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-   -   Texas State University Suspends Greek Life (https://greekchat.com/gcforums/showthread.php?t=238346)

homeward*bound 11-14-2017 06:40 PM

Texas State University Suspends Greek Life
 
Texas State University has suspended fraternity and sorority activities following the death of a fraternity pledge at an off campus social event. Chapters are prohibited from holding new member events, chapter meetings, social functions, and philanthropic activities until a thorough review of the Greek Affairs system is completed.http://www.txstate.edu/news/news_rel...eks111417.html

Kevin 11-14-2017 07:39 PM

This trend will continue.

carnation 11-14-2017 07:45 PM

How is this legal?

Kevin 11-14-2017 09:52 PM

I don't think it is, but if we're talking about a few weeks, it's probably not worth the fight.

PhilTau 11-14-2017 11:41 PM

Two alcohol-related deaths just over 12 months apart. Texas State's president can likely justify the immediate administrative action. It is interesting that the suspension seems patterned on the recent FSU suspension.

Kevin 11-15-2017 12:35 AM

Suspending all fraternity members' constitutional rights without at least notice and an opportunity for a hearing is unconstitutional on its face. They didn't even give some passing semblance of due process. There must be some backroom dealing between the Greek community and the administration because to me, this pretty much looks like free attorney fees for anyone who files a lawsuit as civil rights lawsuits mostly require the offending state actor to pay the Plaintiff's attorney's fees.

PhilTau 11-15-2017 01:40 AM

The legality of the blanket suspension at Texas State cannot really be discussed intelligently because we have no specific information about the suspension notices given to each organization and the exact language included in them. We can only generally assumed that the action taken by Texas State's president was some type of emergency suspension; however, this may not actually be the case. For example, we have no way of knowing the detailed agreements entered into by each Greek organization with university or the conditions, powers and authorities contractually granted by each organization to the university. It does appear that each organization will be under some type of review by the university to determine whether it will be allowed continued university affiliation.

Anyway - here is a more detailed press report about what the university is doing.

https://kxan.com/2017/11/14/texas-st...-investigated/

Kevin 11-15-2017 09:58 AM

So the denial of students' First Amendment rights without so much as notice or an opportunity for a hearing cannot be intelligently discussed? No. It's illegal to do what the school did. One of these days, a group is going to challenge this and win.

LaneSig 11-15-2017 11:30 AM

I can almost understand ("almost") the suspension of social activities at this time. However, like the situation at Florida State, I do not understand suspending chapter meetings.

33girl 11-15-2017 01:54 PM

I honestly think the people who think up things like this have zero idea what a chapter meeting is actually like.

PhilTau 11-15-2017 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin (Post 2447310)
So the denial of students' First Amendment rights without so much as notice or an opportunity for a hearing cannot be intelligently discussed? No. It's illegal to do what the school did. One of these days, a group is going to challenge this and win.

I probably should have said jump to conclusions instead of intelligently discussed. My point is that we know very few facts here. What is clear is that Texas State's president has delegated authority to suspend without prior notice or hearing if there is a continuing danger or an ongoing threat of disruption of the school, but must set a case hearing as soon as practicable. From what I can tell, Texas State has a pretty good legal staff backstopping the university's disciplinary actions. This is what I meant when I said we have not seen the actual notices that went out to the groups. I would expect that many of the suspensions (especially the sororities) to be lifted pretty quickly at those hearings.

I can't overemphasize the fact that in the last 10 months four fraternities at Texas State were suspended multiple years (with some having their charters revoked) because of university alcohol policy violations during an October 2016 party where a severely intoxicated sorority member was killed. Now, less than 13 months later, another person dies under apparent circumstances that clearly violate the university's hazing and alcohol policies. There are likely more incidents documented by Texas State where a death was not involved, so we are not aware of them.

PhilTau 11-15-2017 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaneSig (Post 2447311)
I can almost understand ("almost") the suspension of social activities at this time. However, like the situation at Florida State, I do not understand suspending chapter meetings.

All activities is easy to understand. There are some wiseacres that would throw a kegger and call it a fraternity meeting.

Sciencewoman 11-16-2017 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 33girl (Post 2447319)
I honestly think the people who think up things like this have zero idea what a chapter meeting is actually like.

