BCS rankings just don't make sense
 

Hey all... wondering what everyone thinks of the NCAA Football BCS rankings...

Teams are listed below by this weeks BCS ranking. # in parenthesis is the strength of that team's schedule.

IMO, it is NOT all that IMPRESSIVE to have Miami and Ohio State undefeated when they are playing the nation's 18th and 21st toughest schedules. Or Iowa at #5 w one loss but the 40th toughest schedule (sorry IowaHawkeye).

And then there are my USC Trojans at #6 with 2 losses (against top 15 teams, on the road) and the #1 toughest schedule in the nation.

Doesn't it seem like more weight should be given to the strength of schedule than there currently is? Esp if, for instance, USC and Michigan at #1 and #2 in strength of scheds are ranked so much lower than teams not even anywhere near playing the toughest schedules. Ohio State barely squeaked past Michigan this weekend, and OSU is #2, UM 11? Doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

1. Miami (18)
2. Ohio State (21)
3. Oklahoma (24)
4. Georgia (10)
5. Iowa (40)
6. USC (1)
7. Notre Dame (29)
8. Washington State (27)
9. Texas (22)
10. Kansas State (60)
11. Michigan (2)
12 Colorado (7)
13 FLorida (8)
14 Penn State (11)
15 Colorado State (30)

That said, OMG i am loving the season my team is having!! :)

Maaaaaan,

Who else will be praying for a Miami loss so the Sooners get into the championship game??

ktsnake? i KNOW you're with me on this one. That is assuming of course the Sooners beat OSU and beat the North representatvie in the Big XII title game, which i think they will.

Boomer Sooner!

Kitso
KS 361 points i hope Syracuse scores on the 'Canes this weekend

They always rank Texas to high. They have lost 2 games and they are still in the top 10??? They should have dropped out of the top 10 with the loss to Texas Tech.

Don't worry AXO, i have a feeling tu will be out of the top 10 after Friday ;)

Kitso <---eternal optimist when it comes to Aggie Football
KS 361

Re: BCS rankings just don't make sense
 

I will co-sign the last sentiment, although I've not intensely followed college football this year. The Carson Palmer Heisman question is burning up the L.A. sports talk radio airwaves.
:cool:
(1986 USC graduate, BTW).

Go Hawks :)
 

Personally - I agree that the BCS rankings are a bunch of BS. But Iowa only has 1 loss and USC has 2 - so personally, I believe Iowa should be ranked above USC. We beat 2 top 15 teams (UM/PSU) on the road and have had a great season with a possible heisman winner (banks).

If youre going to have strength of schedule be so heavly weighted - I think margin of victory should come into play as well. I agree, Ohio State had an awesome year at 13-0, but some of those games they barely got by (Purdue- last minute heroics/IL in overtime/Michigan) did they get penalized for that? Not really.

It would be RIDICULOUS if USC beats ND this weekend (and I hope they do) and still doesn't earn a Rose Bowl invitation b/c WSU won this weekend and holds the tiebreaker (head to head winner)

Teams like FSU, not even in the top 15 - who earn an automatic BCS bowl bid just b/c theyre conference champ - don't deserve it and shouldn't get the bid.

Oh well - until the BCS system is fine-tuned or we turn to a playoff system, nothing we can do but complain...

Iowa, I agree with you, and I'd love to see a USC-Iowa Rose Bowl pitting Heisman candidates Palmer and Banks against one another. Now that would be a great game.

But the whole FSU with what, 5 losses, getting an automatic BCS bowl is RIDICULOUS.

Ohio State not getting penalized for the games IowaHawkeye mentioned, but USC getting penalized for the 3 pt OT loss to WSU and 7 pt loss to Kansas State? Or, WSU dropping from 3 to 8 because of a 3 pt loss in TRIPLE OT to UW?

And Margin of Victory-- YES YES YES. Would help my cause, as USC's only barely squeaked by victory was to Cal at 30-28.

We beat Auburn 24-17
Colorado State 40-3
Oregon State 22-0
Washington 44-21
Oregon 44-33
Stanford 49-17
ASU 34-13
UCLA 52-21

All very SOLID wins.

and lost to
WA State 30-27 in OT
Kansas State 27-20

Does not seem the rules are applied fairly across the board.

