Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince Discussion
 

So I thought it would be wise to start a thread so people who have finished the book could discuss. I have every intention of being done by tomorrow, so I'll join y'all the. :)


Discuss

I haven't finished the book yet

I am going to love this book and hate it at the same time.


and my :( still stands because I read pg. 606 (well scimmed it). But yea, I this will be a love/hate relationship.

I am ready to get on a plane to the UK and have some choice words with JK Rowling.....

Well, I got the book at 2am this morning and finished it by 5:15am. All I can say is: wow.

(Don't read on unless you don't care that I'm going to discuss the book-- this IS a thread for people who have finished it, after all).



I was really really bummed that Dumbledore died. I thought that he added so much magic to Hogwarts:( But seriously, what was it that Dumbledore saw in Snape? You can tell throughout the books (up through book 5) that if Snape isn't evil and on Voldemort's side, he seems like a fishy character and doesn't have good intentions. Why did Dumbledore keep him on the staff, and why did he give him the defense against the dark arts post? (I think I need to reread the book, perhaps it mentions reasoning for that).

All in all, I thought this one was pretty good. My favorite is still "Prisoner of Azkaban", but this one is up there on the list.

So here's my thoughts...

I think R.A.B. is Regulus Black.

As much as I loathe Snape, I still think he's a "good guy," so to speak. I know he killed Dumbledore, but I think there was a reason. Dumbledore begging Snape not to kill him seems incredibly out of character...maybe he was begging Snape TO kill him, for reasons unbeknownst to us. I know there has to be a reason why Dumbledore trusted Snape.

I also think Harry himself is one of the Horcruxes.

I thought the book was absolutely genius, but I know a lot of people won't like it at all.

I think that Snape killed DD b/c of the Unbreakable Vow he made to Narcissa. However, this does not redeem this bastard in my eyes.
I'm pretty pissy right now over the book though.

I did love the explanation of Horcruxes. That explains why Voldemort can't die...yet.

Too much teenage love drama for my taste but what can you do? They are of that age.

I agree with you 100% ADqtPI! I also think that Kreacher has the real locket. In OotP in the "Noble House of Black" chapter when they are cleaning out the house Harry mentions a big locket that they can't open.

I'm inclined to believe that Harry's scar is a Horcrux, because of the "only a true Gryffindor" comment from Chamber of Secrets as well as Dumbledore wondering what object of Gryffindor's that Voldemort could possible have placed the Horcrux in.

I will say that I have been hoodwinked by JKR before - she may want us to believe that. It's a little perplexing though because it seems to imply that Harry has to kill Voldemort last and if that's the case - he'd have to try to destroy himself to get rid of that last Horcrux prior to that.

There's still something very important about Harry's eyes that still has yet to be explained, she usually doesn't reinforce something for no reason and it has been mentioned in every book.

http://www.livejournal.com/users/blu...apo/97618.html

My thoughts on lj..


MY SHIP IS CANON!!! REMUS/TONKS IS CANON!!

I don't know if I agree that Harry is the Horcrux. The book mentioned that Voldemort was using the murder of Harry to create a horcrux. I guess we'll see!

I'm DEFINITELY going to reread the books - and especially 5! DD's death threw me for a loop - even more than Sirius'. I did like how the revelation of Snape as the Half-blood Prince was sort of an after thought. The title - and even then chapter titles make it seem like this person plays a major role (as the half-blood prince) in the book - which I guess he does, but not in the way he could have! I think this book was more of a revelation of WHY Voldemort is how - and to understand your enemy can help you defeat him. I think Harry grew rather a lot in this book with regards to general growing up (versus the angst and impetuousness of Book 5).

The lovey stuff was a bit much, though!

Sarah

I'm still undecided as what to think about Snape.

I'm wondering if JK didn't mean the therm "Half-Blood Prince" to stand for both Snape and Voldemort. Literally for Snape and figureatively for Voldemort -- we learn so much more about the back story of Voldemort in this book and how and why he became Lord Voldemort.

I think very little of book 7 will take place at Hogwarts -- at leat not in the terms of the day-to-day life of the students as it has the other 6 books.

I am not surprised by anything that happened in this book at all. We knew that Dumbledore was going to die because Harry has to face Voldy on his own as an equal.


As for the Half Blood Prince. I think it was meant to be the play on words that she made it out to be. I need to find the interview but she said that Snape was not a good man and he needed to stop being thought of as such.I think this book was really about Snape not being a nice man.

