A Question for the ladies of the NPHC(not for the sensitive)
 

Ok I HOPE and PRAY that we can all be mature here, but if the moderators of our forum think it's getting "hot in hurr" then I by all means close the thread.


I was looking at some of the other forums and one over on Rho Lane caught my eye. One Lady of Sgrho asked her sorors if it is their fault that they are not more well known. So that got me to thinking:

Is there a competition or jealousy between the larger sororities and the smaller ones? Why is it that if you have more numbers that the typical response is:

"Oh they just have more numbers because it's too easy to join"
"People are just following the trend"
"They don't know about us, so that's why they joined XYZ"
"They have bigger numbers, but we really are a family"


I'm really trying to understand why all the hostility, I hope I get some educated responses.

Much love,

QTE

IMO
 

QTE,

I think you should add "people or individuals" to your initial question ("Is there competition/jealousy..."), because it is not our sororities that have "issues", but the PEOPLE in these sororities that have "issues".

:cool:

Competition.....
 

For all purposes....I think there is competition amongst each of our organizations. Why? I have no earthly idea since we are all uplifting 'our' community and a lot of our platforms/targets are the same. Maybe because it's healthy and it keeps us all on our toes????

But let's be real......competition has been going on since the beginning of time. We hear all the time who was the first established/incorporated sorority; who's the largest; who has a 'constitutional bond' and who doesn't; who is the tightest because they know one another and don't cross 100's of women on a line; who steps the best; whose a member of 'our' organizations (famous/non-famous members); whose process is longer/whose shorter/whose paper, who does the most community service, whose history is the 'tightest'; who's the most popular and etc.

Yes, most of the time it is done in fun....but a lot of time it seems like we are competing/jealous of one another. Especially to outsiders who hear such. And of course you are going to 'pub' your organization, but do you have to put down the others to make yourself look good? (Something to ponder). A lot of us do.

Now to the outsiders....Greek Unity does exist....don't get it twisted. Most of us realize that we are 'people' first.


Have a wonderful, blessed day!

Good question
 

I agree with AKA2D '91 when I say that such comments are reflections of members not the organizations. If they have negative comments about other organizations then they must be insecure about their reasons for joining their organization. I don't feel the need to justify why I chose Zeta and why others chose a different road. Is it possible for XYZ sorority, Inc. to have a line of 50+ and each and every member be dedicated to the principles of the sorority? I think so! Why do we assume that large organizations have no cohesiveness? Why do we assume small organizations are wack? (for lack of a better term :P). I think thats a million dollar question.

I agree with you Dove1920.


Tinese :D
SGRHO Boston, MA

Personally I don't think this conversation is going to provide the answers we need simply because most of those who reply are confused about this issue as well. The rest will either read & not post or post & avoid the question entirely.

There's always going to be competition. All 4 of us are pretty much pulling from the same pool of women: college educated & public service oriented leaders. Friendly competition is fine, but some folks can't take a joke, some folks just say stuff to make themselves feel better, and some folks simple type before they think, as has been the case with a number of threads.

I was going to take the time to call out folks, but I decided against it. What good would it do? There are Sorors, AKAs, Zetas and SGRhos that have said some JACKED UP stuff, especially lately, and it's messed up that it's the same group of 5 or 6 total that don't know that "I love my organization" DOES NOT MEAN "I can put down/disrespect/make snide comments about your organization."

All of us, at one point or another, have claimed to be elitist. Being elite does not come from being first or large, or consitiutionally bound, or small. It does not come from having small lines or large lines. Nor is it validated by those aspects of our organizations. The fact of the matter is ALL of us are elite. None of us should slight another organization to prove or explain otherwise. Good natured joking among friends is one thing. But some of the comments that prompted this conversation are quite another...and quite embarassing.

Bottom line, you can have ORGANIZATIONAL PRIDE all day long, as you should. However, don't let your pride cause you to INSULT others who are not in your orgs. There is a difference between the "dissing in chants" that we all do and some of the derogatory remarks that I have seen on Greekchat.

yeah
 

Yeah I have to agree, it seems that certain people in organizations are upset, and I want to know why.

For example, in the Sgrho thread "Why is it that", I almost spilled my juice when it was mentioned in a sarcastic tone that noone paid respects to a lady of sgrho who had passed, then someone pointed out that it was not made KNOWN and so we didn't know. But all I'm thinking is "so it's ok to act hostile just because people didn't know"? I'm sorry, but I would of had no ill will towards any of you if you had not posted about our soror. To put the dead into it is kinda morbid to me, IMO.

