Greek RESPECT
 

After speaking with several greek and non-greek people I just have to ask some of you currently in the Greek System a few questions. Please understand it is not my attempt to offend anyone, but I would like to know of this Greek "ettiquette" prior to my going Greek.

Why is it when Greeks see those people with the "SOON TO BE_________" shirts on they get extremely offended? I mean I would think that if someone loves your organization that much you would be flattered...hmm

Why is it that BGLO's can't say the word PLEDGE? I don't know if this is true nationally but I do see it here.

Why is it that NPC sororities aren't allowed to talk to prospectives?

Why is it in the Greek system fraternities/sororities are becoming more of cliques than organizations?

Re: Greek RESPECT
 

Pledge is not supposed to be politically correct anymore.....pledge is a promise, not a person. However I was a pledge and that time in my life will always be referred to as such.

Sororities can talk to incoming freshman about going greek, just can't talk up their own house. That's to keep from influencing decisions before the PNM has a chance to see everyone.

Everyone has special feelings for their own letters, they mean something special to us. Seeing someone that's not a member wearing them just isn't cool. Besides, what if you wore a shirt about one group and that group didn't invite you to join. In the meantime, all the others would think you're not interested and rule you out. Then, you might miss out on a terrific group that you'd be happy with. Leave yourself open to all opportunities.

What are these "Soon to be _________" shirts? I have seen little legacy babies and kids with bibs and shirts that say "Future XYZ" because their parents who were in those orgs. thought it was cute but I have never seen anyone over the age of five or so with something like that.

I have never seen anyone dumb enough to wear them, but I HAVE seen them on sale in adult sizes.

Why on earth would anyone think it was okay for them to wear letters that they have no right to? Do not work for? For a child to do it is one thing, that is more a statement of parental desires, but an dault should just know better. Not to mention the sheer nerve of it! How dare you assume that you will be a member! Those shirts show a lack of humility, discretion and sheer common sense.

Enchantress:

I will try to answer your questions, the best I can from my perspective...I hope it's helpful.

First of all, yes it is good to see people wearing your letters, and having pride in your group...if they are a member of your group.

Seeing someone wearing a "soon to be" shirt would upset me for a couple of reasons

1) my letters hold secret (and sacred) meanings to myself and my brothers, so having someone who just "likes" my org wearing them is bothersome to me, they don't know the meaning, solemnity, or ritual of my group (or at least I hope not) and therefore shouldn't be wearing them until they can better understand the significance and the meaning of them.

2) As fraternity and sorority members we receive a lot of negative publicity (most from actions of our members) but regardless, having someone whom you don't personally know wearing your letters opens you up to the chance that they won't live up to your standards, may act in an inappropriate manner , or disgracr your chapter or organization. If a member does something in letters or even without there are judicial procedures that they will go through...with Joe or Joann Random...there's not the check system.

3) Personally, anyone who would have the ego (or gaul) to wear a soon to be shirt would not be someone I would like to have in my group....they obviously have a ridiculously high opinion of themself, and an attitude to match.

I am not a member of a BGLO, but did advise the NPHC local concil in grad school. I don't know if it's a matter of them not being able to say the word pledge.

I would say that it would have to do with being a "Pledge" and going through the "pledging" process. Because, all nine NPHC organizations banned together and have "outlawed" pledging in their groups. The process formally known as pledging is now called intake. In the past "pledging" carried or still might carry on some campus a negative connoation (hazing, etc.)

Actually many fraternities and sororities (not all) no longer use the term "pledge" some feel it's just outdated and carries to much of a negative connotation for people.

NPC has a set of guidelines that all member groups have approved known as the Unanimous agreements. In these agreements is a process for formal recruitment (rush) procedures.

These policies are in place to hopefully insure that the process is fair, and clear of biases. Therefore the NPC women in sororities should not talk about their group or other groups outside of their recruitment events....it is just a means to hopefully guarantee that no one is promising membership to their organization, bad mouthing other groups, and following all the other procedural processes.


I don't really know how to answer this one, because I'm not absolutely sure what you are asking. But I think you want to know why do the chapter members seem similar and hang togehter (ie. like a clique)?

