University of Pittsburgh reviewing greek life!
 

The University of Pittsburgh has commissioned a study/review of the Greek system. They say it’s to see if improvements to our Greek system or another Greek system would work better here. But none of the students I have talked to are confident they have our best interest at heart. Recently we had an open forum about the Greek system where we could ask questions and get answers. The only two people that were there had little or no experience with Greek life. One was the woman commissioned to write the review. Neither our temporary Greek advisor nor the dean of students was there. Our old Greek advisor just left. No other student activities or governance groups are being reviewed and they say it has nothing to do with our advisor leaving.
We were asked if we had any suggestions as to how to make our Greek system better. We gave some ideas but not knowing what’s other systems are like does anyone else have any ideas? Most of the ideas that we had were either questioned or attacked by one of the two people there. Hence why we aren’t confident with their intentions. Alums from Pitt any ideas? Any other students from Pitt? I want to meet with the woman writing the review if I get some good ideas, hopefully she will listen to someone one on one. Has this situation happened to any one before? What happened in the end?

Ps. please forgive any typos I have been writing term papers all day.

Perhaps a group of students could approach the administration and the Office of Greek Life about having a student advisory board working on the project. Pitch the idea as a way for a group of students -- both Greek (NIC, NPC, and NPHC) and nongreek (think student government leaders, etc.) -- to help bring positive changes from other campus's to your school. As much as possible, approach the administration and others involved with the review with a positive attitude -- that you think that the review is a great idea because it will help a good system become even stronger. If the committee members writing the review feel like they are being "attacked" they are more likely to become defensive and their attitude towards Greek life at Pittsburgh and the review will be more likely to be negative.
Hope this helps

SigEp,
How many of the Greek Chapter Advisors are aware of this situation? If they haven't yet been told about this, they should be made aware of the situation immediately. Are they looking at the fraternities, the sororities, or both? From the point of housing, or the point of asset v. detriment to the University? These are all points that should be answered immediately, because without knowing the REAL agenda, you don't know how best to approach the situation.

Then, try to get the Advisors involved in a summit of sorts, and let them discuss the reasons why the presence of a Greek community is even questioned. Maybe they'll select a few people to sit down with the University officials and talk sense into them.

Start there. Stay calm, but focused. Try to have IFC and Panhel fully aware of the situation, and realize that y'all are under a magnifying glass right now (read: this isn't the time to do anything stupid!). Again, and I can't stress this enough, get your Advisors involved immediately.

Keep us posted!

honeychile

With what I've been reading about some of the changes in Student Life going on there I don't blame you for being wary of their intentions...

Why on earth would they have a forum on Greek activities without the Greek advisor there?? That's like a wedding without the bride. Who is the woman doing the review? Is she a Pitt employee?

I'm not sure what they mean as far as making the system "better" - do they mean numbers, risk mgmt, rush, housing, what? I would tell them that until you know what issues they want addressed, it will be hard to address them. Try talking to some advisors/students at W&J or (sorry for the heresy) Penn State - their systems are the closest and probably the most similar.

This is the story that ran today in the Pitt News:

http://www.pittnews.com/vnews/displa.../3dc5f8945bb9a

I'm pretty wary of this whole thing, but at the same time, doubtful that they would get rid of the greek system.

For one, we really don't cause much trouble. Underage drinking is the only problem that we've had in recent memory that I can really think of, as well as what goes along with it (fights, etc.), which happen just as much, if not more, at off campus parties. We've actually gotten a lot of good press for the university, raising a hell of a lot of money for philanthropy.

Second, there are A LOT of greek alumni that they would be alienating. I remember working at the Capital Campaign Weekend ( a HUGE fundraising event that they had two years ago), and meeting incredible amounts of greek alumni. They would risk losing a TON of money from alumni- and you know Pitt is always on the lookout.

I do think that chapter advisors and national/international headquarters of the groups need to be advised that this is going on, because the manner in which they're going about doing it is very shady.

I'm wary, but hopeful that they're doing the right thing.

