Greek Advisor....hmmmmmm
 

Does your school have a Greek advisor who seems to hurt the GLO's more than help them?

Well, at SDSU we do (and I'm sure deltasigstan will agree).
I have been waiting to post this because it is a tricky subject, and I didn't know how I should go about it...anyway, here it goes:

i attended the nor-cal freshman/transfer orientation a few weeks ago. at the orientation there was a 2 hour period where the new students could walk around to the various tabled set up for clubs and housing at SDSU. i represented the IFC at the fraternity and sorority life table. when I got there I looked at the info papers that I would be handing out. On the paper that had everything you could ask about Greek life there was a section listing every GLO in their category (IFC, Panhellenic, USFC, etc.). Next to my fraternities name there were 2 asterisks (**). if you looked at the bottom of the page it said "** denotes suspended university privdleges." basically it was telling any PNM's that that house is in trouble, and has limited privileges. My house was the only one to have the asterisks next to its letters.
Now this would not be a big deal, but off the top of my head I can think of 2 other IFC fraternities that have been in trouble with the school, and will be on probation in the fall. One for a cocaine bust last summer by San Diego Police Department. The other thing that makes this unfair is that I have a copy of a letter from the vice president of student affairs for the university (and it was send to every Greek life advisor, and assistant advisors) saying that our "sanctions" will be reviewed with our nationals by the start of the year. What does this mean? well we could have every university privilege back by the start of fall. I will be personally meeting with our nationals in 10 days at our GAC to discuss our standing (and it is good, very good, right now). The last I heard from our President was that our Alumni were planning on meeting with the Greek Advisor to talk about this.
Back to the point of my thread....
Is this discrimination? What are our rights?
have you had a Greek advisor that does more harm than good? What did you do about it? any advice for me?

You are so not alone. Our Greek advisor is just awful. She's no help at all, for anything. She favors one group, and the rest of us are pretty much out of luck. She hasn't done anything quite as nasty as what yours did, but she definetly does not enhance the greek system on our campus.
The thing is I know that there are some awesome greek advisors out there. I met quite a few at My Sororities Leadership conference this summer. I think that there all just hiding on the east coast! Us out here in Cali have to put up with the yucky advisors!

We had a really bad advisor last year. She had no idea what Greek Life was about and she basically made our org. look bad and that was something we didn't need, especially being a new org. on-campus. For example, at our school we have to turn in a list of all of our pledges to school administration as well as to the advisor. One of our pledges was in her class and our advisor was like, "I don't know why they (Greek Orgs) make you pay for membership....Those girls should be buying you all gifts everyday if they want you in their org..." Obviously we let her go. :D

You are not alone Josh. The problem is that they pay Greek Advisors peanuts, and basically provide them with an agenda. A lot of times we think it's their faults for our problems, but I think they just are following the plans of the administration. It's sad, but often times true.

Well, we did, but they finally got rid of her, thank God (8 dissolved chapters later). :mad:

OH.
MY.
GOSH.

Do not even get me started on how much I hate the nazi bitch.

There was an incident where XYZ said we were violating some party rules, when it was just that THEIR particular rules were more strict than ours. After figuring that out, the other sorority dropped their charges. But the greek advisor bitch called BOTH our nationals and told them we were both violating national rules, which we weren't because we are really careful about that!!

There is more to that story, but I don't feel like going into it now... kind of complicated and annoying.

I hope other people with hellish greek life advisors find ways to cope!

greek love,
april

There is a new greek advisor at my school this year, thank goodness. Our old one was HORRIBLE. She always managed to not be there during formal recruitment (hello, that's one of your only f***ing jobs!) because she had "family events" to attend. I can see this happening occasionally, but it happened just about every year! There was also an incident where my chapter gave a girl a bid through formal recruitment, and the girl turned down the bid, thus making her inelligible to pledge another sorority for a full year (she had signed her preference card, and it is clearly stated on there that if you sign it, you will accept any bid that you recieve). Well, as it turned out, one of the largest sororities on campus, XYZ, was eligbile for COBing a couple of girls that year, and since they were "unfamiliar with the COB process," they gave this girl a COB. They claimed that the COB section was missing from their copy of the NPC manual, and they thought it would be ok. So, rather than punishing XYZ for breaking the rules by revoking this girl's bid, the greek advisor said that she would let it go because she said it would punish the girl more than it would punish XYZ (which I can see, but the rules are clearly explained on preference night, so if she wasn't going to accept a bid from her second choice anyway, she should have suicided.) This greek advisor was also known for letting the larger houses take "quota plus plus plus" because she didn't want any of the pmn's to be unhappy if they didn't get their first choice, but she didn't realize that she was basically killing the smaller houses by doing that. She also basically let all of the larger houses commit rush infractions because she never punished any of them. Sorry this is so long, but her stupidity still makes me so angry! :mad: But, I've heard that the new greek advisor is very nice and he wants to help get greek life back on track. I'm keeping my fingers crossed...

Well, Josh, in response to your original post, I suggest this: Try to talk to your Greek advisor first. Probably take some of your brothers along - makes you look more like a unified front. Tell her/him that if PNM's are going to know this about your chapter, they also need to know it about the other chapters that are in trouble. Also tell her/him that the situation is turning around and you don't feel that PNM's should really know about chapter problems that are in the process of being solved. (Quite frankly, I don't think that type of info should be on an info sheet at orientation, but that's just my humble opinion.) If talking to your advisor doesn't help, try having one of your national officers talk to her/him (like the ones you'll soon be meeting with). Sometimes advisors are a little more willing to listen to a national authority than snot-nosed "frat" boys. And if that doesn't work, file a formal complaint with her/his boss. Somewhere at your school, your advisor has someone she/he has to answer to. I say go up the chain of command until something works.

That really sucks that this happened, and having a crappy advisor hurts the entire greek system at your school. Good luck and keep us updated.

Actually, I don't have a problem with Greek life letting students know who is on probation, but I do have a problem with it being applied unfairly. Assuming you all are under similar sanctions, it was definitely inappropriate to single you out.

Bad Greek life advisors ... gosh, yes, I've seen them, but don't get me started!

Sublelty is a virtue! I actually did laugh out loud when I read that!

But, Greek advisors can be really bad news. Those of you who have been around for a while might remember the sexist comments in the newspaper from the advisor at the University of Colorado after an alleged sorority hazing incident.

In another situation at one of the chapters I advise, the president of the university offered our chapter a couple of prime located lots on which to build a house at $1 per year for 99 years. The Greek Advisor went ballistic and tried to block the deal by any way he could, including saying he was going to open the opportunity up to all of the other GLO's on campus. (I should point out that most, if not all, of the others owned houses -- ours was small and rented at the time) He also had a personal agenda in that he wanted to build a "Greek Life Center" on the lots.

I finally had to point out to him that HIS BOSS had offered the deal, and if he really liked his job, maybe he should back off a little. He was gone by the next year, I think.

Now, to be honest and fair in terms of full disclosure, I should point out that the President is a Delt alum (no relation to me -- that's a joke) and the brother he made the offer to was the student member of the University Board of Trustees. The deal was not done in the end because the chapter is new and doesn't have the means to raise the down payment, etc.

EEEKK!! I am almost afraid to post here but here it goes....

I am a Greek administrator and l've got a few comments about this thread.

Let me start by saying that yes, horrible advisors DO exist and some hurt more than help their respective systems. However, many times as members of the Greek community, it is hard to see things from the University perspective and many times, the Greek Advisor has to be bearer of bad news from the Administration. The position is basically a liason between Administrators and students. When the Student Affairs department says 'look, if a fraternity is on probation we have to designate it in the rush pamphlet', it is the Greek Advisor who has to carry this out, often at the expense of his/her popularity with the Greek community. If an advisor believes the University is making a poor decision, it can only be fought to a point - I mean, you DO want to have a job the next morning. Greek Advisors have supervisors too, and they can't just go around defying them. Greek organizations are ultimately under the jurisdiction of the University, and I think at times this can be forgotten. It sucks being the one who has to regulate the policy - but you do it because sometimes that's just the rules and you have to.

Another problem with Greek Advisors is many times they are Non-Greeks who are put in this role either because of lack of funding or lack of on-campus administrators. This is unfortunate because I believe you need to have been Greek to understand Greeks and their needs as organizations. I love what I do, and even though your actions may be misunderstood, if a member of the community takes the time to try and understand the action, the entire relationship is much better.

Believe me, many times, you DON'T want the Big-Wigs at University's having their way with the Greeks - some would deal with problems by banishing Greeks altogether (and I know we have all seen this happen to some campuses).

Again, I am not denying that there are people out there who suck at their job - but try and understand that not all advisors are the devil's spawn :) I was chapter President and until I began working for the Greek advisor my senior year, I had a hard time understanding what the hell Student Affairs was doing.

An addendum:

I forgot to say on the post above, that the replacement Greek Advisor seems like a really good person.

When some members of our chapter were involved in an accident on the way to a division conference, she and other members of the administration were impressive in thier response and support.

As in any other position, there are good ones and bad ones.

At least you guys have Greek advisors......

SF State doesn't have a Greek Advisor?

We had a greek advisor who NEVER (in the 8 years she was greek advisor, still is, actually) pronounced our sorority's name correctly!! No matter How many times people corrected her.

There's a sign that you care about the job.....

My favorite is that she was never greek, which seems to occur more frequently than I would have thought....

trus, but it just sucks when we are the only fraternity that is singled out...especialy when there are many other fraternities on my campus who are on probation, some for far worse actions.

DRau--

You are so right on your points. One of my sisters is a Greek Advisor here in PA, and she gets so much shit from people. She has to deal with all the same crap you talk about, and she says that people think it is her who is giving them the run around or such, when actually it's people above her. I'm sure your efforts do not go unnoticed if you're a good greek advisor, so kudos to you :)

Yo, what are you talking about? There is a Greek advisor for all the orgs. then there is a personal Greek advisor for orgs. You have to have a personal Greek advisor for you frat or sor. to be an org. on our campus, SFSU. Come on dog, are you new to the Greek life or what? Ask James he knows he is our F.S.C president. I know, I am on the F.S.C board and work for the Office of Student Programs and Leadership Devolpment office, so I work for him every day-but Sat. and Sunday:D. Our Greek advisor for the F.S.C, Fraternity Sorority Council , is hella cool. He tries very hard to get us to get along and work on rep-ing Greeks hard core! He is a honary member of a frat. I asked him once which one it was, he laughed becuase he did not even remember. He laughed, I couldn't believe it, but hey, he stills works hard for our Greek community and it is a damn shame to hear Pi Kapp142 saying he did not know we had a Greek advisor. I am proud to have our Greek advisor! Oh yea, DRau if you want to see the A-Phis on our campus visit our website, and if you visit www.sfsu.edu and go to OSPLd I think they have a pic. of our Greek advisor with the Greeks on campus; in a photo.
-Heath
FKT
www.bspotonline.com/phitau

Greek Advisor mini-rant
 

We had an "interesting" Greek Advisor back in my day. (He's since resigned.)

Back when my sorority was a new local, there was a meeting for (I believe) parents of prospective students, focused on the greek system. Many fraternity and sorority presidents, including the president of my sorority, were there. At one point during the talk, the advisor said "There are four sororities at this school." My sorority's president cleared her throat very loudly. The advisor turned to her and said "... oh yeah, and you guys." He did *not* correct himself and say "sorry, five sororities" - he just proceeded with his speech. :mad: That's just one of many examples...

Yep the Greek Adviser was a non Greek Shacking with a SPE our closest rivals in sometimes dirt fights!

I would take the Damn Job for more that I am making now as would be a raise! I would make them toe the lind but be fair as I know what aaallllll of the Greeks doo for the scholl besides do dumb assed things that make us all look bad!

There have been some words trust me between me and my guys!

Like get it together or I will tell International to close the Chapter down! I can get real serious at times!

I agree! :)

It's too bad to hear all of the horror stories about bad Greek advisors, because we have the best! She is an AOPi alum and has done so much for our greek system in her 7-8 years at Montana State. Too bad that she is retiring in december and we'll have to find somebody to replace her. I only hope that it is one person that fills the job and not some ramshackle coalition but together but the university administration.

Our Greek Advisor is a Delta Sigma Theta. She has done wonders to bring the black and white Fraternities and sororities together, and she really tries hard to keep our system going....But she hates my fraternity because we dont like to be told what to do, and we have got in many arguements due to her lack of knowledge concerning the traditionally white orgs at our school. It also seems like rules only apply to our Fraternity sometimes. But overall she aint bad, and her boss the dean of student life loves us, and is awesome at mediating problems. We love Dean Daniels....

PS. After we own 2/3 of the awards at our schools greek banquet, we went over to a table and put all our Awards on it and all of us officers posed with it. It was a very proud moment for us and we had worked hard all year to get those awards. The greek advisor came over looked at us taking pictures with all the awards and told us we where stupid.......That I will never get over.....It was plain uncalled for, and inapropiate.....

How does some one become a greek advisor? I cant imagine there's any particular major one would need, but what qualifications to yall's advisors have?
on a side note-I had a dream a few weeks ago that I changed my major to "greek advising". Not that we offer that here, or anything. :D
Heidi

Heidi -
At most schools, the Greek Advisor/Director is a position in Student Affairs. Depending on the size of the campus and the needs of the Greek Community, this position may or may not be combined with another position. There are levels of administrators, and I believe this is a level II or III, which at most Universitys requires a Masters Degree in either Higher Education/U. Admin/Counseling or something of the sort. Many programs will also require you to be doing some sort of internship or on-site work while you are persuing your degree. I am currently a grad. student in Higher Ed. at San Jose State U., and I'm interning as a Greek Affairs Coordinator (I don't get to be the 'Director' yet) at a school with a fairly small/newer Greek System.

Hope that helps!
:cool:

Heidi -
At most schools, the Greek Advisor/Director is a position in Student Affairs. Depending on the size of the campus and the needs of the Greek Community, this position may or may not be combined with another position. There are levels of administrators, and I believe this is a level II or III, which at most Universitys requires a Masters Degree in either Higher Education/U. Admin/Counseling or something of the sort. Many programs will also require you to be doing some sort of internship or on-site work while you are persuing your degree. I am currently a grad. student in Higher Ed. at San Jose State U., and I'm interning as a Greek Affairs Coordinator (I don't get to be the 'Director' yet) at a school with a fairly small/newer Greek System.

My undergrad. major was Communication, but I don't really think it matters...

Hope that helps!
:cool:

Most Greek Advisors have traveled for thier group as a traveling consultant (not all but many), followed by 2 years of grad school in a Higher Education Adminstration or Counseling program. While in grad school he/she will also work 20 hours a week in the greek life office on that campus, working under the supervision of a full time GA.

Then, they go on to work full time in greek affairs.

prophet,

i think i know who you are talking about but i think what my bro was trying to say was that we dont have someone that is just a greek advisor and nothing else, if he is that then i guess i'm an idiot. I know that we have a personal one for our org but i dont think he is very good. Oh well. I'm curious to know about all the things he has done for us greeks, let me know.
Also we should get a Phi Tau/ Pi Kapp b-ball game going, i dont play softball, let me know we should have it every semester, of course we all know who is going to win.....

hit me back!

Yo, Prophet
 

I am not knocking the gentleman that has worked so hard for us Greeks at SFSU, I am just bemoaning the fact that he is not a full time Greek Advisor or the fact there is not a Greek Affairs/Life office. I think that guy is great and relly wants to see us succeed as a community, I just wish that he was soley in charge of us Greeks.

The difficulty with advisors is that there usually doesn't exist a hard and fast criteria to judge their performance.

Plus their job descriptions are generally vague and not behavior directed.

This makes it hard to prove they are good or bad. Usually people work off impressions, so there can be wide ranging feelings for the same advisor. Plus people develop personal relationships with the advisor that can color their perceptions. Don't we usually defend our friends and give them the benefit of the doubt?

We should also start by saying that Greek Advisors are human with all the whims and foibles of basic humanity. Meaning there are people that are just better than others, more knowledable, have superior perspective and/or better meaning.

So when dealing with the Greek System the advisor is likely to be very concerned with individual Greeks he/she likes or dislikes, and then more or less concerned with the health of the system itself depending upon their inclination.

That being said it should be realized that at the core of any system that truly promotes Greek Life is an empire building Greek Advisor or other really pro-Greek administrator.

Although sometimes it was an older one that set the system up and the newer ones that are running it.

And the core of any passive or destructive system is likewise the Greek Advisor.

Greek advisors are the ones that set up the structure and training of the various intergreek councils. Inferior training and structure means an inferior council that is easily manipulated.

Further the Greek Advisor wields an imense influence over Officers and Greeks that deal with him/her through personal influence, and a lot of people will respond to that influence. So if the advice is good or knowledgable it helps, bad or inferior and it hurts.


The Greek Advisor provides a lot of the leadership resources from which Greek Officers draw. If he/she has a lot of good knowledge and an effective system to dissemintate and teach that knowledge widely it is good, if not its bad.

Another thing the Greek advisor that wants to be effective should do, is make sure that the campus Greeks know what other campus systems are like. That way the Greeks can compare their performance to others and learn what others are doing correctly.

It also allows the Greek advisor to look at the systems that other Greek Advisors have set up or run to promote Greek Life on their campuses . . . That way they can compare their own effectiveness. . . .

Edited for spelling

A quick and dirty way to judge the overall performance of a Greek Advisor in relation to your Greek System is to go back to the date they arrived and ask the following questions:

1. Are the organizations significantly bigger than they were when she started? (A clear sign of Growing Greek Life)

2. Are there more organizations on campus? (Again a clear sign of more Greek interest)

3. Have the intergreek Councils improved in operation? (More functions and less concerned with regulation etc)

4. If the answer was yes to those questions, is it because of programs the Greek Advisor started for that purpose or through their spiritual leadership (Personal influence)?