I also think,and this is strictly my opinion,that Peter Pettigrew will kill Snape. He owes Harry one since Harry spared his life and that is the least he can do for him. The Peter/Snape pairing at the beginning is what makes me think that. She is very deliberate in her pairings of people.

:( I was really sad about Dumbledore until I read the part about how at his funeral, Harry saw a phoenix rising from the flames around Dumbledore's body, singing joyously as it sped to the sky. That seemed so Christian, so Narnian. :)

Also, since Draco was so hesitant about killing Dumbledore, I'm hoping he'll convert to the good guy side.

I also hope that a good deal of Book 7 will take place at Hogwarts, even though Harry claimed he wouldn't be back.

For some reason, I was kinda hoping that Fawkes would become Harry's pet but I guess since he has Hedwig...*shrugs*

Doesn't mean he won't come back for the big finale!

Question for those with deeper minds than mine-- in the first chapter Fudge is explaing to the PM that the Dark Ones are responsible for all the awful things happening around London. Could this be JKR's way of trying to explain Al Quida to children?

DaffyKD

I CRIED LIKE AN UGLY LITTLE GIRL FROM CHAPTER 27 ONWARD.

I mean, we knew it was coming (or at least I did) -- he had to die before Harry took on Voldemort or there would be no convenient excuse for Harry to do it alone. But OMG, the emotional manipulation here! She's going to have to do a lot to make the seventh book not pale in comparison (drama/emotion-wise) to the sixth.

Is Harry really not going back to Hogwarts next year? He has to be! It's not a real Harry Potter book without Hogwarts.

I agree that R.A.B. is definitely a Black, and probably Regulus.

You know that Ginny and Harry will be together eventually, and Ron and Hermione, so I'm not really that worried that they weren't together at the end of the book.

Mel, I absolutely agree that there is more to the Snape story. The thing is that I hate the guy and I really wish he would turn out to be bad -- but I just don't think he is. That's too simple. Imperius curse maybe?

fire1977, good spot with the locket in the Black house.

The Harry as Horcrux theory is definitely an interesting one, but I don't know if I buy it yet.

I was hitting myself on the head when it was revealed that Snape was the Half-Blood Prince -- how I did not see that earlier, I have no clue.

DaffyKD -- I have always felt there were much stronger Nazi/Death Eater parallels than al-Quaida/Death Eater parallels in the books, but I suppose the fact that it's allegorical means that you could interpret it either way.

On the whole, definitely better than Book Five. I think Goblet of Fire and Chamber of Secrets are still my favorites, but this one was definitely a good read.

Was up half the night reading it, and finished it also.

I was not prepared either for the Snape situation.

I thought the romances were a little much..but good teenage stuff.

The Horcruxes..wow...what do you guys think would be some of teh other Horcruxes? Remember, Dumbledore said that something from each house...and two of them are accounted for.

Any thoughts on McGonagall as headmistress, now?

I don't see them closing Hogwarts...i could see it as a place of refuge now?

Ooooh, another idea. Was there any point to the scene where Mundungus Fletcher steals stuff from the Black house? Maybe he unintentionally stole the locket? I doubt she'd just put that scene in for shits and giggles.

Brilliant.

I almost have to stop reading this thread; you guys are going to decode Book 7 for me before it's even written. ;)

She said here that some readers have gotten very close to some parts of the ending. She also said thge next book is two years away,which I don't think is unreasonable.

I agree

Did anyone else think about the resemblance between Harry/Ginny and James/Lily? Everyone says Harry looks like James and both Ginny and Lily are redheads. Just a thought I suddenly had towards the end.

Gonna suck to have to wait for #7.

The was a lot of relationship stuff in this one. BUT, Dumbledore did tell Harry that the ability to love gives him a power Voldemort doesn't have. So the relationships are really quite important.

I was never one to root for Harry and Ginny, but this book made me want to see them together so much! I agree that the whole relationship stuff was thick and teenage in this one, but I found myself getting excited to find out how they were going to get together, as well as the whole Ron/Hermione relationship. It does seem obvious that they will end up in those pairs, and I hope it does.

I had not thought of R.A.B. as being a Black, but I do think it's a good theory. I also looked back through the book looking for the first names of Borgin and Burkes, but could only find one of them in my quick skimming. Didn't Hermione see that locket in their store in Knockturn Alley? Hmm, I tihnk I will need to read it again soon to pick up on the little details.

I found it interesting to find out after so many books that the DADA position really IS cursed- since that has been casually mentioned by the students in almost every book. Very cool.