IMO, the top 8 teams should get the BCS slots, PERIOD. Screw FSU's auto bid and Wash St getting rose Bowl because of head-to-head tie breaker thing. Of course, WA State has to get past UCLA on the 7th, and possibly w/o Jason Gesser. And after USC humiliatiion of UCLA, I think UCLA may just be able to pull out the win, and then USC would get the Rose Bowl that we deserve.

Oh, and Wash state LOST this past weekend to UW in triple OT.
They play UCLA on Dec 7th, they lose, Rose Bowl is USC's, cause they'd have 2 conference losses, while we only have one.

The only real solution I could give ya'll in this matter would be have an 8 team playoff. The top 8 teams in the BCS would be included. You could use existing bowls to form the playoff system and then keep your non-BCS and low-ranked bowls around for unworthy teams.

I think in a Playoff you'd get a *REAL* champion, someone who was consistant AND talented. Not some BS like Ohio State where they squeak out wins against teams that are only highly ranked because they're in the Big 10.

I'll Guarantee you they'd have at least 2 losses in the Big 12.

Just look at what Big 12 punching-bag Iowa State did to Iowa at the beginning of the season? Remember when they finished their non conference games they were ranked #9 in the nation. They go through the Big 12... Where are they now?

49-3 against the Sooners...

Big 12 teams are fairly evenly matched with the exception of Baylor and Kansas. Besides those two I think any other team would be serious contenders in any other conference.

The cream always rises to the top. I agree if Oklahoma wins out the rest of their season they *should* be playing for the championship...

Hell... if Bowling Green had won out they may very well be headed for the Fiesta with a Miami loss.

And *that* is why the BCS, coaches and AP ranking systems are worthless.

Im not a fan of the sooners, so I hope colorado beats them in the big 12 championship, I hope miami drops and I wouldnt mind seeing a Ohio State vs Georgia title game, that would be cool.

aggieAXO- you can NEVER rank Texas too high, HOOK EM HORNS!!!!!!!!! :p

I still say we should use ESPN's proposed system of using every bowl game as a playoff game, with the national title game switching between the current BCS title games.

The only reason Nebraska won those two titles in the 90s was because they had such a soft schedule. The title they shared with Michigan was BS, the Wolverines should have won outright.

The BCS is complete bull, but it's the best we're gonna have until we have a playoff system, and the revenue brought in by bowl games apparently is too much to bring it to that format.

At least all the conferences with any real talent have championship games.. SEC, Big 12..

well, being from nebraska, i know a whole hell of a lot more than you about nebraska football. you see, in 1994 we beat up the colorado buffaloes, a buffalo team with kordell stewart, michael westbrook, and rashaan salaam, granted none of them are too great as pros, but they were dominant in college, and they beat them. heard of the florida gators? yeah, who beat them in the fiesta bowl by a huge margin? oh, that was nebraska! most analysts, coaches, players and fans will say on record that some of the husker teams from the 90s are some of the best ever, and maybe some of the teams they played werent all that good, however they could beat them by like 76-21 and thats with using backups for at least the 2nd half, if not the first. And in 1997, there will always be controvesy around the true champions, however keep in mind that washington state came really close to beating michigan in the rose bowl, and if that were to happen, then nebraska wouldve been the outright champions. there you go buddy, i wait your response.

ktsnake- you have the right idea about how all the talented conferences have title games

deltasigstan- speaking of weak schedules, you go to san diego state right? thats a good team there buddy

Yeah but I don't expect anything from State, nobody does. Well, I do expect to lose to BYU 49-0 or worse.

Ok ok so I jumped the gun...............

its all good dude, i had to chime in about the huskers though dude, those titles (with the exception of 97) came with someone who is my favorite husker ever, and one of the best college players ever, tommie frazier. I used to look up to that guy way back in the day. and ill give sdsu some credit, yall did produce marshall faulk!

true, but that was back when a) people at SDSU cared b) we were good

I have no complaints about the system this year. The two unbeaten big conference teams are #1 and #2. Wins do matter. Otherwise Nebraska would somehow find their way into the title game again even with 4 or 5 loses. Oklahoma is probably the best team in the nation right now yet they stumbled once.

Thats why I don't like a playoff idea. The regular season would be fairly useless if 2 and 3 loss teams got in as well as the unbeatens and a team like Oklahoma or Georgia.

Sorry amycat, but losses hurt, no matter how early in the season they are. Many teams besides USC can make the claim that they have been playing well since an early season mistake or two.

