Tight Curls or Silky Straight???
 

Hello all!! I have to do a news article for a journalism class and I need your help. A lot of sisters either choose to wear their hair natural or some choose to go to the salon every 6 weeks and have their hair relaxed...some do it for the convenience, the look, or some may say, trying to emulate European standards of beauty.

What is your opinion??

I'm looking for anyone who has chose to go either route, why you chose that route and your opinions on women who chose to do the opposite of your choice. Also, any comments on the subject as well. My article is due Friday, so, if you like, you may respond to me privately on email at misskriss01@hotmail.com or we can start a discussion right here in the forum!! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Thank you so much for your time and I look forward to your comments!

I stopped perming in high school because I just got tired of the whole chemical process. It's that simple.

I was tired of getting touch ups, having to avoid water unless I was washing my hair, buying all these "maintenance products" to keep my hair from breaking off, getting trims to get rid of WHAT DID break off, not being able to scratch my own head before my appointments, waiting forever in the salon...etc. When I looked at what I was doing to maintain a "look" it started to LOOK really SILLY. So, I just stopped.

People ALWAYS ask me what do I do to my hair. I love to say that glorious "n" word.

NOTHING!

Any natural person can tell you that maintaining a chemical look is a lot more work then being nappy. I threw %90 of my hair products in the trash when I let go of the lye. As of now I own a bottle of shampoo, moisturizer, a pick, a wide-tooth comb, and a bottle of Olive Oil. That's all I need. Talk about wash-and-go!


What do I think of women that perm?

Well, there is only one kind I can't stand. Those are the women that get scared every time they THINK about new growth. The ones that go to get a perm every two weeks to flatten the new growth that hasn't even showed itself yet. It's one thing to like the way a perm looks, but it's another to hate the way YOU look without it. I don’t care what anyone says!! Every black person in AmeriKKKa has been influenced by white culture...you can’t avoid it. BUT, how much someone plays into this influence lies solely in the strength, determination, and awareness of that person. Black has never been nor will it every be beautiful to other people, and they will always make that known to us. Some of us believe it.

There is so much more about being natural that I love, but unless you have experienced it you can’t really understand it.

Being natural is a state of mind. It has to be. You have to be ready to for the mess that the world will throw at you.



[This message has been edited by Poplife (edited January 23, 2001).]

I perm my hair, but only because I feel I have to. My mother started perming my hair when I was two! It is that coarse!
I have wanted to go natrual for a while but I was worried about not having options. I am so used to going to the salon and asking for a ponytail, flip, twist set, parted in the middle or whatever. I am the type that goes to the salon every week. I always ended up spending too much time there (3-5 hours) or too much money. Now that I am a full time student I don't think I can do it anymore. I realized last semester that my hair was one of the largest sources of stress in my life. That is ridiculous! I spent $130 on a weave for this past mini-semester because I knew I would be busy.

As far as perms being a way for us to emulate european standards of beauty...I do think that was the reason for the creation, but it is so much apart of our current culture I wouldn't attribute perms to that.
Poplife-If you have any advice, or any info about how you went through the transformation please e-mail me.

Misskriss01-Thanks for the great topic!

[This message has been edited by spankee (edited January 23, 2001).]

I've spoken on this topic on two previous threads. Two years ago I had shoulder length relaxed hair. I allowed my new growth to grow in for approximately four months and chopped all of my hair off. To my surprise, my hair was naturally curly and manageable in a 'very' close cut. It was very easy in the summer time because it was simply a wash and go style. Come winter I froze. This past summer I decided that I'd try growing it back natural. Problems arose after it got to be about 2-3 inches.
No matter how much I coiled, twisted it, or just let it do whatever it wanted to do I still wasn't satisfied with the look. This stage was a very trying stage for me because I felt that it took much more for me to maintain it naturally. I'm a neat freak and aside from the coils (which took 2 hours to do) I really couldn't get it to look neat.
I then said to hell with it and relaxed it. I am now in the process of growing it relaxed. My point is that I feel no less or no more in touch with my 'roots', if you will. For me, it's truly what I feel comfortable with. My hair doesn't define me. I can easily decide to cut it all off again if the mood strikes me. It's what I like and not what society (African American or Caucasian) dictates.
BTW Poplife, it's true many sisters run to the relaxer when their new growth starts growing. It may seem trivial; however, the fact of the matter is when you have two separate forces growing you will sustain much breakage if you don't stay consistent with the relaxer.