I've known about this for a short time, we just have no other way to get into contact with the other sorority chapter advisors. Honeychile and KDdani, can you see if your respective chapter advisors have any of the emails that sharon sent out to all of the advisors during recruitment?(at least sorority chapter advisors?)I know it's a long shot but still.... In reality there is not much we can do as we are just alumna. I forwarded the article to Pitt's DPhiE chapter advisor a while ago. I'll see what she has to say about it.

As far as changes....hmmm, well first I have to agree with honeychile in that you all have to be very careful with your actions this year, including the greek week formal. If you really want to find out what other greek systems are like try contacting some other greeks at schools with similar demographics as you all. Urban Campus, small percentage of greeks,etc. I'll try to pm you with some of the stuff that really does need to change.

That lady's name sounds familiar. I used to work in the mailroom at towers and if its who i am thinking of she had something to do with safety. I could be wrong though, I know she did something with the pitt police.

Try not to be defensive about this whole review thing. I'm guessing that all of the fraternities and sororities heard review of greek system and started the rumor mill that pitt is trying to get rid of greek life, as they do every year when SGB holds elections. Think of it as a way to make positive changes. I agree that it's shady but you do have to make the best of it.

If you guys are frustrated with them not knowing remember that a) they can't keep track of EVERY student organization big or small and that b) someone needs to make sure that the higher ups know what you are doing.....they don't read the pitt news and I've never seen the chancellor strolling about club laga during greek week events.

In the meantime, keep us posted!!

Fire1977 etal - I sent the link to two of our Executive Officers, both of whom I trust to take it to the best authorities. I would ask those on campus to keep your alumnae in the loop, so we can do the best we can!

honeychile

ps - If I ever refer to you as Fireluv, please don't be upset! It's the screen name of a friend on another message board!

Time to revive an old thread...
Honeychile, does your chapter have a chapter advisor? Can you pm me with it.

SigEp42 same for you if you are still posting hear. I understand that one of your brothers is IFC rep too, can you get in contact with me??

Same for kddani and killarney if you ladies have the means of finding out!!!

Fire1977, you are with pm!

honeychile

I know University of Delaware and University of Maryland have implemented "guidelines" of sorts to keep Greek orgs truer to their missions and appease the university. Basically if they don't meet requirements then they lose social privileges, etc. Its a sort of happy medium for both parties, and it also gives Greek life a little more of a purpose.

I always worry when a college says they are going to have a "review" of the greek system to look for "improvements", but I really do not think they can just eliminate the whole greek system, or even individual frats. Unless greek life is really out of control at Pitt, I don't think you have anything to worry about.

I wouldn't mind if they were reviewing ALL of the student organizations, but there really hasn't been anything too severe with the Greek organizations, in my opinion to warrant it. Are there things that could potentially be a problem yes, but again I think that a strong advisor could fix those problems.

Put it this way, if for an example you put expectations on the greek community for community service then it should apply to the other campus organizations...or at least it's my two cents.

Edited to add: I think our main concern is that the Greek Advisor position (who also advised a couple of other groups) isn't completed eliminated.

Just thinking "out loud" - a few years back, Pitt was considering moving all of the sororities into house much like the fraternities, so they could use Amos Hall for other students. Do you think that's part of the "review"?

honeychile

They were talking about putting 3 houses up on the hill where the stadium had been. Don't know what ever became of that. I know it was mentioned last year but the amount of money that had been stated was INSANE! but it was mentioned breifly and then we never heard of it again. Who knows, but that really shouldn't factor into the whole G.A. thing, you know??

More news for all you pittsburgh people. The last article said that the students that were representing greek life would get to see a copy of the report and now, hmmmm, they only get to see excerpts of it. I second what the pres of panhel said.

NEWS
Pitt's Greek report nears completion
by GREG HELLER-LaBELLE
News Editor
January 24, 2003

The report that could determine the future of Pitt's Greek system will be done soon, if all goes according to plan.