You got folks wanting to leave GC over just TALKING about the issue, so I ask again, why the hostility? Cause this just can't be over competition. I think some feelings were hurt and that's how it started.

QTE

I agree with you Soror 100%. Outside of the "dissing in chants"--there is enough negativity out there without us contributing to it.


Albany Alumnae Chapter
Delta Sigma Theta
11-Spr'96

But should we even diss in chants????
 

I know...this is a little off subject...BUT....

I don't think we should even diss in chants! That's just my personal opinion. What does the public see? Also, a lot of chants lead to these stereotypes.

I heard the other day that one group during a step show called another group paper and threw paper at them? Where's the grad advisor/pan council/administration.? Do you think the women that are in that organization (the ones that got dissed) are really going to be down with the ones who did this????? NO!

Yeah, some chants are cute....but I've heard more than just your 'AKA is what a Delta ain't....what a Zeta wanta to be.....' kind of chants where people are just poking fun. I've heard chants (sorors included) where people are calling folk out of their names/ talking about folks history/ saying some orgs. should be fraternities and etc. That's not cool! And even though we think its in fun, some time it goes too far.

Just crazy! If you have the chance...talk to your undergrads about this. I know when I hear chants that are very, very, disrespectful to me, I let people know -- Your letters, community service and Sisterhood should speak loud enough for themselves. If they don't....you need to fix that...not talk about others in a chant!!!!

Re: But should we even diss in chants????
 

Soror (my psychic twin), I soooo agree with you on that!

If I had the answer to this question I would sell it!
 

My fellow greek sisters,

If I had the answer to this question, I would sell it and make a GRIP! Anyway, I think that it's safe to say that we've all experienced some "hateration" no matter what the org. I think (and I may get blasted for this, but what the heck) all of this starts from the catty nature that a lot of women have! Some women seem to talk about each other like dogs! (don't get mad because if it is not you, you know somebody that does it) From skin color, to hair, to body type, to everything under the sun! So my thing is that we have to first be comfortable as women and learn to look at each other as the beautiful black creatures that we are and then and only then can the pettiness stop!

For the record- The thread that my sorhor started (in my opinion) was not intended to offend anyone, she was merely posing a question that quite frankly needs to be addressed amongst sorhors. To those that were offended you have my deepest apology.

Just my .22 cents!;)

another question along these lines...
 

Something has been puzzling me lately. What is up with the "retaliation" threads? I mean, what's the point?

Make sure it is 150% accurate....
 

Why not post the "call outs"? I'm curious to see what and who is on this "list".


Yeah, today, I've "retaliated", so sue me. I do not appreciate blatant FALSE accusations (made publically) being thrown my way or my fellow moderator's way. You would get the point if the tables were turned and "DST moderators" was used and NOT "AKA moderators".


This is ONLY GC...it's cyberspace :rolleyes:, but many are incarcerated and have been killed because someone FALSELY accused them of an act. IT'S THE PRINCIPALITY OF THE SITUATION!

Let's not pretend we are soooo removed from this....

:cool:

I feel calling folks out would be counter-productive. I said I wasn't going to do it in my first reply, and I'm not. But if I did, there would be Deltas and AKAs and Zetas and SGRhos on the list. I don't discriminate.

This is just a dialogue to find out WHY there is such hostility around here and WHY people feel uncomfortable on some boards. We're not here to discuss particular incidents or to avoid the original question.



I just think it's funny for there to be an important message for folks not to reply & stoop to the level of others but retaliation threads are created after that. And if it's "ONLY GC...it's cyberspace :rolleyes:" why bother with doing either? Why waste energy responding to the ramblings of people in cyberspace who are not worth it?

I'm not referring to one incident or one organization, but the one you're talking about is included. All I know is what was posted on both sides AND that before the forum software was changed, it was possible for a moderator to edit a signature. I'm not saying it was done, just saying it was possible. If the tables were turned, I know the issue would have been resolved shortly after it happened. It appears to me that it hasn't and it is still a sore spot. Whether y'all want to sort that out is not for me to decide. But if it's the principle you're concerned with, I would think all parties involved would discuss it with each other rather than making remarks to their own sorors.

I don't think we are pretending that we're SOOO removed from this. If we were removed from it, there wouldn't be an issue to discuss becasue it wouldn't be OUR problem. N'est pas?

I'll give my honest opinion on this one
 

Why not post in all forums? Maybe some people just don't have the time. Maybe some people don't find all topics interesting. Maybe some people (like myself) came to GC to meet SORORS and that's it. So not posting in other forums to me is not that serious, it's not what I came to do.

Why do people feel uncomfortable or unwelcome? I don't know? What can we do to make you feel welcome? Should we quote everybody and everything? Maybe we didn't find what you said to be interesting. I mean, what type of welcome are you looking for? What can I say to make you feel more welcome and enjoy your stay more? It's a chat board, people, that's all. I have posted MANY topics that have gotten NO PLAY! Did I feel ignored? Nope, figured peeps wasn't feelin my topic. Move on.

Why the hostility? I'll tell you exactly why I'm hostile right about now. I don't appreciate people bringing up events from the past (Endroad). I don't appreciate it being put out there that an AKA Moderator edited someone's signature when it DID NOT HAPPEN. And if it did, where, pray tell, is the edited post. Because even with the OLD software, it would STILL tell if a post is edited. So I don't think it's cool to put something like that out there like that. That too is evidently a sore spot since it was even brought up, cuz it happened in the past as well. But if you felt that way, why not PM somebody and find out why? Why wait until the drama rears it's ugly head and put the AKA moderators out there like that with an ACCUSATION, not a FACT. While you all may not "feel" me, to me, it's a SERIOUS MATTER. Did I try to rectify the situation and get some clarity? YES I DID! Did I receive a response? NO I DIDN'T. So, with no communication, how quickly would you have resolved that situation? It was important enough to be posted what was allegedly done, but not important enough to give a response when called on your accusation? Whatever. When it was said what the AKA MODERATORS did, that made it personal, and that's how I took it, and that's why I'm lightweight upset.

Why hostility on other parts? I'm not really sure since I can only speak for myself. My opinion, however, leans toward insecurities and the need to feel accepted (that is evidently not being met).

(And please don't take MY opinions as the opinions of my sorors. This is how I feel.)

Make sure you are clean as snow....
 

That's :cool:, but why continue to say I can "callout", but do not? Aren't you just as guilty, basically INSTIGATING?
If it is counter-productive, why mention it on more than one occasion? You opened the door...I came on in. :D

There are many of us who are guilty, not only when it comes to the NPHC, but other groups on GC, therefore bring it out! You were the only person who said twice that "I can call out..." (Maybe we need to compare lists, you know to make sure it is accurate...we would not want to leave ANYONE out. :D)

Like I have said, I do not appreciate being falsely accused of anything, but until it happens PERSONALLY, I would not expect those unaffected to understand/comment.

:cool:

[i]I cannot stand a liar nor a thief[i/].

As Long as People are Involved...
 

Well --

People are people. Everyone doesn't do everything the same. Some people will visit some boards. Some will not. Some people will post all over and some will not. I think the problem is just because people wear certain letters people think thats how that entire organization is. Wrong!

At any rate...the same thing with the retaliation threads. Everyone doesn't handle everything the same way. Sure, some people may do stuff in pm. But others may choose not to. That's on them. We are all different.

Just look how 'we' are acting with the subject at hand. And yes, interest individuals are looking. Do we really want to look like this -- not because we are greek, but because we are black women????

Subject at hand....

Yes, there is competition and hostility. I think sometimes it continues on because that's the 'perception' we give off. When people make bad comments about BDQ when they are TWY they don't realize it looks as though they are competiting or dislike that org. And I know its just you have org. pride, but at the same time do you have to put down to lift up. And we are passing this 'perception' to the interested ladies. And they even say the same thing now. It was a time where interested ladies wouldn't down any org. prior to joining one. But now they feel comfortable and we let them do it and laugh. Pure craziness....and then the saga continues....

I would just like to say that I agree with Keli (hey club!). My only reason for response in the SGRHO forum was to dispell the generalizations posted. We all know members of orgs (our own included) who joined for the wrong reasons but those are individuals. As I have said to others before, if our orgs are what we say they are (and I know Delta is :) then we are all worthy of praise in our own right. I have respect for all women in the different orgs but I do have a problem when the chants turn into slander.

P.S. I would just like to state for the record, that I was not aware of the fallen sister of SGRho. If I would have known, I would have surely offered condolences and so I offer them now during your sorority's time of mourning.

Instigating...kinda like what you're doing now, huh Via? ;) I know I said I'd call folks out once but I rethought & removed it. You call folks out & then what? More mess? No thank you. But again, it's "ONLY GC...it's cyberspace" so it shouldn't really matter, or does it? But since you're so willing to call folks out Via, go ahead, say what u want, just spell my name right. :p


Moke, I said is I knew what was posted. You're right, you can't do much with folks that don't want to communicate, but one way or another it would have been resolved...that's just me. And yeah, if the post was edited, it would still be there but there was that month of posts that were lost whne GC went down, again, just putting that out there. The whole mess is just unnecessary. Forgive me for trying to get isht cleared up. Apparently some folks like keeping up mess & complaining about it, I don't happen to be one of those people and I don't happen to like seeing folks I consider friends involved in it either.




Is it so wrong to ask WHY folks feel that they have to make out of the way comments and is it wrong to expect an answer as opposed to getting suggestion of how the question could have been better phrased? Is it so hard to give a reason why people say the things they do? I mean, was it that you lost your composure for a few moments or are you like this all the time? Were you only taught to love your organization and that the others are beneath you? Do you buy into the stereotypes and challenge anyone who tries to tell you that you're not like that? Or is it that you just don't care about any other letters but yours and you only interact because you feel you have to?

Is it necessary to throw our comments about being pre-occupied with coloring the world pink & green or crimson & cream in a thread about increasing visibility? Is it necessary to create a thread with the same name on your board in "response." Is it necessary to remind everyone every everytime a relationshiop with a fraternity is mentioned that you have a consitiutional bond with a fraternity? Is it necessary to assume/suggest that just because organizations bring in large lines that they are not bringing in quality members? Is it necessary to dismiss folks as being bitter rejects? Is it necessary to cut the monkey over some invisible prizes and bragging rights garnered from a network that we're supposed to be boycotting anyway??

It's like a mini-race war around here sometimes. I'm starting to see why folks look at us as glorified gangs...that's how we act.

Do not try to put your idea on me. I only asked you a question as to why not do those call outs, when you mentioned it twice. That's not instigating, that's coming to you straight and point blank. You chose not to do that, FINE. Do not try to put the heat on me, but you know what, I'm a trooper, I can handle it, I'll take it.


Hell yeah, it matters. Again, for the third time (maybe fourth), as long as I am accused, you are dayum straight it will matter. I do not expect anyone to agree with what I have ever said on GC. I am not like anyone else on this board. We all have similarities, commonalities, but that is it. I'm not one who feels sorry for this and sorry for that...woo woo woo, be my friend, let's chat, let's do this, come join my organization...that's not me. (I know that was never mentioned, but I am adding that in for lagniappe) If one wants to make generalizations about the organization I am a member of, fine. Yet, when one targets me as an individual, it is another issue all together.

Glorified gangs? I do not believe in that mess. I act alone. Whatever I say, I say it. It is MY opinion, MY beliefs. It is not the opinion nor beliefs of my sorors, my organization, my sister, my mother...ONLY ME. (again, MY opinion)

I apologize again DeltaQTE...
:o

The End! :D

AKA2D'91 I am not offended, I got you e-mail, sorry my box was full, I cleaned it out:p

I am not offended by opinions, I am offended when someone comes at me in an immature manner and expects me to be the bigger person. Hence an e-mail I got from one member of Pan-Hel who was offended with something I said, well she showed her azz in that letter, and I'm suppose to just take it? No sir!


And I'm tired of having to defend my sorority just because we have more members. I'm tired that it "has to be something" else besides that my sorority works hard to be where we are at for people to want to join, it's ridiculous:rolleyes:


I think we are all doing a good job with dialogue right now, nothing major so far:D


QTE

That doesn't translate into being all you care about. If it was, you wouldn't be upset if the rest of us went away. :)


Interacting because you have to in a "i really don't care for these folks, but in the interest of sisterhood/greek unity/NPHC-ness, I will" sense.

I know Moke. :) Good looking out with the answers.

the Drama normally starts with a disgruntled member
 

Whoever said it's not the org but a disgruntled member hit the nail on the head. Here's one true story.

