School with the reputation of cutting half of PNMs?
 

Hi - on the Sorority subreddit, a PNM claims that her "smaller Southern" school with a very small Greek system cuts over half of PNMs on the first day of Recruitment. While I don't believe her, I wonder what school she could be at and why they have this reputation. She also thinks the school "doesn't have rec letters."

What small Southern school could this be?

Well, it's possible a large number could be released if PH lets women who don't meet the minimum GPA requirements of the groups go thru recruitment. And smaller schools often do that along with many women being first time college students which can mean they don't really "get it." NO school requires recs. Only national orgs do that so it would depend on which groups are at that school.

Could it be Elon? And do you think they actually mean that the “top” chapters cut more than 50% due to RFM?

My alma mater is a small liberal arts university with a small Greek system (currently four sororities and three fraternities). The university has a special program for students which gives "points" for attending a variety of campus programs, events and trainings throughout the year. Score enough points and the university will give you a couple thousand dollars off your tuition. The university decided a couple of years ago that fall formal recruitment would be included among the programs for which students could earn points. Students now earn points for attending the Sisterhood round of parties (open to all registered for recruitment) and the Philanthropy round (first round of invites). Last year, almost 140 women registered for fall recruitment, but more than half of them dropped by the end of the Philanthropy round, and only about 65 women actually attended Pref parties. While the university feels that it's a great opportunity for freshmen and transfer students to meet people and learn about Greek life (and campus life), the GLO's have more mixed feelings. Yes, some women who were iffy about joining a GLO might be swayed once they've attended parties and seen all of them up close. But a lot of time, effort and money is being expended on participants who aren't really interested, and the high drop rates can impact RFM.

So this isn't really an example of the school "cutting" PNM's; more like giving women an incentive to participate and then removing that incentive before Preference. And no school cares about recommendations -- that is something determined by each chapter, based on it's national's policies.

Lots of people just love to say this to make their Greek system seem more exclusive than it really is.

Yeah, she got cut despite a great GPA and campus involvement, etc. I tried to let her know that until she figured out why she got cut by all chapters on the first day, a re-rush wasn't likely to be successful. That's when she told me about half of all PNMs get cut by all chapters on the first day, because there just aren't that many spots.

I didn't try to discuss further.

There is noooo way that happens! "Not enough spots"?

Agree with Carnation. Calling baloney on your PNM.

Perhaps she meant, not that many spots.......in the next invitational round........for high-return chapters.........due to RFM.

Just to make it clear...
 

Are there schools where less than half of the women participating in Recruitment who meet the objective requirements set by the school are offered bids by one of the sororities? (and if so, what school has the smallest percentage being offered bids?)

You've been on GC for a long time; you know that the way your questions are worded are not going to be answered. Simply too many variables at play in recruitment.

One example: women who voluntarily withdraw from recruitment when they don't get invited back to their desired chapter(s). Can't be offered a bid when you don't play all the way through. How does that affect the answer(s)?

Again, your questions would benefit from better refining your search terms. You have a tendency to pick up the broadest brush possible and then paint. I know you think I am picking on you, and I'm truly not. I'm being a responsible analyst and trying to help you. If I were the one asking, I would break down the questions into much more definable terms.

How does that affect the answer(s)? It doesn't.
Variable 1: Number of women who sign up (and meeting the school and Panhel's objective criteria) to participate in Panhellenic Recuitment. As far as I can tell, at most schools this is a specific number. It doesn't matter whether they drop immediately after signing up, suicide at their final choice or continue on all the way to becoming a pledge.

Variable 2: Number of bids offered by the Sororities participating the Panhellenic recruitment at the end of period, regardless of whether they are accepted by the girls. (Which should be more or less equal to the sum of the quotas)

Are there cases where Variable 2 is less than half of Variable 1. I'm not looking to find out whether for Alabama's 2016 rush the ratio is .4135, I'm looking for round numbers.

I have to ask: have you ever taken a basic research class?

ABSOLUTELY the answers will be affected by the way the questions are posed/written! Your examples are, for lack of better words, not related to your original questions. Sheesh. Sigh.