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"Unless you know the road you've come down, you cannot know where you are going"
~Temme proverb, Sierre Leone~

No, No. I said that some women run to the Salon BEFORE they even SEE some knew growth. It's a difference between THAT and actually having some new growth there. I know the deal. I used to do it. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif

Oops, didn't mean to misquote you. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Hey All!
MissKriss this is an interesting topic to do a report on. Good choice!!
Well I haven't had a relaxer for almost four years now. At first I went natural because I thought I needed to (I wore braids for 3 years and read that after taking them out you have to let your hair rest for about a month before perming).
After I wore my hair for that month I knew there was no going back. With natural hair, for the first time in my life I felt beautiful for myself 100%. It was hard at first. Hearing uneducated comments from family and men wore on me. Then I learned to take these comments in stride. Actually wearing my hair natural has filtered out the men who are interested in me genuinely and the men who just wanted me for a certain "look".
Also wearing my hair natural has also had a spiritual impact on my life also. I won't get into all of that now but if you want to hear a little about it send me an email.
Oh and I definitely have to agree with Poplife. Everything you said was on point. You go girl!!

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...Taking control of my beauty... loving me for me...

Thank you everyone for your responses!! It's interesting on how we all feel about this issue.

Classy_Diva5 - what method are you using where you don't have to get a relaxer AND go back and forth between natural and a relaxed look?? Girl, if I tried to do that...well, let's just say it wouldn't work. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Thanks for the comments and keepin' coming!

Originally posted by Classy_Diva5:
To my knowledge, these products have NOT been tested by the FDA for being a cause of cancer, or other health problems. It was stated in a book (can't remember the title) that when autopsies are done on people with relaxed hair, the skull is coated with a light green film/slime.

http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/eek.gif

Classy_Diva5,
Where did you hear this from (and how long ago)? That sets an uneasy feeling to me, especially since relaxers have been used for many years now and the government has not preformed thorough tests.

[This message has been edited by Resplendent_Maria (edited January 23, 2001).]

Actually, my own Grandmother has been hot combing her hair for 5 years since she learned the same thing. She attempted to persuade the rest of the women in family to follow suit, but to no avail.

I do know that people are warned to used caution when perming. I read in article at the FDA website and it admits that RELAXERS DO NOT HAVE TO BE APPROVED BY THE FDA TO BE MARKETED. The only time they can step into action is when there are complaints (i.e. the Rio disaster). The article can be found here:
http://vm.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/fdahdye.html


I’m still unclear as to whether or not they test them, but I’m under the impression that they don’t. If anyone knows please contact me.

I used to relax my hair in the past, because I thought that it was the only way that I could tame my hair to "act" the way I'd like it.

But now that I have found a healthy hair-care specialist, I've learned that I don't need a relaxer. I've been relaxer-free for 1 year 2 months and counting http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif. My hair is a little past shoulder length, & I can wear my hair natural, or if I want to wear it straight, I have her flat-iron it and dry-wrap it-this style lasts me 2-3 weeks.

I've learned a lot about relaxers, and one of the reasons that I stopped getting relaxers is because of the long-term effects. No one really knows what they are. To my knowledge, these products have NOT been tested by the FDA for being a cause of cancer, or other health problems. It was stated in a book (can't remember the title) that when autopsies are done on people with relaxed hair, the skull is coated with a light green film/slime. I definitely DO NOT want to use a product that does that to me! Sure, it gets the hair straight, but is it worth risking the chance of having problems in the future? Now, I only use organic-based products, and they work really well for me.

