AAs: The Pledge of Allegiance
 

When attending sporting events, at work (teachers/administrators), etc.

1. Do you recite the pledge?
2. Do you place your hand over your heart?
3. Do you stand while it is being recited?


I do not recite the pledge, I do not place my hand over my heart, but I do stand. I think I stopped reciting it after I graduated from high school.

:cool:

I stopped saying the pledge in 9th grade. I do stand, but that is all.

Re: AAs: The Pledge of Allegiance
 

Ditto!

Yeah, I just stand too. I really hate to even do that. I only do it so I don't look like the odd woman out.

I also stopped saying it in high school. I'll only go as far as to stand.

Hmm, I can't remember when was the last time I said it. I think it was at a football game ??:confused: Anyway, I stand, place my hand over my heart, and say it because through all the BS that goes on here, I would gladly prefer to live in America than anyplace else....you better believe it!!

VIVA USA!!

AMEN!

As someone who is a second-generation American, and has been back "home" regularly, I can recite that pledge with real fervor, believe me.

As messed up as this country might be, there is NO PLACE ELSE in the world that a black person can live the kind of life that is possible here. We seem to forget how FORTUNATE we are sometimes. If any of you want, I can arrange a trip to stay with my relatives so you can understand what it really MEANS to have a constant food source, indoor plumbing, transportation, and all the things that we take for GRANTED in this country.

We are spoiled. Even the option of not saying the pledge of allegiance is one that a lot of people in this world DON'T HAVE. Being less than fervent in your patriotism meant that the Tonton Macoute would be knocking on your door in Haiti.

The reason I don't say it is not because I'm not content with the lifestyle in which the US has afforded me. I'm very aware that I lead a privileged life. However, I don't say the words because I simply don't believe in their validity. ....With liberty and justice for all?!? :rolleyes: Oh, the hypocricy! Man, those words weren't written with me in mind and I think that today, in 2002, they still don't apply.

I do all the above. If you've never been outside of the USA, its hard to explain what the Pledge stands for. Yes, things are not so great here, esp. if you are melanin-enhanced, but we have it a billion times better than most people.

i haven't been to an event recently where the pledge was recited, but i do so each and everytime it's appropriate. My father is retired Army and my late grandfather was Navy, so i say it in honor of them if nothing else.

:)

Ditto!

When I was younger, I didn't have an appreciation for the privilege and honor that I have in being an American. I place my hand over my heart and recite the pledge for three reasons.

1) My ancestors were instrumental in building this country. They toiled this land, built its railroads, etc. My family members fought in wars, helped to build communities, fought for my rights...all of this came at a price...but its a system that is not paralled elsewhere...so I appreciate the US, and I uphold the original values as documented in the pledge of allegiance.

2)I say this pledge as a prayer...that we will all have liberty and justice and that it will become a nation UNDER GOD. I commit to those values, and so I recite the pledge.

3) I've been outside of the country. I've been to Africa and England. I've studied international politics. When I look at other places throughout the globe in comparison with this nation, I am glad to be called an American...and therefore value the pledge as mentioned in 1. When you are abroad and away from all that is here...you will surely have a new sense of appreciation for what is here. Amidst all the politics, socioeconomic types of strife, and racial differences....I still appreciate the US.

True dat. My late father served 21 years in the Navy, so I will recite it in his honor.

Those words right there are the very reason that I no longer recite the Pledge of Allegiance

DOUBLE Ditto!

I've been outside of this country, not only Mexico :rolleyes: :p ;) on more than one occasion and I still do NOT say it. IMO, it does not say that I want to live any OTHER place.

It's just a choice.

:cool:

1. Do you recite the pledge?

NO

2. Do you place your hand over your heart?

NO

3. Do you stand while it is being recited?

NO

I feel the same. Anyway, I don't recite things I don't believe in.

I agree completely.I have gotten into many "discussions" with some people over what it means and they always give me that "black people built this country so they have you in mind" speech.I still beg to differ.

1. Do you recite the pledge?
2. Do you place your hand over your heart?
3. Do you stand while it is being recited?


1. to be honest, i don't even know the pledge of allegiance. over the years, i've forgotten it.

2. nope

3. the last time i stood was probably in elementary school. people look, but no one says anything to me.

these answers also apply to the star-spangled banner.

No, the pledge of allegiance was not written with us in mind. True.