Seriously...I know more than a few undergrads who would welcome a ban on chapter meetings. ;) However, these would provide a mechanism for education, information distribution, and discussion.

Tom Earp 11-16-2017 07:39 AM

I wonder if we are all missing the point here?

While all discussions are about legalities here are we missing the point that hazing and deaths keep going on and on? Is this a which came first situation? The chicken or the egg? Which is more important, life or death?

Yes, I agree that the bounds were over stepped here, but whose fault does the blame lay?

LaneSig 11-16-2017 10:12 AM

^^ I would hazard to guess that the vast majority of GCers are against hazing, and subsequent deaths by hazing or alcohol intake.

What we are questioning is the universal suspension on all Greek activities, especially chapter meetings. I do not know about other organizations, but my own uses the ritual that binds us at 90% of our meetings. It's the ritual that brings us together and unifies/bonds us.

My personal opinion is that the university should provide the chapter presidents and IFC/NPHC/NPC/MGLO reps with as much on going information as possible. Then, allow the chapters to conduct chapter meetings so that information can be dispensed by the officers and reps to their chapter members. Having the information can help stop rumors and also let the members know that the university admin is trying to work with Greek Life orgs instead of just playing dictator.

ASTalumna06 11-16-2017 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 33girl (Post 2447319)
I honestly think the people who think up things like this have zero idea what a chapter meeting is actually like.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaneSig (Post 2447363)
What we are questioning is the universal suspension on all Greek activities, especially chapter meetings. I do not know about other organizations, but my own uses the ritual that binds us at 90% of our meetings. It's the ritual that brings us together and unifies/bonds us.

My personal opinion is that the university should provide the chapter presidents and IFC/NPHC/NPC/MGLO reps with as much on going information as possible. Then, allow the chapters to conduct chapter meetings so that information can be dispensed by the officers and reps to their chapter members. Having the information can help stop rumors and also let the members know that the university admin is trying to work with Greek Life orgs instead of just playing dictator.

All of this.

If anything, I would think that these schools would want chapter meetings to continue, assuming they know what they accomplish. The school can still make rules surrounding them (e.g. the meetings must be held in certain locations on campus, there has to be at least one advisor in attendance, etc.), but to restrict members from meeting with each other seems counterproductive.

SWTXBelle 12-08-2017 01:37 PM

My letter to President Trauth
 
Dear President Trauth,

In 2013, members of the Texas State University drum line were found to be hazing other members. They were arrested and suspended from the band. The band was not suspended. The entire music department was not shut down. The athletic program, with which they are obviously affiliated, was not sanctioned. Those arrested were given due process and paid for their crimes. No one would argue that they did not deserve all the consequences of their bad decisions, but they were the ones who paid the forfeit, and not those innocents who had nothing to do with their transgressions.

Now in 2017 the entire Greek system is being forced to pay for the bad decisions of a few. It is my understanding that an investigation into the tragic death of Matthew Ellis is still ongoing, with many questions left to be answered. Quite rightly, the national organization of Phi Kappa Psi has suspended the chapter. But to hold the entire Greek system, including sororities, responsible for the possibly criminal actions of members of one organization goes against all common sense and violates the rights of those members who are examples of the positive aspects of the Greek system, a system which for over 150 years has enabled men and women to develop into leaders in their communities, providing support and training which results in members who go forth and improve the world around them.

I do not know of a single fraternity or sorority alumnus who does not support holding miscreants responsible. Because we know the great good which can come from membership in a chapter which is living up to its ideals, we bitterly resent being punished and forced to pay, both literally and figuratively, for the sins of another. I fail to see how cancelling the celebration of my chapter's 50th anniversary does anything constructive.

Instead of punitive measures against the innocent, this should be a time for meeting and providing guidance as to how members, both active and alum, can insure that their chapters are living up to the high standards of their organizations. If you truly wish to make a difference, education, mentoring, and upholding standards is the way to do so. We are a three generation Bobcat family. My mother, my daughter, and I are all proud members of the same sorority. I know the many benefits, both personal and community-wide, of a healthy Greek system. Those who besmirch our good name, who break the law and thus heap ignominy on both Greeks and Texas State University should be given no quarter. But this action smacks of falling in line with other universities simply because that's what they are doing - the worst kind of bowing to peer pressure.