What? I think you've got your home-team blinders on pal . . . OSU beat PSU, Michigan, Washington State . . . I believe that's as many top-15 teams as OU plays in the Big XII, no?

Iowa got worked in the 2nd half by a crazy performance by one guy, which is fine . . . PS - 30-26? And that's to an A&M team who MIGHT go .500 in conference play . . .

Look, you beat the teams you're supposed to beat. OSU did that, they're better than say Oklahoma in the polls. It makes sense - now, you can flip-flop the next few positions, and I might give you Iowa over OU in the coach's poll doesn't make a ton of sense to me (and I'm an Iowa fan) - but all that's for naught in the BCS.

Don't give me "the Big XII is SOOOOO hard!!!!1" whining to cover a loss to A&M. Bottom line is, OU wins that game, they're in the national championship.

Read the above . . . this makes no sense.

Reward the teams who DON'T LOSE to shitty teams.

If you're going to just 'excuse' one loss, there are a couple other teams who'll stake a claim to OU's spot in the Fiesta - and if Miami loses, I say put Oklahoma there. But not if there's two undefeated teams.

I'm an avid FSU fan and alum and even *I* don't think they deserve to be going to a BCS bowl. (with 4 losses) However they did go 7-1 in the ACC (but come on...it's the ACC)

I am also pulling for Miami to lose this weekend. I don't know if I could possible dislike another team more. Go Orangemen!

The fact is with the BCS teams in weaker conferences will have a better chance of making it to bowls... Hell ND or FSU wins 9 and they get an automatic BCS bid? Is that fair?

Put them all in a playoff and see how it works out.

Oh and A&M is a VERY underrated team. They've lost a lot of close games and had some breakdowns this year. They've got a lot of talent and are a very dangerous team at home.

If you've ever seen Kyle Field you'd know what I mean.

Re: Go Hawks :)
 

:) I agree with that statement on the surface, but... it also goes back to my strength of schedule argument...

Iowa is playing the 40th toughest sched and has 1 loss
USC is playing the TOUGHEST sched and has 2 losses

Give Iowa (or Gerogia, Miami, Ohio St, Okla for that matter) a tougher sched or USC an easier sched and THEN the playing and ranking fields are a bit more fair.

Yeah, I'm a RABID SC fan, and so my take is biased. But USC in top 10 or not, its just not a fair system.

Re: Re: Go Hawks :)
 

As much as it kills me to say it - GOOD TEAMS FIND A WAY TO WIN. I'm not an Ohio State fan at all - but even when they struggled to win games (and they did struggle against Purdue, Illinois and Michigan) they did win them and are 13-0. Same with Miami, they struggled with Rutgers and Pitt, but they are undefeated. A good team with a solid defense, a working offense, and a good coach - can pull out those wins. And that is why they are #1 and #2...

USC is a great team, you won't get any arguments from me about that, but lets take a look at those losses:

WA State 30-27 in OT
Kansas State 27-20

Both of them could have been won by either team. A good team finds a way to win every game. If USC had won both of those games, no doubt they would be sitting pretty at #1 in the BCS.

i must admit, miami isnt as strong as they have been in the past (and they WERE pretty good last year, bcs or not)...and this year has been weak....theyve been lucky and somehow navent gotten killed yet.. but the time will come...hopefully not, but i know its inevitable... id love to see them in another bowl game this year but they woudlnt deserve it.. *sigh*...oh well.. nonetheless, i love my 'canes...go miami!

Miami will still beat any team in the country this year anyways.

That's because they're my team :)

Is that why they are #1 than? :p

Re: Re: Re: Go Hawks :)
 

I absolutely agree with you. It KILLS me that we lost, and by so narrow a margin in those two games early in our season. Why couldn't we have gelled as a team earlier? its a woulda-coulda-shoulda scenario for USC. But I'm sure you can understand how frustrating it feels for Trojan fans to know we could have done it and we didn't. :(

Ah, but I have no complaints today. We're #4, which is more than fair. We'll (most likely)play a team in a bowl that will give us a good game--whether that's Iowa or Georgia. :)

Oh believe me I know.. if we hadn't lost to crappy ISU we would be guaranteed the Rose Bowl (big 10 tiebreakers 1,2 would no apply and the team that han't been there the longest would go - IOWA) with a shot at the NC.