BUT the pledge of allegiance sets forth a guideline as to what Americans are supposed to believe in. Even when Americans don't live up to those standards, in this country there is a belief that those things....liberty and justice for all.... really ARE for all, and that this is an ideal worth fighting for. It reflects the VERY BEST of us, and of the American spirit. When those words were not meant for us, they were a spur for those who believed in our humanity and our rights, who took those words to heart and fought for us, both black and white. That was what America was SUPPOSED to be, and what they wanted to make it.

Americans might not always uphold those traditions, but this country is one of very few in this world where people still think that that is how things SHOULD be. When your civil rights are trampled here, you can do something about it, you can fight those systems, even when you don't win, and that MEANS SOMETHING. People are working for things to be that way every day. Isn't that what we do in living our lives? Work for things to get better?

Sororities and fraternities were not for us at one point either, but we took them and what they MEANT to heart, and we call ourselves Black Greeks today. Same way I will call myself a Black American, and recite the pledge.

awwww
 

awww, Stillwater! I LOVE listening to and/or performing the SSB. I think it is one of the most beautiful pieces ever written. But, that may just be the musician in me.

I feel the same way. I have been out of the country to see how "others" live and I do appreciate living here ( oh but do I !) But that last line gets me.

1. Do you recite the pledge? Yes
2. Do you place your hand over your heart? Yes
3. Do you stand while it is being recited? Yes

I don't find anything offensive about it.

I just wanted to add to what I originally said.......


A lot of people mentioned that America is the best country to live due to our standards of living.Materialism aside I doubt there is NO better country than America.

What about things like.....
racism
taxes
police brutality, etc..


There are more than a FEW countries where this doesn't exist.

Wait, there's a country that has no racism?

Please tell me where that exists, because I seem to remember a couple of race riots in England last year, and anyone who has ever been to France, knows that that 'liberal' society has some great big race problems- mostly with Middle Eastern peoples, but race problems and police brutality all the same.

And taxes are everywhere, lol.

Yes, yes, and yes.

I am an "Air Force brat" and I was raised to respect our country, our flag, and everything our flag stands for.

:) My little breakdown of the Pledge of Allegiance:

I Pledge Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, --- Right, I do pledge allegiance to my country so I will pledge allegiance to the flag that symbolizes it.

one Nation under God, --- This is about the only thing that bugs me in the Pledge of Allegiance because our Government sure doesn't act like it is under God...

indivisible, --- We better be indivisible otherwise we will lose the freedom we have if another group/country divides and conquers us.

with liberty and justice for all. --- Was this line written with me in mind? Probably not...but as a citizen of the U.S. I am entitled to both liberty and justice. Granted the liberties are regulated and the justice isn't perfect but I will take that over no liberty and no justice system any day.

Actually, lovelyivy taxes aren't everywhere.

Fine.

Any country with an established bureacratic system has a system of taxation.

Unless you are talking communism/socialism which are different economic models, and not particularly succesful in terms of gaining capital.

And it does little to change my initial argument, there is no country in the world that affords black people the kinds of opportunities available here. If you believe that false then please present evidence.

Hmm..I think this thread shows evidence of the epidemic in America. We are constantly being told how good we have it, how good it is compared to anywhere else. Well do not tell me how good we HAVE it, I want to think about how good it COULD BE/SHOULD BE. We really lose sight of that... although MUCH progress has been made, there is still much progress TO BE made, and I am one of the one's who will not pledge anything to a country that tries to stifle that progress at every turn. I do acknowledge that IN COMPARISON, we do have it better than most. That is true enough. But in my eyes, what we do have is not good enough. And that is largely due to the severe oppression that the United States Government levels at "minorities" at every turn. So I will not recite the pledge of allegiance until I feel that the words actually ring true, and are not just some naive pipe dream.

Which is not all bad. I wonder if most of our problems stem from being a capitalistic society. Sometimes liberty and justice work better for people with more capital.

I agree with Librasoul. Just cuz we have it better doesn't mean we accept what we have just because it could be worse. And I don't think anyone is debating the quality of life that we have in America. I am grateful that I have the CHOICE to not say the pledge. I think the issue comes into what you believe, and I don't believe in the Pledge. Do I have faith that it could one day ring true? Sure. But there are so many mistruths up in EVERYTHING, and the pledge is just one of them. And the military... nevermind... I don't even feel like getting into this today.

Socialism is one economic model I personally like, communism is great in theory, but doesn't work in practice. It has never worked in practice, because people are people, and corrupt.

