*sigh* overzealous PNM
 

okay, this might get confusing, so bear with me...

I hang out with this girl (we'll call her Sue) who is a really good friend of one of my friends. She doesn't seem to have any girl friends and totally latched on to me. Though she's nice and pretty cool, she can be pretentious, overbearing, and lacking in sense of humor. I think this comes from being insecure and needy. Her mom is a Phi Mu and wants Sue to join a sorority because she sees that Sue can't make and keep friends. That said, she asked me about structured recruitment one night and I told her briefly what she can expect from it, empasizing that she'll find where she belongs and can be happy.

She must have selective hearing or something, because she thought that meant that because she knows me and some of my sisters from hanging out with us, that she's automatically going to get a bid from us. Honestly, and this may sound totally shallow, but I don't think our chapter is the place for her. Most of my sisters who met her don't like her, but are always nice to her. I keep reminding her "you've only met some of my sisters. Keep an open mind and see where you belong."

Sue is ADAMATE about being an AGD. She works with our VP recruitment, and one day asked her, in front of a large group of people, how her chances were for getting in. Needless to say, that put our VPR in a very uncomfortable situation! She said the same thing I keep saying, to go through structured, and she'll find her place, whether it be AGD or not. Sue took it the wrong way, and called me that night saying that VPR basically guaranteed her a bid!

What do I do or say? I don't know how to talk her out of this mindset. I care about her and know chapters on our campus where someone like Sue would fit in perfectly, but she doen't get it. Short of beating her with a stick and screaming in a megaphone "YOU DON'T BELONG!! YOU DON'T BELONG!!", What else can I say? Sorry this is so long. If you guys made it this far, i applaud you :)

AGDPrincess70

Well, grades would be an issue, are they bad? That's such an easy out. If a girl asks why and she has bad grades, that's the only reason you have to give...even if she's really a crackwhore who wouldn't get bid with a 4.0!

Anyway, just tell her that it is a chapter decision and that it is not up to you.

You could say something like, "well, we had a lot of legacies go through recruitment this year. We have to bid them first, and once we bid all the legacies, we didn't have enough room in our pledge class for you."

or you could just be honest with her (which is what i'd prefer if it was me) and say you just didn't mesh with the chapter and we thought another house was better off for you?

She has to understand that recruitment is a numbers game. If she's not high enough on the list, someone else is.

Something I just thought of...might want to document these incidents in case she or someone else wants to file a recruitment infraction b/c she/they thought Sue was offered a bid.

Maybe she would be happier in another sorority, but if she is so outspoken about wanting AGD, other groups may get turned off so she goes no where. I'd bluntly say, "Sue, AGD cannot promise you a bid. That is against the rules.!!" I'd tell her that other groups may be turned off...

Is there a Phi Mu chapter there? If so, she must think she doesn't have a chance there..

Hey Kiddo, now you have me curious as to who this is!

Lynn makes a good point about telling her flat out that AGD cannot guarantee her a bid, it's against the rules...also tell her that not only will other chapters be turned off, but that she'll end up turning us off as well if she thinks she will get a bid just because she has met a few people (...aka - you-know-who situation). Lynn, no, there is no Phi Mu chapter.

to Leslie...
 

Hi Honey!

Yeah, I need to talk to you this week :) It's a heck of a story. Hopefully I'll see you tomorrow at Christy's grad party thingie.

LIEP,
Holly

It might be a good idea to sit down with her and explain how formal recruitment works. Explain to her that there are several rounds of parties, and any sorority can cut her after any round, and that she shouldn't get her heart set on one house. I'm concerned she may decline all invitations except AGD's after round 1 (assuming AGD invites her back), then end up nowhere.

If she continues to cling to AGD, (I know this sounds harsh) maybe you should cut her after round 1 so that she can explore other options. It sounds like most of your sisters that she's met already feel she wouldn't be a good fit.

Is she a legacy to any house that is on your campus? (Sisters, grandmothers, even aunts and cousins?)

Re: *sigh* overzealous PNM
 

That's not all that unusual to assume that.
I would've thought the same thing. Matter of fact I did in the past.

That's fine. If you all don't want her, don't act like it. Like aephi alum said, cut her like in the first round or someting. It appears that she really needs something like sisterhood, but AGD isn't for her. That needs to be communicated in some way or another. It's hard, but the further she gets with you all then she gets cut, the more she will be hurt.

I just thought I would express my agreement at cutting her early. Also, be SURE you document this stuff. Lynn is right, you don't want this coming back to haunt you.

Definitely cut her straight away. Yeah, you may feel bad because she needs friends or something, but it isn't your job to do it for her. If she drops recruitment or gives you shit about it, tell her it isn't your decision alone, and that the chapter decides as a whole.

Send me her number and I'll call her and tell her how it is.

LOL, you just made my morning!

Everyone has great replies. I agree with being honest with her. No one can guarantee a bid.

To dzsaigirl's point, grades could be an out. I know with AGD (as I am sure with other chapters), we look at the whole picture. Grades, community service and involvement, physical and interpersonal atributes, etc....

You could explain to her that going through formal recruitment is a mutual selection process. Chapters select members based on the whole package and likewise PNM's select a chapter on its whole package. The goal is to make the connection.

When I went through rush, I swore I was going to be an ADPi because two of my good friends are ADPi's. However, when it came down to it...AGD was the right place for me. I don't think I could have figured that out through informal recruitment.

Good luck.

Tough Situation
 

My Chapter recently went through a situation like this... since first day only reason we cut is for grades... on the second day the girls cut and we drop a certain lowest scoring% of women and the scoring ended up that the girl ended up in the lowest percentage... if you can't cut right away... don't invite her to preference... if she chooses to suicide your chapter... i am sorry for her if she does not get in but you have to do what's right for the chapter just keep leading her in a direction that is possibily another and hopefully she gets a good Recruitement counselor that will help her find a place...

there are truly letters for everyone :-)

Valerie

I agree with what everyone above said, although I think using grades as an excuse could get murky. In that case, my fear would be that if she really gung-ho and accepts that as the excuse, what happens if she goes all out and does get her grades up by the next year's formal rush....she's going to feel that she "solved the problem" and wonder why she didn't get a bid that time either. Not that raising one's grades is ever a bad thing ;) but I'm just looking in the long run/worst-case-scenario

I think you're making this more difficult than it needs to be.

What you need to do is sit the girl down and tell her that regardless of her relationship with you and with your VPR, NO ONE SISTER CAN GET A PNM A BID BY HERSELF.

Tell her that no matter what she thinks she heard, even if she heard right (which we know she didn't and you need to document, just in case), that doesn't mean the rest of the chapter will vote to give her a bid.

Remind her that one vote is one vote is one vote. That's all. Majority rules. The VPR's vote counts for no more than any other sister's vote. Then tell her that voting is a private process that is based on sisterly trust, and that a chapter must always respect the majority decision of its sisters, regardless of individual or minority opinions.

Please don't fib to her about grades or legacies, etc. etc. etc. If/when she does not recieve a bid, tell her that the majority of the chapter just didn't feel like it was a good fit--for her or for the chapter. That's utterly legitimate, and it's the truth.

At the same time, even though you say that you and your friends don't see her in your chapter, you never know--this PNM could go through structured recruitment, and a majority of your sisters could decide that she fits in just great....just as you think this PNM shouldn't count her AGD chickens before they are hatched, neither should you!

Best of luck with this one! ;)

Just thought I'd throw this out there... maybe we shouldn't be discussing something like this on a public board? Afterall, aren't most Greek membership selection processes private to only their initiated members? Anyone could be reading this...

In my opinion, this should be dealt with in the chapter where the problem is occuring. Look to the advisors and volunteers that work with your chapter to find alternatives and a solution if the chapter members cannot come up with one on their own. But by all means, misleading a PNM about the recruitment process may not be the best idea.


Just my $.02! :)

There isn't any formal recruitment going on right now.. the problem is that this girl thinks she's going to get an AGD bid when recruitment does happen... so we are giving advice about what to tell this girl so she doesn't assume just because she hangs out with one of the sisters now that she's going to end up being AGD come rush. AGD hasn't been voting on her or anything yet :)

I understand greekwendy's point of view. Membership selection is a touchy thing with most fraternity women, because our foremost concern is to protect the integrity of the process!

The only thing which I can add to the conversation is that Alpha Gamma Delta has specific attributes that we look for members. We want women that will contribute wonderful things to the Fraternity and the world at large. And ALL potential new members are given respectful AND equal consideration, be she legacy or friend or new acquaintance. Everyone gets their fair shake.

I am sure that the Alpha Gam chapter will handle this situation in a manner which is best for everyone involved!

And that's all I have to say about that. :)

Thank you, Forrest! ;)

I think that you should encourage her to go check out every sorority. Otherwise she might limit herself to only your sorority which might result in her not receiving a bid. Tell her to keep an open mind and check out every option. She might decide during recruitment that she has a better fit with a different sorority. ;)

Everyone here has had great things to say... Good advice :D

I would be honest with her (like many here have said) sit her down and let her know that no one can gaurentee her a bid and that she will need to go through the process just like everyone else. Let her know she has just as much a chance of getting in as she does not getting in... In other words, she should go through the process, be open to every house and see what happens.

Just be up front tell her this is the way the process works, that it is nothing personal, but that every girl who goes through this just has to wait and see.

If after that she doesn't get it, well then if your house feels she isn't a good fit, then she'll be cut and it will all be done honestly.

And who ever said to document all of this, I TOTALLY agree!!!! Document everything, as detailed as you can (dates, people there, etc.) It is sad to say, but sometimes people will try to sabatoge things because they didn't get their way. Good luck and let us know what happens!!!!!

It does not matter if recruitment is happening at the time, what GreekWendy was saying is that Membership Selection should not be discussed online.
Just be careful what you say...anything can be used against you later on.

I understand selection is a touchy/private subject. I think that AGDprincess, who came to the board for advice, knows that as well. She has been careful to give us just enough information for us to try and help her out.