As far as my opinion on women that use relaxers....
More power to them! I used to use them myself, so I can't judge them for what they do, nor can I say that they are trying to emulate the European beauty standards-even though it was this culture that said that straight=great/nappy=not happy. If they want to alter their hair to have it more managable for them, then that is what they choose to do. But for me, I chose to get rid of the relaxer because I know that I have alternative choices to get the same look that relaxers give.

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"Mind ya own, stay true to ya own, be ya own."
Peace and God Bless
Classy_Diva5

I'm with you girl. There might be long-term side affects that are harming millions of women. But since no testing has taken/will take place, we will never know. That's a Capitalist nation for you. If it's making a lot of money then let it slide. It's kinda scary when you think about it.

I wonder what avid perm wearers would do if relaxers were pulled from shelves. Do you think there would be an underground perming ring?

Poplife-I am at work CRACKIN UP!!! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif
An underground ring!!! I hope that no one takes it that far!

Well, back in the day before relaxers were made by real companies and put on the shelves, they used to boil lye and lard/grease together in a pot and apply it DIRECTLY to the hair/scalp. Now you know that that had to burn like crazy!!! I hope that no one (male or female because we know that some brothas still sport that fresh-outta-the-cell-block permed look, ESPECIALLY here in CALIFORNIA) goes there again.

I know that the FDA won't even go there with testing and all, because if it is true that damage and harm are caused by the use of relaxers, there will be lawsuits flying left and right-myself included http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif.

It's a shame what some companies will put out for us to use just for their own capital gain http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif.


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"Mind ya own, stay true to ya own, be ya own."
Peace and God Bless
Classy_Diva5

Thanks Poplife and Classy_Diva5,

Your info and website was informative. I only began to relax my hair two years ago, and although I like the way my hair is now, I'm thinking about flat ironing my hair and growing out my relaxer.

I have never had a perm before. I wear my hair natural, its about shoulder length. When I want it straight I go and get it pressed.
The trouble is that lately I have wanted to change my look and experiment with different hairstyles. I am not willing to lose length, but I am dying for some new ideas. If anyone has suggestions on how-to books, or how-to magazines (the ones I normally get don't include instructions), I would be eternally grateful.

Hello to all,
I want to start off by saying that I had no idea that perms may be able to have such severe side effects! Like most of you, I have considered/tried going natural. This past fall semester I was in a play called Black Hair 101: Doin' the Do, and it was directed by an African American woman professor. Amongst the cast were many different women with many different hair styles. There were weaves, perms, naturals, fades, dreds, braids and ect. The play explored not how but why african american women do their hair the way they do.

I won't deny that to some degree the social norm for us to straighten our hair has not influenced my decision to continue perming my hair. African American women perm their hair to be straight and White women perm their hair to be curly, so in my opinion its kinda like we imitate each other. My hair grows fast so I have to get perms every 4 weeks, but one time I let it grow out for about 8 weeks. During this time I discovered that I simply did not have the patience to wait for my hair to grow out, so I got a perm. My hair is healty and overall I haven't had many damage problems as a result of my perm. I will admit however, that the slimmy scalp concerns me !

I guess the point that I am trying to make is that just like the clothes I wear, my hair is a medium of expression for me. The main reason I perm my hair, and why many other women perm their hair, is for versatility. My perm allows me to achieve many different looks and styles to reflect my individuality. I do understand that to different women hair means different things. But to me thats what it means.

Synamynn
"To get something you've never gotten, do something you've never done!"

i hate my curls....i get flat irons alot and never perm my hair. going natural for me is wearing my hair curly instead of straight. BUT ALAS!! i have found my hubby Paul Mitchell...(sorry pop, you know i luv you!) i'm sorry but i got that "WG hair" so i gotta use those WG products. but ever since i started using his setting lotion while blowdrying, it has "relaxed my curls a SIGNIFICANT amount... http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

anyway i just thought i'd give my hairstylist a quick plug. he des my hair better than any female could. lol http://www.metropolitanhair.com/jiggie.htm

Little32 you might find some ideas on there


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The truly educated never graduate!