I see what you guys are saying about the comparison, but I think that part of our duty as citizens is to make it better, like generations of African-Americans have done in this country. Generations of black people fought and died to make sure that we were able to say that we are CITIZENS of the United States, and it's laws apply to us too. I see saying the pledge as honoring their sacrifices, and committing myself to a similar ideal.

Because the only reason they were able to acheive preogress is because America is a country that believes that those ideals SHOULD be true. Liberty and justice are an ideal this country considers worth fighting for, and that is why we are where we are.

Look, I understand if you don't recite the pledge, I just don't see things the same way, simple as that.

I'm proud to be a citizen of the United States, and I stand, put my hand over my heart and say the pledge of allegience. For all the people who don't like this country and what it stands for, please remember this one of the few places you can say you hate your country and have other people DIE TO PROTECT YOUR RIGHT TO SAY IT.

My take on it
 

I say the pledge at times (but this is rare), but at other times I don't. I guess this is b/c I recognize both sides ofthe situation, as you all have presented. Esp. after 9/11, I think what the flag and the pledge of allegiance stands for is HIGHLY CONTRADICTORY and HIPOCRITICAL. Yet I also know that I wouldn't live the life I am able to in any other country in this world, and that many of my ancestors died in the struggle to afford me this privilege. This is why I guess I usually stand and acknowledge the pledge, and will place my hand on my heart, but usually not recite it.

Do you believe that the words of the pledge ring true? Literally?

I don't recite the pledge of allegiance nor do I put my hand over my heart. I do stand up though.

I don't believe in the pledge of allegiance therefore I do not say it. To me, the words are just words. They sound great on paper but things don't really work out like that in the real world. I also have a problem with pledging my allegiance to anyone or anything who wouldn't do the same for me. I pledge my allegiance not to a flag, not to a country, but to my family, my friends, and all of the beliefs and causes that I hold dear.

Breaking pledge news
 

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U.S. National



Pledge Declared Unconstitutional
Wed Jun 26, 2:36 PM ET
By DAVID KRAVETS, Associated Press Writer

SAN FRANCISCO (AP) - A federal appeals court ruled Wednesday that the Pledge of Allegiance is an unconstitutional endorsement of religion and cannot be recited in schools.


The 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ( news - web sites) overturned a 1954 act of Congress inserting the phrase "under God" after the words "one nation" in the pledge. The court said the phrase violates the so-called Establishment Clause in the Constitution that requires a separation of church and state.

"A profession that we are a nation `under God' is identical, for Establishment Clause purposes, to a profession that we are a nation `under Jesus,' a nation `under Vishnu,' a nation `under Zeus,' or a nation `under no god,' because none of these professions can be neutral with respect to religion," Judge Alfred T. Goodwin wrote for the three-judge panel.

The court, in the nation's first ruling of its kind, said that when President Eisenhower signed the 1954 legislation, he wrote that "millions of our schoolchildren will daily proclaim in every city and town, every village and rural schoolhouse, the dedication of our nation and our people to the Almighty."

The court noted that the U.S. Supreme Court ( news - web sites) has said students cannot hold religious invocations at graduations and cannot be compelled to recite the pledge. But when the pledge is recited in a classroom, a student who objects is confronted with an "unacceptable choice between participating and protesting," the appeals court said.

"Although students cannot be forced to participate in recitation of the pledge, the school district is nonetheless conveying a message of state endorsement of a religious belief when it requires public school teachers to recite, and lead the recitation of, the current form of the pledge," the court said.
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WTH??
 

The ruling doesn't surprise me. :rolleyes:
We need to put God in everything we do,say,think..
So what are we supposed to say now?

One nation
... under the cherry moon
...undercover
...under the boardwalk
...undercover brother
...underoos

:mad:

What about our currency.. are we gonna need new bills and coins as well?

Seems like the US Supreme Court will overturn it, who wants to be the judge that goes against GOD?

Re: WTH??
 

OMGOODNESS!!!!! This is pure comdey!!!:D

I too would like to know the same thing. I believe some of these government people get a little beside themselves. :(

How about one nation under a groove?
 

I am actually surprised that someone hasn't challenged this a long time ago, especially when the whole issue of saying prayers in school was getting so much attention.
There was a time when I did not recite the pledge because I thought that it hypocritical. But since 9-11, my views on a few things have changed. Although what we recite in the pledge may never fully come true, I believe that it is something that all of us who are Americans or residing in America should strive for and the only way that that is going to happen is if we all fight for it as a nation.