People find common connections with individuals and groups of people, thus the reason they join that organization. So, on the outside it may seem like they all look the same, do the same, act the same, but there actually is a lot of diversity in terms of background, ideas, majors, family, and even beliefs.

If someone were to look at a group of you and your friends, they might notice many similarities and draw conclusions about you and them based upon those observations...that doesn't mean that they are true...just their perceptions and what they can pick out on the surface level.

I'm sure that you and your friends differ in many ways, but at first may seem similar to outsiders.

The truth is often times, if you talk to a fraternity or sorority member and ask them why they joined that group. They can usually name one person that had a big impact on them and will be like "Joe Random, and I really clicked." He seemed like the type of person I want to be friends with.

Hopefully, of course they will like the majority of the chapter and not just that one person, but often it is just that one person who "seals the deal."

Hope I was able to answer some of your questions.

Thanks for listening.

Re: Greek RESPECT
 

What did they tell you?
:confused:

Quote:

Please understand it is not my attempt to offend anyone, but I would like to know of this Greek "ettiquette" prior to my going Greek.

In my opinion, this is like asking your professor for a copy of the Final Exam KEY when it's your FIRST day of class.

If you are intersted in a BGLO, you will probably have to do some research to get your answers. There are many forums on GC that can help you. You can do this by performing intense searches.

:D

(BTW, I was born in S'port.)

I'd just like to reiterate what other folks have said in regards to NPC members not talking to freshman.

NPC members CAN talk to freshman about anything except to say "join XYZ" BEFORE formal rush. They can talk about friends back home, the sucky cafeteria food, or how great Greek life in general is. After formal rush has been held, sorority women can talk to freshman (and upperclassmen at any time) about anything, including how great their own org is.

The only exception is that DURING formal rush, sorority women are not supposed to talk to potential members outside of the rush parties unless necessary for schoolwork or their jobs. (I assume there is also an exception for unusual cases such as a younger sister rushing, and you both go home for mom's birthday ...). The idea is to prevent "dirty rushing": "How did you like XYZ? Oh? Well, you know, they're not very popular with the boys ... oh yes, your chances at my house are very good." Since formal rush lasts about a week, this prohibition isn't too hard to deal with.

At some schools, where rush is held immediately at the start of school, there are prohibitions against Greeks talking to frosh in the immediate days before rush. But then the sisters and the rushees are already preparing for rush, so I guess it's for the same reasons as above.

Could the SOON TO BE ___ shirt possibly be meant for NM- because technically they are not true "sisters" until after initiation- but they are more then likely gonna be- in which case wearing a shirt like that wouldn't be so bad. Like if their bigs got it for them!

We aren't cliques. We aren't just orgs either. We are brothers. I favor the company of my brothers, because they are my brothers. Assosiates, classmates, aquaintenses, coleauges, etc will not always be there no matter what. Maybe they will maybe they wont. But I can trust that my brothers are my best friends and will always lend a helping hand.

THat would be nice, except I've never seen these shirts for NPC orgs, I've seen them FOR NPHC orgs and we don't have PNMs.

I've never seen "soon to be" shirts, just "future x" shirt. In my opinion, these are only appropriate for babies, and I'm even dubious about that. (Stressing that this is my PERSONAL opinion, not AXD's or NPC's.) However, potential new members (aka girls who have NOT pledged yet) generally have no idea which sorority they're going to join, and if they do they're usually wrong, so it wouldn't make sense for them to have "future" shirts. And yeah, it would piss off most sisters at their presumptuousness!

I'd like to point out that pledged but not initiated members ARE SISTERS. They are members of the org. At least that's the case for Alpha Xi Delta. Our new member manual refers to "you, our sister." New members (today's term for pledge) cannot vote or wear our crest, but otherwise they have full privileges of membership.

Re: Re: Greek RESPECT
 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by AKA2D '91
[B]

In my opinion, this is like asking your professor for a copy of the Final Exam KEY when it's your FIRST day of class.


...If you want the exam, see Opie25's response above!!!

Iris

Re: Greek RESPECT
 

I'm only giving a response to this part, because I believe Opie gave perfect answers to the rest of it...