[This message has been edited by meeks (edited January 24, 2001).]

Well, I would go back to the "hot" comb!
Cause this sistagirl, is NOT about to sport a "bush"...lol http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif

Thank you all! Your replies have really helped me develop a very interesting story for my class.

Personally, for easy maintenance, I choose to relax my hair. My hair is VERY coarse and even I went natural, I would have to use some kind of texturizer to be able to put a comb through it.

I've considered going natural but I just can't see it for myself. But I respect sisters who can do it.

Thanks again for helping me out!!! I appreciate it. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Around my senior year in high school, one of my good friends cut off all her hair. The reasoning behind her move brought up a big discussion amoung our circle of friends. As we began to do more and more self evaluation, one by one we all found ourselves making the change.

The biggest question pondered was why we got our hair permed in the first place? Although each of us had different answers, only one conclusion could be made...We were ashamed. Then we thought about the source of that shame and figured why be ashamed of the way our hair grows from our scalps. "They" are not ashamed of how "theirs" grows. And why be facinated with how long your hair grows, it's genetically determined anyway. ( It's so funny to hear some people say they cant get their hair to grow past a certain point. That's because genetically that is you stopping point. But I digress...) So in an effort to take back power that we felt was stolen from us moe than four hundred years ago, we got rid of the perm.

I felt a difference in my spirit almost immediately. It gave me a certain assertiveness that was not there when I claimed "their" ignorance.

In the seven years since my decision, I haven't regreted it once. I feel like I've gotten to know a side of myself that I don't think I ever would have known otherwise.

Today, I feel like whatever I do to my hair is not rooted in the legacy of slavery. I can wear twists, after-twists, a big blown out Angela Davis, the afro puff, or I can get it pressed. But whatever I do it's because I want to not because I'm ashamed and I feel I have to.

The rest of Y'all are on your own (meaning I have other things to think about than whos doing what to their hair and why). I don't judge anyone for what they look like. As long as you are comfortable with who you are, I'm comfortable with you. Besides, when my hair is pressed I'm not going to be walking around with a banner saying "IT'S NOT A PERM. REALLY. IT'S NOT."

Get out of my head, Serenity. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

You sound a lot like me. People cannot believe my press is NOT a perm. I rarely wear my hair straight anymore (can't remember the last the time I did), but it's all good. I like fact that I CAN have my hair blowing in the wind if I want to. *lol* I don't choose to because 1.) I just don't like that look anymore and 2.) The idea of wearing my hair straight makes me think about how overly-sensitive black women are about their natural hair. It's like they are ashamed of it. I don't want to play into that.

The "versatility" reason has always interested me because I see it a different way. I can wear all the styles that I could when I was perming and PLUS all the hot new natural styles that won't work with straight hair. To me that's versatility.

This year I came to the conclusion that perms are a trap. Not just physically, but mentally. Think about it:

1.) Perms are designed to break down the keratins in your hair making it weak. Women like to think that because their hair doesn't break off when you perm that it is healthy. But when your natural hair (the truly healthy hair) grows in, the permed part starts to break off. Why? The natural part is A LOT stronger then the broken down compounds in the permed hair. As a result permed hair cannot "stand up" to natural hair and falls off. That's why you see breakage when you miss a touch-up. They think that's what it will be like if they stop perming so they get scared and get more chemicals. That's the ROOT of the problem (pun intended).