According to Pitt director of Public Safety Deborah Furka and Vice Provost for Undergraduate Studies and Dean of Students Jack Daniel, Furka's report studying Greek systems at Pitt and across the country will be done in the next two weeks.

The report was scheduled to be completed in December, but Furka said that it required "a lot more research documentation" than originally anticipated.

"With the research that was obtained, there was a lot to go through," she said. "There was a lot to digest."

Daniel, who was sick with pneumonia for much of winter break, said that he met with Furka during the Martin Luther King Jr. Day weekend.

"It turned out to be far more complex than we thought," Daniel said.

The report will be only be seen by Daniel, but he said he will "discuss sections" with students before making a decision.

"I don't want to do anything to hurt the Greek systems," Daniel said. "I definitely won't receive a report and then take action."

Furka declined to comment on whether there had been direct student input into the report, but did say that feedback from the Greek forums held last semester were included.

"It's been very involved," she said. "It's been a priority ... for Student Affairs as well as the Greek organizations.

Panhellenic Association President Alissa Krutoff said she did not have any comment at the time, but did say she had not yet met with Furka to discuss the report.

"I just want to know what's going on," she said.

coughcoughbullshitcoughcough

from what I have heard of this dude, I don't find that to be too cool.

Question for the legal people on here. . .

How does the Freedom of Information Act apply here? It's not a disciplinary report, nor does it contain personal student information. So, if it's at a public university, can it be obtained under FIA?

I personally would like to see it (interested in research AND greek life).

I'm not all that familiar with the FIA.

But one thing about Pitt is that it's not technically a public school. It's "state related"- they get money from the state, but it's still private in that it's not run by the state at all.

But the Pitt administration has really really been screwing Student Affairs in the past yer.

Yeah I agree. Here's my thought. He says he'll share excerpts with the students to discuss before he makes a decision. What the h*** decision is he making?? I'm so irritable right now.

Just for giggles, and beause I'm nebby, I searched the Pitt News on this.

From Nov 4:

Many students were concerned as to whether or not they will have a say once the review is complete.

"We are hoping to get input from the students on what they feel are important qualities for a Greek adviser," Harrigan responded.

"Rather than just hire a replacement, we want to be sure we are hiring the right replacement," Harrigan said. "This is all being done to find the right person for the job."

Vice Provost and Interim Dean of Students Jack Daniel is allowing the student committee on Greek life to look over the review before it is published to the public, according to Pat Creighton, member of student government of Sigma Chi.

I still don't understand what background the head of Pubic Safety has to do this evaluation (it said in a couple places she had "worked with Greek communities" - ambiguous much?) or process what she finds - it's clear she didn't know what she was getting into or she would realize how long it takes to do these sorts of evaluations.

Grrrr....
I have so much to say but I don't want to put it on a public forum. :(

I say knock yourself out. I have a few choice words in mind to describe this situation, and most have 4 letters :p

Hey I tried to post earlier but I screwed up some how.

One word can sum up my opinion of the Pitt administration… Disappointed.
Between this and the debacle with the chancellor I have very little faith that the administration has the students needs in there hearts.
I can tell you that the Greek forum that they used to gain student input was completely bull poop. (Pardon the French) I attended the forum and it was 2 hours of the two women in charge of the report asking how they could help us and ignoring every suggestion. Neither Jack Daniels, nor our interim Greek councilor was there. At one point during the forum they asked what we did. The two people who were supposed to have experience with Greeks were surprised to find out how much we actually do. As for a Greek advisor from what I hear from brothers who work with Terrie Melani (the temp Greek Advisor) he has the job weather the students like it or not. The vagueness used in the article is about par in what we the students have been told. The consensus of those I have talked to is that no matter what the school says it wasn’t a tighter leash on Greek life and if it doesn’t get it they will find away to dispose of us. (Can you tell we don’t trust them?) Every time we voice a concern about what is going to be done we are met with a vague answer like “nothing will be done with out consulting the students. Then in the article it says we will only be able to see sections of the report. I have known the Panhell president who was quoted in the paper for 3 years, and one of my pledge brothers is the IFC president. If they aren’t telling either of them what’s going on I don’t trust them.

