So SAD/ANGRY
 

Yall, I am so sad and so angry at the same time. My 9th grader asked if she could talk to me in the closet. Mind you, if we go to the closet it is serious-very serious. I grabbed some tissue because tears are usually shed in the closet, prayers are made in the closet....Well, anyway she told me that she is 2 months pregnant. Sorors and sisterfriends this is the 5th young lady this month. Lets see.....one seventh grader, two eighth graders, one ninth grader and one 11th grader. Two ninth graders and one 10th grader and one 12 grader have already had babies. This is so depressing. I have a ninth grade (male) student who fathered two of the babies. He can barely read. We need to do something-but what! I talk and I talk and I talk. I mean I really get real with them. This is a rural area and there is not much to do. Why do they want these babies so desperately? They walk around so proud. I forgot that one of our 7th graders just had a baby about a month ago. She told me that her labor was not all that bad. She was out with the baby the next week. What is really going on! This troubles my soul. How can these young kids be mothers and fathers to their children when they are but children themselves? Yall, I am so grieved. The more I talk the worse it gets. The counselor and the local health department have been educating them about STDs, pregnancy, drugs etc... Maybe I need to just shut up!Does anyone have any suggestions? I am all ears!

MAYBE YOU SHOULD TALK TO THE PRINICIPAL OF YOUR SCHOOL, EXPRESS YOUR CONCERN FOR THE SEXUAL INVOLVEMENT OF YOUR STUDENTS.. ESPECIALLY THE YOUNGER ONES.. AND SOMEHOW TRY TO GET APPROVAL TO START SOME TYPE OF PROGRAM/SEMINAR TO EDUCATE THE CHILDREN ABOUT PROMISCUITY..INSTEAD OF YOU DOING IT ALONE.. TALK WITH THE TEACHERS IN YOUR SCHOOL AND WITH OTHER TEACHERS IN YOUR SCHOOL DISTRICT... FIND OUT IF THEY ARE HAVING THE SAME PROBLEMS AND SEE IF MAYBE YOU LADIES AND GENTLEMEN CAN COME UP WITH MAYBE A DISTRICT PROGRAM TO HELP THE STUDENTS OF ALL RESPECTIVE SCHOOLS.. BUT MORE SO.. CONTACT THE PARENTS OF ALL THE STUDENTS.. TRY TO GET THE PARENTS TOGETHER ONE NIGHT AND TALK TO THEM ABOUT YOUR CONCERN, AND GET OTHER TEACHERS AND THE PRINCIPAL INVOLVED.... TRY TO DETERMINE WHAT YOU , THE PARENTS AND THE ADMINISTRATION THINK IS THE PROBLEM.. TRY TO DETERMINE WHATS CAUSING THE KIDS TO GET THEMSELVES INTO THESE TYPES OF SITUATIONS.. MAYBE ITS TOO MUCH TIME ON THERE HANDS.. MY GRANDMOTHER ONCE TOLD ME THAT AN IDLE MIND IS THE DEVILS WORKSHOP... IF THAT IS THE CASE THEN MAYBE YOUR SCHOOL DISTRICT OR PARTICULAR SCHOOL NEEDS TO INITIATE SOME TYPE OF AFTER SCHOOL PROGRAM FOR THE KIDS..... RECENTLY , IN MY HOMETOWN , THEY STARTED AN AFTERSCHOOL PROGRAM AT WHICH I VOLUNTEER AT.. THE KIDS ARE ENTERTAINED AND HAVE PLENTY OF RECREATONAL THINGS TO DO.. ITS HELD IN AN ELEMENTRY SCHOOL GYM HERE IN TOWN AND THE GYM IS A CENTRAL LOCATION FOR THE SCHOOLS (ITS NOT A TRANSPORTATION PROBLEM FOR THE KIDS TO ATTEND.. AND ALSO SOMETIMES WE OFFER TO GO AND PICK UP THE KIDS) WELL WITH THIS PROGRAM WE HAVE PLAY TIME AND WE HAVE WHAT WE CALL CHAT AND CHEW TIME.. WE GIVE THE KIDS INFORMATION ABOUT SCHOOL, TEACH THEM LIFE LESSONS, TALK KTO THEM ABOUT HOMELIFE AND WE DO EDUCATE THEM ON PROMISCUITY.. WE FEED THEM DRINKS AND SNACKS AFTER THE CHATTING AND SOMETIMES INFORMATIONAL GAMES WE DESIGN TO TEACH THE KIDS.. ALSO WE HAVE DIFFERENT "SESSIONS" WITH THE KIDS AND HAVE BEAUTY DAYS FOR THE LADIES AND THINGS LIKE THAT , WHICH WE HAVE AT THE END OF THE WEEK TO MOTIVATE THE KIDS TO CONTINUE COMING.. ALSO WE HAVE DANCES ADN OTHER PARTIES FOR THE YOUNG TEENS WHICH ARE SUPERVISED BY COLLEGE STUDENTS AND YOUNG ADULTS.. WE GIVE THEM SAFE AND WELL SUPERVISED PLACES TO HANG OUT...ITS WORKED REALLY WELL.. ALOT OF TIME IN "OUR" COMMUNITIES WE HAVE ALOT OF PROBLEMS WITH PARENTS NOT BEING ABLE TO BE AT HOME WITH THEIR KIDS AS MUCH AS THEY NEED TO .. THE KIDS REALIZE THAT THEIR PARENTS ARE FREQUENTLY GONE AND THEY COME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT THEY CAN DO AS THEY PLEASE WITHOUT THE PRESENCE OF AN ADULT.. IN MY OWN PERSONAL EXPERIENCES WITH THIS MANY TIMES I CAME TO THE CONCLUSION IT WAS JUST A MATTER OF HAVIND ADULT SUPERVISION THAT THE KIDS NEEDED.. I AM SINCERELY SORRY TO HEAR THAT YOU HAVE KIDS BARELY IN HIGH SCHOOL FATHERING AND MOTHERING CHILDREN.. I HOPES THIS HELPS YOU....i WILL KEEP YOU, YOUR STUDENTS AND THEIR FAMILIES IN MY PRAYERS..~MS. BABYJSC~

This is so sad!! I am going through the same thing myself with my students. It is to the point where I sometimes, honestly, do not know what to say at all. Especially my students who are below grade level and then they start naming who the godparents are -- who are reading below grade level too.

