A Warning To Canadians!!!
 

Just wanted to give you all the heads-up that malcontents are headed your way...

NEW YORK (July 19) - For all they share economically and culturally, Canada and the United States are increasingly at odds on basic social policies - to the point that at least a few discontented Americans are planning to move north and try their neighbors' way of life.

A husband and wife in Minnesota, a college student in Georgia, a young executive in New York. Though each has distinct motives for packing up, they agree the United States is growing too conservative and believe Canada offers a more inclusive, less selfish society.

``For me, it's a no-brainer,'' said Mollie Ingebrand, a puppeteer from Minneapolis who plans to go to Vancouver with her lawyer husband and 2-year-old son. (for the love of Pete, it's not like we're overflowing with qualified puppeteers to begin with and now this woman is packing up and leaving! It's just not right)

``It's the most amazing opportunity I can imagine. To live in a society where there are different priorities in caring for your fellow citizens.''

For decades, even while nurturing close ties with the United States, Canadians have often chosen a different path - establishing universal health care, maintaining ties with Cuba, imposing tough gun control laws. Two current Canadian initiatives, to decriminalize marijuana and legalize same-sex marriage, have pleased many liberals in the United States and irked conservatives.

New York executive Daniel Hanley, 31, was arranging a move for himself and his partner, Tony, long before the Canadian announcement about same-sex marriage. But the timing delights him; he and Tony now hope to marry in front of their families after they emigrate to British Columbia.

``Canada has an opportunity to define itself as a leader,'' Hanley said. ``In some ways, it's now closer to American ideals than America is.''

Though many gay American couples are now marrying in Canada, virtually all return home, hoping court rulings will lead to official recognition of their unions.

Hanley's situation is different because Tony - a Southeast Asian - is not a U.S. citizen. The men worried that Tony could be forced to leave the United States after his student visa expires in two years: They were elated when Canada's immigration agency said they could move there as partners.

Hanley, who works for a Fortune 500 company in Manhattan, (the Union Square McDonald's maybe?)doesn't know how the move will affect his career.

``It's a challenge, it's scary,'' he said. ``We'll have to drop everything we know here, go up there and figure it out.''(two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun)

Thomas Hodges, a computer systems major at Georgia State University, said his dismay with American politics started him thinking last year about going abroad. He recently wrote an article in a campus journal titled, ``Why I Am Moving To Canada.''

``I'm thinking about Toronto, though I hear it's cold up there,'' (gee, ya think???)Hodges, a lifelong Southerner, said in a telephone interview.

Hodges, 21, complained about a ``neo-conservative shift'' in the United States and praised Canada's approach to health care and education.

``The U.S. educational system is unfair - you have to live in certain areas to go to good schools,'' he said.

Rene Mercier, spokesman for Canada's immigration department, said any upsurge in U.S.-to-Canada immigration based on current political developments won't be detectable for a few years, because of the time required to process residency applications.

During the Vietnam War, U.S. emigration to Canada surged as thousands of young men, often accompanied by wives or girlfriends, moved to avoid the draft. But every year since 1977, more Canadians have emigrated to the United States than vice versa - the 2001 figures were 5,894 Americans moving north, 30,203 Canadians moving south.

Mollie Ingebrand, 34, said she has felt an affinity for Canada for many years, fueled partly by respect for its health care system. Her doubts about the United States go back even further, to a childhood spent with liberal parents in a relatively conservative part of Ohio.

``In school I was always told this is the best country on earth, and everyone else wants to be American, and that never really rang true to me,'' she said. ``As I got older, it occurred to me there were other choices.''

Her husband, George, 44, has spent little time in Canada, but said it seems to offer a more relaxed, less competitive way of life. He has no qualms about leaving his law practice and selling the family's upscale home in Minneapolis.

``I don't idealize Canada the way my wife does, but I'm ready for an adventure,'' he said. ``I don't know what I'm going to be facing. That's what I'm reveling in.''