2.) Some women go a month or two without perming and try and judge their "natural" hair by what's sitting at the roots. They think that it was they will be working with should they stop perming. It's not that easy people! Your hair texture WILL CHANGE over time. My hair was DREADFUL when it was just an inch at my scalp, but luckily I was patient enough to let it grow. Now it's baby soft around the edges/root while the length grows in a spiral pattern. How do you know that natural hair "would work" unless you tried. And I mean REALLY tried; tried to learn how to treat your hair like it is supposed to be treated...


3.) Why in the world would a black women need the courage to go natural? If one more person comes up to me and says that I will scream. I have never seen a white girl say that she is scared to grow out HER perm. It's embedded in many women's minds that they will look ugly in afros, bushes, locs, twists, dreads, or natural curls. That is why we always hear "It looks good on some people, but not on me."


4.) The issue: with not being able to get a comb through it. Most combs are made straight hair, not for kinky black hair. Besides, you can't treat natural hair as you would permed hair. It's totally different, but most people don't realize that. They try to go about their hair care routine as if they were permed. Sorry, that's impossible.

misskriss01: there was really NO method that I used-Nov.'99, I decided that I wanted to grow my relaxer out, so I go to the shop twice a month. My stylist gives a shampoo, deep condition, virgin olive oil hot oil treatment, cuts between 1/4 to an inch of hair off, and then if I want to wear it silky straight, she flat-irons my hair and dry-wraps it (wraps the hair around my head and then place me under the dryer for about 15-20 minutes). I comb it down, and I'm good to go for about 2-3 weeks.

Poplife-I am in the same boat as your grandmother. Since learning that relaxers aren't tested by the FDA http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/mad.gif (because relaxers/products generate so much $$$ in sales, I am pretty sure that they will NEVER be tested because if there are harmful effects, they may have to be pulled from the beauty supply stores), I will never put that stuff on my hair again. Also, thanks for giving the link on your most recent post.

naturalbeauty08-I feel you 100% on the change to going natural http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif. The first month of going relaxer-free, I knew that people would question why I chose to go that route. When I had my relaxer, I would always hear "Your hair is soooo pretty"-now when i wear my hair straight, people CANNOT believe that I don't have a relaxer-it's like they think that you have to have one to have "pretty" hair. As long as you take proper care of your hair once you decide to go natural, you can achieve the same look that you had as when you had a relaxer.


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"Mind ya own, stay true to ya own, be ya own."
Peace and God Bless
Classy_Diva5

I guess that is supposed to be directed to me...
Anyway, I did not sport a bush in the 70's, my hair was wayyyyyy too long! And I am NOT going to sport a bush in the year 2K1!

I am not afraid, I just do not want to, and I will not.

Now, if it floats your boat, cool!

You have your hair care ideas, I have mine and so does the next person...

Nope. That's what I always say. Would have said it regardless of what you said. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif

F.Y.I. All four of my "ideas" are FACT. You can read any natural hair care book and it will tell you the same thing.

I decided to kill the perm that was killing my hair and body http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif my sophomore year of college. Why? well I was watching some little girls, I can't remember who they were, but they were black and were playing house. While they were playing, they put slips and blankets on their head to cover up their own hair. They were playing like they had long straight hair.
Now I used to do the same thing, but it REALLY bothered me. Most people in my family are natural so I was the one "holding it down" for the permed heads. But then I thought about my daughter (future, hypothetical daughter) and asked myself how I would feel if she asked me about straightening her hair...