OOOOOOOOO that really gets me too Bluereign. They give each other baby showers and to hear a ninth grader say,
"This is my God Child" really burns me up. These kids are getting more action than I am. They know far more than I did at that age. What is your school doing to curtail this problem?

Thanks Babyjsc

I, too, am sad at your news. I agree with babyjsc. An afterschool program may be an answer. I work in a computer center in a building mostly populated by low to moderately low income families. The majority of parents do not come home until at least 5 or 6 p.m. The school most of the kids go to lets out at 1:30 p.m. We host an After School Program every weekday and even have activities during the holiday and summer breaks. This has done a lot of good. The children have somewhere to go after school, are entertained, and are learning the importance of hard work, sharing, good manners, etc.

I am also involved in a mentoring program for girls in the 7th and 8th grades. A group of college females act as mentors to the young ladies. We host discussions, retreats, and field trips throughout the school year. To end off the year, we have a Cotillion for the 8th grade girls. The 7th graders act as ushers. This type of program has had numerous positive results: the girls are exposed to college level females and are given the sense of how important education is, they are able to partake in activities they may not have otherwise been able to participate in (i.e. a Cotillion or a girls only retreat), and each girl's self esteem is lifted as she realizes her abilities and potential. You may want to look into starting a program like this.

Lastly, I suggest you try and start a separate young ladies and young men's program. This could be similar to the mentoring program, but led only by you and a male teacher. It could be an open forum for the kids to discuss their concerns and even their reasons for doing certain things (i.e. why the girls choose to have sex with their male company rather than just playing video games, etc.). You may find that the reason is a lot deeper than "my parent(s) weren't home." The group could also be a place that you talk openly and honestly with them, outside of school, about sex, promiscuity, the importance of safe sex, consequences and responsibilities, and even the importance of education to the future of your children.

Since you've mentioned the importance of the closet in your classroom discussions, you could name the group "Closet Talk." Just a suggestion.

Try to get parents involved as much as possible, but I can tell you from experience, it is HARD! Many of the parents of the "troubled" kids either are not as involved or are not able to get as involved due to work constraints. Maybe your results will be different.

I hope this advice helps. All of the programs I've worked in have been successful, so I know that anything you decide to do will work just as well. Just remember that planning is key and that you want to target the kids who need it most. Usually the ones who want to participate are those that are already on the "right path".

As was mentioned, I will keep you all in my prayers, and good luck!

Upon reading the initial post I intended to express my sympathy. After reading the remaining posts I could only be reminded of my own history. My cousin became pregnant while in high school. After the family accepted her fate my cousin began planning for her baby. I have always "looked up" to my cousin who is two years older. She gave birth to a boy and asked me to be his godfather. Although I was very mature for my age, I had no idea how to care for a child. Imagine a young black male only 14 not old enough to drive but pushing a stroller around the neighborhood saying this is my godson. The memories are very vivid for me. Despite the many obstacles and difficulties, I am so proud of my godson. Today, the little man that was my high school mascot when I graduated is now a freshman football player at NC A&T State University.

To the educators I ask that you talk to your students about their current situation. Although their pregnancies are untimely, they now need to focus on how they can care for their child and continue their education.

"Life is about choices - some are good while some are bad"

Conskeeted, it's not only sad, it's scary to those of us who are parents.

I mean I talk to my six year old daughter now about being married before becoming a "mommy", but it still ruffles my feathers to imagine that she might not take my advice.

I believe that parent involvement is PRIMO, but I have plenty of friends whose parents did not condone prematiral sex, but it sure didn't stop their daughters from having it.

I, like you, just want to know what to say. I don't have the words to explain that it's not cute, when they so obviously think it is.

There are several young people on the outskirts of my life that I try to talk to, but someimes I can LITERALLY see it going in one ear and out the other. You can't tell them anything, because they have an answer for everything.

If you come up with a fool-proof plan, e mail it to me.


Miss. Mocha

I have to say that I was staying away from this one until I read your post. I really appreciate what you've said.

You guys, I agree whole heartedly about that situation being sad. The fact of the matter is they're losing their childhood without even knowing the full extent of what they're doing.The fact of the matter is parenthood is really tough.
I was a bit afraid to post because of a previous post about un wed mothers trying to enter a certian soroity..I fit that discription. I'm unwed but I'm active as a sisterfriend hoping to one day be given a chance.

I had my daughter my last year of high school and got pregnant my first time having sex.Believe it or not I went several months without saying anything. I was afraid, ashamed, confused...you name it, I felt it. I lived my life the model student and child until then. When people finally found out my situation, they went out of their way to let me know how disappointed they were and how I should have known better. They talked endlessly about what a shame I was to my family and so on and so forth... In the end I felt worthless and still didn't know what I needed to do to take care of myself to make sure the baby was healthy. The fact of the matter is I was pregnant. There wasn't much I could do to change that fact, but I had no one there for me to at least direct me on what I should do next.I went 7 months without prenatal care and I almost died having my child.(When I finally did get my prenatal care it was because I started reading books and things like that to give me a clue. I WALKED to the doctor!)

I went on to finish highschool that year with honors as well as begin my first years of college with honors. I was determined to do that for me and my child and prove to others that I wasn't another girl on the road to nothing.

Throughout the years I've made it a personal quest to educate as many young girls that I can on sex, why it's great to wait, why they can stop after they've started, how to protect themselves properly ....and most importantly LISTEN WITHOUT JUDGEMENT. These girls need love and attention, they need guidance. I'm by no means saying that them having sex and getting pregnant is ok, but if it's already done don't turn your backs on them.Even the one's that seem like they're determined to be hoochie mamas, that may be all they've seen or all they know. If you have it in you to do it...Try to show them the right way.