I will admit to being somewhat bitter because I know full well that in the past hazing by athletes and non-Greek groups has not resulted in the kind of draconian measures being leveled against us. It would have been wrong to disband an athletic team, or wipe an entire organization out, because of the actions of a few. It's wrong to do so now. However, since we cannot go back and undo what has been done, I call upon President Trauth to respect over 50 years of dedicated service of Greeks to the Texas State community, and conduct her review as quickly as can be done. Punish those who need it, educate those who do not, and enable us to work with our chapters to make sure that no member ever is endangered or treated with anything less than the respect due to every member of the Texas State University family.

Sincerely,
Christine Boyett Barr
1986 Sallie Beretta Outstanding Senior Woman.

Kevin 12-08-2017 02:29 PM

Shutting down FSL groups without so much as a conversation sends the message that the administration does not value the thoughts of the students.

I'm afraid my alma mater might be on the verge of something like this. We haven't had a death, but a recently recolonized group appears to be on the brink of losing recognition because of numerous alleged sexual assaults, accusations of hazing negative interactions with law enforcement, etc. It's just one group, but we have to be in the mindset that we don't only have to ensure our own groups are safe, but we can be punished for the actions of groups whose members we MIGHT have shaken hands with once during recruitment week.

lake 12-08-2017 11:06 PM

Absolutely fabulous, well written letter speaking truth. I look forward to seeing what happens.

ASTalumna06 12-08-2017 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle (Post 2448842)
Dear President Trauth,

In 2013, members of the Texas State University drum line were found to be hazing other members. They were arrested and suspended from the band. The band was not suspended. The entire music department was not shut down. The athletic program, with which they are obviously affiliated, was not sanctioned. Those arrested were given due process and paid for their crimes. No one would argue that they did not deserve all the consequences of their bad decisions, but they were the ones who paid the forfeit, and not those innocents who had nothing to do with their transgressions.

Now in 2017 the entire Greek system is being forced to pay for the bad decisions of a few. It is my understanding that an investigation into the tragic death of Matthew Ellis is still ongoing, with many questions left to be answered. Quite rightly, the national organization of Phi Kappa Psi has suspended the chapter. But to hold the entire Greek system, including sororities, responsible for the possibly criminal actions of members of one organization goes against all common sense and violates the rights of those members who are examples of the positive aspects of the Greek system, a system which for over 150 years has enabled men and women to develop into leaders in their communities, providing support and training which results in members who go forth and improve the world around them.

I do not know of a single fraternity or sorority alumnus who does not support holding miscreants responsible. Because we know the great good which can come from membership in a chapter which is living up to its ideals, we bitterly resent being punished and forced to pay, both literally and figuratively, for the sins of another. I fail to see how cancelling the celebration of my chapter's 50th anniversary does anything constructive.

Instead of punitive measures against the innocent, this should be a time for meeting and providing guidance as to how members, both active and alum, can insure that their chapters are living up to the high standards of their organizations. If you truly wish to make a difference, education, mentoring, and upholding standards is the way to do so. We are a three generation Bobcat family. My mother, my daughter, and I are all proud members of the same sorority. I know the many benefits, both personal and community-wide, of a healthy Greek system. Those who besmirch our good name, who break the law and thus heap ignominy on both Greeks and Texas State University should be given no quarter. But this action smacks of falling in line with other universities simply because that's what they are doing - the worst kind of bowing to peer pressure.

I will admit to being somewhat bitter because I know full well that in the past hazing by athletes and non-Greek groups has not resulted in the kind of draconian measures being leveled against us. It would have been wrong to disband an athletic team, or wipe an entire organization out, because of the actions of a few. It's wrong to do so now. However, since we cannot go back and undo what has been done, I call upon President Trauth to respect over 50 years of dedicated service of Greeks to the Texas State community, and conduct her review as quickly as can be done. Punish those who need it, educate those who do not, and enable us to work with our chapters to make sure that no member ever is endangered or treated with anything less than the respect due to every member of the Texas State University family.

Sincerely,
Christine Boyett Barr
1986 Sallie Beretta Outstanding Senior Woman.

What really struck me after reading this whole thing is that they're cancelling your chapter's 50th anniversary celebration. My chapter celebrated our 25th on campus a few years ago, and I can't imagine missing out on that experience because of a fraternity's poor decisions and actions.

SWTXBelle 12-09-2017 10:32 AM

Update
 
Response to my letter -
Dear Ms. Barr:

Thank you for your email dated November 30, 2017, in response to the recent suspension of all fraternity and sorority chapter activities at Texas State University. I recognize the decision has affected many people in our university community.

I am grateful for your thoughts on this difficult issue. We understand and appreciate the true impact of Greek chapters in our community, and our goal is to preserve the value of these organizations and create a safe environment for students.

Student safety remains my top priority. We are conducting a comprehensive review of Greek life governance and it is our aim to establish a safer, more responsible culture within the Greek community.

This spring, Dr. Joanne Smith, Vice President for Student Affairs, plans to relay a timeline for next steps and relevant information about what the comprehensive review will entail. If you have additional questions, you may contact Dr. Smith directly at 512-245-2152 or via email at js14@txstate.edu.

Thank you, again, for your email.

Sincerely,

Denise M. Trauth

And my letter to Dr. Smith
Dr. Smith,

As per President Trauth's email which was copied to you, I am asking for the timeline for the review process. It would of course be terribly irresponsible to suspend operations on all Greek letter organizations without a plan in place, so I look forward to hearing the administration's timeline.

In the meantime, I appreciate having a topic for my newspaper column in The Paris Post-Intelligencer, and will be asking my fellow Greeks to withhold any and all support for the school until this travesty is rectified. There is not a Greek problem; there is an alcohol problem, and while the GLOs provide a convenient scapegoat, the fact of the matter is that it was a problem when my parents attended college there, when I did in the 80s, and when my daughter did in 2008 - 2012. If student safety is truly your concern, that should be the focus.

Given my family's history with the school, I want nothing more than what is best for our reputation and standing in the academic community. I see the unilateral action against all Greek organizations, whether guilty of any infraction or not, as denying students due process and unfairly penalizing the innocent for the actions of a few. I expect better from my alma mater.

SWTXBelle 12-09-2017 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06 (Post 2448869)
What really struck me after reading this whole thing is that they're cancelling your chapter's 50th anniversary celebration. My chapter celebrated our 25th on campus a few years ago, and I can't imagine missing out on that experience because of a fraternity's poor decisions and actions.

It's devastating. 50 years - and we had founding members coming. And, I hasten to add, costs the community all the hotel and restaurant reservations we had made.

Kevin 12-09-2017 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle (Post 2448899)
It's devastating. 50 years - and we had founding members coming. And, I hasten to add, costs the community all the hotel and restaurant reservations we had made.

If the active chapter's activities are suspended, why should that affect alumnae? In fact, if you were to have your alumnae run the actual event and invite active chapter members as guests, how would that be a sorority function?

SWTXBelle 12-09-2017 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin (Post 2448930)
If the active chapter's activities are suspended, why should that affect alumnae? In fact, if you were to have your alumnae run the actual event and invite active chapter members as guests, how would that be a sorority function?

The active chapter was sponsoring it, and we dare not give even a hint of going against the edict lest they decide to make an example of us. Unfair, but there it is.

AGDee 12-10-2017 02:48 AM

The ban also says that the collegians may not attend any alumnae activities.

Kevin 12-10-2017 09:45 AM

Or you could go ahead and have the activity and if the school responds, your lawyers could go get free money from them.

Sciencewoman 12-10-2017 12:03 PM

Hahahaha...but seriously, they're telling members they can't go to alumnae events, which have zero affiliation or recognition status with the university?

This sounds like a situation that's ripe for a challenge.

SWTXBelle 12-10-2017 12:26 PM

Honestly, foregoing university recognition is looking better and better, and these colleges need to understand that it is an option, whereupon they will have NO say in their operations. I do not think that is an ideal situation, but it is an option. The other is to lawyer up and challenge it - I don't know who would be willing to do that.

Sciencewoman 12-10-2017 02:22 PM

Our International President is an attorney.

Kevin 12-10-2017 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sciencewoman (Post 2448990)
Hahahaha...but seriously, they're telling members they can't go to alumnae events, which have zero affiliation or recognition status with the university?

This sounds like a situation that's ripe for a challenge.

Like I said. Free money. I can't believe not one of the organizations at Texas State hasn't challenged things.

