. But the main point in that case - which America rightly did not overshadow with the racial point - was that she murdered her kids...(as a mother of 3 - one being an infant - I still get very emotional about this).
I can't believe you drove down the road. I would've gotten ill.

And I think you're right about OJ.

I spent most of my childhood in a verrrrry small town in SC (big culture shock after leaving NY)with one stoplight. When I was a teen, I remember loosing a ring during a play and going to the customer service booth for help (Charleston). I was talking my head off and the man behind the glass looked right through me as if I wasn't there. We call it "the stare" (the philosophy that 'you are nothing - therefore I see nothing') and growing up - were used to it. And this was in 1989. In 1991 or 1992, my husband - then boyfriend - went there with our college choir. At the hotel, my hubby was trying to get assistance in finding our rooms. The person (I think he was the janitor, but I can't remember - 3 kids'll do that to you) looked right thru him as if he wasn't there and refused to respond. Being from Brooklyn, he thought the guy didn't hear him and kept pressing the issue. I had to explain to him what the "stare" was.

Things must've changed alot in the past 10+ yrs in SC, but I doubt it. I applaud you, however on not being that way.

I agree with whomever said it's all about prior experience. Of course I don't understand why minorities can be quicker to point out a racial issue than I (as a white, middle-class, Southern girl whose family is about as white bread as it gets) would--but that's because I haven't had the experiences that they've had. I think in some areas, like the one where I'm from, people are moving away from all-out discrimination to just pretending that race issues/differences/whatever don't exist...which is probably just as bad, in a way.

it is, because it marginalizes the experience

Yes, the small towns in South Carolina do have a problem with racial attitudes. It's almost like they've never seen someone from another race. The town my parents live in has a chapter of the KKK in it, and everyone that grew up there seems to know where they meet. They were proud they knew where the KKK met. We didn't because we weren't from there and were appalled (not surprised) at the fact this wretched little town had a KKK chapter there. Plus, we just didn't care where they met. We just wished they'd go away.

I am surprised you had a bad experience in Charleston because it's more racially mixed. But, honestly, I don't find the fact that Susan Smith blamed a black man was racial. I mean she could have drawn from a hat what the person looked like. I just do not like it when people draw the race card whenever it's convenient. Granted, I am caucasion and believe like you should treat everyone like you want to be treated. I also realize not everyone believes that. It's just like I believe those people with higher financial status and those with higher authority bear a greater burden to society due to their fortunate gain in finances and power. There are those who do not believe that either.

I am not here to trivialize racism because I admit it does exist within areas all over this nation. It happens in New York between people just like it happens in South Carolina. What do you think gangs do? Most gangs consist of a majority of one race or another, and they gang up on rival gangs with a different ethnicity. It's just like all Southerners don't walk around barefoot and pregnant, while eating chitlins and dirt, then, turning around to check on the moonshine brewing. The northeast and other parts of the country are not necessarily any more socially advanced than the southeast. Southerners are branching out and infiltrating other parts of the country and vice versa.

We all experience things differently, and I will admit I just don't understand why we can't all treat each other with respect, no matter the race, religion, or gender. I will also admit I don't understand what it's like to be another race because I will be white until the day I die. I am proud of my race but I don't think I am any better than a black person, asian, etc. All we can do is listen to one another and accept each other as a person not certain race, gender, religion person. Yes, I am one of those d*mn liberals. :p

slight hijack: They used to have marches down the center of the town where I grew up. The only grocery store there was owned by one of it's most vocal members.

end slight hijack

Tickled Pink,

When my parents first moved to where they live now, the KKK had a march about a month after they moved up there. I was like dear God! I was a naive 18 year old and a freshman in college. I didn't realize the KKK even still existed because I thought they broke up way back when. Guess they're still alive in podunk towns. I about had a wreck because I saw some of them standing in the First Baptist Church's parking lot taking off their costumes.

end my highjack! :)

I'm glad you posted this.

Thanks, DSTCHAOS

In a way I almost wish that the KKK was active up here... it'd be so handy with the guys in deserving of a severe shit-kicking openly identifying themselves with costumes ;) A visual identifier of blinding ignorance is so much easier than waiting for some tool to spout his stupidity...

Deleted because we got the situation settled! :)

^^^^^
What happened? Did I read something wrong??? I thought he was calling the KKK guys stupid, saying that it would be easier to identify them with the sheets than to wait for them to say something stupid. Did I miss something?? :confused:

And here I was about to post a X days and counting that a thread about race did not go up in flames.

ZTAwgirl - I don't think you offended anyone....

????????:(

Guess you didn't understand the post... ztawinthropgirl I was pretty much saying what Tickled Pink 2 read into the post.

Basically I was lamenting the fact that the raging racists are more covert up here, and that the silly white sheets would be ever so handy in idenitfying those who deserve the hockey stick to the groin.

No...that's how I read it, too. :confused:

LOL. You misunderstood, but that happens sometimes on message boards. :)

Yep. :) The "good ol boys" are as active but less visible in a more traditional sense.

This was just another case of message board misinterpretation. No harm and no foul.

Sorry! I misread! I apologize! My bad! I agree the KKK people are stupid!

'Overpromotion'
Here's a fascinating story originally from England's Daily Mail:

A black police bodyguard who protected the Duchess of Cornwall has won $70,000 [Australian, or around US$53,000] compensation after suing Scotland Yard for "over-promoting" him because of political correctness.

Sgt Leslie Turner--the first black personal protection officer to guard the royal family--will receive the "racial discrimination" payout after reaching an out-of-court settlement with London's Metropolitan Police.