There are afterschool programs but they are not really direct at addressing the problems or the things these kids have on their minds!! I think direct one-on-one confrontation works well. I just thought about an 8th grade girl I had about 3 years ago who was very smart but just had some social problems. One day she came to school with new clothes and shoes and a $100 dollar bill. She told me her boyfriend gave it to her. I told her "no young lady should ever take clothes or money from a boyfriend. That is what fathers are for. So you know now he thinks he owns your body too. You are too smart for that". The next day she came to me, hugged me and said, "thanks, my own mother would never had told me anything like that." I was just passing down info that my own momma had told me at that age. I think what we need are more people to just step up and "be real" with our children because too many of them don't get it at home. Maybe we need more afterschool programs with topics such as these. I liked the Jerry Springer idea though.

Conskeeted19, I totally understand where you are coming from. I encounter the same thing when I counsel young kids at the health clinic and in a youth program. It is really a sad situation, in which there isn't much that one can do. I have found though that just being there, listening and giving positive reinforcement goes a long way. I think it's really good that they feel that they can trust you enough to talk to you. I think that this is why some of the kids that I talk to always come back or remain in touch with me. A majority of the time they are just looking for attention and acknowledgement and aren't getting it from where they should (at home). That is why they end up straying the wrong way.

I think that schools starting as early as possible need to initiate sexual education programs. I came to this conclusion when I heard a 8 year old say to me , "I could bang you out". Mind you, I first learned of that phrase in college. Unfortunately, we cannot wait until high school to begin this type of education. Society says it's alright for the parents to work at least 8 hours a day and send their kids off to school for almost the same time. So in turn children have to learn about life at school, especially if their parents aren't teaching them.

My best advice along with some of the other suggestions is to talk with the other teachers and the school board to see if you can have programs that educated these kids about sex. I know and fully believe that kids should be learning only math, science, etc., but times have changed and we as a society need to adapt to these changes, no matter how bad they may be.

Right now, I'm trying to initiate a program at a youth center in which we take kids to area colleges and expose them to that environment. I know that this may be a bit early for some of them, but they need to know what opportunities are out there for them. Half of them only know the world they live in and need to see the rest of the world and what life has to offer them.

Conskeeted-I know how you feel, because my best friend had her child when we were in the 10th grade (she was 15).
I think that it is great that they feel comfortable enough to have told you, because most of these kids may not be able to talk to anyone else about what's going on.
I agree with some of the previous posts-these girls need to see how hard it is to care for a child. When I was in high school, our teacher made us carry a heavy sack of flour around for our child development and parenting class. Back then, things were different, so that did the trick for some of the girls that wanted kids. But we all know that times are totally different now...
I don't know how the administration or the girls families would take to it (because I know that you need permission to do any activities involving the students), but I think that they need to do a "Day in the Life"-Ricki Lake does it all the time. They need to SEE how hard it is AFTER the child is born. A lot of young girls think that it is all about the pregnancy-this is the easy part. But when the baby is born, that will turn their world upside-down. They need to see how hard it is to feed, bathe & dress their child AND THEN have to get ready to go to school. They need to see how hard it is having sleepless nights day after day. They need to see how everytime they get $$-it is gone just as fast because the baby needs things. They need to see how having this child will have an effect on their social/family life.
I'm not saying that all girls fail at being parents-what I'm saying is that they need a strong dose of reality. Unless these girls come from families where their parents are very well off, and money is not an issue, how are they going to support that baby? And being that they are still young, they can only work so many hours in a week, and usually they can only get minimum-wage positions, and that is not enough to live on.
I hope that all of these ideas inspire you to come up with a plan to school these girls. I'll keep you in prayer http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

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"Mind ya own, stay true to ya own, be ya own."
Peace and God Bless
Classy_Diva5

Shalom Conskeeted19 (Shalom Everybody)!

Conskeeted19, I just want to say that I praise the LORD that you are there for your students and that their situations are felt deep in your heart.

I encourage you to keep up the good work you are doing by providing them a safe place to come to, confide in, and be comforted with grace and mercy.

I pray you strength to keep on keeping on---don't get weary in your well doing! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Shalom~

Okay, I teach at a high school and I come into contact with a large number of "our" girls. Anyway, one of the girls I sponsored became pregnant at the end of her junior year, last school year. Her baby is due this month (of her Senior year).

Now, teenage pregnancy is a big NO NO for me and what I believe. Yet, I wanted to get something for the baby. She told me it was a boy. BUT I do not want to convey to her that I "support" what has happened. The idea of teenage pregnancy etc. Yet, at the same time, I'm like, what can be done NOW? http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/confused.gif The baby is almost here! He did not ask to be born.

So, I think I will still get the gift. My better judgement says I should. I don't have to like what has happened, but I can show some positivity, cause she is probably "feeling" it from all sides right now.

That's a good thing. You guys can't possibly know just how much shame and how much they are disappointed in themselves at that point.(most anyway)The end of the pregnancy is no joke , even more so for a young girl Your body doesn't feel like it's your own anymore and there's the FEAR http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/eek.gif Of the pain that delivering the baby will bring.

I was so grateful for everything I recieved for my child right down to the tiniest diaper bag or pacifier. I knew no one was saying that what I'd done was ok, but at least they hadn't completely given up on me.you know?

Everytime I see a young girl strutting pregnant and proud talking about her babydaddy and what he SAYS http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/rolleyes.gifhe's going to do I want to take off my belt and whip her butt,but at that point what good would that do?
I then tactfully bust their bubbles and explain how it's not all it's cracked up to be and get them to start thinking about the real world and not some dream they've developed in their heads.
It's so tough trying to help todays youth but if not me then who? http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/confused.gif

Thanks !! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif
I also agree that reality sessions would slap them in the face about how hard it really is. Hang in there Conskeeted19. they need you more than you know!

I don't know if this suggestion has been given, but here it goes.

I would suggest finding a serious-minded young mother that DOESN'T have a support system, and have an assembly centering her story. When the other girls hear her story, realizing that the baby IS NOT a toy, and all of the strife they will have to endure if they have one, it might change their minds about sex.