I was definately very sad by Dumbledore's death- it's so hard to imagine an HP book without his guidance to the younger characters. But, I think that Harry will somehow still benefit from his guidance, even without him there.

I thought I had read somewhere that we will be learning more about Lily and James' backgrounds, but maybe I was wrong. Hopefully we will in book 7. I agree that the whole eye thing might have significance.

Goodness I want book 7 NOW!!!!! Hahaha.:)

I wasn't thrilled with this book for a few reasons:

- 1. I saw friggen spoilers on LJ by accident (people had them as buddy icons) and went into the book "knowing" that snape was the hbp, dumbledore would die, and snape would be the one to kill him. pretty much ruined the book for me - no surprise really :(

- 2. Dumbledore was by far my fav character. However, there was something in book 2 about him never truly leaving Hogwarts as long as there is someone there who believes/supports him (something like that) Hopefully he'll make some sort of appearance in some way or another in book 7


my prediction for the end?

Harry will beat Voldemort (no surprise there) and the Death-Eaters and thereby eliminate the need for Aurors... so instead, Harry will take over as the Defense Against the Dark Arts teacher at Hogwarts. He's proven himself as a teacher and he has the ultimate experience. I think it'd be a nice ending :)

I also thought we would be hearing more about the backgrounds of James and Lily. Overall, I thought this was much deeper and darker than the others...and I was very glad to have so much explained!!

I guess it figures that Dumbledore would die ... Harry does have to do stuff on his own. But, really, why does everyone who cares for him die? I just thought it was a little much to kill off Sirius in OotP and then, just as he's getting really close to DD, kill him off too.

Also, I feel like the good side (order of the phoenix and such) is really losing at this point. One thing that really stuck out to me ---Harry did not fight Voldemort at all in this book. While we learned a ton about V., we still never saw him. And, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that this is the first book where we don't meet/see/overhear Voldemort!

Anyway, I can't wait for the 7th (and, tear, last) one! 2 years is WAYYYY too long!

I just finished…

I figured that they would kill off DD, but not until bk 7. I thought that JKR would have him around to impart more knowledge unto Harry. Or at least kill DD off right as Harry has to face Voldomort giving him the extra determination to win.

I totally believe this theory. I always thought that DD explination of Harry’s link to Voldomort (in bk 1 or 2) to be pretty weak. I like the idea much better that Harry has part of V’s soul in him. This would explain the Parsletounge, and the dreams, slipping into V’s subconscious, similarities to Tom Riddle (determination, skill, ect.), and Harry’s ability to sense V through the scar. The scar could be V’s entranceway to the Horcux.

This is an interesting theory too. I like the fact that Harry inherited all of the Black possessions. If the locket is somewhere in the household, or at least was at some point before someone stole it (Mundungus or Kreecher), then it would rightfully belong to Harry. This could help him get it back to destroy the soul inside.

It’s weird, but I kind of want Draco to turn good in bk 7. He did show remorse in the bathroom with Moaning Myrtle (crying, ect) and he said that his family was being threatened. Maybe Draco felt influenced to follow his father’s footsteps as a Death Eater. Was his mother actually a DE branded with the mark or is she just a loyal follower? She did not want her son to take on his task; she wanted him safe. That shows that Draco knows what it is like to be loved, right? Possible way to turn him good?

I’m a closet romantic, and was really happy when Harry started to feel for Ginny; when they kissed I was sooooo happy for them. I didn’t think she still felt that way for Harry anymore. First crush and all… As for Ron and Hermione, I like the way that they kept trying to get back at one another (reminds me of my youthful days). But, hurry up already and through them together. I think that Ron and Hermione more closely mirror James and Lily than any other characters. Why, I can’t place my finger on it…

That’s all for now… more thoughts to come I’m sure.

Is Voldemort going to kill Draco now? In the beginning of the book Narcissa tells Snape that she thinks that Voldemort only gave Draco the job because he thought Draco would be unable to perform it. Even though Dumbledore is now dead, Draco himself didn't kill him with his wand.

I agree with S&S about the whole Nazi/Death Eater parallel. My friends and I once had a discussion about how the books parallel the Holocaust. Hitler said that in order to be considered Jewish, you needed to have at least one Jewish grandmother, which he did in deed have. Similarly, Voldemort is on a sort of quest to get rid of all the half-bloods, even though he, himself is not of pure blood.