Here I was this "pro-black freedom fighter", but I realized at that moment that I had an issue: at that time, I could not see myself as beautiful, the way God made me. Now I do NOT have self esteem issues (unless too much esteem is a problem http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif. so for me to realize that the very CONCEPT of me being beautiful the way I was created was something I had issue with, REALLY upset me. After a few months of going back and forth, I finally realized that this s*&^ had to go. And I have been perm free ever since.
Now, admittedly, I could be a pro-black freedom fighter w/ a perm; conversely, NOT having a perm in no way assures one of being "conscious". But for me, it was very hypocritical to uphold the idea that "Black is beautiful" when I didn't truly KNOW for myself that it was or even could be.
Going natural has been a very spiritual experience for me as well. Simple things like, I LOVE standing in the shower, washing my hair and feeling it exploding all over my head--that may sound odd to some, but I'm trying to explain a feeling here, and that is difficult.
There were no other natural heads at my school when I made the switch; at least if there were, I didn't see them (I went to school in central Pennsylvania, black population was small, so I expect that I would have known them! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif) and that was hard. I really wish I'd had this thread when I first started.
And you're right, they aren't testing, or planning to test perms...and they really should. I do know that women are advised to leave the perm alone during pregnancy...which in a way begs some questions: if it's harmful to the baby for you to perm during pregnancy, wouldn't it still harmful for you to breast feed while perming? or better yet, if it's harmful to babies, at what age is it no longer harmful? seven? eight? 20 something? ever?
Now I'm on a roll http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif. If we know that perm chemicals can harm us physically, is it really a stretch to wonder how it impedes our mental capacity, ability (it does go on our heads afterall)? If you didn't know whether or not a box of cereal contained chemicals that cause life long negative effects on your daughter or not, would you still let her eat it in the morning on her way to school? Just something to think about.

[This message has been edited by 1 Woman of Virtue (edited January 25, 2001).]

A couple of questions for you Poplife.. What do you mean your hair was DREADFUL when you first started to grow it out? What if it didn't end up "baby soft around the edges" and in spiral patterns at the ends? What if you had those little be-be shots that we used to tease boys about in the 2 - 3 grade (usually because they didn't comb their hair.) Would you be as proud to be nappy then? Would you still give folks who perm a hard time? Is a texturizer more "BSC" (Black socially correct--my new made up term) than a perm or does it not make a difference cause it's all chemical? What about a blow out kit? Is that o.k.?

Now, I'm not about to "justify" why I relax my hair. But in response to the question, I do it for convience, versatility, and most importantly BECAUSE I WANT TO. It's my hair and I'll do what I want with it. I know that my hair will look good naturally, but my hair looks TIGHT in the silky straight hairstyle I've got now.

I've seen a lot of women on this board and not just for this question "justify" what they choose to do. More specifically those who went natural. I don't believe that anyone-natural/not natural, should have to defend their actions or QUESTION why others do what they do.

If you are truly happy with YOURSELF and your decisions then what others say to you shouldn't bother you-no need in "justifying" yourself. Moreover, if you do something that someone else doesn't do, why worry about what they are doing, feeling, or acting and then try to inform them of what they are doing so that they change their perspective? We are all educated (hopefully) people here and we EACH know what we are doing. If it isn't YOUR hair then don't be concerned.

Now ain't that the T-Ruth. LOL

Because everybody doesn't have that "indian" in their family. Hence, they get a relaxer.

Good Questions, Eclipse.

When I say "dreadful", that's in the literal sense. My natural hair would coil itself in the same way that dreadlocks do. It made it very hard for me to manage my hair because I had two drastically different textures on a single strand.

My original plan was to loc my hair as soon as I grew enough. If I didn't have the softness and the curl I would have gone ahead with the locing. But I liked my hair so much "untamed" that I decided to let it be. I might loc it later on in life, but right now I am enjoying the versatility of wearing twists, afro puffs, fluffy ponytails, and the like.

As for the be-be's (or buckshots as we say down here), why would I be ashamed of that? Do YOU have those when you don't touch up, and are YOU ashamed?? Do you think the only people that can be proud of their natural hair are people that have some curl like me? That's the vibe your giving me. Shoot, naps are a natural part of being black. Besides, I don't have what some call "good hair". It's pretty, but it's rough! It's brittle in the back, soft at the roots and in the front, and curly on the ends. I'm just so used to it that the idea doesn't phase me. Like you said, buckshots only happen when you don't comb your hair. I don't know what notions you might have of natural headed people, but most of us are meticulous groomers. I wash my hair 5 times a week (minimum) and every night I moisturize, comb, twist, and wrap. All of my natural friends have similar grooming habits.

