"Leaking" Information
 

Fellow Greeks,

I've noticed on many websites (including inter/national official sites) that A LOT of information is given out, including the meanings behind colors, organization names, etc.

I'm wondering why there is SO much information out there on some organizations! I can only guess that many very old orgs have so much information that some of it loses its secret identity. What is it really?

Re: "Leaking" Information
 

Some orgs have initiated a quarter of a million people... with that many people, you're bound to have some jerks who "accidentally" tell their BF or GF, or some bitter people who had a bad experience and want to get revenge.

Sad, but true.

And for some, some of that information is not secret at all. To my knowledge, there is no real "secret" meaning behind our jewel. For another group it may be that their colors don't have a secret meaning. Some groups have open mottoes that coordinate with their greek letters that are publicly displayed, but have a second secret motto that is revealed at their initiation. It's just another example of how our organizations are very different from each other.

Sometimes it bothers me that you can find juat about everything about ASA on our website, but I figure that it's all open stuff, so why not? Compared to many soroites, ASA doesn't have a huge amount of secrets...which also can be a benefit because instead of saying "We have two colors, and they have a really cool meaning, but I can't tell you" at recruitment...we get to say "We have four colors, two primary (Crimson, Pearl White), and two secondary (Palm Green, Gold) and here's why...." Plus, our 4 colors are tied to our 4 exemplars, which are tied to our 4 symbols, which are tied to our 4 aims...so I guess if we couldn't talk about our colors, symbols, exemplars or aims, that's alot of stuff eliminated from our recruitment spiel...

As stated in the previous posts, it's up to the individual fraternity or sorority to determine the level of secrecy attached to their meanings and ideals.

In Freemasonry, for example, each individual Grand Lodge has its own interpretation of the ritual of the three degrees. What one Grand Lodge may consider esoteric and only transmitted 'mouth to ear' another Grand Lodge may have it printed word for word in their monitor of ceremonies.

However, many people forget a principal tenet of their fraternal obligations: the business of the chapter and the confidences of a brother or sister should be held as private and inviolate as the meanings behind the organization and means of recognition. Likewise, the sanctity of the ballot box. Who gets elected or who gets blackballed (or cubed) is no one's business but the chapter's.

Re: "Leaking" Information
 

Simply because a lot of that stuff may not be secret for some orgs. The meaning behind colors is not a secret to all fraternities/sororities. I doubt that a GLO would put secret information on a public website, and expect it to remain secret.

If it's on the international website, it's OKAY. They wouldn't put stuff on there that the public isn't allowed to know....

Being realistic, in an organization like Delt which is rapidly closing on its 150th anniversary with 140,000-plus initiated members, the thought that secrets (probably all of them) get out at one time or another shouldn't be a surprize. I suspect that's true of every fraternity and sorority.

It is important to me that I protect our secrets, but if someone else decides, for whatever reason, to publish everything there's simply nothing I can do about it. I wouldn't be happy, but still powerless.

In the final analysis, it's not whether your Ritual, etc. are an absolute secret -- but rather how you feel about it, and how to live up to the meaning and intent. At least that's how I feel about it.

BTW, our colors, flower, open motto and a few other things are not secret. We have a pre-initiation ceremony called The Rite of Iris which is also not secret. Some chapters don't even do it.

Finally, I'm not really interested in other groups secrets. What good does it do me to know them -- except to try to be "one up" on someone else. So what?

ETA there are some groups (I think DU is one of them, who are completely non-secret. That's OK, too.

I was wondering about this lately too.

If you look at some sorority websites -- for example ASA or AEPhi -- you can find out lots of stuff about what their colors/mascot/exemplars/letters mean. Obviously it's open information or it wouldn't be on the website, and perhaps they have both open and closed meanings for a lot of those things, but I've always wondered what makes some groups choose to make certain information open whereas other groups keep the same information closed (if there's any reason besides simply personal choice). If you take a look at AGD's website, for example, you can hardly find any information at all -- mu_agd was trying to look up some information on an open program for me and couldn't find any.

