Canada passes Same Sex Marriage Legislation
 

cbc

Same-sex legislation passed
Last Updated Tue, 28 Jun 2005 22:34:21 EDT
CBC News
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The Liberals' controversial same-sex marriage legislation has passed final reading in the House of Commons, sailing through with a vote of 158 for and 133 against.

Supported by most members of the Liberals, the Bloc Quebecois and the NDP, the legislation passed easily, making Canada only the third country in the world, after the Netherlands and Belgium, to officially recognize same-sex unions.

But the passage of Bill C-38, once again, came with a political price tag for the government. Joe Comuzzi, resigned from the cabinet so he could vote against the bill - an open rebuke of the government legislation.

Comuzzi was the minister responsible for Northern Ontario.

Although he was the only cabinet minister to break ranks with Prime Minister Paul Martin over the controversial plan to legalize the marriage of gays and lesbians, it highlighted the divisions within Canada and the within the Liberal party, pitting supporters of equality rights against those who are defending religious freedoms.

For Comuzzi, the decision to resign meant putting principles ahead of the privileges of cabinet. "In 2004, during the election, I promised faithfully to the people of Thunder Bay-Superior North, that I would defend the definition of marriage," he said, explaining his move.

The prime minister said he regretted the decision of a man he called an "old friend," but accepts it because the government must speak with one voice on same-sex marriage.

The "vote is about the Charter of Rights," said Martin. "We're a nation of minorities and in a nation of minorities you don't cherry-pick rights."

The government has moved over the last few months to appease critics both within Liberal ranks and among Canadians at large. Amendments were introduced to ensure no religious group or charitable organization is forced to accept same-sex marriage. But in spite of those amendments some groups remain unconvinced.

Same-sex marriage remains one of the most difficult issues ever to confront Canadian politicians. In large part passage of the bill is the reason the parliamentary session was extended for the first time in 17 years.

But while Tuesday night's vote closes off the debate in the Commons, the Conservatives insist there is no closure for Canadians who believe marriage should continue to be defined as the union of a man and a woman, to the exclusion of all others.

Conservative Leader Stephen Harper says if his party forms the next government, the law will be revisited.

Harper made the promise one day after suggesting the adoption of the law lacked legitimacy because it relied on the support of the separatist Bloc Quebecois. Harper said he believes Bloc MPs are the legitimate representatives of Quebec voters. But he argues most Canadians aren't buying it as a final decision since most federalist MPs are opposed to same-sex marriage.

Harper says a Conservative government would hold a free vote for all MPs on the matter, rather than forcing cabinet ministers to vote with the government.

I'm so happy about this, I can't even begin to express it in words. I'm so proud to call this place my home. :)

I'm really proud of the fact it was passed as a civil rights issue, and I very proud of the fact they took into account religious concerns into the wording of the legislation.

However it should be interesting to see what Klein/Alberta do in the short term... and what Harper will say/do in the long term (there was talk of him annuling the legislation if he become's PM).

And I just hope and pray that that man NEVER becomes PM.

Victory!!!

Certainly a giant step in the right direction.

With this legislation I guess that means that they can shoot episodes of "My Fabulous Gay Wedding" in other places than Toronto - so now Scott Thompson (aka. Buddy) can be unleased on the rest of the country :D

Go Canada! This is a really good thing.

(or some would no doubt say....Blame Canada ;) )....sorry I couldn't resist.

I'm personally going to enjoy looking into the WBC's reaction to this :D Maybe the "reverend" Phelps will be so enraged by it he'll have a stroke or heart-attack (crossing fingers) ;)

What has this country come to?? :(

It looks like it's come to an understanding of the fundamental rights of people, as well as the need to prevent discrimination based upon sexual orientation . . . oh, it's also come to the realization that laws should be passed regardless of religious pressures.

oh, dear canada, what have you come to?!?

Sad, huh?

:confused:

What do you mean - so people of the same sex can now legally get married, and this right is now (will be) protected by the Charter of Rights and Freedoms... and yet no religious group is forced/required to perform the marriages - so essentially it is a civil union that is performed by some churches/temples.

Basically it boils down to a full recognition of the right of homosexuals - rights that technically they are entitled to as per the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. So the rights of homosexuals are to be recognized/upheld, and the rights of religious denomonations are also to be recognized/upheld; I don't see what the issue is...

I don't think places of worship should even consider lessing these unions. I attend a hippie church (will leave soon. I'm considering going fundementalist at the rate this country is) and was almost forced to go to the Pride march this weekend (show up to service on June 26, go as a congregation afterwards...I didn't go to church of course)

Today's society, especially in Canada, is too liberal and is just going to get worse. IF things get any worse, I don't know what I'm going to do.

Cooper, I really dont think I want to marry YOU! Sorry Bro!:rolleyes:

Guess I am just a Basic Person, a place for its thing and a thing for its place.

Ah but that's the thing, places of worship don't have to perform the ceremonies at all - their right to follow/protect their teachings is protected in the legislation. So the freedom of places of worship to refuse to perform the ceremony is protected, just as your right to attend a place of worship that is closer to your beliefs...