You might feel that I am trying to give permed people a hard time, but that is not my intent. I just want people to question themselves and their reasoning. Like I was telling someone before, it's not fun but it's helpful in the long run.

I don't like chemicals period. I believe them to be toxic for the black women's body as well as her spirit. Occasionally I feel like wearing the “loose curl look”. I just grab some CD hair milk, slap it on after a shower, and roll out. BAM! Instant natural texturizer. There’s nothing wrong with experimenting. But I consider a texturizer one of my “traps” since you go through the same things with a full relaxer.

What's a blow-out kit?

That goes back to what I asked Eclipse.

Why is the only "acceptable" natural hair, white girl curly/bi-racial natural?

My hair is still "black hair". It's funny that people hear "curly" and automaticly think of silky, bouncy, pantene pro-v curls. Ain't nothing silky on this head! I got an afro...it's just curly. *lol*

Too bad I'm a "hopeful" because I'd show you some pictures. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif

This is so true!!! When you perm your hair, the relaxer does not just get applied to the hair, it gets on the scalp. And as others have mentioned, it obviously is absorbed by the scalp and your hair folicles. this means thst the hair that was in the process of growing inside your scalp at the time of your perm will be affected by the chemicals as well. Therefore, when it starts to grow out, it is hard and brittle and dry. This is not the natural texture of your hair.

Lord, Child you don't know what a blow out kit is??? LOL I guess I'm showing my age, huh! Blow out kits were very popular in the 70s when The Michael Jackson/Foster Silvers (you have heard of the Silvers, right?) look was quite popular. It was designed to make your afro bigger by using chemicals and heat to strech out the curl pattern a bit. They were the rage. Ask you momma 'nem, they'll tell you!

Now, as for the vibe I'm giving you...I don't think any of those things. My questions came from your assertions that a person's hair texture will probably change (like yours did) after they get rid of the perm and the "DREADFUL" state is not a permanant (no pun intended!) state. When I read this, I took from it that because of this a person should not be 'scared' to go natural. Since I didn't want to put words in your mouth, I decided to ask. I was trying to determine if your hair had stayed "DREADFUL" (your word, not mine) if you would have continued with your decision and trying to understand why you, with your 'happy to be nappy' self, would use such a word to discribe your natural hair texture. It may not have been the permanant texture, but it was the natural texture. BTW...in the literal sense "dreadful" means "Causing great fear or anxiety". Most of the consciously loc'ed (meaning they are doing it for political or religious reasons) folks that I know detest the word "dreadlocks" as a friend of my says (I think she is quoting someone else) "Ain't nothing DREADFUL about my HAIR" I guess you could have meant the 3rd defination (according to my dictionary "inspiring awe!"

Eclipse

Oh yeah...who said I ever got/needed a touch up? I might have 'good hair' that leads me not to use chemicals. (And I will leave it up to YOU to define 'good hair'!) http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif

Dag, I forget that I'm not talking to close circle of natural friends.

"Dreadful" is a sarcastic term my friends and I concocted to describe what a lot of hair . We don't use it as a derogatory term...more like a explanation of texture. Like I said, we used it to describe hair that "dreads" on it's own. I say "dreadlock" because if you just say "loc" it's a slightly different look. Locs are tubular and Dreads are more angular.

I will rephase with just for you. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif

"My new growth was very tightly coiled when I first stopped perming."


New growth is NOT the true natural texture. As Serenity said, it's the fake me out natural that still has the chemicals on it that seeped through the scalp. It takes a while for your hair to purify itself. After that's done your true hair will come out. That's why I personally don't count new growth as natural hair.

Quote:

Oh yeah...who said I ever got/needed a touch up? I might have 'good hair' that leads me not to use chemicals. (And I will leave it up to YOU to define 'good hair'!)!"

