I Hope This Does Not Happen At Other Universities....
 

My sister is a Theta at Alabama, and during this time of year is Student Government Association elections, so she sent me a very intersesting article:

http://www.cw.ua.edu/vnews/display.v.../404ecb260be11

I have had "the Machine" explained to me, but my, my,my....

Sounds like a form of hazing.

I guess Mayor Daley's ghost lives on in Tuscaloosa, these folks need to grow up.

people actually place real stock in those threats?

Only 20% of this campus is greek, so it seems that if the other 80% of students voted, the Machine would have no power. Sounds like the greeks are the only ones who care enough to vote.

It amazes me that this kind of stuff still goes on even in 2004. I didn't go to a "Southern" school with an old established Greek system......

From the article and who they want to elect, it sounds like they are still living in 1955....

I've heard stories about "The Machine" but this is rather ridiculous.

http://www.greekchat.com/gcforums/sh...threadid=47965

and Taualumna, these are not pledges voting, they are actives, so why in the world would you bring hazing into this????????????????

I think Taualumna called it hazing for two reasons: 1) the pledges were advised during a pledge meeting about the way the Machine's system worked and basically advised to go along with it and 2) the pledges were not allowed to vote; they had to turn over their ID info so that the actives could vote the way the Machine wanted.

As has been said before, the Machine is simply making use of block voting. While some of their tactics are questionable, they aren't doing anything campus groups haven't been doing for years: band together to elect who they want.

i don't know much about the bigger greek systems at the larger universities.... but was it chi omega that was against her? or the overall greek system? i don't really understand this...:confused:

I believe BamaAlumna can answer this better than I can, but here goes...

My understanding of the Machine is that it is comprised of a "select" group of sororities and fraternities... It has been explained to me that not every sorority/fraternity is involved. Also, it was explained that it is mainly those sororities/fraternities that are called "Old Row" that seem to be more involved...

GChatters, feel free to correct me if I am incorrect on any of this info! :D

One Word, "sickened"!:(

Campus Polotics at its Crappiest!:mad:

As there was another post along these lines some time back, I am sure it may be true!:o


Rise lower class Greeks take over the Whole Damn Thing!:cool:

Some times, "THE OLD LINE GREEKS" can suck for their Semi Self Importance!:o

there's another thread on this somewhere.....

Hazing doesn't just happen with pledges
 

Intimidation of any form, whether it's between pledges and actives, pledges and pledges, or actives and actives -- it's hazing.

NPC defines hazing as:
Hazing is defined as any action or situation with or without consent which recklessly, intentionally or unintentionally endangers the mental or physical health or safety of a student, or creates risk of injury, or causes discomfort, embarrassment, harassment or ridicule or which willfully destroys or removes public or private property for the purpose of initiation or admission into or affiliation with, or as a condition for continued membership in a chapter or colony of an NPC member fraternity

If AGD really sat its new members down in a circle, and then told them how to vote, and then singled out Lumpkin -- that is hazing!!

Assuming the accusations about intimidation against Alabama's XO and AGD chapters are true, they certainly would be in violation of the NPC policy on hazing.

Re: Hazing doesn't just happen with pledges
 

I don't think there was a question as to whether or not the actions were hazing. I believe 33girl simply misunderstood the events which took place in the article... I DO NOT think she was making excuses for what happened...
Lighten up;) We don't need to have the NPC rules quoted... I think most of us on here are quite familiar with the rules and regulations against hazing...

It's only hazing if it's tied to membership
 

Go back and read the definition again, Jhawkalum. It's not hazing unless done as a condition of initiation or continued membership.

One person interviewed (Lumpkin) said she was told once that her involvement in the "disapproved campaign" might result in her being made inactive. That threat, if coupled with any action described in the definition, might qualify as hazing. Otherwise, the article describes heavy intimidation and coercion, but not hazing.

Actually not to prolong it... but on a point of clarification ;) were the activities between pledges and actives or pledges and pledges, or actives and actives??

There is no doubt the actions were reprehensible but the collective - Theta Nu Epsilon itself, is (most certainly!) not NPC and not subject to NPC rules. Its member orgs may well themselves be NPC but the threats etc weren't perpetuated against members of an org to others in their org or wishing to become a part of their org.

So on a purely technical point I don't see that it fits the hazing definition - though it is unacceptable and no doubt the general attitude and actions of individuals are a far cry from the core founder values of the member sororities involved in Theta Nu Epsilon.

ETA: Ohhhh MysticCat81! A pox on you for typing & posting faster than me! ;) :p

Decadence,

To answer your question, it was between some actives and the pledges gathered as a group for a pledge meeting on the rules and regs of the Machine. The pledges were gathered in a group at their house and asked if they had a problem with abiding by the rules of the Machine. (They were asked by an active who also happened to be a Machine "rep".)

ETA:
"At the end of the spring 2003 semester, Lumpkin also said she heard she would likely be placed on inactive status in the sorority like Riley Buck. Lumpkin was told Buck had become inactive because she had led a successful College of Arts and Sciences Senate campaign against the Machine's wishes." (From the above mentioned article...)

Honestly, if people aren't allowed to vote how they want to vote, that goes beyond hazing IMO.

And it (allegedly) doesn't only tell its pledges how to vote, it tells its actives how to vote also. Any one - pledge or sister - who was campaign managing a non-Machine endorsed candidate would have received the same treatment and singling out in a meeting. Say every Friday is pin attire day and the sisters have to dress in pin attire or get fined - if you apply that to the pledges it's not hazing because the sisters have to do the same thing too.

Don't get me wrong, I think this is whackety whack whack, but I don't think that "hazing" is quite the term to throw around here.

I'm really trying to stay out of this and I am not going to comment on it a great deal.

I don't think this is ever construed as hazing. It's not something done to pledges by actives.

The whole thing is much more complicated than it appears. I really can't explain it. I don't particularly want to try to explain it. I will just say that it's more complicated than you think and that unless you've been around it yourself, you don't understand.


To the best of my knowledge, Kappa Alpha Theta is not a machine-affiliated sorority.

At my school, it's like 70% Greek. But, the Greeks do control most of the school. One of my sisters is Senior Class President and the Vice-President is also in a Sorority. Its mostly like that in the upper classmen classes and the Freshman and Sophmore classes don't have too many Greeks because they just got to the school.
Also, the Student Government is not run by Greeks but since there are so many people crossing I have no doubt that Greeks will be in the most of the offices in the years to come.

Machine
 

Open this link and look for the Chapter on the Machine, and it will give you alot of info on the machine, as well as, sources for the info.

http://www.education.ua.edu/leader/f...heCapstone.pdf