:) I truly believe Iowa will get the Rose Bowl bid. So hang in there, and let's root for losses from Miami, Georgia, and, especially, Washington State this coming weekend. :) ha ha

Georgia is not going to lose. I doubt Miami will unfortunely. It's always nice to dream though.:p

Who is WSU playing this weekend?

Sorry, but Miami is the best team in the ocuntry right now. And I am saying that knowing GOOD AND WELL that we should have beaten them in their house. Jinxes aside, we had that game.

As for FSU, come on. Cut us some slack. We beat a good UF team, as well as the same Iowa State team that beat the Hawkeyes. :p

Sure, we lost 4 games, but if we play like we did last Saturday I don't see any reason at all why we shouldn't win whatever bowl we play in.

ZetaAce and IowaHawkeye, in the event that we play wither the Hokies or the Hawkeyes, I am gladly taking GC wagers... :D

oh shit - done and done, I'll take everything you have buddy . . . although Rix did play a pretty good game last week, for a piece of crap.

USC is in the clear - top 4 in BCS = guaranteed spot. Really, the only thing that can go wrong for the Hawkeyes is someone taking ND as the 2nd at-large, and that would be RIDICULOUS, especially after the scalping at USC this week.

Personally, I sorta hope WSU wins this weekend - I don't really want to play USC, they're way too hot, and Palmer was out of control against ND. I'll take WashState over them, easy.

You are a smart, smart man. I've been a USC fan for 15 years, and I've NEVER, NEVER seen a team this hot, not w Rodney Peete, not with Todd Marinovich (lol), not with Mark Carrier, not with Keyshwan Johnson. And, MIKE WILLIAMS IS A TRUE FRESHMAN, my GAWD, I hope Matt Cassell, who will take over at QB next year has what it takes.

My favorite quote of the weekend is from Sportcenter the other night "No one, including Miami, is playing better football for the past two months than Southern Cal."

I don't know - I'm pulling for a UCLA win. an Iowa/USC Rose Bowl would be hotter than the NC game.

Plus, I wanna run into Amycat and Mr. Amycat in southern cali and see who exactly this mystery man is ;)

ha ha ha I agree USC-Iowa would be GREAT! The only team I'd like to play more is Miami, Cause I believe we'd win, damnit, and then peeps would have to shut up.

As to who he/we are... lol But yeah, we'd have to meet up, I've already got my connection working on tickets. :)

Old Notre Dame could be up to it again. Its funny that they are even being considered for a BCS spot.

Anyone else remember the rivalry Miami and ND used to have? What I woudln't give to see them play again, esp in a bowl game.. Not going to hold my breath, but that'd be fun !

for all the bcs haters...
 

Yes, its imperfect. Yes, a lot of teams are where they should not be. Ive personally done loads of research on sports (in the pathetic hopes of landing a job somewhere on ESPN) and this is what Ive found: the panel of experts brought in to create the BCS were the finest coaching minds in college football (rumor has it that Jimmy Johnson, Eddie Robinson, and Barry Switzer had parts in it). Having said that, everybody has a different idea of the perfect system, and the worst thing you can do is incorporate incompatible parts of each. Strength of schedule is determined from opponents last years records (ex. if Notre Dame went 13-1 last year, that would make all their opponents schedules rank higher, even if, when they come around on this years schedule, they are 0-6). Current opponent strength has very little to do with the BCS score.

I know, theres not just that. But I think now some important points should be addressed:

1) Theres not going to be a playoff system. Ever. In the age of television sponsorship, theres just too much money to be lost.

2) 99% of the time, public opinion is that there is a definitive national champion. (sorry Oregon fans) No more Nebraska/Michigan nonsense.

3) A win is a win, even a near win. And losses do make teams go down the rankings, just not much. Look at it this way: If Florida State was #1, everyone on the team contracted the flu and they lost to unranked Tallahassee State Basket Weaving College, should they lose their ranking and TSBWC become the new #1?
I think one of the best things about the BCS is that it compensates for fluke wins and losses.

Thats my rant. I agree that the BCS needs a lot of tuning up, but its better than most alternatives. And the Associated Press and college coaches are getting along better than ever :D

P.s. The Oklahoma fans got really quiet all of a sudden... :p

Re: for all the bcs haters...
 

Despite my earlier rants on this topic, I now mostly agree with that statement. :P