At my chapter, in the fall of 94 (I was still a neo), we had an interest meeting. One of our Founding Chapter Bruhs son didn't make the next line because he had a 2.4 GPA.

We had one guy who we let start the process because he had a 2.47 and was enrolled in 3 classes + we knew that the transcipts with the grades from the next Quarter would be the ones used by the intake team.

Now, our Founding Chapter Bruhs son knew ole boy didn't have a 2.5 but he thought that the Bruhs, somehow, FIXED his grades. In other words, he was mad because he thought the Bruhs just didn't want to eff with him. "Why didn't they fix MY GRADES TOO?" [that type of thing]

Next QUartEr, he went Sigma.. and from then, till he graduated, became the biggest Omega hater in Alabama (the state).. I ain't even playing...

so, I said all that to say this...

A lot of folks who start drama are people who are disgruntled because they got turned down or the 'REJECTED' letter from the Sorority they originally wanted to join... and then, for whatever reason joined Frat/Sorority XYZ...

If you think about it.. I'm sure you know at least one greek like that..

Ok, I understand now. Nah, that's not me, lol, cuz that's phony and I don't do phony. But it is SUCH a loaded question, because who would be honest about doing that? I really hope no one does that, that's pretty foul.

Re: Re: I'll give my honest opinion on this one
 

I am not saying I attribute it to being insecure based on the opinions of an org. But if you make threads talking about HOW COME NO ONE RESPONDED TO MY POST, I FEEL IGNORED, THEY DIDN'T WELCOME ME, that screams insecurity, IN MY OPINION. If you come at me and say you think AKA sucks, I'm not going to think you are insecure because you hold that opinion. But if you come at me and ask me why I didn't respond to your post????? On a message board??? Where is the opinion in that? So I'm not going against people's opinions, hell we all have them. I'm going on BEHAVIORS.

I agree with Swamp Thing when he said that most of the drama comes from people who got rejected and then joined another organization.

Another part of the 'problem' is what happens at probate shows. Don't you understand that its just a show. This is ABC's time to shine and call all the other organizations "out" about something. Don't take it personal. I mean I love DST just as much as any of my Sorors, but we all know they were AKA's (just an example) so why get mad when they mention it. The key word is WERE. The same goes for the rest of the organizations. For example, on my campus, the ladies of EFG got into a fight (promise it wasn't us) and the ladies of TUV called them out at their probate. Now, I'm not saying this was right, but EFG made their own bed, they had to lie in it.

The problem on my campus is getting the other sororities involved. All the frats will partake in any event given by another Greek organization, but the sororities won't. Even cook-outs! We (Pan-Hellenic Council) cannot get the other sororities to partake in the activities and if they do......they don't socialize. What's the problem? Lack of participation is something I don't think I'll ever understand.

Re: But should we even diss in chants????
 

On those points, I agree with you. I mean, who is anyone to call someone else, ESPECIALLY someone in ANOTHER ORGANIZATION paper? Are we suddenly privy to everyone's process? Do we cross pledge? Did I miss that memo? :confused: The situations you've described go WAY BEYOND dissing chants to being flat out mean and there's no reason that. It's like the respect for the fact that there are 4 of us for a reason is totally gone, if there ever was any to begin with, and that's sad.

to answer some of my own questions (since hardly anyone else is)
 

charge it to lost cool/being tired of the drama.


Of course I love my DST. I'm not an AKA or a Zeta or a SGRho for a reason. My love for Delta does not include disdain of or disrespect toward the other three organizations. I was not taught that. I did not, and do not, teach that. You will not hear me say, nor will I think that I cannot & will not hang out with someone JUST BECAUSE she is a AKA/Zeta/SGRho.

It has no place in a converation of that type.


I don't see why. We all know our own histories and traditions. No one's history is better than another's.

As I commented earlier, are we suddenly privy to everyone's processes? Do we all suddenly know what everyone's selection pool was? Were we there for the chapter's discussion & vote? Are we getting documents saying who was rejected from what? I highly doubt it. Without that information, we are unqualified to make such sweeping generalizations. TRUE, there are SOME CASES where someone was rejected from one org, acceptied in another and is now hating on the org that rejected them. But that CANNOT be the source of ALL the hostility. If it is, then maybe we do need to publish lists of who was rejected & distribute them.


I've said my piece on that one. I've never been more embarassed in my life as I was when that conversation was taking place.