His representatives argued he landed the prestigious job as Camilla's bodyguard only because he was black.

It was claimed that as a result of being over-promoted and not receiving proper training and support, Sgt Turner made mistakes which led to him being re-assigned.

This suggests a tantalizing line of legal attack for opponents of "affirmative action" in American higher education. The U.S. Supreme Court has ruled that, at least for the next 22_1/2 years, "diversity" is a "compelling" enough reason to justify discriminating at the margins against people of pallor. But what if a black student were to sue, claiming he had been admitted to, say, Harvard and done badly there because he was not held to the same high standard as other students?

"Used with permission from OpinionJournal.com, a web site from Dow Jones & Company, Inc."

I dont see where there is a huge racial seperation in South Carolina. I have lived my entire life outside of Charleston and some of my best and oldest friends are black. Maybe it is because the high school I went to had a majority of black students. I have friends who are "semi-racists" not because they were taught growing up to hate black people or whatever just because of their own personal experiences with people of that race (long complicated story that involved the death of a friend)...I have noticed a bigger racial seperation in people that I know from other states.

To even get into Harvard one has to pass the same tests as anyone else, race is a factor that may be taken into consideration. Now, if the student fails how can he blame Harvard for not preparing him for the standard of his own education let alone use his race as the determining factor. He has to pass or fail on his own merit, the standard is there, he has to apply himself and open a book!

starang....you are telling the absolute truth
 

I think for the most part, many of the posters on GC are fairminded individuals (maybe because of the diversity of the student body at college). The ones with the serious issues wont post or participate in an honest discussion on race. They will sit back in the cut, with hate in their hearts, never saying a word. As far as I am concerned, they are the most lethal.

But to respond to what Starang said....that is the absolute positive truth. I was in the military for a while and did a one year tour in Korea. As a black woman, I was absolutely amazed at the response of the Caucasion(sp) soldiers to racism against them. The store keepers would sometimes refuse to sell to soldiers or would overcharge along with hostile stares a general rudeness. They were really offended and confused as to why the South Koreans were so hostile to them (they were hostile to all soldiers. Many of the Koreans in our specific area had never come in contact or seen non Koreans). Ironically, these same soldiers could be seen walking through the countryside yelling "WHY DON'T YOU ALL SPEAK ENGLISH":confused: . We would get briefings on how to interact with the Nationals and the soldiers would be emotional (almost teary eyed) recounting altercations with the nationals. Anywway, when I can back stateside, the most down, coolest Caucasion people I would run into had done a tour in Korea. I even had a section Sergeant who stepped in on a racial issue (He cut the fool on my behalf....I loved him to death).

BTW.....I always believe that OJ did it, Micheal Jackson did it, R Kelly did it. I dont believe in upholding wrong because of race.

Racism is still an issue here in the US. We still really refuse to deal with it.

Back to the original post on this thread talking about OJ Simpson. I don't think that it's a race issue on how he got off the hook, it's a fame issue. Same as Robert Blake...He had a hitman kill his wife. I love it how those two were found "innocent" during the state criminal trials yet were found guilty during the civil trials. It just shows that if you have the money you can do whatever you want.

exactly a famous person is probably a 100 times more likely to get away with a crime (or get a easier sentence) than a normal person (although I am sure Ray Carruth would disagree with me)

Re: starang....you are telling the absolute truth
 

America is still very racially segregated. That applies to our colleges, places of worship, workplaces and families.

The importance of "racial" diversity has been replaced with cultural, regional, social class and religious diversity. People overwhelmingly live in bubbles and surround themselves with like minded and similarly situated others.

Like you said racism (and discrimination) is still an issue in the U.S. People refuse to deal with it because racism has a different manifestation than in years past and people have been throwing THE R WORD around carelessly. When you even have racial and ethnic minorities denying that racism exists, or saying that they have never experienced racism and wish everyone would get over it, why wouldn't nonminorities also question its validity? This stuff IS rocket science sometimes and not everyone is concious and observant of their social world.

The race issue with Simpson has more to do with the public's reaction to his arrest and trial:

1) The "black man-white woman dynamic"
2) The "his not guilty verdict is payback for years of injustice"

and, my favorite

3) The whites who were falling over themselves and outraged when he was acquitted.

Contrary to popular opinion, most blacks didn't view Simpson as a hero nor did they really think he was innocent. Just like how many blacks supported Rodney King's ignorant ass because of their general distaste for the police brutality of blacks and Hispanics.

You're right, there is racial separation everywhere. "Huge" is a subjective and unnecessary descriptive/distinction when talking about race issues.

Some of your best and oldest friends being black has really nothing to do with whether or not there's a huge racial separation in S.C.

Teena,

I "complained" that Hong Kongers were "hostile" to me, even though I look just like them. Things just are "different" in Asia. For example, waitstaff would stand by your table, almost glaring at you while you're paying for your dinner. They seemed so impatient to me. At least the service charge is included...This only happens even at some of the higher end restaurants. Privacy isn't something more traditional Asians believe in...:(

LOL. Exactly.

IS anyone else getting fed up with The Race Card being thrown out everytime someone is not elected or accepted?

In todays Local News Paper, the Race Card was thrown because a African-American was not selected to the Head of The County Court.

If a race of people do not wanted to be deemed as such then dont make a reason for being judged as such.:(

It does get tiresome.

Hell, I am a Minority anymore not the Great White Hope as some so profess.:rolleyes:

White Male.
Over 35.
Divorced.
Working.
Not on Welfare.
No Kids.
Drive a sensible auto.
Dont live above My means.

I dont have a vision card and try to use it at an ATM when it is not supposed to for that purpose.:mad: