White women in black sororities
 

Have you ever noticed that most white women whojoin black sororities only date and marry black men? Is this so theycan fit in? Mybestfriend and I were talkinabout this. Is this the white person's way of saying you can never have anything of your own....I will always be there to watch over you and regulate....Well watchand regulate are extreme but what are people's thoughts on this. I plan to post this under a new topic.

To be honest, I never understood why a white person would WANT to join an NPHC or other African-American fraternity or sorority considering our history and culture.

I've always said that when and if I do meet any of the Caucasian Deltas I've heard about, I'm going to ask them why...forget where she pledged, forget where she lives and even if she's active, I want to know WHY.

I'm not going to say I'm against Caucasian members because I don't know if I'd ever be in a position to vote on a white candidate and I wouldn't want that to come back to haunt me. But I can say that, knowing how some Sorors grill prospective African-American members, if a Caucasian woman can come through, survive, not be bitter, and be TRULY COMMMITTED to our cause and identity, then she has nothing but love and respect from me.

But I digress. It may well be a case of some saying now that segregation and separate but equal is "over" you cannot have a greek org or college/university to yourself. I don't personally know any Caucasian women who are in an African-American sorority, so I can't intelligently address the dating and marriage part of the question. That's a good question. I'm interested to see what springs forth.

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Kelli
12-DN-94
SSU c/o 1997

I'm making a couple of assumptions here so if I'm wrong or if you feel otherwise feel free to share. =)

I'd guess that people who join BGLOs do so because they grow up around African Americans and relate more to "black culture" than "white culture".

At least that's pretty much been my experience with non white members in "white GLOs".

It's like 12dn94dst wrote:
"knowing how some Sorors grill prospective African-American members, if a Caucasian woman can come through, survive, not be bitter, and be TRULY COMMMITTED to our cause and identity, then she has nothing but love and respect from me."

In the end all that matters is how committed the member is, not what color they are.

I would say that most of the white members of BGLO's joined because they liked what the orginization stands for, the liked the sisters, and they felt that it was the best place for them.

To be honest, I don't think white's should join black sororities. Why? Simply because they have there own. Why join ours? Could a white person please tell me why they joined or would join a BGLO's? I really want to know....

When I first thought about rushing, I considered every GLO on campus - NPC, NPHC, and otherwise. I did a lot of research (mostly online) about nearly every sorority (and some co-ed greeks) on campus. It wasn't so much that I was making a choice among GLOs already at OU; I was evaluating what the sorority I was interested in bringing had to offer, compared against other, obviously successful organizations.

I was impressed not only with the niche that my sisterhood had the potential to fill, but also with the niche that many of the GLOs and BLGOs were already filling. I was particularly impressed by two organizations, one a GLO, and another a BGLO. I was really impressed by the seriousness with which the sisters/sorors took their committments, and just how unique they were and the fun they had within their chapters. It never crossed my mind to not to attempt rushing either one, simply because I wasn't white or black. I was impressed by the standards upheld by the ladies, and I felt it would be an honor and a challenge to be a part of their bond.

Obviously, I rushed/pledged/joined neither of those two organizations...A.S.K. grew too dear to me to contemplate anything else, after a while. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

i'm proud to say that AKA does not mandate discrimination based on race, that was why there was a need to start our own sorority, we were not excepted. So how backwards is it to deny someone membership if they really want and can do what it takes to get it. Believe me no white woman will easily roll into a black sorority beating out other black candidates unless she is down for the cause and that is at the discretion of the chapter.
Why they would want to join i think SoCalgirl summed it up.

ooooooooooooooooo Shalom girl should I even bother with this one or should i leave it alone? just tell me cause i tend to make people angry!(smile)

This is a forum, you should post what you believe. Not everyone is going to like what everyone has to say. If you bump heads, that is fine, I think that it's just important to be respectful. I think you should post what you believe Prettygyrl.

Can you clarify who you are talking about? All non black people or only white people because there is a rainbow in-between.

Go ahead prettygyrl you and I are always being cursed out for our views on things or are either butting heads. As you've seen in other topics on this site, I am not easily offended. I enjoy hearing your opinions....we'll either agree...disagree....or agree to disagree. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif
So you go girl..........

WELL........... I think you are right about them not wanting us to have anything of our own. I mean what are their real interest in sororities founded for BLACK Women especially since their are some sororities that are mostly "white" women! I mean we all know that one of the reasons that the black sororities were founded was because we could not get in to theirs. It turned out to be a very positive thing for black people. I personally think that we should take pride in what was started for US and not for them. I mean dam don't yall wonder why they have to have a piece of everything? I know most of you know what your founders had to go through to get their sororities started on WHITE campuses so why now do they want to be down. I mean really now thiry or forty years ag o how many white people were beating down the doors of bglos to be a part of them. I feel the same about this as the dating thing. I MEAN DAM WE HAVE TO LET THEM IN OUR HBCUS NOW, THEY ARE INTRUDING ON OUR FAMILIES ANDNOW THIS........ I mean why are we so accepting of them when hell they still are not all that dam accepting of us...... I mean really we still underrepresented in just about every dam thing. If you watch he news everyday you hear something new about some sort of racism or a lawsuit a Black person had to bring against white people about something. Dam they practically have all of our dam men now they may exist in your sorority and you have to look upon them as your soror(sister) I do not know about yall but I do not and will not ever have a WHITE sister! Its not about hating them or being racist it just about keeping certain things pure for your people! You do not have to dislike a white a person or be a racist to know that you do not want share your heart with them. Ya get what I am saying. I know people say I am racist and I hate White people but that is not true. THE TRUTH IS I LOVE MY PEOPLE AND WE HAVE TO WORK TO DAM HARD IN THIS WORLD FOR ANYTHING WE HAVE SO WHY WHEN WE GET SOMETHING OF SO MUCH WORTH TO US (SUCH AS OUR BGLOS AND OUR FAMILIES) WHY IS IT THAT WE DO NOT MIND SHARING IT WITH THEM! I MEAN DAM YOU LOOK AROUND IN THIS WORLD TODAY AND SEE THAT MOST OF THE THINGS THAT WE ARE NOW "ALLOWED" TO DO WAS NEVER THEIRS TO KEEP FROM US IN THE FIRST DAM PLACE....YET AND STILL TODAY WE ARE STILL HAVING A HARD TIME! I HAVE SAID IT BEFORE AND I WILL KEEP SAYING IT THE FOUNDERS OF ALL THE BGLOS DID NOT HAVE WHITE PEOPLE IN MIND WHEN THEY STARTED THEIR ORGS AND I HIGHLY DOUBT THAT THEY EVER INTENDED ON WHITE MEMBERSHIP. These are just my personal feelings I hope no one allows themselves to get offended. OH AND WHAT DO YOU THINK SHALOM AGREE OR DISAGREE? I JUST WONDERED HOW YOU FELT CAUSE USUALLY WE ON THE SAME PAGE.(SMILE) OH AND SHALOM GIRL WHERE YOU FROM? IF YOU DO NOT MIND WHY DON'T YOU GIVE ME YOUR E-MAIL ADDY.... I LIKE HOW YOU THINK(SMILE)

prettygyrl, e-mail me... a12deltanu94dst@yahoo.com

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Kelli
12-DN-94
SSU c/o 1997

prettygyrl wrote:
"I mean dam don't yall wonder why they have to have a piece of everything?"

prettygyrl wrote:
"I mean really we still underrepresented in just about every dam thing."


Kind of contradicing yourself there prettygyrl? First you say that it is not okay for a group of people to have a piece of everything, then you say it is okay for another group of people to have a piece of everything. Yes, I know you wrote "underrepresented in every dam thing" but this does imply that there should be representation in everything.

In order for one group of people to gain equal representation the rules must apply to all people. Otherwise, it would cause unequal representation. It cannot be considered equal for black people to be allowed entrance into a histocially white college/university if white people were not allowed entrance into a HBCU. In order to get equality you've gotta give equality. This is the idea behind equality for all. If you were to stand in the way of a white person entering a HBCU or a BGLO you would be no different than a white person who would stand in the way of a black person entering a HWCU or a WGLO.


prettygyrl wrote:
"I HAVE SAID IT BEFORE AND I WILL KEEP SAYING IT THE FOUNDERS OF ALL THE BGLOS DID NOT HAVE WHITE PEOPLE IN MIND WHEN THEY STARTED THEIR ORGS AND I HIGHLY DOUBT THAT THEY EVER INTENDED ON WHITE MEMBERSHIP."

So are you saying that BGLOS should not allow white members? At the same time the BGLO founders were establishing these organizations there were also many other organizations which felt the same way you describe about black people. Does how these people (white/black founders) felt back then mean that we should not change this? Does this mean that all of society should not change either? Should we all forget about social progress and just go back to the way people thought 100 years ago? Is that what you really want? Segregation/separation?

After reading many of your posts, prettygyrl, I get confused as to what you say you are fighting for. You may say you want equality & justice, but so much more of your words are saying that you want hatred & anger between white & black people. That's only going to get in the way of progress & change, not help it.

You know, Black Sororities are sued for many things. The most common is membership. Would it serve any of the 4 NPHC organizations to open themselves up to law racial discrimination suits?

Ah, a new slant on INCORPORATED legally bounded NON-PROFIT organizations, that pay taxes, and receive lots of grant money.

Admittedly I was taken aback when I began meeting white sorors in ALL of the NPHC.But I have noticed, often these girls work just as hard to prove they did not do it "just to be down."

Am I interested in the NPHC becoming a fully intergrated 50/50 mix? No. Some things are simply best understood by other sistahs. It's about identification.

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Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated...Every Finer Woman's Dream!

Segregation is not always a bad thing...



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Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Incorporated...Every Finer Woman's Dream!

Finer Woman wrote:
"Segregation is not always a bad thing..."

I'm sorry but i have to disagree. you can't have it both ways. segregation is ALWAYS a bad thing. you can't say it is good for some people because it keeps things pure, but it is racist for others because they are keeping people out. In today's day and age we must be accepting, even if it means going against the norm.

If "white" colleges and sororities (and i use that term loosely because they really don't exist) admit non-white members, then "black" colleges and sororities should have to do the same. If not, it becomes a "separate but NOT equal" case and we all know how that turned out....

Please, I'm not trying to start anything, I just wanted to speak my mind.

I agree. The 4 Sororities are about the Sisterhood of African-American women.

I also have to agree with Finer Woman when she said segregation is not always a bad thing. In some cases, it keeps things organized and simpler.

According to Websters, segregation is the act or process of separating or setting apart from others or from the general mass.

The world we live in is still segregated, and I'm not talking about just racially either. Think about it. We work for SEPARATE companies. We go to SEPARATE schools. We belong to SEPARATE organizations. This board has SEPARATE forums. How can anyone say that segregation is ALWAYS bad? Nothing in this world is "always" or "never" anything. Mixing just for the sake of mixing is a lot of bull and sometimes causes more confusion that it's worth.



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Kelli
12-DN-94
SSU c/o 1997

prettygirl said:
I have wondered the same thing. I have never personally met a white woman who belonged to any of the NPHC sororities, but I do know they are out there. I wonder how many of those of you who are NPHC members have met (if not pledged with!) non-black sisters? The few people who claim to have seem to think highly of them.

My personal speculations on why they would want to join? 1st, they probably identify with many of your ideals (not necessarily those directly related to race, but those in regards to how to live your life, service, etc.)
2cnd, they have probably been very personally touched by race relations in this country, or just that particular BGLO itself. Maybe they are of mixed races, and want us all to learn that while we're different, we can still learn to love these differences. What if when I was growing up I had been an underprivelaged kid, and an NPHC sorority (we'll say AKA for an example) had come around a couple times every year to help out w/ food and clothes and to just spend time with me. I'm sure that I would start to think highly of these women, and if I was lucky enough to make it onto college (given my hypothetical circumstance) I know that AKA would be the first BGLO or GLO I looked for, regardless of my race, because I would want to give back like those sisters had done for me.

And you are right, you should take pride in what was started for you (African-American women).

prettygirl said
This isn't necessarily the topic, but I just want to briefly address it. This is the same kind of thinking that resulted in Jim Crow laws in the early 1900's. It wasn't right then, it isn't right now. And I would imagine that non-blacks who attend HBCU's do so for the same reasons any of us chose our respective colleges/universities: the department we were interested in has a good reputation, the professors, the class sizes, the location, financial aid, etc.

I think that it's important to have pride in your heritage and your history, no matter who you are. But part of that is being willing to share that with others folks, especially when they're interested.

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SilverTurtle@greekchat.com
Phi Beta Fraternity
Phi chapter

Username look do not start that holier than though white person bull shit! No that was not a contradiction. YOU know what I meant WE are underrepresented in certain careers etc. I would not care if the glos never let me in hell thats why they had to start the BGLOS in the first place. SEGRAGATION is not always better. Let me say this much to you.....in MOST situations people segregate on their on Right. I mean you could walk into a Highschool Cafeteria or to a dance or etc and you will see mostly that whites are with whites and Blacks are with Blacks. My people fought for intergration because segration was not equal. It was not really that they were dying to be next to yall it was that we had the worst of everything! If we would have been EQUALLY segregated theN I am sure we would not have fought so hard to become intergrated. WE are underrepresented in high paying careers and so on. These jobs were not created for WHITE people(although yall act like they were) They were created for people period yet still we have to work twice as hard as you to even make IT in this world. BGLOS were created FOR Black people period. There are no maybes in that, that is the fact! I do question why white women want to join them but do not think i do not question why a BLACK woman would choose an glo over an BGLO! Some things are better left as is. I mean the fouding of your glos and colleges were founded before yall thought of us as 100% humans! So qutie naturally at first only you all were allowed there. But the reasoning behind the founding of our HBCUs and BGLOS is just so deep for us. I mean how many of you have founded anything on your own because a whole other race of people thought of you as less human? The BGLOS have a lot to be proud of because they are still going strong to this day and they are a big accomplishment for our people. WE had to fight white people for them to think of us as a real person I mean how upsetting is that? You look around today and little has changed! I think that the BGLOS are a sign of our strengh and abilites. They are something that shows us what we can do when are working together for the love of our people a love that seems so distant today. They are something great created for the good of us. So whether I am greek or not I still ask why should we share that with them? I have never ever seen a white woman or white man in a BGLO but if I ever do,I am not greek as of yet, but I would still feel like they have something of mine! I see so many Black women and Men turned away from these orgs. and i wonder how could thousands of Blacks get turned away from BGLOS yet somehow a few whites squeezed in. The greeks represent a strong Black family for the most part their is love and respect for one another. If you continue to allow outsiders into your family it will weaken! I do not care what BGLO a white person is in, in all actuality .......THEY CAN NEVER FEEL YOUR PAIN OR LOOK AT YOU WITH COMPLETE UNDERSTANDING OF THE PROBLEMS YOU FACE JUST BECAUSE YOU WERE BORN BLACK. YALL COULD NEVER BE ON THE SAME PAGE BECAUSE NO MATTER HOW MUCH PEOPLE TRY AND SUGARCOAT IT, THINGS ARE DIFFERENT FOR US THAN THEM SO I ASK YOU HOW CAN YOU LOVE THEM THE SAME AS YOU WOULD ME OR ANY OTHER BLACK PERSON? WHAT DO YOU HAVE IN COMMON? I MEAN CAN THEY REALLY LOVE A BGLO AS YOU DO? CAN THEY REALLY RESPECT IT AND UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY STAND FOR AND WHY THEY CAME ABOUT? Once again i say these are my feelings. Its not racism its truth. I am sure there are whites in BGLOS and I am sure they will continue to be as with interracial relationships. I can not stop these things from happening I can just pray for my people. Whatever choices people make they are the ones who have to live with them. FOR THOSE PEOPLE THAT GET INTO RELATIONSHIPS WITH WHITE PEOPLE OR CROSS THEM INTO THEIR ORGS. I JUST HAVE THIS TO SAY TO YOU ........DO YOU REALLY KNOW AND BELEIVE THAT NOW TO THEM WE ARE COMPLETE HUMANS OR WILL YOU ALWAYS WONDER...............

prettygyrl wrote:
"No that was not a contradiction. YOU know what I meant WE are underrepresented in careers etc. I would not care if the glos never let me in hell thats why they had to start the BGLOS in the first place."

Yes, I completely understand what you meant by your point about being underrepresented in many areas. And I agree with you about that. My comments were about your statements where you say it is NOT okay for white people "to have a piece of everything" but you implied that that it is okay for black people to be represented (have a piece of everything) "in just about every dam thing." My point is that just as blacks should be entitled to equal representation, the same applies to whites. Everyone should be entitled to equality, it is not a one way street.


prettygyrl wrote:
"SEGRAGATION is not always better."