Sorry to rant but students at this school are always getting screwed by the administration I’m tired of it. I think I can speak for most Greek students when I say I do not trust Jack Daniels or either of the women putting the report together.

Hey, I have a question about Mr. Just Because You Are Named After Alcohol Doesn't Make You Cool...

isn't he the INTERIM Dean of Students? IN-TER-IM, as in place holder, as in you are not supposed to make sweeping changes as the office isn't yours to keep. We dealt with this isht at Clarion the year after I graduated...the interim prez (who was approximately 120 years old) came in and made changes in the alcohol policy and other things. No one was too happy about it.

Plus I saw that Jack Daniel is a Provost of some sort. I'm unfamiliar with the layers of administration at Pitt, but isn't that somewhat of a conflict of interests?

Mayby...

Maybe they are plannign on making the changes while everyone in charge is "interim" so when the real replacements get here we wont hate them.

If it smells like a duck, talkes like a duck and walks like a duck, most likely it aint a squirrle.

lol@ Jack Daniels being the Interim Dean of Students! Jack Daniels :D :p

I hope that everything works out for my fellow greeks at Pitt. :)

Wow! Good Luck!
I'd think about contacting alumni that are lawyers and see if you can get by with the FIA thing. Most likely if they are recieving any state money, they fall under state guidelines in most cases. Wouldn't hurt to check, and besides, admin, at least here, hates lawyers, they have logic that doodles up their plans to do shady stuff.

Good Luck!
Lil E

What changes does Pitt want to make?

madmax -

no one from the admin will come out and say what they are looking at specificially, that's part of the problem.

update
 

Just an update on the review:

http://www.pittnews.com/vnews/displa.../3e5ad7aca83ea

I read that this morning, at least it makes it sound somewhat positive.

I think all in all Pitt is a fairly well behaved greek system who DOES a lot for charity- as a whole and as individual houses.

Let's hope for the best.

I just sent that to all the sorority advisors before I logged on here. We have a meeting with panhel exec tomorrow.

From what I have heard from the people that were at the Greek Review today it was overall positive. I guess we have to wait and see tomorrow if the Pitt news will print the recommendations.

If Pitt News doesn't publish it, I hope that someone in on the meetings will post, if they're able to!

I'm looking at it right now. My scanner would take forever to put it up here, however. They didn't really put out anything too specific and it's obvious that they know nothing about the greek system.

Edited to add: they did reccommend the hiring of a new greek advisor, which is now posted!!!

Let me guess - you are all getting pledge houses in North Oakland, right? :D

Pitt News Article About Report

Doesn't really tell us much of anything. While I haven't talked to anyone who went to the meeting, I did read one of my sister's away messages that said it was a waste of time.

Probably didn't tell us anything that we ourselves didn't already know. I guess i'm happy that the admin is paying some positive attention to the greeks.

They're going to be starting the application process for a new Greek advisor- fun position, but i'm not sure how well it pays. Any GC'ers interested?

OK, I will come and be the Greek advisor. :) I can just see that.

They are definitely right about the suckage of the web site.

Are they saying they want house moms for the fraternities? I'm assuming you guys have RA's on the sorority floors. Aren't there 2 or 3 groups not in the sorority dorm? It sounds like they want them all to be there.

TPA has a suite in McCormick, KKG has a house mother and live on bayard (as did Theta before they closed) the other 9 have their own floor in Amos (Sheila, I have to take you up there sometime).

They want to explore using leases for the sororities and look over the issues with the off campus fraternity recognition. They totally don't understand the concept of the panhellenic judicial board and they have no idea that the advisors (at least panhellenic) meet.

They also plan on incorporating a 5 star system, which on of the Chi Omega advisors who used to be a traveling consultant brought up a campus she visited with this type of system and she said that the chapters were constantly on some sort of probation. That in combination with an overprogrammed greek system wouldn't be very fun.