5. Do you officially hear about more interGreek intercampus conferences etc? Or is the Greek advisor setting up such conferences himself? (A sign that she is giving you more information about how other campuses perform and allowing you to network with those Greeks)

6. Has the Greek Advisor set up a series of leadership seminars that deal with "How To" issues that have left you with the ability to do things better? (a clear sign of some sophisticated leadership knowledge and an effective presentation. Oh and if you don't leave with a "tool" you can use for your problem it doesn't count)

7. Is your Greek Advisor more concerned with giving incentives than giving out punishment?

I skirted on this issue in a post above, but it's also important to remember that generally a university Greek Advisor works for the university in the final analysis.

Because of that, they have the option to carry out the administrations desires, lobby for change in those or find another job.

As many school administrations become more anti-Greek, (whether for good reasons or bad) the prospect of more "bad" (at least from the GLO perspective) Greek Advisors is probably strong.

Um,
no
no
no
no
no
no
and no.


Were having issues w/ our greek advisor right now too. As I have mentioned before, shes very unprofessional, and is nothing more than a middle manager. Our last greek advisor rocked. Hes now director of greek life at SWT. God I wish we still had him. Anyway.."Shelly" as well call her, has been busting our chops about summer rush.

Until last summer they let all student orgs set up tables at orientation (which is 2 days long) and rush. They got rid of that last summer, so wed talk to frehmen outside of the orientation, when it was done. A few weeks ago she came by and told us to leave as we couldnt be there. We did , but investigated, and we arent breaking any rules by being there, especially since its in the student center, which is student funded. so she got her boss involved, (which i hate incidentally) and she was "ya'll cant be here" and we were "why" and they were like "'cause." So we called the chapter atty, and he got them to say in their own words that we could be there. So we assumed the issue was dead, we won, right? No, cause dumb ass hooker tells us yesterday to leave. So were gonna go way over her head to resolve this. I am tired of dealing with some dumb ass who doesnt know what she is doing.

I will say that our Greek Advisor is excellent- he's a Pike from IU. He works really hard to keep things together, keep the houses from screwing up too badly- he tries to act as a buffer between us and the administrators who want to shut us down. Though he still makes some tough decisions- he closed the Pike house after they screwed up big time. All in all, he's as good as one could expect under the circumstances.

How does he rate on the quality points I listed above? Just curious.

On the points you named, he's terrible. We've lost seven houses, the system is less than half the size it was, and the chapters hardly speak to one another. But that would have happened with or without him- our Greek system is self-destructing. Imagine everything that the undergrads in a Greek system can do wrong. Now multiply it by 500. Imagine houses $18,000 behind in payments to their nationals, roofs caving in, rapes, assaults, brawls.....no deaths yet, but I'm sure that's coming. Hazing that cuts pledge classes by three-quarters by the end of the semester. And every weekend, 2000 drunk underclassman wandering the town's main thoroughfare on their way back from the row.

He's kept us floating through all that- spun every piece of bad press, minimized damage where he could, cut chapters off where he had too. My chapter relies on him- we're not even two years old, and we have a clean record, but every time another house does something wrong, the administration threatens to crack down and restrict the rights of all Greeks. Last year, the administration wanted to close all Greek housing. He convinced them to just set new standards- if he hadn't done that, we wouldn't be in our new-to-us house.

So......he's like the head of a small school for the mentally retarded. He can't really improve their situation, but he can keep them from burning the building down.

Yo, for sure we should play some B-Ball, I played the other day with one of your bros, maybe your him I don't know. Anyway he is a baller and I'm down for anything and, "of course we all know who is going to win...."(PiKapp139). I don't know why don't you tell me. Never talk shitnik untill you have done the deed. About the things he, Greek advisor, has done for Greeks I can go on and on, but it'd be to long. I work with the guy trust me has done alot for Greeks, but of course he can do more. The reason he is not only a Greek advisor is because SFSU is not a large and strong Greek community, like Berkeley. Phi Taus and Pi Kapps need to be the role models to the other Greeks on campus because our organizations are the largest. We need to work the system, an underground I.F.C thing. Not saying we need to form an I.F.C. because it won't happen, but we need to work together as if we were part of an SFSU I.F.C.
FKT SFSU epsilon theta chapter
www.bspotonline.com/phitau