I agree. I believe that segregation (between groups of people not defined by color) is not a problem in certain instances such as "12dn94dst" described above in her comments, different jobs, different schools, different organizations, etc. But, when it comes to segregation among blacks & whites within those instances (jobs, schools, organizations, etc) it is NOT okay. Segregation in non-public groups such as families or friends isn't really open to public scrutinization since those are choices made out of personal preference and are not open to the general public.


I don't know much about the history of how & why BGLOS were formed except for what I've learned in these forums. I do understand & agree with you (prettygyrl) about almost everything you say about BGLOS. The only point I disagree upon is how you say that BGLOS should be black-only now since they were founded by and for blacks and were black-only many years ago. That would not be any different than a GLO which was founded by & for whites and was white-only many years ago saying that they should be white-only today. The rules/laws do & should apply equally regardless of the color of the majority of people in an organization. Don't get me wrong, I don't think there should be 50/50 representation in BLGOS as their history is better understood & felt by blacks, I just do not think that the few whites who do join these organizations should be discriminated against based on COLOR.

prettygyrl, in many of your other statements you refer to whites of the past as "YOU". Please, do not be misled and think that I am the same or that I think the same as the white people of years ago did. I am very, VERY different. I'm referring to statements like "before yall thought of us as 100% humans!", I have never in my life ever thought of anyone black (or people of any other color) as less than 100% human. I wasn't even alive during the civil rights movement. There is a whole new generation of people on this planet who think & feel very differently about the world around them when compared to people of older & past generations.


prettygryl wrote:
"You look around today and little has changed!"

I think this really depends on where you look and who you look at. Where I have seen & everywhere that I have been in my (young) life, things are VERY, VERY different. Much different than even 40 years ago.

I have to say that I have sands who are not "black", but if you think that she loves SGRho less then me, then you are wrong. Although I will agree that the fact that we are black has a lot to do with the need of our orgs., that is not our only focus. I have met white soros who I fell do love SGRho as much as anyone else.

However, I still can understand were we don't want to loose our African American foundation, but I love my sands and I could never say that she is less of a soror then me.

So I guess I'm stuck in the middle, here.

username........ should be enititled to equal equality and is, is two very different things. i never said once, that your glos should have to let black people in. I do not feel we need to be "represented" in your orgs. Why do we need to be in a "white" greek org. when we have our own? IF I AM NOT MISTAKEN IT WAS YOUR PEOPLE THAT MADE EQUALITY A ONE WAY STREET IN TH FIRST DAM PLACE SO WHO YOU TRYING TO CONVINCE. Keeping our BGOLS pure and our families pure is not unequality.(vice versa) Unequality is the fact that in Black neighborhoods the schools are shitty and white neigborhoods they are not! Unequality is the fact that Black get pulled over a vast amount more than white men! Unequality is the fact that white police officers gun down Black people like everyday as compared to Whites! Unequality is the fact that in a class that I was in, I was the only Black person in the class(which is how it was in most of my classes at this particular school), and the teacher ignored me everyday. I would raise my hand and she would never ever call on me, so finally one day after my hand was in the air for than ten minutes!...A white girl raised her hand and was called on immediately, and told the teacher that I had a question!!! Have you ever been in a similar situation username? Unequality is the fact that Black Boys make up the highest percentage of children in special ed! Unequality is when I could the same education(if not more) as you username and you would mos likely make more money than me! See dear unequality is one is not being treated as an equal when they are ENTITLED to equal treatment in certain settings. BUT! Not allowing white people in BGLOS or not agreeing with interracial dating is NOT a form of unequal treatmen BECAUSE BGLOS were mad for BLACK people there for you are not official entitled to membership! White people do NOT need to be EQUALLY represented in a BGLO, because afterall it is an BLACK GREEK LETTER ORGANIZATION!! i MEAN DAM HENCE THE NAME! IF you feel that you are entitled to equal repesenttation in a BGLO THEN YOU ARE SADLY MISTAKEN (vice versa). If that was the case why even bother with th disnction of BGLO and GLO! NOR are YOU ENTITLED to be a part of a BLACK FAMILY(vice versa)or entitled to Black MEN as with the case of the orgs! YOU HAVE YOUR OWN!! YOU can tell me you think this or that way but really I do not know what you think of me and really I do not care! I know I am Human and I know my race has always been so what you should do is go on tell some of the people in your family or you friends family that Hey I have always thought of Blakc people as 100% human why didn't you? Or WHY don't you! I ask you? HOW can you tell me what is different for us? YOU do not know shit! What has changed for your people in the last forty years? Alot right! I do not know where you looking at but MAYBE you should open up your eyes so you can SEE!

SORRY FOR THE TYPOS IN THE LAST POST BUT I WAS KIND OF JUST LETTING IT FLOW! ANYWAY IA MDONE WITH TOPICS SUCH AS THESE JUST BECAUSE I CAN NOT BE REALLY FELT AND HEARD BY TYPING FACELESS IN A FORUM SO NO NEED TO KEEP ON ATTEMPTING TO MAKE PEOPLE UNDERSTAND. I HAVE ENJOYED READINF PEOPLES POST THOUGH AND I WANT EVERYONE TO KNOW I RESPECT YOU R OPNION. I DID WANT TO LEAVE YALL WITH THIS LAST POST IN THIS PARTICULAR FORUM, ITS THE SAME AS THE ONE I POSTED IN ANOTHER FORUM DEALING WITH WHITE/BLACK ISSUES...........I want to say something to Black people........UNFORTUNATELY ARE PRESENT STATE AS A PEOPLE IS VERY WEAK CURRENTLY, AND I COULD GO ON FOR DAYS AS TO HOW IT IS WE BECAME THIS WAY BUT I WILL NOT EVEN BOTHER WITH HOW IT STARTED. I WILL SAY THIS THOUGH.........WE WILL NEVER(I CAN NOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH) EVER GAIN EQUALITY IN THIS WORLD AS LONG AS WE CAN NOT GAIN IT AMONGST OURSELF. UNTIL THE DAY COMES THAT WE CAN SAY THAT NONE OF THE PAIN AND SUFFERING WE ENDURE IS AT THE HANDS OF ONE ANOTHER WE WILL CONTINUE TO STRUGGLE IN THIS WORLD. AS A PEOPLE WE HAVE A POOR SENSE OF WORTH AND WE CONTINUE TO HURT EACH IMMENSELY INSTEAD OF LOVING ONE ANOTHER. THE LOVE OF OURSLEVES IS KEY TO OUR STRUGGLE, WE SHALL NEVER OVERCOME UNTIL WE ARE STRONG AS A PEOPLE AND UNIFIED WITH A DEEP LOVE AMONGST OURSELVES. WE NEED TO REALIZE THAT THE GREATEST ACCEPTANCE WE CAN ACHIEVE IS THE ACCEPTANCE OF EACH OTHER NOT THE ACCEPTANCE OF OTHERS! UNTIL WE CAN LOVE, RESPECT, TRUST, AND BE LOYAL TO ONE ANOTHER WE CAN NEVER BE THAT WAY TO ANY OTHER. IF THERE ARE SOME WHO THINK THAT ARE IN LOVE WITH THE OTHER OR THAT RESPECT OR ARE RESPECTED BY THE OTHER, OR THAT THEY TRUST OR ARE TRUSTED BY THE OTHER, THEY ARE SUFFERING FROM A FALSE SENSE OF LOVE, RESPECT, TRUST, AND LOYALTY CAUSE ALL THAT BEGINS AT HOME. IF YOU DO NOT LOVE YOURSELF THEN YOU CAN NOT POSSIBLY LOVE ANYONE ELSE! I KNOW THAT WE ARE ALL INDIVIDUALS BUT AS A PEOPLE WE ARE ONE IN THE SAME. I SEE THINGS SUCH AS INTERRACIAL DATING,ALLOWING WHITE PEOPLE INTO BGLOS ETC. AS ANOTHER WAY THAT WE WEAKEN OURSELVES. THESE THINGS WEAKEN BONDS THAT WE MAY ALREADY HAVE AND CHANCES OF BONDS TO BE FORMED. IT IS JUST ANOTHER WAY WE DIVIDE OURSELVES. IF THERE ARE SOME WHO DO NOT BELEIVE OR WHO HAVE YET TO SEE THE REPERCUSSIONS OF THESE THINGS TRUST ME WHEN I SAY YOU WILL ONE DAY SEE. IT IS NOT ABOUT HATRED, OR RACISM. YES WE CAN WORK WITH WHITE PEOPLE, GO TO SCHOOL WITH THEM, ASSOCIATE WITH THEM, HELL INVITE THEM OVER FOR DINNER. YOU KNOW, WHATEVER. BUT! OUR FAMILIES AND OUR ORGS(SUCH AS BGLOS) IS SOMETHING THAT IS OUR OWN. PRIVATE PERSONAL! THESE ARE THINGS THAT WE HAVE AND ARE FIGHTING TO MAINTAIN, THINGS THAT WE HAVE AND ARE FIGHTING TO KEEP IN GOOD STANDING, TO KEEP THEM STRONG. THESE ARE THINGS THAT WE HAD TO AND STILL HAVE TO WORK DAM HARD AT TO KEEP TOGETHER AND TO KEEP THEM POSTIVE AMONGST OURSELVES! WE DO NOT HAVE TO SHARE THESE THINGS WITH THEM NOR SHOULD THEY HAVE TO SHARE THEM WITH US. WE ARE DIFFERENT! WE ARE VERY DIFFERENT! OUR LIFES WILL ALWAYS GO IN DIFFERENT WAYS. INTERGRATION MAY BE A GREAT IDEA IN SOME ASPECTS OF OUR LIVES BUT IT IS NOT SUCH A GOOD IDEA IN OTHER ASPECTS OF OUR LIVES. HOW CAN YOU KEEP THE BLACK FAMILY STRONG IF ONE OF THE HEADS OF THE FAMILY IS NOT BLACK? ITS REALLY NOT EVEN CONSIDERED A BLACK FAMILY ANY LONGER, RIGHT? SO WHAT HAPPENS WHEN ONE DAY THERE ARE JUST NO MORE BLACK PEOPLE AT ALL?........ I JUST WANTED TO GIVE YALL SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT. I AM DONE WITH THIS TOPIC. I WANT TO SEND LOVE OUT TO ALL PEOPLE, BECAUSE I DO LOVE ALL PEOPLE. i JUST HAVE A GREATER AND MUCH DEEPER LOVE FOR MY PEOPLE AND IF THAT MAKES ME A RACIST........... THEN HELL, SO BE IT! AND ON THAT NOTE PRETTYGYRL IS OUT ON RACIAL TOPICS FOR AWHILE! BECAUSE THEY ARE BEGINNING TO BECOME A BIT REDUNDANT AND POINTLESS BECAUSE SOME DO NOT KNOW, SOME DO NOT WANT TO KNOW, SOME DO NOT CARE, AND SOME WANT TO JUST CONTINUE TO PRETEND! MY IDEAS WILL ALWAYS STAY THE SAME AND I WILL CONTINUE TO TRY AND UPLIFT MY PEOPLE ANY WAY I CAN! LOVE YA

are you saying that if a university or sorority is 95% white with 5% minorities it is not a "white university" but if its 95% black with 5% whites its a "black university"
Is there a double standard? Yes "white universities and sororities exist. I prefer the term Predominately White and Predominately Black which is more accurate believe it or not not everyone at HBC's are black.

Hi Shalom!!! My view on this topic varies. The problem that I have with white people joining BGOs is that it seems that many of them are trying to fit in. Many white women, that I know, that have pledged black sororities are in interracial relationships and hang around black people. Now I am not generalizing, I am only speaking of those that I have come in contact with. It seems to me that these women are trying to fit into a lifestyle and what better way to do so than join a black greek sorority? I am dating a white and indian male and also have a considerable number of white friends but I did not choose to pledge a white sorority because I did not have any type of love for them in my heart. Nor did I feel that that path was for me as a black woman. If I found a white woman that joined a sorority because of its purpose instead of her friends or boyfriend then I would give them the upmost respect. But as far as I am concerned it is a matter of them trying to fit in where they get in...instead of getting in where they fit in.

prettygyrl wrote:
"i never said once, that your glos should have to let black people in. I do not feel we need to be "represented" in your orgs. Why do we need to be in a "white" greek org. when we have our own?"

The U.S. law makes it so that GLOS & BGLOS cannot discriminate based on color. This enables individuals to make the choices that are right for them. I'm not saying that all black greeks should be in GLOS or that all white greeks should be in BGLOS, all I'm saying is that individuals deserve to choose for themselves because of ethical, moral & legal reasons.


prettygyrl wrote:
"Keeping our BGOLS pure and our families pure is not unequality."

I agree with the point about families, but not about BLGOS/GLOS. Yes, greek organizations are very much like families but they are also public non-profit organizations which many times receive public funding. Organizations like this cannot be "public" and at the same time be exclusive to only people of a certain color.


prettygyrl wrote:
"HOW can you tell me what is different for us? YOU do not know shit!"

Well, I guess that means you cannot tell what is different for white people either, because you are not white. So any of your other comparisons between white/black are not valid, because you should have no clue about white people just like you say I should have no clue about blacks. The logic applies both ways.


prettygyrl wrote:
"What has changed for your people in the last forty years? Alot right! I do not know where you looking at but MAYBE you should open up your eyes so you can SEE!"

Yes, alot has changed. As in my previous statement I still say that from everything I have seen in my (young) life and everywhere I have been, many things are different. But, I'm starting to think that both of us are suffering from the same short-sightedness. Because where you are or have been, things are not very different than 40 years ago, but where I am & have been things are very different.


prettygyrl wrote:
"so what you should do is go on tell some of the people in your family or you friends family that Hey I have always thought of Blakc people as 100% human why didn't you? Or WHY don't you! I ask you?"

Because I do not know (and never have known) ANYONE who thinks that way.

What is this? If you have such a problem with white women joining black sororities, you are perfectly welcome to deny them bids. Maybe they just want to be black. Is that such a problem?

------------------
andrew watters
Theta Chi – ucla

I think that we've run the racial topics into the ground. . .am I alone on this?

Agreed, Moderator... there seems to be too many treds of this topic running currently...

I would like to say this:
prettygirl has responded strongly to all of these topics, and has been met with alot of oposition... while I do not agree with many of things she has said, and have found some comments to be insulting, I do admire her will and tenacity to express her true feelings.
If only everyone where as able to speak how they feel this honestly, without fear of "ruffling someones feathers"....

keep it real pretty...

I don't think that it is possible to run racial topics into the ground. Topics are ran into the ground when they are not important anymore and people keep talking about them. Race is still an important topic. You might not feel that there are racial issues...maybe that is how you see it. But according to my life and the things that I see...I will be discussing it for days to come.

Perhaps you misunderstood... there are currently four treds which are covering the topic of race... and all four treds have almost identical replies, and counterreplies...
I dont think anyone meant that the topic is not important, obviously it is; but four treds, going back and forth, back and forth is a little excessive..

Exactly what I meant. Racial relations are important. I didn't say that they aren't. I said that this particular topic in this particular message board system is run into the ground. There are actually 5 threads going, and even a sixth if you count the eradicating racism thread. We should at least narrow down the threads. And as I see it, 2 are exactly the same topic, started by the exact same person, with the exact same opening statement. And there are 2 about white women joining black sororities (this thread and "Curious" by Monique). It's a bit redundant. By all means, continue to talk about it, I only meant that there are enough threads out there about the same topic, we should close down a few and limit it a bit. No sense in people reading the same thing over and over again.

[This message has been edited by mgdzkm433 (edited June 07, 2000).]

prettygryl you are alright with me. I know how you feel, b/c I get called racist and all that crap b/c of my views. But honey you keep on being the strong black woman that you are b/c you are a rare breed. I would love to keep in contact with you. SO HOLLA BACK...to let me know that you are still reading these things and we'll exchange information.

username.....honey, I'm sure things have changed over the past 40 years for you and your family....black people are everywhere doing everything that they couldn't do. But for me what you may see as a lot of changes ...i recognize them as being a small stepping stone to getting what my people deserves. We built this country and what do we have to show for it....not much. As a race some of us have lost our minds...killing each other , when we are all that we have left. No one is knocking you or making you the symbol for white people everywhere, so don't take things personal. You keep looking up!!

awatters-.......What's wrong with wanting to be black....EVERYTHING!! I realize that our culture is beautiful and diverse. We are a strong and forgiving people. But to white people i say don't sweat us. White people should not try to be black....be what your ancestory says that you are...Get a life!!

To anyone of mixed heritage....no offense ...go wherever you please

would i call a white delta soror.....yes...sister?...NO. Hey we can laugh and joke and cross the same sands but no matter what i will always be different...she will always be different. That is life.

Like prettygyrl i wonder how long this issue will be a topic. Soon we will say remember when there was a pure black race.....

I HAVE A QUESTION: What makes a Strong Black woman? Is it her views on race?

Well said

Sorry, It's not that easy in BGLO's
There is a MIP to go by

Why do you refer to white people as "they"? It is very degrading, the same as if a white person were to call black people "they" or "those people" - I understand you feel strongly about your views, but don't lump all people who belong to a particular race together! There are white people who are good, and white people who are bad...there are black people who are good, and black people who are bad...there are Latin people who are good, and Latin people who are bad...get my drift???

[I know that some of them will keep saying that everything should be equal bs, but they are the ones who made everything unequal and THEY are the ones who are keeping it that way! They are and have always been unaccepting of us in their families, and orgs, hell they half ass do not even want us to work side by side with them! Then they want to front and whine when we are unaccepting to them in our families and org. Thats there superiority mindset, they feel like who the hell are we to be saying NO WHITES ALLOWED! Its in their nature although some will never admit it. They feel like we should be "honored" to have them in our familie and orgs.


You are promoting your own ignorance by calling yourself a member of an "inferior race" - I have never, NEVER used this term for any person REGARDLESS of race, color, ethnicity, creed, religion, sexual orientation, etc...so why are you?

I mean after all we are the inferior race so shouldn't a Black person feel special that a white person want to be with them, or join there orgs?

Love the language - it really makes you sound educated about your cause...by the way - "DAM" refers to a structure built to contain a body of water (i.e., the Hoover Dam) if you are using it as a curse word, it should be spelled "DAMN."

Fuck NO! They can not handle our rejection period! I do not give a dam what they can handle or what they expect us to feel like!

Who is this "they" again - perhaps you're refering to my brother...I don't even tell people that he is my "foster" or "adopted" or "whatever"....he is my brother and I am his sister...I was in court to testify that he would be loved in our family - and he is! Our blood runs the same color and our love for each other as family cannot be tainted by the color of our skin. Of course maybe you would prefer that he stay in his "family" - you know the one with his "Strong black woman" mother who didn't care about him (or the other 4 kids that she knows about) - just where her next line of coke was coming from. You mean that family? Just wanted to be sure because I would much rather him be with someone who loves him and cherishes him for the human being that he is! Not for the race that he "belongs" to.


They have been saying for years that they do not want us in their families and orgs.,

Maybe these people aren't brainwashed and conditioned, but rather taught by their families to stop the hate and break the cycle! They have been taught that the only way to educate is through love...not hate (or whatever pretty little sugar coated words you want to use)

Also I know that there are many many of my people that are so brainwashed and conditioned or who obviously do not REALLY know what is going on and what has been going on between us and them ever since we were brought here.

My best friend would be ashamed to call herself one of "your people" because she is what I consider to be a true strong black woman - she is considerate and loving, and when she comes across someone who is ignorant (regardless of race/color/ethnicity/etc.) she is the one who comes out on top by educating them through love - not hate! And she certainly isn't inferior in anyone's eyes.

Unforunately Shalom, alot of our people do look at themselves as inferior and do not even realize it.

Then why can't white people have their own things such as the "White Miss America" or "Essence - for the strong White woman" or even one of the 14 college scholarships that I couldn't even apply for because I wasn't an African American. What about the student loans that are breaking my bank because someone decided that the color of my skin should stop me from having a scholarship even though my grades were excellent (always 3.7+)? Are you talking about me wanting these things for my own??? Look both ways on a two way road!

Once again I think one of the biggest things is to understand that it is not "racist" to want some of your things for you own and just for your own!


I'm rather glad you aren't posting any more. I'd rather hear from educated men and women who can express their views without venom dripping out of every word. I wish you luck out there - its a mighty cold world when you try to go it alone! We all need each other! Remember - Educate...don't Hate!