I think it has EVERYTHING to do with what happens in the homes these young girls live in and visit. If they are surrounded with promiscuity, they will explore it.

That was a great post Exquizit!!!! I couldn't agree with you more.


Conskeeted19: I have to two suggestions (1) you (or your school), should have the girls who have already had their babies talk to other students and show them that raising/having a baby isn't as "glamourous" as they think and (2) make your students plan a budget that includes caring for a child.

Make them plan their budgets for diapers, milk, clothes, childcare and so on. Tell them to act as if they have NO ONE to help them care for their baby but themselves.

I agree that it is sad that children grow up too fast. Parenthood is no joke.

I also agree that peer examples are a great tool. On an episode of Jerry Springer, they actually did a socially conscious show about teenage parenting. The guests on the show indicated that at 13, 14, 15 years old that they were trying so hard to get pregnant. After they were all introduced and their family members expressed their frustration, a group of teenage mothers (one as young as 12 years old http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif ) came on to tell them that teenage motherhood is not all it is cracked up to be and to not make the same mistakes. Well, needless to say that the words went in one ear and out the other. The kicker was that the guests who were determined to get pregnant had to take care of the teeenaged mothers' babies for ONE night. They all changed their minds in the morning because they didn't have a clue about motherhood.

Of course, this situation could not possibly address the long-term issues of teenaged parenthood such as finishing school, daycare and social adjustment but it is a start. Conskeeted, maybe something along this line may work in your school?

I agree with exquizit that once the baby is made that the teenage parents need love and support. A single mistake should not lead to ruining someone's life. Even sadder are the teenage babymommas and babydaddies that CONTINUE to repeat the mistake. There are too many that have multiple children before they are out of their teens.



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MCCOYRED

Dynamic
Salient
Temperate

Mu Psi '86
BaltCo Alumnae

I really feel for this situation. I agree that if this is a rural area where there isn't really much to so, after-school programs would most likely be beneficial.

ALso, parent education classes. Many parents put so much responsibility on the school staff it's amazing. It's like, what they don't learn at school they just don't learn.

Self-esteem is a big issue with teenage pregnancy. The attention these young girls get, when they may be getting very little elsewhere is very alluring. Attention from boys, friends, classmates, etc.

I used to do HIV education in high schools and middle schools in LA, Inglewood, Hawthorne, etc (Los Angeles). At the middle schools, I would talk about postponing sexual involvement, in hish chools, it was risk reduction (for HIV,STDs and pregnancy). Well, at one middle school, I am talking about postponing (which is appropriate for MOST of the students, not ALL). I had a 12 year old girl in the class who had TWO children. She was looking at me like "too late." First baby was by her first cousin, second was by someone in the 12th grade.

Situations like this also tend to be cyclical. I now a woman who is 45 years old and is a great grandmother. She had her daughter at 15, her daughter had hers at 15 and then her daughter had hers at 15. When you have children at such a young age, you still have a lot of growing up to do. The basic mistakes where you stop and say, "Wow, I will never do that again and I will teach my kids,one day not to do that either," haven't even been made. If I am 18 and my child is 7 years old, what can I possibly teach him/her? So when that child is 14 and I am 25, I am not thinking of teaching sexual responsibility, I'm still trying to get mine.


I am not speaking for all young people who have children. SOme have a tight support network and are able to graduate, do well, marry and have other children. Butthe majority end up depriving themselves and their children of a half-way decent life.

The problem with teen pregnancy definately needs to be dealt with, but there are some college educated adults that also need counseling about unwed pregnancies and STD's. There is a girl at my school who has a baby with a guy. She always talks about all of the places that she and this guy go to and all of the things that they do together. So all this time, I'm thinking that "It's good to finally meet a girl who speaks positively of her child's father and it seems like they have a good relationship." Okay, so the other day, I asked her what she was doing for lunch and she said that she was going out to eat with her child's father. Later on I asked her about her lunch date and she was like, "Oh, we just sat in the car and ate because he had his other baby with him." My response was, "Oh, so he had a baby with another girl before you met him?" She says, "No, this is his newborn."

I ask her, (regardless of whether it was my business or not) "Why does your boyfriend have a newborn baby, when your child is two years old and he has been your boyfriend since the birth of your child?"

She says, "Oh well everybody makes mistakes."

Okay, fine everybody does make mistakes. I let the issue go and went on to talk about something else. No sooner than we finished talking about that drama, she told me, "I need a new job because babies are so expensive and I want another one." My question, "Who are planning on having another baby with?" (I wanted to ask why she wanted "another baby" and not "the first" husband, but I try to mind my business sometimes!)

She said that she wanted to have another baby with the father of her first child.

I wanted to tell her so bad that it seems to me as though your child's father seems to have his hands full with his brand new baby and that since you just took him to court for child support LAST WEEK, you probably shouldn't even want to get involved again. If he was the least bit interested in taking care of the kids that he keeps helping to make, he wouldn't need the courts to make him pay some measly amount of child support. He would volunteer to make substantial payments for the support of his child. Ooops, I meant kids, because eventually the new "baby-mama" is going to have to drag his tired behind into the same court to collect her funds. How stupid is this whole situation? So, I say that some grown women need to sit in on that same Sex Ed class that the teenagers attend.

Thank God it's Friday. Guess what? Today, during last period, my student told me that she had to talk to me. I was doing 3000 things at one time. I kept telling her,"Ok, wait just one minute." The minute never came. When the bell sounded for us to leave, I was gathering my things to dash out the door. I turned the lights out, and that same student said, "I really need to talk to you." I went back into the room and just stared at her. She said, "I haven't came on my period in 2 months." I wanted to scream to the top of my lungs, pull my hair, jump up and down, but I didn't. I just can not believe it. Another one!(8th grade)

Thanks for all of your suggestions. I have already started putting some of them in action.

I can't tell you how good it feels to be able to come home and exhale to friends who truly care and understand.

I'll keep you posted.

P.S. "Closet Talk" is a great name!