But any place that is closer to my beliefs would be criticized by people as being "un-PC" even if we have the right to do that. THat's what I DON"T like about this country. We somehow HAVE to have liberal beliefs in order to be taken seriously. If we don't, we're rednecks or "old country" (depending on how long your family has been here). I used to think I'm very CBC/Banana, but the more I think of it, the more "old country" I'm becoming.

I wish America was as progressive and gave people the freedoms that Canada is giving its citizens. Just because I'm not gay doesn't mean my gay friends shouldn't be allowed to be married because they choose to live their lives differently from me. The world would be a terribly boring place if we were all the same :)

Yay Canada!

What has come about someone who would say such a thing?

That's not true at all, and is complete speculation on your part.

Yes, I have liberal views. I believe that all Canadians, regardless of sex, ethnic background or sexual orientation should be entitled to the same rights and responsibilites as everyone else.

The whole debate on whether religious institutions would be required to performs homosexual marriages should have never been an issue. Religious institutions are not forced to perform heterosexual marriages they do not agree with, why all of a sudden would they be forced to perform homosexual marriages.

The problem with Canada is that the government feels the need to protect us from everything. The sooner they learn to stay out of my beadroom and away from my body, the better. The are spending way to much time on this issue when the should be worrying about the $1 billion + gun registry program that doesn't even work.

You've hit the nail on the head right here. There are some people in the US that think this too (the self appointed "enlightened" LOL). Just continue to be yourself and don't be afraid to be bold in your beliefs. Yeah, some people will have something to say (look at this thread) but that's to be expected. But as I said before, sometimes, you've got to be bold.

Being quiet isn't the same as being "tolerant" nor is it being "intolerable".

I disagree. I tell people that I'm conervative, that I voted Conservative both federally and provincially, I get a bad reaction from them. This has been my experience, both in real life and from Canadians on this board. At school, I hear people criticize conservative people all the time, but if I criticized anyone who was more left wing, I'm considered "backwards". The list goes on.

See I think the beauty of this law "pleases" both sides and everyone has their rights and freedoms that they should have had in the first place and not "granted" to them.

If you choose to have a same-sex marriage, yay for you and if religious institutions choose not to sanctify them, yay for them.

I will not get into a debate on the "perceived" evils (or lack there of) of homosexuality, which I believe is a religious discussion and I really try to avoid those.

This law should make everyone happy, regardless of beliefs

and if you are scared to express your beliefs or what someone is going to say/think of your beliefs, then you have bigger issues than this law.

DO NOT LET THEM SWAY YOU or be ashamed of your beliefs, stand up and declare them from the roof top. This is your core, you need to defend them and say "this is what I believe and you have no right to look down on me for them, just like I have no right to look down you 'cause of your liberal beliefs." Screw 'em and move on

How does someone "force" someone to go to a Pride parade? Did they strap you on the back of a motorcycle driven by a big butch girl in a leather harness?

The thing that gets me about some Conservative denominations is that they try to put out the message that their denomination/church is welcoming to all, that they provide succor and shelter to all, but at the same time, they turn around and champion discrimination. I'll never understand that.

WTF is it to you or anyone else if Betty and Susie or Rico and Amir from down the street want to have legal, civil, and social recognition of their loving relationship? How in the world does a relationship between TWO people threaten any relationship that you or anyone else might have? I'm not being facetious here -- help me to understand. If I told you that my husband and I are polyamorous (which we are not, BTW), what's it to you?

The one good thing that will most likely come out of this legislation is that there will be a creative "brain-drain" from the US. Lots of lesbian and gay Americans will move north and bring their disposable incomes, talents, and skills along with them. When the creatives desert a society, that society is in trouble.

Basically, it would look impolite if one doesn't go. The entire congregation was going to go to the parade together after the service. The church is within walking distance of the parade.

But it's better to look 'impolite' by practicing discrimination? Okay. Gotcha. :confused:

Seriously though - maybe that's why I don't get churches. If that kind of groupthink exists in your congregation - regardless of whether it's liberal or conservative groupthink - I don't blame you one bit for looking for another church.

Actually, this is only partially true. As it stands right now, there's no way for civil servants to opt-out of performing same-sex marriages. Basically, there has to be someone on staff who is willing to perform the ceremony at all times. If you're in a small town and you're the only clerk, you'll have to marry Rico and Amir (or Betty and Susie) even if it goes against your beliefs.

That's one thing that I hope they work out ASAP. Because as much as I champion same-sex marriages, I don't think anyone should be forced to participate in something that goes against their religious beliefs.

(And that includes going to war, but that's a different topic for a different thread...)

OK . . . now I know little of your daily life in Canada, nor do I care, especially at the rate your logic is declining. However, this bit is absolutely insane, and you should consider invoking RC's Greekchat Rule #1.

-RC
--It's also called the Principle of Parsimony.

Yes, there will always be someone who will criticize your choices, but I think what you have done is make a sweeping generalization about Liberals/liberals.

i used to vote Conservtive until they went to far to the right for me. They did not reflect my values or my beliefs so I stopped voting for them. But the way you phrased your comments was as if you and like minded people were the only victims. I know people criticize me for voting Green and I know people criticize me for having what they might consider "backwards". You're not the only person this happens to.

It's pretty much the same for me... I quit the Conservatives after they drifted to the further right - and became the home of religious fundamentalism... but the other parties don't really support my views. So I get criticized for being to conservative on some issues (military, monarchy, education) or too liberal on other issues (health care, foreign policy, privitzation) - the difference is that I try and approach each issue not as how it applies to me or my beliefs, but rather how it applies to the country (and to some extent the rest of the world).

So while from the point of my faith I reject same-sex marriage - as part of my religious beliefs... however I also see the civil rights of homosexuals as vitally important to the fundamental nature of Canadian culture and beliefs (equal rights for all). So I'm very pleased that religious institutions can decide what approach to take to same-sex marriage, while granting the legal rights to homosexuals that us hetreosexuals enjoy. In effect the right for civil unions has been firmly legalized, with the possibilty for some faiths to recognize the unions on their own terms...

As for what effect this legislation will have on Canadian society I can't really predict - no one really can - but in the short term I can't really see it having that much of an impact (at least in the urban centres).. in fact look at the comments about the gay wedding show - it's just like any other wedding show, not really that interesting. As for long term impact it all depends on how divisive the issue becomes during the next couple of elections.

I too am a "casualty" of the PC-Alliance merger. At one point in my life I supported and voted for the Progressive Conservatives, and wish they or a party like them still existed. I am more conservative when it comes to military and the economy, but more liberal in regards to health care, education, etc. But until such a party resurfaces, I feel the Liberals uphold my beliefs and values.

I don't understand how or why gay people are attracted to each other, but that it their peroggative. I live in one of the most gay friendly places on earth and it doesn't affect me in any way, shape or form.

I am getting married in 6 weeks - it takes nothing away from that, that gay people can also marry, heck they've been allowed to marry in BC for a few years now.

Many people mention talk about the sanctity of marriage being ruined if gay people can marry - hello! I think many heterosexuals have already made a mockery of marriage.

Agreed. The idea of a traditional "nuclear family" died out when the divorce rate started going up... and how can we go back to that when we have celebs that can't seem to go thru life without at least two major publicized break-ups.

I figure it doesn't hurt my chance to be married to my future hubby, so why should I worry about if homosexuals are able to claim each other as their power of attorney and share medical benefits?

Well this place is not my home (I just happened to be married to Mr. 1228, who is from here), I have never considered it to be but...I am proud of Canada for taking this step

I am hella happy about this! Folx having sense enough to keep out of consenting adults lives and bedrooms!
However, I am the only one in my immediate family who feels this way (I have a Pentacostal mother in law) :rolleyes:

Hurrah Hurrah for Canada!
 

In 20 to 30 years our children will look back on this debate and see it as silly as when cross-racial or cross-religious marriages were considered strictly taboo. "How silly the government would ban such a thing?", our children will say, and we'll smile for we were alive when it changed.

I actually listened to the final night of debate and the vote on CPAC. My heart filled with pride when the bill passed third reading. What a wonderful country we live in!

Yes, some people say we're getting to liberal, and they are entitled to their views, but I am so looking forward to the day I get to see my GLBT friends marry who they love.

What a beautiful bill. What a beautiful country. Parliament gave us a great gift for Canada's birthday: equality in marriage.

I'm satisfied. I suppose. I kind of don't see the point in marriage at all right now, but hey, if two people can get married it shouldn't matter which two (as long as it's not incest).

Taualumna, I can understand what you're saying. Because the majority right now is liberal-minded, you do have a tough time. I do believe that despite all the "preaching" on tolerance by the left, many liberals forget to be tolerant of the Right. My best friends are conservative and I'm very far-left, but we still manage to get along :) In general, I do have to make a strong effort though when talking about religion since I wish it didn't exist at all. (but I recognize that stems from my personal experience)


Anyway, a couple years out of highschool I ran into a friend, here's the convo:
[walking along downtown, ca. 1998]
"Hi jen"
"Oh, hey, Jay, how's it going?"
"good, just got married this summer"
"oh really? that's great"
"yeah, to him [gestures to guy standing next to him, I didn't know he was gay]"
"oh terrific"
(converstation continued)

So gays have been using the word marriage for plenty of years, even when it wasn't recognized.

yay for canada!!!

But yes, we Liberals often criticize Conservatives for doing what we do often to them.

I could have cited the same conversation between me and a friend in the military... a friend I have seen under fire and someone I respect deeply... the fact that he is gay doesn't matter - the fact that he is a friend, and in love does.

Oh, Canada?;)

Senate Approves Same-Sex Marriage Bill
 

Senate votes 47-21 to approve Liberal government's same-sex bill

(CP) - One of the most raucous debates in Canadian history resulted in a vote late Tuesday that made Canada the fourth country to sanction same-sex marriage. More

Rest of the article is here:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/cpress/20050...enate_same_sex


Anyway, what do you think of the Tory comments that we'll have this debate all over again if they win the next federal election?