Oh I am here Shalom, but I have cooled in most of these forums. Like DC and MGDZKM433 said it is CERTAINTLY not that I do not feel it is an important issue it is just that it HAS become redundant because we continue to disagree or agree in the same type of forums. MOstly the same people. I feel I have made my point, I mean we can go back and forth all day long! I expect for people who choose to not look to what is reality as opposed to what, I believe, as fantasy to say what they think are all the "right" things to say. I say what IS the TRUTH not what may be right or wrong to say. When I expsress my views I am speaking from the heart because things of this nature are so important to me. I do not say them just to offend white people but if I do hell, those are the breaks! I know some of them can not accept the truth about what has happened and what is happening. I know that some of them will keep saying that everything should be equal bs, but they are the ones who made everything unequal and THEY are the ones who are keeping it that way! They are and have always been unaccepting of us in their families, and orgs, hell they half ass do not even want us to work side by side with them! Then they want to front and whine when we are unaccepting to them in our families and org. Thats there superiority mindset, they feel like who the hell are we to be saying NO WHITES ALLOWED! Its in their nature although some will never admit it. They feel like we should be "honored" to have them in our familie and orgs. I mean after all we are the inferior race so shouldn't a Black person feel special that a white person want to be with them, or join there orgs? Doesn,t that make us feel like we are somebody! Fuck NO! They can not handle our rejection period! I do not give a dam what they can handle or what they expect us to feel like! They feel like we look down on them (as they do us) when we say we do not want them in this or that! So of course they feel as if,the White race can not be looked down on! I do not give dam how they feel. I am not even sorry if you think that is harsh. They have been saying for years that they do not want us in their families and orgs., but when they say its "oh you know how white people are." When we say it they can not deal! What I have been trying to get them to understand is that I feel the same way about Blacks in white families and BLacks in certain orgs of theirs!(It has to go both ways) So this is not a "hating white people" ordeal, This is simply not believing in mixing our families and certain organizations that we all belong to! If they want to make it out to be that I am racist then THOSE ARE THE BREAKS. Also I know that there are many many of my people that are so brainwashed and conditioned or who obviously do not REALLY know what is going on and what has been going on between us and them ever since we were brought here. I know that coming on here going back and forth with faceless people is really doing us none the good! I wish I could get with every Black person in the world face to face so I can share a few things with them. Unforunately Shalom, alot of our people do look at themselves as inferior and do not even realize it. Alot of them actually do feel like what they are doing must be worth mereit if you know white people want to be a part of it to. Some of my people do feel better about themselves when they THINK they have won some acceptance from them. I know for most cases it is not their fault they really do not know any better. I will continue to pray that one day we will come together and see that we are stronger as one. Once again I think one of the biggest things is to understand that it is not "racist" to want some of your things for you own and just for your own! If white people or Black people feel guilty when they have feelings about keeping their families pure or some of their PERSONAL orgs.PURE then maybe they have osme kind of complex about their race. Because you should never be afraid to have more love for youe family than you do a stranger! although I know greek org are Public Servce ORG.s Bglos were started to help uplift THERE people so I believe that Public was actually meaning more so that they were Serving those that were outside of the greek org. I really do not think that most Greek orgs(white and Black) meant that to mean that anyone in the "PUBLIC" can join if that was the case then why do they have membership intake? Everyone is not CHOSEN so in that sense they are private. I mean People always use that Public SERVice as part of their resoning for thinking that BGLOS should no problem in accepting white peoplein their orgs., if that is what Public Service ORG. is supposed to mean then all Greeks should allow anyone to join no matter the age or G.P.A. Right. That is not how it is done though now is it so therefore, greek orgs are PUBLIC SERVICE ORGANIZATIONS, but in all actuality there is a form of private membership!.............DAM LET ME STOP SEE HOW I GET OF ON A RANT SHALOM ABOUT THIS STUFF. I WAS ACTUALLY JUST GOING TO TELL YOU I WAS AROUND AND LEAVE MY ADDY. ...............................................SHA LOM MY E-MAIL IS asiablake@hotmail.com I'M OUT

I will post just for you OTHERSIDE... First of all I did not refer to my race as the inferior race. If you have so much education then I suppose you could read and understand shit! I was saying that in a mocking sense because that is and how some white people do and have felt. SECONDLY YOU ARE DEFINITELY WRONG ABOUT THE LAST COMMENT YOU MADE CAUSE I DO NOT NEED YOU FOR A DAMN THING SO DO NOT FLATTER YOURSELF!(NOW DOES IT MAKE YOU FEEL BETTER THAT I ADDED THE N, YOU PROBABLY JUST ASSUMED I WAS USING "EBONICS" THOUGH RIGHT) JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE "RAISING ISIAH" AND YOU CLAIM TO LOVE HIM AS YOUR OWN BROTHER DOES NOT MEAN ANYTHING TO ME. I CAN NOT REALLY SPEAK ON HIS MOTHER CAUSE I DO NOT REALLY KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO HER BUT, JUST BECAUSE HIS MOTHER MAY NOT HAVE PROVIDED A GOOD HOME FOR HIM STILL DOES NOT MEAN THAT A "WHITE" FAMILY IS THE BEST THING EITHER. I DO NOT KNOW ABOUT HIM BUT I WOULD RATHER BE ON THE STREETS WITH MY MOTHER THAN LIVE IN A HOUSE WITH A WHITE FAMILY WHO CALLS ME DAUGHTER! HE PROBABLY WOULD HAVE BEEN BETTER OFF! INSTEAD OF LIVING HIS LIFE LIKE SOME FAKE ASS DIFFERENT STROKES RERUN! GIVE ME A BREAK YOU JUST ANOTHER "SIGH" IN MY LIFE!Does my cursing bother you? if so THOSE ARE THE F***ING BREAKS!.........NO I AM NOT ALONE ACTUALLY, I HAVE MY PEOPLE WITH ME EVERY STEP OF THE WAY! I REALLY DO NOT GIVE A DAM(DROPPED THE N THIS TIME JUST FOR YOU) WHO YOU WOULD RATHER SEE POST HERE BECAUSE THIS IS A PUBLIC FORUM SO IF YOU DO NOT LIKE WHO IS POSTING THEN YOU SHOULD CHOOSE NOT TO READ THEM!..........*SIGHING* PEOPLE JUST DON'T GET IT! * LAUGHING* No she did not say we NEED each other! I will laugh about that for days! I can not quite think what I may EVER need her for? OH AND BY THE WAY I DO KNOW WHAT A DAM IS IT IS A SORT FO BARRIER TO KEEP SOMETHING IN ITS PLACE ITS SORT OF LIKE THE BARRIERS MY PEOPLE HAVE STRUGGLED TO BREAKDOWN THAT YOUR PEOPLE PUT UP TO KEEP US "IN OUR PLACE" RIGHT! RIGHT............I'm sorry Shalom dag I am gone for real now. I just had to let her know about that INFERIOR ordeal and of course I went on and on............PRETTYGYRL LOVES THE LOVE!