Good hair is hair that does exactly what you want. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif

Whether you perm or not, the tone you used when talking about nappy hair lead me to believe that you don't like it. You tell me which is worse: A black person with kinky hair that hates it, or a black person with "mixed"/straight hair that hates kinks?

Both are self-defeating.

[This message has been edited by Poplife (edited January 25, 2001).]

I've been geeting my hair permed since I was 4 years old, and I wouldn't have it any other way! The natural look just isn't for me. Getting my hair permed is what I'm used to and it's what I've know as long as I can remember. I perm and style my own hair so it's not a hassle to take care of my hair. I love my permed tresses and I'll keep it that way. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif No one in my family has kept their hair natural for their entire lifetime w/ the exception of my great grandmother (God, rest her soul).

Girl, how did you get all of that out of my ONE sentence? If I didn't say all that, then don't assume that's what I meant. I was just stating a fact that some black people deal with. It was just a joke, lighten up, and I wasn't referring to you. You're alright, be natural. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

I'm not a joking type of girl.

I just had to come back and add a few more comments. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

I think that as black women, we are the most diverse group of creatures to ever walk this earth. We come in a variety of different shapes, sizes and colors, and each of us is very unique. Being a black women, we have so many options as to what to do with our hair, which is what makes being a black woman so wonderful. I believe our personality speaks through our hair. If one chooses to relax their tresses, "lock 'em up", or just let it curl up, we must respect each other's choice. Just because a woman chooses to get a relaxer doesn't make her any more/less black than the woman who chooses to wear afro puffs.

There is chemical and disease engineering going on everywhere. Unless you are a hermit, living in the back hills of Kentucky somewhere, growing and herding your own food, you are subject to some kind of "exposure" to unknown chemicals. It's everywhere - who knows, maybe not only your relaxers but your shampoo and conditioners!!

All I really want to say is that hair is a form of expression in some respects. Whether you choose to go straight, go natural or go jheri curl, it's all about you!! Period. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif

Obviously. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif

My question is.Why does the topic of hair get so dang touchy? Personally I really think it was great for you guys to educated the "Permed Ones" such as myself on what we're doing to our bodies. Honestly it did make me think for a second.

On the same token it didn't make me want to stop at once either (my choice, it may sound crazy but this whole world is a little looney) http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/eek.gif
Maybe one day, but not today. I did leave the boards with a little more to think about as far as my perming goes but this whole thing leaves me feeling as though some are being a bit self rightous. You went natural and bravo, but no matter how much you try to bang people's heads ther's still gonna be a bit of perming going on. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif But as you made the joke (or not) before POP about the underground perm thing...I really don't think it'll come to that http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/tongue.gif


[This message has been edited by exquizit (edited January 25, 2001).]

One thing about life: we all see it through the veils of our experiences. I could just as easily say that those of you w/ perms started in on the convo feeling like you had to defend yourself and your beliefs from us natural heads. I think both may have a touch of truth.
While I don't think anyone on this thread was attempting to bang anyone's head in, we all had an opportunity to engage in meaningful, challenging discussion. And that my dear sisterfriends is a wonderful part of being a woman--we just got it like that! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif
If any one felt like their toes were getting crunched on--either in this thread or any other, or life in general--we need to examine why. Don't just assume that it is because you were attacked...maybe your stance on the issue was not well stated and that is what others were responding to, then http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif there is the chance that you (me, whoever, the person in question) were just wrong (hey, it happens). In any event, I must say that this forum is one of the FEW that I have found where memberfriends and sisterfriends can engage in some semblance of real discussion, and I greatly appreciate it. God Bless.


[This message has been edited by 1 Woman of Virtue (edited January 25, 2001).]

(from the AMEN bench)

VERY WELL SAID!

THERE ARE MORE IMPORTANT THINGS GOING ON IN THIS WORLD! GEESH! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/eek.gif

NEXT THREAD, PUHHHLLLLLEEEZZZZEE! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif