Alternative sexuality in Greek life often kept in closet
 

Although she had a number of close friendships with other women in her house, after she came out, Suzanne said she completely cut ties with most of her sorority sisters, fearing her old pals would look back on their friendships with her and misinterpret their closeness.

"A man who comes out as gay in a frat probably hasn't snuggled with his frat brothers," she said. "I feel like it raises different issues for women because of the closeness they're allowed to have in society."

http://thedaily.washington.edu/news....=11641&-search

Several years before I was in sorority, I heard that there was a openly gay sister. I think it was as accepted as possible, I even heard she brought her girlfriend to formals. We didn't have a live in requirement, so there wasn't an issue with undressing etc. I am more inclined to believe that she kept it pretty quiet when she was a collegiate member and was more open about it as an alum.

We've had openly gay sisters, they brought their girlfriends to formal. People who may have been uncomfortabled learned to open their eyes. I'm not saying it wasn't hard on these ladies, but I think the house as a whole grew becuase of it. However, unlike the schools mentioned in the article, we were not huge on mixers so there was less date a fraternity boy pressure.

This is an interesting topic -- and it's definitely true that there are more "out" fraternity men than sorority women. I've never met a lesbian in a sorority, although I know a handful of gay men in fraternities. This isn't really surprising, though, since women tend to come out later than men in general.

I should mention that my college is extremely liberal, so to be honest, that may have played a role in the acceptance of my gay sisters. Sugar and Spice you almost went there, you could probably see what I mean.

Re: Alternative sexuality in Greek life often kept in closet
 

You would think they would have contacted Lambda 10 Project to get a bit more information about this topic to begin with.

Lambda 10 was founded by the brother of a Phi Mu :)

www.lambda10.org/

That's definitely true -- I can easily see sororities at Beloit, Lawrence, or similar schools accepting lesbian sisters. Not so much at Wisconsin. I know plenty of Greeks here who would accept a lesbian sorority women 100 percent, but unfortunately, I also know plenty of them who would not.

I know way too many LGBT Greeks from Lawrence... seems they find their way to Iowa State for grad school.

Out and Greek
 

'Out and Greek'
Shane Windmeyer speaks about the ins and outs of being gay and Greek.

By Iris Sela
Correspondent
February 03, 2005

"We must go deeper than the stereotypes. Gay people come from all walks of life."

This was the marrow of author Shane Windmeyer's lecture on Wednesday, which he delivered to a large crowd of USF students -- many members of sororities and fraternities -- about the importance of being a straight ally to gays and lesbians who are members of sororities and fraternities.

He also presented several facts about the gay community and shattered some commonly held stereotypes.

Windmeyer's presentation included many commonly asked questions about gays and lesbians, including why gays and lesbians join fraternities and sororities.

"It's not to play touch football or to decorate," he joked. "Gays and lesbians join for friendship, camaraderie, brotherhood, sisterhood, leadership and social aspects."

In essence, the same reasons straight people join.

Some of the issues encountered by gays and lesbians in fraternities and sororities have to do with the gender roles many members face, Windmeyer said. Gay men may worry about being beaten up or seen as feminine for not "getting laid" by women, while lesbians may encounter losses in friendship over not fulfilling a feminine image.

Windmeyer interacted with the audience, giving six students a "quiz for straight people" to find out how much they knew about some aspects of the gay community. He called it their GPA-- Gay Point Average. The purpose was to educate the crowd on some symbols of the gay community, including the rainbow, which is a symbol of pride; the upside-down triangle, which was reclaimed after Nazis in WWII tagged gays and lesbians with the symbol in concentration camps; and the Greek symbol Lambda, which symbolizes coming together and creating synergy.

Windmeyer also spoke of the importance of being open and accepting to gays and lesbians that may come out within sororities and fraternities.

"If your best friend was gay, what would you do?" he asked. "This question can make all the difference to somebody who is coming out."

He explained that many gays and lesbians come out of the closet to be honest about who they are, and that many seek support because of difficulty they might have experienced coming out to family and close friends.

He also mentioned the lack of positive gay role models in the community and the tendency for many people to get their information from TV.

Windmeyer spoke of the positive experience he had in coming out to his fraternity, Phi Delta Theta, during his third year in the fraternity.

"What made my fraternity accept me? One word: brotherhood."

"I think this presentation will help students realize that there may be gays in their fraternities," said Scot Wilkinson, a member of Phi Delta Theta's USF chapter. "Hopefully it will make members more comfortable with the issue."

Windmeyer is the founder of the organizations Lambda 10, Stop the Hate and Campus Pride Net, and is the author of three books that deal with coming out in the Greek community. _

Shane's sister is a Phi Mu and they are both really *great* people!

gays/lesbians in greek orgs.
 

these days, is it really a big deal if a sorority/fraternity has a gay member? it is nothing new-when i was in school, there were gay/lesbian members of greek orgs. on campus and i didn't know anyone who thought anything of it. it just "was".

One of My Alum (Now) Brothers is Gay and does a Drag Queen Show.

Did I know He was Gay, no. Would I have cared, NO!

He was one hard workking Brother of the Chapter, that was the only thing that I thought about Him.

I know that there are Gay Brothers of LXA and most other GLOs. But, what is more important, being Gay or an intregal part of the Chapter?

It still may not be accepted by a lot of People it is a fact.

Funny, one of the Most Macho Guys I know on The PD, a Captain of the SWAT Team is Gay but still a hell of a guy!:)

Ah Well, looks can be deceiving. They are People Too!:cool:

I know someone who attended my alma mater a few years before I was there. She was in a sorority, very well-liked by her sisters, very involved, held a bunch of offices including exec board, etc... She was also bi. When she finally came out to her sisters, most of them cut off contact with her.

Discrimination is, sadly, alive and well. :(

Tom--does he do drag in KC?

-wendi

I attend a very conservative school yet lesbians in sororities aren't a big deal at all. Gay guys in fraternities..well...that's a different story.

Now, I've had 2 recent lesbian sisters, they brought their girlfriends to formal and all, loved the sis and the gf no matter what, heh :) We even changed our a page on our website from "Sisters and their Men" to "Sisters to their Significant Others' because we didn't want one of our girls feeling left out. *nods*

it depends on the chapter
 

I think it really depends on the organization and the chapter. I have heard of greek members (not at my school) making comments about being gay, or different in terms of race of religion and I just think it's sad. I think this is one of those topics, as well as another thread on a pregnant pledge, that depends on the views of where you are. If you are from a town that accepts the gay lifestyle compared to a place who thinks it sends people to hell, you are going to get 2 different chapter feelings

I think it is good that there is a gay fraternity for those who wish to join a greek org. and not have to be worried about the feelings and discriminatinos of others.

I have a good friend that I found out was gay and I never would have guessed it in a million years. He is not as outgoing to join a greek org, but for the most part he lives that portion of his life in secret as to not be discriminated against. Sad, sad, sad.

hey guys -- first post

i thought it would be appropriate for me to chime in her cuz i'm gay and i'm also in a fraternity.

this is my whole take on my mere 2 weeks of fraternity life. honestly, I joined a fraternity mainly for the brotherhood -- for a place that could be myelf in a home away from home, and a place where i could feel like 'one of the guys.'

when i was rushing one of the biggest things that was on my mind was 'will these guys accept me if they find out i'm gay?' and i think i chose the right frat from me. my lambda chi chapter is so diverse, not just racially but in the types of guys that are in it. we've definitely got a big contingent of your stereotypical cool fratty dudes but we also have sensitive types, nerds, hippies, liberals, conservatives, moderates, christians, atheists etc. what i loved about it is that despite all these differences everyone has come together in one of the tightest brotherhoods i have seen among the different frats that i rushed. i didn't want to be a part of was a group of guys that all looked the same, and i think i did a good job of finding a place where i definitely feel like i fit in. i feel like i add variety as opposed to feeling like i stand out in a bad way. i also did some looking around to as which frats didn't discrimnate based on sexual orientation in their national bylaws.

some of the other frats talk shit about us, and they won't say it out loud, but i definitely think its because of vast diversity in our chapter and the types of guys we let in. my school as a whole is pretty homogenous, conservative and republican. only thing i have to say to that is, the real world isn't going to be people who are exactly like you, and i would rather learn from someone who is different than me, than get a rude awakening when fraternity life is over.

now i'm not out to my frat yet, because i don't want to get stereotyped before the guys get to know me. however when i do i'm hoping with all my might that my brothers will be mature enough to realize brotherhood doesn't discriminate.

There was one bi and one lesbian girl in my sorority that actually dated each other. Everyone in the chapter and the greek system knew as well. One of my friends is openly gay and was featured in The Advocate. His brothers are very accepting of his openness and even some more brothers have come out. Our system is very open on accepting of everyone no matter what makes them an individual. I just wish the university would accept that notion toward greek life.

My big sis is a lesbian. I love her, and I would never treat her differently because of it. It honestly isn't even something that crosses my mind on a regular basis. I've changed in front of her plenty of times and it doesn't bother me. She knows that I am straight and respects that, just like I respect her. Our entire chapter knows and nobody cares. She definately is not the first we've had, and I'm sure she won't be the last. Our chapter is generally extremely liberal, so that might have something to do with why we are accepting of it.

About half of one of our fraternities on campus is comprised of bisexual or gay men. The other fraternities are not quite as accepting as this one fraternity, but our campus in general does not degrade members of this fraternity because of the sexual orientation of some of the brothers.

The level that homosexual brothers and sisters are accepted probably also depends on the atmosphere on the campus. My campus is a small, liberal arts school with huge theater and music departments. In general, people are pretty liberal on my campus and are open to homosexuals in general.

Bascially... coming from a chapter that had a brother come out (and me being the one he was most concerned about)... it comes down to this: is he a good Brother? regardless of his personal sexual preference, "race", religion, age, creed, background, whatever...

In this case he was a solid Brother so I didn't care one way or the other... what has bothered me (being a Rush Chair) is those who would join the Fraternity as a way to challenge the stereotypical image that they hold... people that define themselves solely by their sexuality, race, colour, creed, or beliefs... before defineing themselves by their actions and character - I have no problem of "going to bat" to defend their character and worth to the Fraternity or Chapter.

I have absolutley no problem whatsoever with a Brother (or girl in a Sorority) that is of sound character... no matter what else may define them...

If a goodlooking lesbian wants to join the fraternity I am sure we can make an exception . . . hot bi-sexual girls are preferred though :p

In some ways which school makes more of a difference than which GLO, but my experience was pretty good. I'm an alumnus of Alpha Phi Omega (co-ed non-housed) and at the chapter at Carnegie-Mellon, one of my two big-brothers was a gay male. He was out of the closet (secretary of the Gay & Lesbian organization on campus the semester before I pledged). My fraternity currently has its second openly gay man on the National board, the first was from California and represented the Pacific Coast, the current one is from Virginia and represents the mid-atlantic.

randy

Randy, just to show you how slow I am (or how not-active) I really had to stop and think "WHO?????" on that second one.

Soooooo slow I am. lol

i know of one gay guy in a fraternity here, but i'm pretty sure a lesbian in a sorority would be seen as something horrible, unfortunately. we might be at a liberal-esque school, but its still a liberal-esque school in the middle of the bible belt. i know that when queer eye re-did the sigma chi house here some of the brothers were very, very against it. i can only think of two fraternities that would be mostly accepting of a gay brother, and i can't really see any of the sororities being welcoming of a gay sister..

I think there are a few gay guys in fraternities at my school -- I can think of a few groups that are more tolerant than others. I know at least 5-6 lesbians that are all in one sorority on campus, and I'm assuming there are a few lesbians/bisexuals in each of them. There is nobody openly gay in my chapter, but I'm sure there are at least some people who are bisexual.

That's OK, I had to think to come up with the first, I remembered he was gay, but didn't remember his name.

And on a broader context, he wasn't just out of the closet, he was *out* of the closet. During the National Convention, his Fraternity CV that was passed around for politicing for votes was on hot pink paper.

Randy

I'm glad we all know gay people. But why is it such a big deal to have a gay member of a glo?

Even having made all of these comments, I wish that it wasn't. :(

Randy

In a word: reputation. We all like to pretend that we're all open minded and liberal (and maybe most of us are), but for every one of us who don't care that a brother/sister is gay/lesbian, there are many more who do care, and will make a point of trying to ruin your chapter's reputation. :(

If you're strong enough to take it, I applaud you. If you're a LGB person in a GLO - and you're out - you deserve a standing ovation.

Why is anything a big deal?

People choose their members. They are free to choose on merit, race, looks, personality, sexual preference, and whatever else they choose.

Anyway, I would have an extreme problem with brothers dating. I guess those in co-ed fraternities don't have issues with that, but if you're all-male or all-female, it's different.

-Rudey

What I'm saying is if a hetrosexual walks into a room, they do not think that everyone in that room wants to get with them. (Well, unless they are delluded) Homosexual people do not go around trying to pick up people they know to be straight. (Again there might be delluded people out there) I realize that people have issues with gays. I have issues with Republicans but I would still give them a bid if the met membership critera.

I guess the world should just be a nicer place. :)

btw: correct me if i'm wrong but the gay fraternity does not allow dating of brothers. i believe most co-eds don't either. I could be wrong though

Technically, Sigma Phi epsilon chapters are not allowed to discriminate based on sexual preference. it is written in our national by-laws.

My chapters have had gay brothers in the past. Our past Alumni Corp. President is gay. Nobody cares one way or another.

So it was OK when you started dating your sisters?

-Rudey

Excuse me?

I know openly gay men in the overwhelming majority of our fraternities here. There are openly gay women in my organization (no actives as of right now, but we have several recent alums), and openly gay actives and alums of most sororities on campus here. The atmosphere on our campus is very LGBT friendly.

There were no openly gay members while I was there, but I have heard stories about members coming out only to the brotherhood during meetings. I think it is good that they felt comfortable doing that.

We don't traditionally have any problem with people being openly gay in our fraternity...however two of the guys rushing are apparently also dating and I find that a bit of an issue

wow, yeah, that's definitely problematic! Let us know what ends up happening, that's an interesting situation

It won't be too big of an issue unless you make it one. In APO, we've had straight pledges date each other for the duration of the process.

The bigger problem will be if a pledge is dating a brother. My APO chapter forbids it.

Just curious as to why that's a different situation?