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You are the master of your own destiny!

This is a topic hitting close to home with me, my sister (pharmacist) had a baby at 16, she had a stong support system finished high school, college and grad school. I cried and cried when she told me because I thought she would become a statistic. Thank God she didn't.

Soror Conskeeted 19 you are to be commended for your interest and dedication to your students, they seem to trust you greatly, use it to your advantage.

AKA2D'91 just buy the gift Soror and give it with the love intended.

There is no stigma attached to being an unwed mother. In fact its rather chic according to the things young people are exposed to. I have no solutions only prayer that we can somehow return to a time when there was modesty and morality in the media, movies and music.

The Senior teachers at my school will not attend any of the girls baby showers nor will they give the girls gifts for their babies. However, privately they will offer support to the mother of the pregnant daughter. They feel that society has made it easy for these teens. They feel that they really need to see that having a baby is easy, but bieng a mother is not. I feel that I have started to lean towards their way of thinking. Soror AKA2D'91, I think that I would offer assistance to the mother of your student. When I had my son, things were not so easy. Sometimes just getting pampers would be a serious chore. I remember staying up all night long with him when he had the cholic. It was not my mother who stayed up-it was me! Boy did I do some tall thinking! I have younger sisters with children. My older sisters and I have made everything so convenient for them. We kept their children. We bought for their children. We helped them to get cars. They are so irresponsible. I remember being at college with no money and no car. I used to pray everyday, "Lord, please put someone in my path that will pick up my child and take us home. My whole point is that it wasn't easy. I have one student that says that the baby she had is not her baby-it's her brother and that she just had it. In fact, she says that the baby is her mothers baby. She does nothing. She is free to do whatever she wants. I am not saying that they should not be able to enjoy life; however, they should be made to feel consequences of their choice.

Thanks again for all of your support!

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You are the master of your own destiny!

I do not in anyway mean to center this topic on me but, I litterally wanted to cry(and I am not sensitive at all)when I read this post. I know how it feels to be a CHILD and grow up with a young mother. My mother was just short of 17 when I was born. And DELTABRAT is right, I was deprived(as well as my mother) of a full decent life.

My mother had a young mind and did not have enough funds to take care of both of us but she went clubbing whenever she had the chance. Not to mention my father, skipped town. I had a very hard young life but, I'm not going to go into great detail about my history but Please!!! Don't stop preaching about taking care of yourself first and waiting!

By the blessing of God, I am a sophomore in college(I am one of the top 15 black students at a Predominately White College), I'm trying my best but it is hard because no one is there to support me. I had to take time off to save up money to go to school and when I went back; My mother TOLD me that I need to get a REAL job and stop wasting my time on a dream(collge education). http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif I love my mother very much, but I had to remind her of my past and let her know that I deserve more.

Most of these children get the short end of the stick and repeat the ugly process of ignorace about sex and babies. There are sooooooo many problems that I had to find out from my teachers, who were actually black men!(there were very few black teachers in my area) I could not find the answer from my mother because she stopped growing psychologically. Even Today, she can't see what I see.

My one teacher didn't judge me but constantly encouraged me to take care of myself first and the rest would come later.

I don't know any of you but I just want to say, I know it seems hopeless but don't give up. Please don't give up because without my teachers and my friends parents, I would not determined to succeed in life. Don't think your efforts are in vain. Don't give up!

I apologize for the length.

This whole story makes me very sad. I do feel as if society has glamourized the plight of the unwed, teenage mother--made it seem much easier than it obviously is. I am very lucky in that I have never had to deal with that sort of situation, but that's just what it is--luck. As bad as this sounds, I have a hard time believing that a 12 year old is engaging in consensual intercourse without being coerced (emotionally or physically), but that's another story.

I think one problem with this is that the young girls have seen others (possibly even their mothers) go through this with the "promise" of government assistance. When you know that your basic staples (and I do mean BASIC) are being subsidized, maybe having a baby doesn't SOUND like such a bad thing. I'm not saying "welfare and food stamps are bad", 'cause I think they're a very good thing. I just know that some girls know they can get their food stamps "expedited", or know the ins and outs of AFDC.

Conskeeted, I think it's very good that your students feel as if they can talk to you about this sort of thing. You are truly an inspiration. I know that I would have been labeled all sorts of sluts and whores, and it's good that these girls can go to someone in an authority position and not be judged. What are the situations of these girls? Are they dating older boys/men? Are they in homes where this sort of behavior is seen? Are they daughters of young mothers? Are their financial situations less than desirable? What's your area like--you mentioned a rural area, but are you near a health clinic where you could possibly get someone to talk about the consequences of safer sex? Where are the mothers?

This is very sad, but I don't know how to stop it. We can't put every young girl on Depo-Provera or something like that--the only thing to do is teach personal responsibility.

Ania, I am so glad that you had some positive people in your life. If you should ever need a shoulder to lean on, don't hesitate to use mine.

AlphaChiGirl, some of the girls are dating older guys. My 8th grade student's baby is by a freshman in college. [ http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif] This area is economically disfunctional. Alot of the students are being raised by their grandparents. Some students are dealing with their parent being "cracked out".