I don't think that Snape is acting under the Imperius Curse. Rowling said somewhere that she wanted this book to shed light on the fact that he isn't a good character. I think he is truly Voldemort's favorite because he is the only Death Eater who isn't of pure blood (just like Voldemort) and he, like Voldemort, is also ashamed of his parentage.

Is it because Ron and James were both pure-bloods and Lily and Hermione were both muggle-born? That's the main parallel that I see.

I also didn't think that Ginny still had feelings for Harry, but there are a couple of comments that she makes before they get together that lead you to believe that she is still interested. Like when she and Hermione get into an arguement about Harry and Ron.

Is it weird that in my head the muggle prime minister looks like Hugh Grant??? I think maybe I've seen "Love Actually" a few too many times. Haha:p

Not just in your head lol.

She saw the necklace that poisoned Katie..........

Gotcha. Thanks for clarifying.

Another theory to add. Don't forget that the sorting hat almost placed harry in slytherin, I still think that's important. Additionally, hasn't it bothered anyone else that Harry was able to open the Chamber of Secrets? JK has hinted that there was more to CoS than meets the eye, and I don't think it's just the Horcrux. However, I can't quite figure out why Harry wouldn't have been able to control the basilisk.

I should add that I don't think Snape will have ANY sort of character redemption by the end of the book, but I could believe that Draco might.

If anyone hasn't read them - I highly suggest reading the Harry Potter guides by, I think it's by "Galadriel Waters". They analyze everything in the books and have some great hints on the text. I didn't realize how in depth JK's text was until I read these. There's a big one for books 1-4 and then a smaller one for OotP. Going on what I've learned from those books - I'd like to know what Professor Trelawney started to say about Harry being a good "Object...." she's always right you just have to decipher what she sees and not listen to her interpretation! ;) And it's held true so far that anytime JKR interrupts a character, that she's covering up an important clue to the story!

I am still typing out my thoughts to HBP, but I did want to add a few things....

Is that the books by wizarding world press? if so, I have them, but I have yet to sit down and read both side by side with the HP books.

Also remember, Dumbledore thought Harry to young to handle everything all at once, so he abbreviated is theories and thoughts.

Along those same lines....Dumbledore did tell Harry that LV did leave a little bit of himself behind in Harry, that is why he's a parseltongue..

I will have to read it again to get more, but I have some pretty strong theories and so far most of my theories about HP have been spot on.

Maybe I'm confusing the movie and the book, but didn't we *not* see/meet/overhear Voldemort in Prisoner of Azkaban? I just tried to do a quick skim, but I can't find anything besides Trelawney's prediction that mentions LV, and then it just relates to Pettigrew.

Yes, I'm an odd one who doesn't mind seeing spoilers before actually reading the book...;) (for me, it builds up the suspense, I guess! :D)

Kids today are so freaking lucky. They actually get to read books that are interesting. I was stuck reading about some geek named Holden Caufield.

The hot female teachers also put out. Back in the day, I used to have to walk 2 miles to get drunk and have sex.

Okay -- continuing on with the "Why did Snape kill Dumbledore?" theory, we discussed this on a different board I post on. Many of them theorized that Dumbledore was silently begging Snape to kill him in that scene. After all, Dumbledore pleading for his life? It makes no sense coming from a guy who has said, "Death is but the next great adventure" and even had that talk with Harry in the cave about how people only fear death because it's the unknown, and that we shouldn't fear it. This also jives well with the fact that Harry calls Snape a coward later, and Snape freaks out: "I am not a coward!" If he had killed Dumbledore -- when he didn't really want to, but knew that he had to -- that would probably explain his reaction there.

Basically, the idea was that Dumbledore spent a lot of time stalling Draco so that Snape could show up, and that the fact that he wanted Snape to kill him was so that Draco wouldn't have to -- to set Draco's redemption in motion.

I'm not sure how I feel about this theory, considering that I figure Book Seven will include a suspenseful Snape/Harry face-off where Harry learns more about the Snape/Dumbledore relationship, and if the above speculation ends up being true, the only proof we will ever have that Snape isn't bad is his own word, which I don't think Harry will accept easily. Still, I think it makes more sense than the idea that Snape is a "bad guy."

Do you think Snape is good or bad? I can't decide.

As much as I dislike him, I think I'd rather have him turn out good - it would make Dumbledore's death not as bad.

These are some theories I've heard:

- Snape doesn't really kill DD, he says avada kedavra but is thinking a different spell that stuns him or something instead. snape is really good at the silent spells, and avada kedavra only works (according to snape) if you really really want to kill that person.

