Were You Hazed?
 

Have you ever had an experience ON YOUR JOB (past or present) where you have felt like you were being hazed? (Ya'll thought I was going elsewhere with the topic, huh? :p )

Yesterday, I chatted with a colleague. At the end of the year, our department has to go through various steps including the department head must "check us out". So, this colleague decides she's going to do it HER way. So, her records had not been completed by our last day of school. So, at this time, she is at the mercy of the department head. Mind you, if you don't have the chair's signature, you cannot complete your process. So, it's 2 weeks after we are out. This colleague is STILL trying to get her signature from the department chair. There were several days where my colleague came to the school for a set appointment, but it was hours later that the chair would return. LOL (but it's not funny) So, this is an account of someone (IMO) was 'hazed on the job.'

Sidenote: This same colleague "checked out" with the same department chair yesterday. :D

I had a job where going to happy hour wasn't mandatory to keep your job, but it was crucial if you wanted to get the good assignments. When they lost their biggest client those who had been to happy hours got lined up with new jobs at good firms, those who hadn't gone to happy hour had to hunt through the classifieds.

I think most people are probably 'hazed' on the job in some way. Especially if a raise is dependent on esoteric performance, which it should not be, like going to happy hour with your co-workers. It is not mandatory, but it made a difference. I think hazing on the job occurs most often when you start working for a company. 'They' will try to give you difficult clients / assignments or put you through the 'ropes' just to see if you can handle it.

In graduate school--OH do they haze for Ph.D.'s...

I felt like I was on line for 8 years before I got my Ph.D. Then I wondered what all the HAYLE was for afterward. Then I got a sorry printed diploma without it being engraved nor embossed with the scripted fonts or anything... Total BS...

Then for my first post-doctoral experience in Dallas, Texas, if you failed to participate in the "journal club" in our field, you were ostracized by both the faculty and the other post-docs... Needless to say, I fully participated in "journal club".

I saw this post and I had to respond. I had to echo what AKA_Monet said about grad school. I am in the first year of getting my PhD and although I do not pay monetarily for it, the form of currency is with my blood, sweat and tears...literally. Faculty members believe that your nose should be to the grindstone. You should not be sleeping or eating...you should be living your research project. And if you're not, you get no attention. I'll be doing this for the next 5 years or so, so this craziness will be my life.

YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! I would have to agree. When I was working towrds my Masters and PhD I would say I was academically hazed. So. True. Some in grad school were hazed, some were not...go figure. For example, the 'big' presentation in my department when working towrds my PhD was to present your research during summer seminar. It was mandatory for some students, but not all. It was so obvious what was going on.

I think grad school hazing has more to do with trying to weed some people out. Here again, it sometimes has to do with esoteric issues.

Ahhh, I know your struggle. What you are saying is true. Faculty members do feel that way. My best advice is to keep a life outside grad school. As time goes on as you are getting more involved in your project, it will become very important to maintain balance in your life. Do what makes your happy.

Here are a few things I did:

1. I always tried to make sure to not work more that 10 hours a day in the lab. I learned this the hard way....

2. Also, if you can do it, try not to work 7 - 8 days straight without a break.

3. Stay involved in your community through church, your sorority or volunteer efforts. Maintaining contact with people outside grad school will help keep you grounded.

4. Take time to exercise. It sounds simple and obvious, but it needs to be done. I started yoga in grad school and I'm glad I did. Yoga helped to relieve so much stress.

5. Keep your hobbies, or start one. I started needlepointing and knitting. The repetative motion of stiching was calming.

6. Enjoy your project. It is yours. No one else will know more than you will about your project. You will become the expert on your topic and people will come to you.

I am hazed *daily*. I am an associate at a lawfirm so basically, the partners haze the associates. You're d*mned if you do x one way b/c partner y will think that it is all wrong, even though partner z loves it...and it's all your fault all the time. You can not be right basically. LOL, yes, it's a haze. If you want to become a partner one day, you accept the hazing (or try to avoid the more premiere hazers). It is a very hierarchical system. I have been saying that this is basically one very long haze and that associates are basically on line.

When I was getting my M.S., doing my thesis research, etc., I didn't feel like I was being hazed. Maybe it was my supernice research advisor. Now lawschool...well, that was another story. It wasn't terribly hard (unlike my M.S. program) it was just basically who would stay up all night long to get everything done. First year of lawschool was a loooooong haze.

I agree with Sigmadiva that it is important to keep a balanced life. It really helps to put things into perspective. Spend time with friends, family, exercise helps to reduce stress also. I even took a yoga class while in lawschool. That really helped.

At the end of the day, we just have to remember to keep in mind what our limits are and not let others impose their limits on us to the point that we are terribly unhappy b/c we are doing waaay more and going waaaaay past our own personal limits. I have learned that at the end of the day, if we fall out in the lab, classroom or office dead, they will basically push us out of our seats and fill it with another body before we even get cold so try not to stress so much and keep it all in perspective. I know personally that it's easier said than done when you're going through it.

SC

I was working in a homeless shelter a few years ago where the middle management people were hazed constantly (esp. Christians). One instance was when we HAD to donate a percentage of our salary back to the organization. I was paying back student loans, credit card debt, my car note, rent , etc. (and not making much to begin with) so I donated a small percentage. I got harassed by upper mgmnt with veiled threats of reducing my salary if I didn't donate more.

Also, quite a few members of the upper management (and others) would send forwards, chain mail, and all other forms of spam to everyone in the company about everything including controversial topics and gay pride topics. I decided to forward an email about Jesus to everyone. There was nothing in the mail that chastised anyone or was "preachy". It simply mentioned how he has been influential for so many years. After that, one of the gay managers emailed my supervisor about me sending offensive mail because 'not everyone wants to read that'. I went to his office and told him that if he had a complaint, to tell me personally instead of involving others. He said he didn't know me well enough. I said that this wasn't the best way to get to know me. Additionally, I told him that if he didn't want to read it, he could have simply deleted it after reading the subject line-- just like I do to all of the spam they send. I told my supervisor everything I told him just in case she got any ideas (she called herself a priestess and was into witchcraft).

At that point, I really didn't care anymore. I was ready to go.

Yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I've been working with this corporation for almost 3 months now and I've already had to let a few folks now.

There have been small instances that have occured that let me know that if I was an old head, I wouldn't have had to deal with it.

One day me and the girl who used to be the "new girl before me"were talking. I was telling her about where I wanted to sit and she told me "Oh nooooo, I want that area and I've been here longer than you so you can take my desk". Heffa Please!! You are not an O.S.!!!! This is the same heffa who asked me "Oh you are going home already *peek at the clock*, what time did you come in?" Ohhhhhhhh my goodness get out of my business, you are on my level. You are notttttt the manager and because of that, that was my response. "You are not P. so why you worried about it?"

"Down with _ _ _ _ _y!!!!!!!!"

Now I am the youngest and the only African-American woman on my team. There is only one other AA and it seems he is feeling that he must "show me the way". Little does he know that I know he has recently been demoted, so all his advice ain't good advice. His attitude is just not right, whatsoever, but I digress. He is always coming around and trying to get me to go meet with our clients. What I didn't know was he was doing this because he doesn't want to go by himself and noone else will go. I got hip to his game because I didn't know that I didn't have to go, so now I tell him I'm busy. Knowing I ain't because I be on GC too doggone much. He recently came over here and told me he was going to pass some of his accounts to me for help, if he ever needed it. Mind you he told me, not asked me. So once again I had to tell him I don't have a problem with that as long as you let me know and I am not busy with my own.

I swear I'm a neo in every since of the word. From Spring 2004 and beyond...............................

I feel hazed everyday when I deal with both my students and the administrators at my school!

i get hazed up all the time.

boss has some wood in his office.

lol, just playing.

but being the youngest engineer...i get hemmed up on my abilities all the time. don't even let me tell you about being 25 and going to a construction site. but i have a backbone, so i actually enjoy conflict with the contractors.

Thanks for the tips soror! I'm first year PhD, and my department must have invented academic hazing! I think most of the students have a drinking problem as a coping mechanism.

wuss...leave the bottle alone, you lush.

Can I please vent?
 

If there is anyone out there that is the legal field, law student, lawyer, I think that may be able to relate to this topic. As a law student, you have to do research on the firms that you are interested before you interview. If you are lucky to be selected for an interview, you then have to be concerned about getting a "call back" interview. At "call back" interview, you are there anywhere between 4-6 hours at a law firm meeting with different attorneys in firm (BTW, these are just for big law firms). This is all for the sole purpose of attys seeing if they can deal with working with someone, letting them handle cases, etc.

Now, if a law student is lucky to be hired for a clerkship, then the clerkship is truly the "pledging" and/or "hazing" period. Some clerks work seven days a week and 12-15 hour days.

And then at the end of the day, after all of this over, you may still not even get the job.

Can I testify?!
 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by AKA_Monet
[B]In graduate school--OH do they haze for Ph.D.'s...

Don't get me started on J.D.'s!!! I wish that I shove the Socratic method up some of these pompous professors' asses!


Oh, and don't get me started on what how of these professors' feel about having blacks in their classrooms (even though there may only be 3 out of 100 in the class!)!

Re: Can I please vent?
 

Unspokenone, I'm sorry. I can't say that I had a bad experience with interviewing. Actually, I was annoyed b/c of the opposite. When I did the callbacks, I was there all of 15 minutes sometimes or met two attys then went to lunch with two others. The interviews were wholly unsubstantive and they wanted to basically just shoot the breeze and see if they liked me as a person. I was like ??? I was annoyed b/c I come from a technical background where the interviews are basically, get up on the dry erase board and show us your genius...or not while we shout questions at you and have you re-derive Green's theorem or show us how you would solve the research problem that we haven't been able to solve for 5 years now. Oddly enough, I got most of the lawfirm offers so I guess that it all worked out. Also, the firms that I went to 1L and 2L summers discouraged us from working on weekends and beyond 5. Heck, we were good if we could get a few assignments done each week for all of the time spent schmoozing and going to summer associate events. It was crazy and I actually got tired of having to go to all of those events. Now *that* was hazing b/c if you didn't go, you probably wouldn't get a job offer. *If* you want to go to a big firm, look for some big firms that are not crazy and don't have exceptionally high billable hour reqs. I would not go anywhere with 2000 or above. To give you an idea, if you take 3 weeks vacation a year and have 10 holidays off that the firm gives (which is the typical number given Memorial Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving, etc.), 1900 billable hours is roughly 8.1 hours *billed (not worked)* per day (a rough estimate can be obtained by subtracting number of weeks in year from number off b/c of vacation, etc. and divide by 5 days in week). Add to the 8.1 hours your lunch time if you take it (b/c lunch is not billable in case you didn't know) and all of the time spent doing things not billable (which will vary by firm but most things done for a client are billable). Now if you want to do ***litigation**** at a big firm, that's another matter and wholly on you. :) Know what you're getting into before you sign up. Understand that you will likely far exceed the minimum each year. Most litigators (at reasonable firms not the crazy firms) that I know bill at least 2000 hours per year and some bill 2100 regularly. Do you like blackberries and being virtually tethered at the hip to work all the time b/c someone will ask for something at the last minute that always has to be submitted to the court TOMORROW. I'm exaggerating a bit but transactional work is much more predictable. However, if you just have to litigate, go for it (or think of litigating in other, albeit less financially appealing arenas like a public office - public defender or attorney general, etc.).

In Chicago, 1950 is the average bill hour req for large lawfirms but at a few (which will remain nameless) it is no holds barred, how high can you go. You can find the *minimum* on www. nalp.org. But you have to ask around about how many attys *actually* work. for some firms, the min is deceiving - beware of firms with no minimum, the number of hours worked is usually not cute.

At any rate, no matter what firm you go to, you will be hazed as a first year and basically as you ascend the ranks, you will have less people above you to haze you but the partners will haze all the same. Heck, some junior partners get hazed. LOL

Don't let it worry you too much.

SC

Re: Can I testify?!
 

Yes the Socratic method can be used to haze. It can be quite comical when it's not you who's being put through it. Are you a 1L? By 2L (and definitely) 3L year we couldn't care less about a prof calling on us...whether we had read or not. We went with the flow. At 2L and 3L level, most don't even bother asking about the facts so as long as you have an understanding generally, you can go with the flow in answering. Heck at my school it probably didn't matter whether you had read the case or not b/c the question never had anything to do with what was in front of you in the book. It was usually pretty abstract and high-level.

ETA: Not encouraging triflingness or the non-pursuit of academic success. Our grades still came out ok. I think that we had just mastered starting with the end in mind...the final is all that matters. Once you realize that, it's over. Heck, I would pull the old finals and old outlines the first day of class sometimes and spend my whole semester reading and/or reviewing with the final in mind (instead of the other way around). But yes, I said all of the time that 1L year was nothing but a haze. Stay strong. :)

SC

[QUOTE]Originally posted by unspokenone25
[B]

Finally..someone who understands...LOL
 

Actually I am going into my third year of law school. Yeah at the beginning of last semester (2L) year, I had gotten past all of the B.S. the professors were trying to pull by intimidating the students. Hell, I rarely read cases anymore (can I say outlines and supplements!!)!

Luckily, the firm that I am clerking with has 1900 billable hours. I am going back and forth between transactional and litigation. Why? I have no idea which speciality I want to go into. I like the research and writing aspect of law and I also like to argue (I'm on moot court). But I just hear so many horror stories from some of my friends working at the big law firms. Yeah there are a lot of social activities but I have also heard of clerks going right back to work right after those events.

Hazing doesn't stop after you join the firm???? Ay que lastimo! Even after as a junior partner?!

Question: Do you feel that black lawyers get more hazed than others or is it an equal opportunity hazing?

Thanks for advice--you are definitely giving me somethings to think about!

Let me testify again!
 

Summer Child: You would think that professors would be past doing the Socratic method to 2Ls but no such thing...my Trust and Wills professor expected us to know the case (facts, black letter law, even dissenting and concurring opinions) and wanted us to STAND UP!!! And do you believe that this b***ard didn't even care about the cases when he gave us the exam?!

Hello all, I'm new to GC and just I couldn't resist this thread.
 

Everything you all have said is so true! Being the new girl at work is not easy, especially if you're the new black girl. People are always testing our endurance.

I'm preparing to go to grad school and law school in the near future, and here I thought I was going through h*** as an undergrad! Shoot! I'm just getting started... :( I guess I better do as my professor says and "bite the bullet!"

Re: Hello all, I'm new to GC and just I couldn't resist this thread.
 

Welcome Kamryn,
There are various levels of "biting the bullet" so I encourage you to evaluate grad schools and lawschools and evaluate the academic side of things as well as other factors that may be a part of your Big Picture life goals in choosing schools. The same applies for work. I say start with determining what your Big Picture life goals are (in next couple of years, 5 years and long-term), prioritize them and *then* choose. You always want to go to a place with a good name if you can (you will not believe how many doors it will open) but at the same time consider other things too. For example, when I chose grad schools, I wanted to be in Cali but I also wanted to go to a good school so I only applied to the really good grad programs in Cali (b/c it was more important for me to have a balanced life than to be in upstate NY somewhere battling the cold ... of course now I do just that in Chicago). When I applied to lawschool, it was important to me that I be able to have a life (at some point) while in lawschool so I knew that I would only apply to good schools that were in major cities or at least in places where I could have a life. I also knew that I was not going to want to have to take 100,000 in lawschool loans alone so I went to a school that offered me a scholarship. It just happened to be a good school too (which was a requirement for me b/c you pretty much work just as hard in *any* grad or lawschool program so you might as well go somewhere that is going to work for *you too* well into the future after graduation). When I chose a firm I knew that I wanted to be able to start a family w/in 5 years or so so I didn't choose a firm that would require me to work late hours and on the weekend b/c I knew that work being my all (which is what it would have been if I would have been working all night long b/c it is virtually impossible to start and cultivate a relationship that way - unless he works all of the time too ... at least that's my opinion) - anyway I would not have been happy. I still make the *same* salary as the folk billing in excess of 2000 hours per year but my billing req is lower and my firm is just as prestigious. So all that is to say that it will be difficult and you have to work hard no matter where you go but figure out what it is that you want out of life and find places (schools/work) that *also* allow you to work toward your *other* non-work goals (if you have any). I write "if you have any" b/c for some, it *is* their short-term and 5 year goal to basically go in, work, work, work and do whatever they think it will take to make partner and forsake other things for awhile ... and that is fine too b/c that is *his/her* plan and what is important for him/her. So it does not have to be as bad and all places are not created equal in all ways.

Good luck!

SC

Re: Let me testify again!
 

Unspokenone25,
Girl, you must be extremely stressed b/c every post has some sort of profane word bleeped out. Relax. Don't let these folk get you all into a whirlwind of frustration.

Yes, professors can be crazy. But I say take it in stride. At least you are one of the last of the lawstudents who can say that you experienced the Socratic method b/c it *is* going away. It was rough on me but I appreciate the novelty of having had the experience now. It is one thing that has made lawschool fairly unique traditionally. Ha! He wanting dissenting and concurring opinions too? Well girl, that just makes your ability to synthesize a case and summarize it in one sentence (which may serve you when you start working if you're doing lit especially) that much more on point. In what area(s) of law do your interests lie? Don't feel pressed to choose btwn xsac and lit. B/c you are right that you don't really know. Try to do both at your firm this summer so that you will be able to say what you'd like to do full-time. Many firms let you do both and encourage it until you are about a third year associate. It depends on your practice area and whether the firm offers both sides of the practice.

I haze the interns. :D :D

Thank you SummerChild for all of your advice.
 

I'm always opened to good advice, especially from those who are where I want to be one day. I'm a first generation college student and there was a lot about college that I didn't know. But with the help of people like you, who were willing to take the time to give good advice, I've found my way through undergrad, and I have faith that I'll find my way through grad school and law school. Thank you.;)

I'm definitely planning on having a balanced life during school and work. I have too many other interests not to. In the future, I also want to have a family and be able to spend "quality" time with them. I don't want work to be all of my life, only a part of it.

I don't understand how billing hours work. I was thinking that it may have something to do with working 40 hours per week, which averages out to be about 1,600 hours per month. Then you mentioned "billing in excess of 2000 hours per year. " Does this mean that in addition to your regular 40 hours per day, some firms require working an extra 2,000 hours of overtime a year?

Relax, Relate, RELEASE
 

Hi SummerChild,

Thank you for the calming words. Yes, very stressed, partially due to the hazing I have incurred this past year and right now with my clerkship. **Taking a deep breath**

I truly appreciate the advice. I truly don't know what practice I want to specialize in. I have learned (from observing some of my fellow law classmates) that sometimes you don't have a choice in the matter of which area you want to practice.

I also concur with what you said to Kamryn. All of that has to be taken into context whether you are in grad school, medical school, or law school. For example, I know that in the next five years, I also want to start a family. I also don't want to work for a firm that will require me to work too late and on a lot of weekends. Luckily the firm that I am clerking for now is a family oriented firm and just as prestigious.

Again, SummerChild thanks for the advice. It is really hard to get advice from another lawyer outsides of the law school setting.

My stupid MS program TRIED to haze...but I thought the work was busy work and not very hard. So, I did whatever I had to do to pass (the school is on pass/fail grading). I was not about to stay up 2 days in a row to basically repeat work I had done in undergrad. Some of my classmates did succumb to the pressure to stay up all the time and give up weekends and vacations.

My biggest piece of advice is to DEVELOP A LIFE OF YOUR OWN. Set aside times where you do not discuss school work, professors, or program politics. Spend time with people who aren't your classmates and who aren't involved in your field whatsoever. If you have to leave town for a few days to maintain your sanity--do it. A few semesters ago, I decided to make the weekends my own. I did all of the work during the week, and I would socialize, sleep, and just veg on the weekends. It provided for very stressful weeks, but it was worth it to have a life on the weekends. I see my classmates--even now, weeks after graduation--who didn't develop a life. I feel sorry for them.

Re: Thank you SummerChild for all of your advice.
 

You're welcome Kamryn.
The billable hour requirement is the total *minimum* number of hours that you must bill in a year. The quid pro quo is we give you $$ and you bill this number of hours to working on client matters. Forget about the 40 hour work week framework. You can bill your time anyway that you want. You can forgo all vacation and divide 52 weeks in a year by the total number of hours that you are required to bill and that is the number of hours that you must bill in a week. Or, if you plan to take, say 3 weeks vacation a year + 10 or so holidays that the firm is closed and you want to take off, that leaves about 47 weeks in a year so you divide the billable hour req by that. I don't plan to work on weekends so I then divide the weekly req by 5 (not 7) and this is on average the number of hours that I need to bill per day. Here is the ringer: *Billable* time is not hte time that you are at work; it is the actual time that you are working on client matters. Therefore, remove all of the time that you are staring out of the window, on lunch, taking telephone calls (if not regarding a client matter) b/c that time during the day is not billable. Here is an example. If your firm reqs 1900 hours billed per year and you take 3 weeks vacation and 10 holidays (Christmas, etc.) that your firm is not open and that you don't want to work at home or come in anyway, then you have 47 weeks in a year left. Divide 1900 by 47 and then divide by 5 days a week and you get about 8.1 hours that you need to *bill* per day on client matters. That does not include lunch, and all of the other stuff that I just listed above. It does not include the time that you may need to go and talk with your friend down the hall b/c you are tired of thinking and want to just relax for 15 minutes. It does not include time that you need to pay your bills or get on Greekchat. :) If you come in, do your job and are pretty good and going from one thing to the next thing throughout hte entire day (whcih can be pretty mentally challenging for some) then you probably will work 9.5 min per day (if you take about a 30 minute lunch). If you like to wander the halls and shoot the breeze, and get on Greekchat for 15 minutes each hour, then you have to work 10 - 12 hours a day just to get 8.1 pure hours of billable time. You don't have to get it everyday, it's an average and most firms don't care when you get it as long as at the end of the year, you have it. But you don't want to fall to far behind b/c it's hard to make it up b/c mentally, it may be difficult to start working 7 days a week near the end b/c you are so far behind...and the work may not be there at that time (you can't bill time working if you don't have the work).

Does that make sense?

I tell everyone that my advice is to consider why you want to go to lawschool. Can you do the same thing with an M.S. or a Ph.D.? If you get a J.D. and take out loans for the whole thing, do you mind working in a firm environ (which can be a headache)? B/c it's hard to make $400/month student loan payments (which is the approx loan payment for a $100,000 student loan bill - but scholarships are out there - I got three and it does not have to cost that much) working at a non-profit or for the government. Think about what it is that you really want and what you're willing to do for it *after* lawschool. Sometimes a J.D. is not necessary to do what one wants to do but many people get it b/c they see it as prestigious. It's all a trade-off. PM me if you have other questions.

SC

Re: Relax, Relate, RELEASE
 

Unspokenone25,
I'm glad that your firm is family oriented since you want to start a family soon. What is this garbage about not having a choice in the matter of which area in which you practice? That is garbage. YOU shape your career. YOU choose the area in which you want to work. YOU make it happen...and stop talking to those silly people who think that they don't get a choice as to what area of law they practice in. During the summer, you may not have a choice but when you work full-time, you definitely do - or else go to another firm. You career does not shape you; you shape it. And remember to stay marketable. I challenge you to ALWAYS constantly choose assignments that will keep you marketable b/c at the end of the day all you have is your training and the $$. So get both. Try to get some assignments in the areas of law in which you are interested so that you will be able to discuss your work experience in these areas if you choose to interview as a 3L. It will make you that much more marketable. My daddy has always said that education gives you the choice. You never have to be anywhere that you don't want to be when you are educated so STRATEGICALLY grab the good assignments; meet the people in the groups that you think you'd like to work in and network, network, network. Always strategically building your network and your skill set to position yourself for greatness. And align yourself if you can with my sorors who I *know* will be doing exactly the same type of strategic thinking that I challenge you to do ... with Confidence and Class.

Have a good one,
SC

I WISH these so and sos would get ORGANIZED! :rolleyes: :mad:

tabernacle!

*side note: thanks to all the educated Black Women that posted, y'all are a RARITY in the world today*

I do feel as if I am being hazed. My supervisor sees great opportunities for me, so she has taken me under her wing to try to move me up in the company. She is constantly drilling me with information. She later plays mind games with me to see if I know my information. She constantly has me doing things that are outside of my job description such as facilitating classes. She's hit me before as well as other upper management when I did something out of line. She is basically trying to mold me into her perfect employee by any means necessary. There is always constant change in which I have to adapt to faster than others in her eyes. Our rules are being restructured. Mind you, my supervisor wants to be a delta, so I pick with her every chance I get. I told her what's up with all the changes in rules and sayings. Is this delta sigma theta? Are you trying to rewrite the book? All in all, I think it will be worth it in the end. I did get a better raise than most on the team. I'm still a work in progress. This is a long MIP.

I'm a assistant professor and I'm getting hazed again (the first time with the Ph.D. program). I was told that "you have no freedom of speech until you get tenure" by my dissertation advisor. You have to try to stay in everyone's good graces, not let folks piss you off and meeting the requirements of tenure: teaching, research and service. I have to show up to events that bore me to tears so that my dean sees my face :rolleyes:

Like last week I had to sit through a musical of 1940's Broadway show tunes :confused: because the alumni give lots of money at this event and the faculty need to make an appearance. Urggghh!!! My fiance swore he would kill me for making him suffer through that. But those are the types of hazing academics have to deal with if we want to continue working.

I have 5 more years before I go up for tenure and I pray I can keep my mouth shut until then.

PhDiva