Good luck.

ETA: note to self: stop trying to help him/her.

Nope. (College was 30 years ago and my degree is in Mathematics) And I felt that I wasn't looking for exact enough answers to require the questions to be that exact.

I believe that my questions as stated was basically were equivalent to "At what schools does a woman who formally participants in recruitment have less than a fifty percent chance of getting a bid?"

To answer this one would have to accumulate the recruitment data from all schools which do recruitment (am assuming you mean NPC recruitment but I digress) and just look at the numbers: # registered for recruitment vs # bids extended.

That would still show women who drop out as not receiving bids, even though they may have gotten a bid if they had stayed in. Does that make sense?

then adjust for that.....the bottom line is that we don't know and can't find out.

Back in the dark ages before computers when I was and active in the sorority that had the highest active and pledge GPA on campus - I was surprised to learn that more than half of the girls going through rush did not meet our academic standards. They could not be pledged.

And there was another sorority on campus that had similar standards. So half of the girls were not eligible for 2 of the 6 sororities on campus.

Our minimum GPA fluctuated each rush - but it was brutal. The year I pledged was the last year they had SR - or "scholarship risk" spots. Where you were allowed to take a few girls one or two 1/10 of a point below (2.5 if the threshold was 2.7) the GPA threshold. They stopped the practice because too much focus was debating which few girls will get those spots - while attention was not on academically strong "top rushees." Also at least half of the SR for the last two pledge classes where SRs were present - failed to make their grades and were immediately on academic probation. Sad for individual girls who were close to our GPA cutoff - but simpler and arguably better for the chapter in the long run.

Because we had such a HUGE academic cut - we had to space it out over two invitational rounds.(But the majority was the first round) Otherwise our first round of invitational parties had the potential to look like a ghost town.

My sophomore year - I had a room-mate going through rush that did not have our grades. She knew that she probably wasn't even close. It sucked because she would have been an awesome addition. I made the decision that they cut her after the first round - she had a great reference so she would have been carried to the second round as a "courtesy" to the alum that wrote the reference. But I knew she wanted to be cut if she was not at are threshold.

We had 5 sororities on my campus and we had a higher GPA requirement than the other GLOs. It wasn't a negotiable thing. We had to cut a lot of girls who would have been great members, but didn't have the grades and would have left us as an academic risk.

How do I find these people?! Now someone on the sorority subreddit is claiming that their school cuts 3/4 of women on the first day of Recruitment!

That's not how Recruitment works! Sororities need members! Members pay dues!

I bet they're talking about release figures--how the strongest groups have to cut the huge majority of PNMs right off.

You would think that, right? I even asked if her school published recruitment statistics because I'm trying to figure out how this is even possible.

She says "Considering 3/4 of the girls that rush at my school are cut after day one...it’s actually not that strange. Again, very strange rush process with predetermined lists. I have had this confirmed after extensively researching online articles (one from a sorority girl who quit and was disgusted with the process) and my current friends in sororities."

3/4 of the girls who rush are cut by every house the FIRST DAY!?!?!

Reading back on the thread these PNM’s sound familiar, I wonder if the PNM the thread was started for has returned and upped her %? I just cannot believe there is any school that would cut 75% on the first day!

ETA: Also “I have had this confirmed after extensively researching online articles” - gossip is not confirmation last I checked. No article or even “one sorority girl who quit and was disgusted with the process” knows the selection process for EVERY org on campus, they’re secret! That’s kind of the whole point!

Also, if 75% of women get cut after the first day, how can you be upset when you get cut? You're in great company!

Edit: I wonder if she means "I got cut from all the GOOD sororities" or "everyone gets cut from the ones that count" and there's just a really bad campus culture about tiers?

And yes, I also LOLed about her extensive online research that helps her know about sister selection. I wish she would just name the school so I can do my own research!

Unless she is at a school with all locals, which I doubt because she mentioned recs, it definitely can’t be true. I feel like she had friends that told her that lie to make her feel better.