Like S&S said, the meaning behind some of our symbols is posted on our website, but the information that is there is all open. Whether there are also secret meanings - maybe there are, and maybe there aren't. :p However, the letters do have a secret meaning other than what is on the website.

Well said! I agree 100%. :)

The reason that the anchor is our symbol is "open" information and on national's website: it's the ancient symbol of hope.

Some websites, I don't think it's so much that they are "hiding" stuff as that the site is set up in a manner that you can't find it. I mean, on some national sites you can't even find a list of collegiate chapters!!

I think that, from what I've gathered, we are one of the more "low-key" sororities as far as lots and lots of secrets and complicated this and thats - but trust me, we do have some. ;)

Re: "Leaking" Information
 

Do you think it might just be about controlling public perception? People have come up with some pretty wild assumptions about organizations with secrets (for example, the Masons). If they put as much information as they can out in the open, it removes a lot of opportunity for speculation.

Re: Re: "Leaking" Information
 

What I've surmised from all the posts is that this is true in part. It seems that the majority of orgs have "public" info that acts as you suggest, to get some kind of information to the public. But, all the orgs also have the "true" meaning behind symbols that only the initiated know.

I just think it depends from org to org - as DeltAlum said, after a certain amount of time (for us since 1869), there are going to be secrets that slip out. All I or anyone else can do is to NOT be that person.

It's interesting how it can differ from org to org what is esoteric and what isn't. I guess it's just for those of us in XYZ or AB org to understand why.

Good point though - I've often wondered myself whether what I was reading was something I should be privy to.

I agree with many of the posts already. I also know that information leaks out...its inevitable. Of course we all hate it. My boyfriend (who isn't greek) came up to me months before we ever dated and said, I know ADPi's handshake. People get some kind of thrill out of knowing 'secrets'. Unfortunately we can't do much about these things, but honestly, if someone read every detail of my ritual, but didn't experience it, it wouldn't mean anything to them. I would assume this is true of most organizations. Our ritual is amazing when you experience it.

As far as open information...I think that's great, especially for pnm's...I believe a potential member should learn all they can about an organization to find one that is the best match. You can learn a lot about an organization from their open motto, creed or whatever else is not a secret.

/hijack
I had no idea that's what it means, that's really beautiful!
/end hijack

My mom figured that out when I first joined DG! It's pretty obvious. While other things, like our colors or the letters on our badge, are private (at least I think our colors are private).

Then there is Delta Upsilon, who doesn't believe in secrets at all. And Alpha Kappa Alpha, who holds open initiation that the girls' friends can watch. I was invited to one, and I hate that I didn't go, because I think it would have been interesting.

Are you sure it wasn't some sort of ceremony to publicly introduce the women as members? I'd be very surprised if initiation itself was open! But then, you learn something new every day!

If it was AKA or any other D9 org, it probably was a Coming Out Show or a Neophyte. These public events happen AFTER initiation which is private.

I think so too :D

Our colors are private ;) so Shhh! :D

Re: Re: "Leaking" Information
 

There's also the possibility that colors, symbols, etc., may have more than one meaning. Sometimes, a group may have open (or exoteric) meanings for its symbols, colors, letters, etc., which are public knowledge, but also have secret (or closed or esoteric) meanings that are known only to members.

Alot of Greek organizations tell some information because keeping secrets creates bad steroetypes. Think about how people have always accused fraternal orgs like Masons and Shriners and Elks of being negative. Alot of people in small towns (like mine) are under the false impressions that fraternal organizations (both male and female) are somehow satanic.

Just my small town back road observation.

Edited to add:

NOT THAT I THINK FRATERNAL ORGANIZATIONS ARE SATANIC. Every man in my family is a Mason all the way back to my great- great grandfather and my boyfriend is an Elk so it's not my thoughts. PLEASE DONT BRING OUT THE WET ROPE ON ME!!