You say that you think fraternities and sororities are becoming "more of cliques " than of organizations, but I think that fraternities and sororities are becoming less of cliques by having unity within Panhellenic, IFC, NPHC, etc. I believe this is especially true with Panhellenic sororities! Just look at how women from all 26 chapters support one another and PNMs on Greekchat! Look at how women from ABC sorority live with, party with, and adore women from XYZ sorority! True, we may form cliques based upon our own sisterhood, and there may be cliques between women within the sisterhood, but that's life- we're women, we're petty, and we cling to other women who are just like ourselves. It's the same for fraternity men! Example: my best friend is an alumna of Kappa Kappa Gamma... I went out with one of my chapter's alums, and three Kappas last night... I go out to parties all the time with Alpha Chi's, Sigma Kappas, etc... and I know this is true for just about anyone out there!

Ok, I understand that I'm getting a little worked up over this, but I'm venting right now... people are always so appalled when they (first of all, know NOTHING about the Greek system) see me hanging out with a friend, and she's wearing letters that don't match mine... ugh, it bugs me so much!

Anyways... so there's another perspective...

In response to your last question I would say that Greeks are no different than b-ball cliques, cheerleaders, Student Gov, etc. We become "cliquish" because to best be able to work together we need to know each other.
When I was in theater and the improv troupe in high school my director told us he wanted us to get together outside of school bc that is the only way we could really understand each other enough to work together. My bf in high school were those that I did plays with--no matter if they were on stage crew or on stage. WE became a team and we had the same passion. This is the same with Greeks--most of us have a passion for our letters and eachother even if we're not friends with everyone in our house we still want to lift each other up and be supportive. IF we can't do this then our houses fail.

Re: Re: Re: Greek RESPECT
 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Iris
[B]lol

I am a little wordy sometimes, huh?

sorry
:)

Opie25....Thank you so much for answering my question I definitely appreciate it. Might I add, the best responses I ever got...no matter how wordy they were...lol

AKA2d '91....hmmm Since when is asking about something prior to doing it a bad thing? You can keep your sarcasm to yourself...a for the record..the next time you use an analogy please make sure its one that actually fits. I'm "considering" the class this is not my first day...just thought I'd point that out.


GphiAngel624...where do I start...First of all don't vent on me...take that somewhere else. I asked for a response you could have easily just given that without the unnessecary emotion.


*sigh* some people....ANYWAY

Thank you to all of you who responded to this...I do appreciate it and I never said that I felt this way personally but after you hear things for a while you become curious.

I was told that Greekchat was the place to come to talk to Greeks who were not "stereotypically rude" but hey then again not everything you hear is true.


Blessings........

I hardly think that people who responded to your thread were stereotypically rude. We're all different and you will get different responses. That's the beauty of GC.

Wow, that was beyond rude. Everyone is entiled to their own opinion whether you agree with it or not. You asked the question and they told you their thoughts and feelings. Before you call others rude, you should stop and think about your words and actions.

exsqueeze me??
 

Enchantress, I know you are just learining about GLO's, but when you ask in a rather accusatory tone "why is it fraternities/sororities are becoming more of cliques than organizations", don't be surprised that some people get upset. In fact GPhiAngel's response was MILD compared to some you could have gotten. You could have said "I hear fraternities & sororities are cliquey - is that true?" and I don't think anyone would have been upset. But when someone who is not a member of an org yet TELLS us what we are, it's pretty presumptuous.

Uh...I will refrain from commenting on the attitude problem...:rolleyes:

But I was wondering...why are you asking NON-greeks about ANTHING Greek? What kind of insight could they possibly have? They are probably the ones feeding you the negative stereotypes that you seem to subscribe to (Greeks being rude, cliques). I would suggest before even thinking of going Greek, you be sure about your intentions.

Enchantress,
I must concur with Steeltrap, 33girl and suzymoonspider that you were afforded wonderful, clear and well-written answers to your questions.
gphiangel624 was being PASSIONATE in her response and that came through loud and clear. As a member of a sorority I immediately understood her vehemence in answering your question, and was glad that she posted in the tone she did. It served to show how committed we all are to not only our GLOs but to Greek Life in general.
AKA2D '91 was rather gentle in her post, and actually very, very helpful. I would also recommend intense searches and actually very simple searches that would give you enormous insight into Greek Life. http://www.nphchq.org/ and www.npcwomen.org have links to sororities and it's very helpful to read of their histories, philanthropic interests and founding values.
As you posted in the following thread:
http://greekchat.com/gcforums/showth...threadid=23687
you are currently establishing your own sorority, reading the information on the links above may well be of tremendous interest to you.
violets

Thank you Violets...and I have looked at those websites...but thanks


Everyone else....hey be blessed...you represent the Greek system quite well

First off as Members of Greek Dom, Yes We do take offense when someone takes an offense position!

And Yess, there are those on GC Who can become offenseive when they feel that they are atacked!

I suggest that All Of You Chill Your Jets before you say some things that We as GCers wonder what you are talking about!

You can get on me, I have Broard Shoulders!

This is not our little site but an open forum for anyone to check on when they hear about it!









Self Importantance is Underwhelming!

Be You and People wil understand You!:D :cool:

Drink!

I don't think Angel was venting towards you so much as venting in general about the topic which you provided..... and frankly, I don't feel that she was overly emotional. And if she was, so what? Greek issues obviously lie very close to her heart... don't you have anything to feel strongly about?

Umm... yeah, my thoughts EXACTLY!

I actually have yet to come across a Greek here who was anything but helpful, kind, patient and polite. When you start a controversial topic, don't be surprised when you get heated answers.

XOXO,
Annie.

The thing is, I don't think someone new, especially non-Greek, knows what is controversial. When I went through rush, it never occurred to me not to ask about parties or boys! How was I supposed to know, with no Greeks in my family and no GC to help me out? Even the Greeks I knew had only just recently joined through informal, so they couldn't give me much advice. I had another friend who was totally into joining a sorority in college, and she had talked about them some in our last year of hs, and I took her word as gospel. Looking back, of course, what did she know?

I mean, obviously it would be controversial to ask, "So, I hear you are really ugly, is that true?" - which is common sense outside of Greekdom as well. If the only people you know are non-Greek, some of them will provide you with some info on Greek life, some true, some false, but if you have reason to believe they know more than you do, you'll at least put some weight to what they say. The thing is, non-Greeks DON'T believe that they don't know all there is to know about Greek life! They watched Legally Blonde and they know that one guy who pledged, and they think they have the scoop. So they'll tell you their opinions with an air of authority.

I don't think we should be hard on someone just looking into the Greek scene who asks questions that while they may seem obvious to taboo to us just aren't like that to outsiders.

bump

*shakes head*

Oh GOD! A Tom Earp Drinking Game!

You take a drink everytime he hits return or uses an earpism. You have to slam your drink when you understand him. Obviously you are too sober if you do. LOL. Ya know I love ya bro.:cool:

Re: Greek RESPECT
 

Now now, that's not fair to say, even the math club is a "clique". STUCK UP is the better word to say. :p Of course that doesn't apply to all, but too many.

Shit Runs Down Hill and Today, I was at the Bottom of the Food Chain!

Thanx for Cheering me up:)

Are We Clicques, Hmm Interesting Question!

Yes!

Are We Clubs?

Yes!

But as We as Members of Greek Organizations, ( I Dont Care What Banner) are Members of an Organization which do many things more than party!

We as Greeks do more over all for Charitys than any other Type of Organizations in the World!

Example:

US Postal Service has a Yearly Food Drive.
LXA has the Great North American Food Drive and at least Triples what they do!

Do We have Differnet Governing Bodies for Our Over All Units, Yes!

While We as Greeks Fight, It is Because We are like a Big Family No matter what Color, Race, or Religion! We still ahve many things in commom!

The Question you asked is valid and some of us who have been involved for a long time and those who have been involved a short time can take somethings offensive!

I know I catch Heck all the time but Ah Well!

Seek and Ye Shall find!

Look under the next rock as that might be where the pot of gold is!:D

what click am I in?