33girl 12-10-2017 08:08 PM

Switch the reservations to an alumna's name (preferably one of the 50 year alums) and call it Susie's Birthday Party or something of the like.

33girl 12-10-2017 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin (Post 2449018)
Like I said. Free money. I can't believe not one of the organizations at Texas State hasn't challenged things.

To be blunt, what the hell is wrong with this generation? They don't think twice about posting pictures all across the internet of drunken body shots, but when it comes to standing up for a principle in which they're entirely in the right, they cower immediately. I know that's a sweeping generalization, but I just don't get it.

lake 12-10-2017 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 33girl (Post 2449022)
To be blunt, what the hell is wrong with this generation? They don't think twice about posting pictures all across the internet of drunken body shots, but when it comes to standing up for a principle in which they're entirely in the right, they cower immediately. I know that's a sweeping generalization, but I just don't get it.

I know! What a wasted opportunity to demonstrate the power of collective action, and show how Greeks can get positive things done - together - instead of letting things happen to them.

Kevin 12-10-2017 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 33girl (Post 2449022)
To be blunt, what the hell is wrong with this generation? They don't think twice about posting pictures all across the internet of drunken body shots, but when it comes to standing up for a principle in which they're entirely in the right, they cower immediately. I know that's a sweeping generalization, but I just don't get it.

It's our generation, not our members. Those of us in leadership positions in our various alumni capacities would be the folks hiring (or being) the lawyers to challenge the school's unconstitutional efforts. What infuriates me though is that so many of these schools own Greek councils voted unanimously to shut down operations. That's game/set/match right there.

If the NIC and NPC are not on a nationwide basis coordinating between national offices and national offices with all chapters, then we as their constituents are not getting the services or the leadership we are paying for. I can say that at my little school, when our FSL advisers have convinced our IFC delegates to vote a certain way as to cede autonomy to the school, our national organizations have coordinated well in putting the kibosh on that sort of thing. Has NPC done some serious pushback at Texas State? Have they weighed in whatsoever? As an alumnus at a school where other groups are rumored to do stupid things or are currently being disciplined for certain things, this is very concerning. What if we've just signed a new mortgage on a facility and the school pulls this sort of thing? What happens to all of the colonies? I've similarly expressed my frustrations to university officials and get responses along the lines of "we think this is a problem to and we will pass your concerns along to IFC."

How the eff is our IFC not already talking about this?

33girl 12-11-2017 09:23 AM

I assure you that my generation (a little older than yours) would not have sat on our asses waiting for our advisors to get us lawyers...we would have done it ourselves. We also would never have voted to shut down to begin with.

And using NPC and pushback in the same sentence lol.

Kevin 12-11-2017 10:36 AM

Over the decades, our organizations have gradually moved from being run by the actives to being run (*wink*) by the actives. If your generation is so much better, why have they not required their actives to fight this on the school level while the alumnae fought it in court? I don't buy that there is some sort of generational weakness. I have to hope that in each of these transactions, the actives have received very specific information from the administration to let them know when this will be resolved and how. That said, I think the Rubicon has been crossed here. There's no going back to the way things were.

33girl 12-11-2017 12:21 PM

I read this post three times and it still sounds like gobbledygook. But I'm not sure how you can "require" 18-22 year olds to care about anything. And I seriously doubt that the administrations are being forthcoming with the students.

Kevin 12-11-2017 03:22 PM

House corps, HQ, and advisers can be persuasive, no? As far as admin not being forthcoming, that's all a mystery to me. It's not being included in any press release, so I don't know whether the school is partnering with the organizations on any level or not.

panhelrose 12-11-2017 04:57 PM

Actives are often told they're not allowed to speak on behalf of the national office, especially to reporters, so I can see why many undergrads don't feel they're in the position to fight back against this widespread action. Yes, it might be a generational thing to just say "someone else will take care of it," but if the national hq has always said to listen to the university and to follow sanctions, why would they do otherwise? This isn't like being on social probation and hosting a small mixer; it's unchartered territory. If I were an active at one of these campuses, I'd be upset but too scared to step out of line, too.

PhilTau 02-10-2018 09:00 PM

According to the 2/9/2018 Austin American Statesmen, the autopsy on Matthew Ellis showed blood alcohol content of 0.38.

http://www.statesman.com/news/crime-...JkeFxdUEzSObM/


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