LIke open and closed mottos??? Is that sort of like what you mean??

My roomate (non-greek, and a little against it) said to me once "it's like all you people act like you know something everyone else doesn't and it makes other people on the defense".
I think thats part of the reason there is some openess to some greek mottos, colors, creeds and what not. It's trying to create a sense of "we want to share some of this with you" type feeling.

No, it's not. It's not in any way a reaction to the perception of non-greeks or anyone else.

GLOs have had both exoteric information and esoteric information for ages. Maybe not in the very beginning for some of the early groups, as student orgs were verboten then. But certainly from the 1850s onward.

The exoteric info was put out there as an outward show of the aims of the group. This was to attract new members and to establish the character of the group on campus and in the community. The esoteric info was obviously the secret bond that tied the members together.

This isn't a new phenomena. If you see it on the group's website, it's exoteric info and fully intended to be there.

wptw

More or less, yes.

To give just one example: All one has to do is look at Phi Gamma Delta's coat-of-arms to see that FIJI has a motto, the three words of which begin with the letters Phi, Gamma and Delta: "Philotes, Glukutate Dunasteia" ["Friendship, the sweetest influence"]. So, publically the letters Phi, Gamma, and Delta stand for this motto, and someone looking at FIJI's website might say "Oh, now I know what the letters stand for." But I'm quite sure (FIJI brothers need neither confirm or deny ;) ) that the letters have a "deeper" meaning known only to brothers.

In the same way, a GLO may have a "public" meaning for a flower, colors, or other symbols, but also have an additional, or "deeper," meaning known only to its members.

And with all the members in every organization, there are bound to be a few disgruntled members...

Not even disgruntled sometimes, but members who don't really respect the tradition of secrecy and blab everything for a 'trade' with other greek friends :p

In AOII we have open sub-mottos for our chapters. At my chapter, Nu Beta, our sub-motto means Victorius Life, and we were named for Nancy Beasley who founded our chapter. That is not a secret. There is one chapter, I cannot remember which one, and it means "Chosen from among the emeralds." That is my favorite of all time. Anyway, our color is cardinal, we do not have a crest because crest our medieval, etc...that is all on our website.

Another thing to remember is that when an organization publishes, even using their own "publishing house," books and literature, it is protected by copyright laws. To do that, they have to register that material. That places the information into public domain, even if we prefer to continue to treat it as private.

For example, all 3 publications/volumes of "The History of Zeta Tau Alpha" are located in the Library of Congress. Even if they were not generally available to the public (before e-bay, anyway), the public was able to obtain access to the book and read it. So, while our history is treasured by us, nothing that is truly ever secret is printed. Not on purpose, anyway.

In the early 1900's (1910 or 1920, I think), our secret motto was accidentally published in our fraternity magazine, "Themis", thus making it our open motto: Seek the Noblest. Convention was interesting that year, I am certain.

Exactly...or, disgruntled and don't give a rat's patootie...how do you think Alexandra Robbins got to follow 4 women around and learn all of those "secrets"? :rolleyes:

I'm not sure that everything printed is automatically protected by copyright laws. In fact, I would suppose otherwise. I think you have to actually assert your rights and copyright the material. Sort of like applying for a trademark. And as you said, since that would involve putting the contents in the public domain, that's why most groups choose not to copyright it.

In fact, I've never seen a copyrighted ritual manual.

wptw

I have actually looked into this at the US copyright website and one does not actually have to go and get it copyrighted in order for it to be copyrighted. I believe all material is considered copyrighted now unless it is something considered to be "common knowledge"-like "one small step for man, one giant leap for mankind". There are also specifics to copyright infringment like-it's not infringment for me to photocopy my sorority ritual and give it to anyone I want, but it is copyright infringment to sell it. It's an interesting website, I'll post it if I can find it.

Copyrights also expire after the life of the author plus so-many years (25 I think), unless renewed by the holder of the copyright (as in the heirs of a dead author). A corporation, I think, would have to renew its copyrights periodically.