The Ingebrands have completed the first batch of paperwork to apply for Canadian residency, hoping their talents and finances compensate for lack of specific job offers. As Minnesotans, they look forward to Vancouver's wet but mild climate: ``Green all year, no mosquitos,'' Mollie said.(won't all that humidity warp the puppets? Doesn't she care about them??)
At Georgia State, Hodges said some conservative schoolmates have challenged his proposed move to Canada, saying he would be abandoning his homeland.

Conversely, Mollie Ingebrand says some of her friends - people who share her left-of-center views - argue that she should stay at home to battle for changes here.

``I've been there and done that,'' Molly said. ``I don't want to stay and fight anymore. I can have that bittersweet love for my country from somewhere else.'' (Fine, just pack your puppets and go. There'll be other, better puppeteers to take your place)

David Crary - AP

I am not prepared to emigrate yet lol. But I have been worried about how much both the politicians and the media teach us to be afraid of each other and how our civil liberties are being seriously infringed on . . We are heading closer and closer to a police state.

Alright.

I think these ppl are forgetting that Canada, like the U.S., has many diverse regions of social policy. Very conservative values remain in our political system, check out the late Stockwell Day's platform and his popularity at the time.

Also, within 50 years you'll see a union of Canada-U.S. (like constitution, no border and a standardized system of social policy). Necessity dictates as such, it's only a matter of time.

Are you saying you like our social system better and you would like to see Canada conform to what we think you should be?

Boy, that post seems a bit on the.. er.. jingoistic side.

I'm American. I moved to Canada. I'm going to become a Canadian citizen, and I'm not moving back to the States.

Maybe it would help if we thought of it in terms of choosing a GLO? We all found something in our respective organizations that spoke to us, and now we're proud to call them home. I think of my move to Canada pretty much in the same terms. *shrug*

Oh, and I'm not a puppeteer, nor do I work at McDonalds'. :D

Did you make the move for a boy?

Not jingoistic at all. Those people are exercising their right to leave and that's perfectly fine with me. Although the puppet lady did remind me a little of Gregory Hines' character in a movie called "White Nights". He was an American who wanted to make a *big statement* about all that was wrong with the US so he emigrated to the Soviet Union but wanted to return to the States once all the publicity wore off. **Please don't take that statement personally; it's in no way directed at you! It's one thing to just up and do your thing but you can do that without notifying the Associated Press!

Off subject: SisterMadly, I always thought you were in Alaska for some reason. Is there another APhi who posts here who lives in Alaska?

HMMMMM, never been to Canada!

Hear they are all HEATHENS!:(

Still the backwoods and mountain types!;)

I wonder at times why so many Movie Pix and TV Shows are filmed there:confused:

EH!:cool:

if they're moving to canada, I think they should take their little popster Avril back with them. :p

You do know that it is the Americans who make these Canadian Popstars big, like Avril and Celine.

I don't like either. If you don't want them playing on your radios you shouldn't have made them big. Because quite frankly, you don't "make it big" until you have "made it" in the US.

Therefore you have no one to blame but yourselves.

Killarney!!! I was going to post this as well. You were a step ahead of me. I just saw it this morning!

I see where they're coming from. I've always thought Canada was beautiful and the people there have been very welcoming to me each time I've been. It would be good for a change of pace, especially for a mosquito infested Southerner like me. I of course have no plans to do so, but for the people who have the chutzpah I think it's a cool thing to do.

Personally, I've always wanted to move to Prince Edward Island and live in Green Gables & teach in a little schoolhouse.... But then I found my Gilbert in Dallas, & my Diana Berry lives in Plano, so there was no need.... Still plan on visiting one day...
http://www.homestead.com/rosebuddz/f...ics/ang224.jpg

Killarney-love your editorial comments on that article. It is indeed a sad day that we are losing a great puppeteer.

If we're shipping off Avril and Celine, can they take Shania back, too? Just a thought...

If they're moving here, can I move into the Puppet People's House? The USA does have way better shopping than Canada.

Tom,
We're not all heathens, but you will recognize we Canadians by our fuzzy green antennae... ;) Once Sistermadly becomes a Canadian citizen, she too will start sprouting her fuzzy green antennae like the rest of us!

As for movies and TV shows, they film here, because it's CHEAP(er) than filiming in USA. Or something like that. The US dollar has strong purchasing power in Canada.

Neither.
Social policy change is constant, and will be a peacemeal product of something similar to the EU. Bits and pieces taken from different sources.

OMG, you are awesome for bringing up Anne of Green Gables! The only thing I know about Canada I learned from LM Montgomery!:D

I already have nubbins! :D

James: we made a list of pros and cons. The biggest point in Canada's favor: Immigrating here is MUCH easier than immigrating to the States. Plus, hubby's profession isn't in demand in the US, but my profession qualifies under NAFTA, which made me a desirable candidate.

But back when I graduated from University, I actually considered moving to Windsor, ON just because I was tired of living in the US. I had relatives in Detroit, so Windsor was a logical choice. Canada was always a possibility for me, but meeting the boy made it a certainty. :)

(Woo-hoo! My 800th post!)

You are well on your way!

I've always loved Anne of Green Gables. Gilbert Blythe is so foxy!

I do agree with many of Canada's ideas on gun control, same-sex marriage, weed, etc.

"If I hear one more time about a fool's right to his tools of rage, I'm gonna take all my friends and I'm going to move to Canada and we're going to die of old age." ~Ani DiFranco, "To The Teeth"

However, it's important to keep in mind that socialized medicine is not all it's cracked up to be, as I'm sure many of our Canadian GCers can tell us. And AFAIK, where you live in Canada has certain bearing on where you go to school, nor are all Canadian schools the same from neighborhood to neighborhood. If you don't believe me, read Peter McLaren's Life In Schools.

DISCLAIMER: I was forced to read Life in Schools in an education class. I am not a Communist.

if they want to leave, that's fine. That goes for anyone else who isn't happy in the US.

I wouldn't. Besides being a happy Texan, i don't think i could drop my y'all and learn to start saying eh? and hoser after everything i said.

Kitso
KS 361 times y'all can go to hell, i'm a-going to Texas

For the record I have NEVER used the term Hoser...EVER!!!

Also I need socialized health care. As a diabetic is is impossible or near to impossible for me to get health insurance. The only way I can get health/life insurance is if it is part of a benefits package from an employer.

So moving to the US is not really an option for me unless a) I suddenly come into a LOT of money, b) I marry a very rich man, or c) I get a good job with great benefits.

Also KappaKittyCat, I'm not sure what you mean where you live in Canada has bearing on where you go to school. Isn't it the same in the US?

"Yourselves" does not represent all of the "U.S." You act like every single one of us has the ability to control what is played on our radio stations.

And some of you act like it's our fault there are singers like Avril and Celine. I have no control over them any more than you do.


ETA: I was also being sarcastic in my original post. I apoligize if it didn't come off that way.

Wait a second . . . Diabetes disqualifies you for health inurance?

Yes, yes it does. With diabetes there are risks of certain complications, like eye problems, liver, kidney, heart, circulation problems. Having diabetes is a risk factor for insurance companies. Therefore, if I were to get insurance my premiums would be very high, and that's assuming I can find a company that would carry me.

Fortunately I have an insurance plan with my school, so my prescriptions are partially covered. However as soon as I graduate I am SOL. Unless I can find a full time job that will give me benefits.

Most pre-existing conditions will prevent you from getting health insurance. Diabetes and asthma are two potentially very expensive illnesses, with maintenance and hospitalization. Luckily, my parents (and my father's employer) have agreed to pay for my health care as long as I remain a full-time student.

Amen to that! If they want to leave, cool..more power to them! don't let the door hit 'em on the way out :p

j/k ;)

Will move? don't know. I wanna get engaged first.

Lady Pi Phi, you're right. It is the same in the US. I was responding to the following incorrect assertion in the original article.

Regarding the educational institutions: is it possible she was talking about grade school, not university? I know that until they put "magnet" schools in my home town, if you lived in a certain geographical area, you pretty much had to go to the school in that area, even if it wasn't the best.

I don't know if this is a widely observed practice all over the US though.