I tried to pass this post up I really did but I am sooooooooo sensitive to things of this nature .....Anyway snazzylady you are wrong there are a alot of negative stigmas attached to unwed pregnancies LOTS and there is nothing CHIC about it! The media does not glamourize unwed pregnancies the media glamourizes premarital sex(which is the problem)Sweetie, stigmas definitely come along with the territory I do not know what world you live in, people look at you funny they make the wrong assumptions and some(as been my experience in these forums) even go as far as to say they do not want unwed mothers in there organizations, guys treat you differently etc etc etc.....I mean people are all smiling when one talks of their children then as soon as they ask that magical "Are you married " question and ones reponse is no and never been peoples whole exspression change, I am a mother with out a husband and I have ran into lots of BS I had a professor tell me that kids born out of wedlock grow up to have mental problems........I have people say I am immoral or promiscuous or whatever else comes to mind.......people ASSUME I am a bad parent because of and in my city if a young lady has any children before graduating she can not be a DEBUTANTE no matter how good her grades are........so you see dear there are alot of stigmas and we have to deal with alot of crap and what people fail to realize is shunning young women or talking about them or telling them how wrong and immoral they are will not help them at all, it actually hurts more, which in some cases leads young mothers to resent their children and mistreat them among other things........One of the biggest mistakes people make in trying to deter unwed pregnancies is to focus on the pregnancy as the problem when that is not the problem the problem is PREMARITAL SEX that is the problem that is the SIN people sit and tell young ladies and young men not have kids etc and etc but some fail to tell them what they need not do is have sex simple as that, but see then that would make most people seem hypocritical so they want to attach neg things too the whole unwed pregnancy thing when its the unwed sex that leads to the unwed pregnancy.........Telling a child not to get pregnant is not telling them not to have sex.......and then some make the mistake of trying to educate the young ladies with children and the young ladies with out together, that may work in some instantces but really they need a little different type of educating because two different approaches should be taken because what one does not want to do is make the young ladies with children feel like any less of a person and they should not be made to feel ashamed see shame breeds low self confidence and low self confidence breeds failure they should not be all the way happy with the mistake but they have to learn to accept it and know that it doesn't make them a bad person nor does it mean they will not succeed in life. They need to learn how to accept it, deal with it and try not to let it happen again, then they need to learn how to be good parents......with each young mother people do not usually know what life is or has been like for that person so how dare one condemn or expect the worse or assume the worse about that person..........People need to be genuine in their approach when trying to help these young girls meaning that you can not say you are going to help them then at the same time look down on them. A unwed mother can still be successful at anything a woman that has no children can be successful at AND they can be good a parent and it does not mean that their children will grow up to do the same thing either, I am a young unwed parent and I am a dam good parent, who services my community and is pulling a 3.9 GPA and I have a job and if my daughter were to have a child young or out of wedlock it would not have a dam thing to do with the fact that I did it. I agree that the young mothers probably need to talk to someone that has a child or children, but not just for the purpose of telling them how hard life is(that part will be obvious soon enough) but too also show them that they can still succeed and they are doomed to fail, this would give them something to look forward too so maybe they would not just sit around and have more.............


I read a post about how young mothers are to young to teach their children this or that something to that affect and I think she said she was not saying every young mother but some, and she is very right but I just want to add somethig else............ My parents were married when they got me and well established in their careers they were probably in their thirties or late twenties and let me tell you I was deprived, my mother did not teach me shit she did not spend 20% of the time with me and my siblings as I do with my children she did not know anything about us they did not give a dam what kind of grades we made or none of that shit.........I do beleive that those kids that shot up the schools in what was it colombine, their parents were married and had prominent careers and look how they turned out.......... I know a woman who had both of her parents in the house and now she is somewhere with about six kids and strung out on crack and a guy who had both parents they had lots of money yet he chose to hang around drug dealers and even sold drugs himself and still drove around the nice car his parents bought him they tried to get him away from this city so he went off to school at FAMU but he got kicked out for selling weed came back here and has not been back to school since! I know a young woman who had both parents who were very religous(not religous like too srict where kids rebel) they were actually good parents besides her they had four other kids two boys and three girls the oldest boy left when he was like 20 came home married to a woman like 32 with two kids then they had a kid he cheated on her she left him and now I don't even think he has a job and he is now like thirty six, the second son got heavy into drugs got out and is now shacking with his white girlfriend they have two kids , the oldest daughter has three kids one before she got married so because it looked bad she married this man that beat her like crazy then had another one then they got a divorce then she had a third one by him now he is jail because he was a big time drug dealer but she says she still loves him, now the middle girl ( the one I was initially talking about) she is the only one that went to college but not before getting into drugs heavily, getting pregnant in the ninth grade losing the baby, coming back to school going off to college coming back home getting pregnant again aborting, then pregnant again kept that one then pregnant again an aborting that one, the youngest girl got kicked out of highschool had to get her diploma through alternative school smokes weed like crazy sleeps around with everybody BUT she has never been pregnant so I guess that makes her the ideal woman RIGHT... I could go on for days point being bad parents come in all shapes and forms and some are even good parents but yet their kids turn out not so good because kids grow up and make their own choices. So see those young unwed mothers who had kids and deprived them were proabably going to be bad mothers with or without a husband or maybe it was not entirely their fault............

SORRY SO LONG THAT WAS JUST MY $200.00 WORTH

DAGGGGGGGGGGG A BOOKKKKKKKKK MY BAD http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

AlphaChiGirl-
"I do feel as if society has glamourized the plight of the unwed, teenage mother--made it seem much easier than it obviously is."
I don't think that society glamorizes unwed pregnacies. Sex is glamorized to a large degree. Also, it sounds as if you had a stable home with two good parents so, you are NOT "lucky", you ARE "blessed"-don't take your upbringing lightly.

Conskeeted19,
I had people like you by my side, that is why I am blessed. Very thankful.

Prettygirl,
I know a good publishing company that could help you out. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif You may have a long post but a very valid one. Young BLACK girls are looked down on by a lot of people. And yes there are some young mothers who live around and for that child. I know one woman who is fanatastic-she is actually a member of Alpha Kappa Alpha Sorority. I admire her because she is very motivated in her studies and she takes great care of her child.
Your last point has a lot of validity. I do have peers who have responsible parents that don't care and screw up beyond belief. And I also know parents who started having children at the age of 30, that still should have thought hard before having any children.

Prettygirl, you a woman who had a child at a young age, don't think that I am bashing all young mothers because their are responsible parents out there. However, I shared my story of what I went through and what I see, where I live.

I won't touch A LOT of what's been said...I will just pray that those of you who are in contact with these young women will continue, by your positive example, to drive the message home that the goal is to improve and challenge yourself FIRST, and that's much harder to accomplish as a young mom without the benefit of experience (waiting until you are ready to assume the consequences of sex); self-sufficiency/accomplishment (post-secondary education and a good job); and a solid, loving marriage (the ideal state in which all children SHOULD be born).