- DD and Snape make eye contact - DD could be telling Snape to kill him silently (they are both .. er.. that L word - legilimus? I can't remember how to spell any of these HP words lol). DD knows he's going to die anyway (from the potion) and if Snape "kills" him, the death-eaters will be convinced that Snape is still on their side (which will keep him as a spy for the order)

technically those 2 can combine into one

- DD died but isn't really gone, bc of that thing in book 2 about him never really leaving hogwarts as long as someone there believes in him/agrees with him/something like that.

- Snape didn't want to kill DD but had to because of the Unbreakable Vow


seriously though, I can't really see DD begging Snape not to kill him. He never seemed scared of death (always said it was just the next step). Hmmm

I disagree. Voldy's intention was to kill Harry.The scar resulted because he couldn't do just that. Remember after the killing curse backfired,he totally lost his physical being.He was basically powerless.I don't think he could have. I think because you have to mean the curses,he put all his hate into it.

Before this book came out,one of the things JK said was that the mirror that Sirius gave Harry was going to play a bigger part in later books. Since it didn't do anything in this book,I guess that means the final book. I think Dumbledore gave that mirror to Sirius. maybe that is DD version of a horcrux.

Okay, here are some of my theories - since I have had a few days to digest the book and start my 2nd read-thru!

1. Dumbledore KNEW he was going to die. I actually think that Snape told him somehow about LV's plans to have Draco kill him. Why else was he SO adament about making sure Harry knew all the stuff about LV and what made LV what he was/is? DD also knew that Harry was ready to face LV on his own because Harry now has the knowledge of HOW to rid the world of LV - and without LV the Death Eaters are really a non-issue. DD also kept telling Harry that Hermione and Ron NEED to know what has been going on - because DD KNEW that he was not going to be there for the support that Harry needed but that Ron and Hermione would be there for him and had the maturity to stick by him when the going got rough (as they have been).

2. I really think that Snape is still a good guy and that he was protecting Draco by killing DD. Snape was hesitant about make the final unbreakable vow with Narcissa but he did. Snape KNEW that when all things came down to it, Draco would not be able to kill DD - basically Draco got in over his head. Draco and Narcissa act tough, but I really don't think they are able to truly act out that toughness when it is at the extreme (killing and innocent in cold-blood).

3. I do not think that Harry (or his scar) is a horcrux. Why would LV continually try to kill Harry if he were? My understanding is that you actually have to MAKE something a horcrux, not just kill someone (though the sybolism of the horcrux is GREAT!). There is also the problem that either LV would have to kill Harry and thus kill his final chance at immortality OR Harry would have to commit suicide (I really do see that as an option in a kid's book) OR Ron or Hermione would have to kill Harry AFTER Harry defeats LV. Harry knows that the last 'piece' he needs to destroy is LV himself - and we know that he will do everything he can.

4. With regards to the locket, the only mention in book 5 is that they found a heavy locket while they were cleaning. Did they throw it out? Did Kreacher take it? Was it still in the room and Mundugus take it? Personally, I think Kreacher has it. By the way, I agree that it was a Black - and possibly on of the reasons Regulus was killed.

I do think this is a rather good book. It answers some questions and leaves others unanswered (James and Lily's history as well as their families'). The next two years will just be time to read through all 6 books and pick up hints left in them all! :)

Sarah

I agree pretty much (or maybe all) with what you're saying here.

I know that Dumbledore was weakened, but couldn't he have EASILY still taken care of a 16-year-old boy who is scared out of his mind?

Dumbledore is very good at the nonverbal spells- it seems to me that he could easily have either summoned his own wand and then used the disarming charm on Draco without speaking. Even in his condition.

I definately think that Dumbledore knew what was going to happen- and I also agree that he was NOT begging Snape to spare his life. Ya'll are all right on on that point as far as I can tell.

I am loving all of the great discussion and ideas that are going on about HBP. I can't wait until JKR starts giving more hints and ideas about book 7!

Yes, but...............

If Dumbeldore's point was for Snape to continue being a spy, there would need to be someone for Snape to report the findings to. Since he has now killed Dumbeldore, most (if not all) of the wizarding world hates him and would like to kill him, so there's no one who is going to believe that he is spying on LV so there's no point. He can "spy" all he wants, but he has no one that will believe him and act on what he sees.

If that makes any sense.............

Voldemort likes "trophies", so the horcruxes are going to be trophies. I wonder if Lily was wearing something the night she was killed. THAT would make a "Gryffindor" horcrux. And quite meaningful to Harry too.