Our community needs to impress upon parents and kids the STANDARD for sexual involvement should be marriage or at least waiting until one is "grown" enough to accept ALL the consequences (STDs, emotional issues, pregnancy, HIV/AIDS, etc.). It seems we no longer value that standard as the norm, and our kids/community is paying for it, dearly.

The band-aids of young pregnant and parenting programs (several of which I support), while necessary, are not stemming the tide of girls in this situation, nor are they addressing the root causes of our girls' problems-poor parenting, inadequate education, lack of self-worth/esteem, inability/lack of resources to set and reach long-term goals, poverty, etc.

Another thought: I used to work with a foundation whose funding focus was girls' programs, not the direct, teen-pregnancy-prevention-type programs, but things like theatre, soccer, dance, poetry, etc. The thought was that girls who are engaged in positive activities and short- and long-term goal-setting/achievement will be by definition less likely to get caught up in having sex that results in STDs, pregnancy, etc. The foundation even had a council of girls who acted as grantmakers themselves, which served as a way to give girls the opportunity to be about grown-up business that had a positive impact, without always pounding the "don't get pregnant" message into them.

I like that model-which has been touched upon by previous posters-that puts the focus on positive living, not just pregnancy prevention. We need holistic solutions, not only the band-aids I spoke of previously.

Ania I was not directing my post at you. I was just touching on some of the points I read about..........Its great that you came through that ordeal with flying colors. I just wanted both sides to be told.


I hope that all the ladies that work with these young girls are affective in influencing them to do great things and try and make responsible decisions.


Its just that sometimes some people seem to forget that the world we live in is not the "ideal" world and we are not living among an "ideal" society. At the same time what one person thinks is "ideal" for them another person may think that something different is "ideal" for them. Then you have some young ladies who are not even taught what a (if there is a such thing) "ideal" life is. So in our quest to school young ladies to work on bettering themselves and to try and focus on other positive things besides sex to do with themselves in trying to deter them from getting involved sexually.................We must remember that there are alot of young women who have already ventured away from what one may think of as an "ideal" situation to have kids in who may need sincere help also without one continuously letting her know how "ideal" her situation is not.
Once it is done a young woman has to find away to make her situation "ideal" for her and her child(ren). In which she can definitely do without some peoples self-righteous bullcrap.

Discgoddess is right it may be a more difficult(depending on ones support system) for those of us, who may have strayed from what some think of as an "ideal" situation, to succeed at certain things at life. BUT that does not mean we can not succeed to the fullest. Success comes in many forms and their is enough out their for all of us to have a nice piece of it. If we are willing to work hard to get it, we shall have it! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

No, our world is not ideal, and I don't claim it to be, but individuals can and do rise to the standards set for them by others (their family, school, community) as well as those they set for themselves (with the help of aforementioned groups). I refuse to believe that we should abandon hope for an ideal, simply because the reality is bleak. If everyone thought that way, we wouldn't be chatting in a forum named after an organization of women who believed in higher ideals than what many in society thought they should aspire to/live out.

I don't think it's self-righteous to hold ourselves and our children to certain ideals, and if delaying sex/children until marriage isn't the ideal of some, then I say fine-just make sure you can handle/finance the ramifications of those acts. That usually is the domain of rational, self-supporting adults.

I don't know if the answer is telling kids NOT to have sex. Do any of you seriously think that if someone had come to you (even if they did), telling you not to have sex if you wanted to, would you have abstained? I've had the experience that if someone tells you NOT to do something, chances are you're going to do it.

The issue here is personal responsibility. I don't know how effective it is to tell kids who are already sexually active to stop having sex, but to advise them of the dangers and to educate them FULLY on safer sex and personal responsibility. They need to know that no guy is too big for a condom, that all sorts of myths about doing it standing up or that having sex for the first time won't get you pregnant just aren't true. They need to know that nothing except abstinence and sterilization is 100% effective.

Maybe "glamourized" is too strong of a word. I think society has made the plight of the young unwed mother look much less difficult than it is, and girls see it just as "oh, I'll have a baby to take care of and love", and not the 18+ year committment it really is. Yes, labor may be "not so bad", but it's the time afterwards which is really hard. Of course, I'm not an unwed mother in high school, so I really don't know.

Yes, I do realize that I am blessed to have two stable parents who love me very much, taught me to be ambitious, and did teach me personal responsibility.

Prettygyrl, it does seem as if you're doing very well for yourself with a child, and you shouldn't be pigeonholed with those who aren't doing well for themselves, and repeat their "mistakes" (I don't know any other word) by having more children.
I think I know why girls who have kids before HS graduation aren't allowed to be debutantes, or at least this was the "traditional" reason and what still applies where I live. I'm not so sure if it's such a BAD thing. Debutante balls were created for those (in the upper classes) who were basically putting their daughters on the "marriage market". These women had usually graduated from high school and college with pristine records, from the best homes. The stigma against unwed mothers was much stronger then than it is now, but unwed mothers who hadn't finished high school were considered "immoral" (take that as you will, I'm just quoting someone who explained this to me). And to some extent, yes, they still are now. At the same time, a girl who was known to be sexually licentious (even without having a baby), drug users, disrespectful, or poor students. It was basically, and still is where I live, "a showcase for good little rich girls who never got caught". The group who did debutante balls where I grew up disbanded before I was of age (but, for the record, I was eligible and had been groomed). I don't think a young unwed mother really fits that description. Sorry to be blunt but it's true.

If anyone would like to discuss anything with me that's related to this topic, but NOT THIS TOPIC, feel free to email. I don't want to be the one responsible for getting this off topic.

Oh yeah...Conskeeted...have you ever had a safer sex program where you showed the girls how everything WORKS? (ie, the way to put a condom on--using a banana or artificial device, etc.). I wonder if the "hands-on" experience could do something for them.

[This message has been edited by AlphaChiGirl (edited February 06, 2001).]

I like your point about getting involved DG. In fact, Alpha Kappa Alpha's Arts target is one of the things that made it attractive to me in the first place.

I took all sorts of dance classes when I was in middle/high school. When I look back on it, all of the girls at my studio graduated High School (many with high GPA's), went to college, and kept our virginity for longer than many of our non-active peers if at all(yes we were all friends and told our business...lol). We also had higher self-esteem than many other girls and had despite what they say about dancers, we had pretty good body image. We were very disciplined and quite proud of our skills that we had worked so hard for. I really think that was the key. We had something other than an infant in our arms to be proud of. Any female with a women's body can have a baby. We had ribbons, trophies, worn ballet shoes, and a standing ovations.

I was lucky to grow up in a place where even if you didn't have the 45 bucks a month to take ballet you could still pay 99 cents for a jump rope and enter the double-dutch tournament. Even though my town was not small, it was very community based. I really do believe that when people come together they DO better.

I just wish there were more community based programs out there. Like DG said, it's not about staring more pregnancy prevention programs. It's about teaching our children with love, attention, and positive examples.

ALPHA CHI GIRL WHEN I WAS IN SCHOOL WE DID NOT HAVE THE DEBUTANTE BALL BUT THEY HAVE IT IN THE SCHOOLS NOW.........TRUTH BE TOLD DEAR THE IMMORALITY OF THE WHOLE ISSUE IS THE PREMARITAL SEX AND IN GODS EYES A WOMAN HAVING SEX BEFORE SHE IS MARRIED IS NO BETTER THAN ONE THAT GETS CAUGHT UP AND HAS A KID, AND IF YOU THINK OTHERWISE YOU ARE SADLY MISTAKEN. GIVING BIRTH IS NEVER A SIN. SO IF YOU ARE OUT THERE OR WERE OUT THERE AT ONE TIME SCREWING WITH NO RING ON YOUR FINGER THEN YOU ARE NO DIFFERENT FROM THE GIRL WITH SIX KIDS DOWN THE WAY, IF YOU THINK YOU OR ANYBODY ELSE THINKS THEY ARE THEN YALL SHOULD BUY A CLUE............SO IF YOU WERE NOT A VIRGIN AT THE TIME YOUR IN HIGHSCHOOL THEN IN TECHNICAL TERMS DEAR YOU DID NOT FIT THE CRITERIA TO BE DEBUTANTE BECAUSE A TRUE DEBUTANTE HAS GONE UNTOUCHED AND IF THAT WAS THE CASE WITH THE SCHOOL IN MY AREA AND SCHOOLS WHERE EVER THEY HAVE THAT MESS I WOULD NOT HAVE ANY PROBLEMS WITH IT BUT LAST YEAR AT THE HIGH SCHOOL HERE THERE WAS A GIRL WHO WAS A DEBUTANTE WHO HAD SLEPT WITH SO MANY GUYS, I'M TALKING GUYS MY AGE(25) BUT YET SHE QUALIFIED TO FRONT IN WHITE BUT THIS OTHER YOUNG LADY THAT ALWAYS VOLUNTEERED WITH US AFTER SCHOOL COULD NOT BE A DEBUTANTE CAUSE SHE HAD A CHILD BY THE BOYFRIEND THAT SHE HAD BEEN WITH ALL THROUGH HIGH SCHOOL HE WAS AND STILL IS THE ONLY BOY SHE HAS EVER BEEN WITH BUT SINCE THEY HAD A CHILD THEY COULD NOT PARITCIPATE BUT THE TOWN HOOKER COULD BECAUSE SHE DID NOT HAVE ANY CHILDREN(DUE MOSTLY TO ABORTIONS) WHATS THE JUSTICE IN THAT? WHEN I WAS IN SCHOOL IT WAS THE POOR LITTLE RICH GIRLS THAT WERE THE BIGGEST SLUTS................


I never said it was self righteous for people to instill their values into their children. That it is fine. One can not instill their values on everyone nor condemn those who do not share the same beliefs though,. As I said before there are some who do not even have parents to instill anything in them, so its not right for others to stand around and pass negative judgements simple as that........I never said give up hope because reality looks bleak, for some hope is all they have. We should all work to better ourselves and better our society we should never give up hope but we must allow people to come around at their own pace. Wanting and aspiring for a perfect world or a world where there is no sin or a world where all sex is had by married folks or whatever floats ones boat in their idea world is fine. To achieve a world of such caliber would require that everyone work together in some aspect and we can not do that if we snub, judge, talk about, mistreat etc, those who have different lives, who have made different choices, and come from different situations. Just because you may not have committed the same wrongs as I have or the same sins as I have, or maybe you have not made the same bad choices that maybe I have..........Still that does not mean that you have not done wrong, or sinned or made a bad choice ..............................So I will say as I always say How can one imperfect mistake making, sinning human being judge another? They can't they just try to and it usually is to either downplay something they did or they have some self-esteem issues to work on for themselves.

If people are not sincerely interested in trying to help a person out then why do people even care what somebody else is doing.


You know how the saying goes if you don't have nothing nice to say then say NOTHING at all.

And my saying is if your not spending your time trying to help and postively uplift others(even if it just simply being understanding) then you should spend your time worrying about yourself and your immediate surroundings because nothing and nobody else is of your concern.

Poplife your are so right and I completely agree with DC O on that poin also.


Oh an ALPHA CHI GIRL I never said how many children I had so you don't know how many "mistakes" as you say, I have made. However many whether its one, two, five , or ten I am handling mine, I am not concerned with myself I never am I concerned with young teenagers who have or may walk the path I have walked. If I could help deter the ones that have not walked it I am pleased and if I can help the ones that are walking a similar path tomine walk it with there head held up high and walk it correctly I am pleased. If I could change just one stuck up, fronting, judgemental persons ways of diminshing these young girls self-esteem then I am fulfilled.

Relax, relate, release.....
Prettygyrl,
I have conversed with you in the past, girl you still have that passion. You can still be anything you want to be in life and I know you'll make it.

Conskeeted I will e-mail you with some possible solutions. It will be kind of long, so I did not want to post it here.

[This message has been edited by bcde (edited February 06, 2001).]